Roe v. Wade - For Men

[KarissaMann05]

Well don't punish the child for her lying. This is for the child's best interest since he is already in the world. Not the mother's or the father's

There are men who decieved a woman that he is wearing a condom when he is not.

I don't think anyone say children should be punished. I know there are a lot of "bad and evil" fathers outside there, yes I know... Yes, I know there are good but lousy fathers... Yes, I know there are male rapists... But do you realize a woman have a right to not tell him that his child is his (it is not matter if he is a gentleman or a jerk)? Do you realize a woman CAN use her child as a weapon to control her child's father for her revenge? Do you realize a woman can rape him and have a baby (yes, female rapists do exist), which he will have to pay the child support? I can see why Stein considers it is not fair. I am not say all women are bad but it would be nice if they are discussing together and make a decision what the best thing for their child... But I don't think it will happen so often, sadly. What is a real solution for both parents? I think it is probably difficult to solve any problem, I guess? Hmm...

Personally, I have no sympathy for rapists, it is not matter if it is he or she. Victims need a lot of support and love more than criminal people.

 

[Steinhauer]

The same reason your mother get support to feed and shelter you. I don't care about Nadya, but I do care about her children.

you realize there needs to be equality before the "problem" gets solved don't you?

If women realized that men have rights too, do you think there would be as many children in need?

Yes, I agree, the needs of children should be met - by responsible adults. You cannot force a woman to love her child anymore than you can force a man to take on responsibility.

If there were equal rights regarding "opting out" I am sure less "unwanted" children would be born.

Women would take more precautions if they realized they could no longer railroad men.

More children would be born who had loving fathers.

 

[shel90]

It's not one sided at all. Both men and women must realize that sex is not consequence-free. You might get a disease, you might get involved with a mentally unstable person, the woman might get pregnant, etc. If people think that a one night stand is risk-free, they are deluded. It's an old-fashioned notion but it's best to be in a stable relationship with someone you can trust.

I have made sexual mistakes in the past and I feel lucky that I had no consequences to pay for except for feeling used or dirty. However, i asked for it as well so I took the responsibility for getting burned.

 

[deafgal001]

I don't think anyone say children should be punished. I know there are a lot of "bad and evil" fathers outside there, yes I know... Yes, I know there are good but lousy fathers... Yes, I know there are male rapists... But do you realize a woman have a right to not tell him that his child is his (it is not matter if he is a gentleman or a jerk)? Do you realize a woman CAN use her child as a weapon to control her child's father for her revenge? Do you realize a woman can rape him and have a baby (yes, female rapists do exist), which he will have to pay the child support? I can see why Stein considers it is not fair. I am not say all women are bad but it would be nice if they are discussing together and make a decision what the best thing for their child... But I don't think it will happen so often, sadly. What is a real solution for both parents? I think it is probably difficult to solve any problem, I guess? Hmm...

Personally, I have no sympathy for rapists, it is not matter if it is he or she. Victims need a lot of support and love more than criminal people.

yeah, but you gotta remember these kids could grow up unstable because of proverty and in the end, you still end up paying for it if they end up in jail or something. Our goal is to make sure these children's needs are met and well cared for.

And it take two to make a child.

 

[KarissaMann05]

yeah, but you gotta remember these kids could grow up unstable because of proverty and in the end, you still end up paying for it if they end up in jail or something. Our goal is to make sure these children's needs are met and well cared for.

And it take two to make a child.

Indeed, I am pretty much agree with you on that.

 

[Steinhauer]

I don't think anyone say children should be punished. I know there are a lot of "bad and evil" fathers outside there, yes I know... Yes, I know there are good but lousy fathers... Yes, I know there are male rapists... But do you realize a woman have a right to not tell him that his child is his (it is not matter if he is a gentleman or a jerk)? Do you realize a woman CAN use her child as a weapon to control her child's father for her revenge? Do you realize a woman can rape him and have a baby (yes, female rapists do exist), which he will have to pay the child support? I can see why Stein considers it is not fair. I am not say all women are bad but it would be nice if they are discussing together and make a decision what the best thing for their child... But I don't think it will happen so often, sadly. What is a real solution for both parents? I think it is probably difficult to solve any problem, I guess? Hmm...

Personally, I have no sympathy for rapists, it is not matter if it is he or she. Victims need a lot of support and love more than criminal people.

You hit the nail on the head.

I experienced a situation before (more than once) where a male friend impregnated his gf/wife. His gf/wife then called me with the news and told me, under sworn secrecy, to not let the male friend know. They then explained they were getting an abortion and would tell him it was a miscarriage.

Pretty low imho.

The fellas it happened to still don't know. I never had the heart to let them know, but I dropped clues for them to get out of the relationship ..... faaaaast.

 

[Steinhauer]

The same reason your mother get support to feed and shelter you. I don't care about Nadya, but I do care about her children.

My mother was supported by my loving dad. He wanted children and so did she. They took the responsibility very seriously.

 

[Steinhauer]

I have a better idea. Since men don't want to take responsibility of their own child.. and the child need support... Lets start a universal child support for the fatherless and motherless.. and tax everyone like crazy over it.

I have a better idea, give men equal rights. less unwanted children would be born. Less government money would be spent on irresponsibility.

 

[deafgal001]

back then, my husband mother had over 16 siblings by different women by her father. they didn't have to pay child support either. It is not less kids. it is more kids with who have to look for food in the trash. Some of them were put in orphanage. But he didn't care because he doesn't have to carry the child and care for it.

Since child support, I've seen less kids because no one want to pay child support. These guys are actually taking the steps to prevent pregnancy.

 

[katz4life]

Wirelessly posted



Most guys CAN'T get a vasectomy until they're age 30! Doctors will turn you down unless there is a compelling medical reason for getting one at a young age.

Why everyone always overlook that?

That's true. Most women are not guaranteed by doctors for hysterectomy until they are at 30 or 35 years old in case if they change their mind. I am not sure if that is rare case for some women to get their tubes back in order to get pregnant after 35 years or older of age. Actress Roseanne Barr had her tubes untied and had gotten pregnant with the last child at over 40 years old.

Wait a minute. I know one deaf man from Southern California who is an atheist and he stated in his profile from deaf social website that he had a vasectomy at the age of 23.

 

[Steinhauer]

I got my dad a father's day card last year that read "Well, its that special day of the year that reminds you a night of sex can haunt you forever".

 

[jillio]

Men don't have as many options? Option #1: don't put your penis in a woman's vagina if you're not ready to live with the results of an unintended pregnancy!

As if deciding to get an abortion and living with that trauma for the rest of your life is an easy "option" for a woman...

The men trying to get this passed are just a bunch of deadbeats who want to avoid responsibility.

Well said. They are simply looking for a valid excuse to avoid responsibility.

 

[jillio]

I have a better idea, give men equal rights. less unwanted children would be born. Less government money would be spent on irresponsibility.

Give men equal rights??? Do you really want to take on equality in that way. If you want equal rights to those afforded women, you are going to sacrifice numerous rights.

 

[Daredevel7]

I am talking about the man in the OP - who clearly stated to his gf, he did not want any kids period. His gf assured him that she could not get pregnant. Then she got pregnant and sued him for child support.

He was lied to and deceived and now his life is ruined over it. When she got pregnant (she willingly lied to him about a non existent medical condition), he *should* have been given the right to opt out.

Okay, so that's your solution. Give the man the right to opt out. He doesn't have to pay child support services. Alright. Let's go with that. What will be the consequence of this solution?

Obviously more men will opt out of paying child support. Honestly, I think most, if not ALL, of them will opt out. You believe that this will create less unwanted children, hence more abortions. I assume because you believe that women just want money and do not care about the baby.

Are you so sure about that? I really hope so.. otherwise you will have mothers stuck with children with even less money and fathers completely gone out of the picture. If they aren't paying for it, why would they bother with the child? Also, you said something about saving the government money. Well, if the mothers have even less money, they may not be able to take care of the child at all. Welfare, anyone? I'm not so sure about the saving government money part.

Honestly, I don't see your solution is better than the current solution. Like I said, there is no solution, only the one with the least damage.

However, in the OP, it seems like WITH THE CURRENT law, the father could be able to get out of it somehow by proving that the mother has deceived him.

 

[Steinhauer]

Okay, so that's your solution. Give the man the right to opt out. He doesn't have to pay child support services. Alright. Let's go with that. What will be the consequence of this solution?

Obviously more men will opt out of paying child support. Honestly, I think most, if not ALL, of them will opt out. You believe that this will create less unwanted children, hence more abortions. I assume because you believe that women just want money and do not care about the baby.

Are you so sure about that? I really hope so.. otherwise you will have mothers stuck with children with even less money and fathers completely gone out of the picture. If they aren't paying for it, why would they bother with the child? Also, you said something about saving the government money. Well, if the mothers have even less money, they may not be able to take care of the child at all. Welfare, anyone? I'm not so sure about the saving government money part.

Honestly, I don't see your solution is better than the current solution. Like I said, there is no solution, only the one with the least damage.

However, in the OP, it seems like WITH THE CURRENT law, the father could be able to get out of it somehow by proving that the mother has deceived him.

That "mysteriously" shows how you view men.

 

[Daredevel7]

That "mysteriously" shows how you view men.

Nope, looking at what is the worst that could come out of this. You are already looking at what's the worst coming out of the current situation. Which is that women can lie to the men and get pregnant on purpose to get child support. And it's very true. That can happen.

What is the "worst" that women can do out of your solution? Nothing, only men can take advantage of your solution. Tell me on what women can do to take advantage of your solution.

Like I said, I'm all about the solution with the least damage. Right now, you're just spurting around going "NO FAIR" without thinking of ALL of the consequences of the alternatives. Sort of like.. be careful of what you wish for type of thing.

I am not saying the solution is fair. I personally think it is unfair to men. But I tend to go with reality of the situation.

 

[rockdrummer]

opt out?? If you bring a child into the world you should not be able to opt out of the financial responsibility that goes with raising that child.

 

[deafgal001]

You believe that this will create less unwanted children, hence more abortions. I assume because you believe that women just want money and do not care about the baby.
.

I keep telling them that it won't. If he have sex with different women unprotected, chances are, 3 out of every 5 women he slept will get pregnant, and maybe 1 will have abortion while the rest decide to keep their child for whatever reasons. And if every man sleep with many women unprotected, he could end up have WAY too many kids from different women. That combine can increase the population.

Women do not want to have another mouth to feed and getting child support isn't worth getting pregnant for. Really. Most of the time, pregnancy really was unintended and they are just not comfortable with abortion. I have heard stories that women who already had abortion, but lied about the abortion anyway (for manipulation, I guess? but it goes to show they really don't want raise a child for money) . I do know that there are women who want children so they are going to have it with or without child support. If you don't want her having YOUR kids, then don't have sex with her or wear spermicide condom. It's your responsibility, you can't trust a woman NOT to have kids.

 

[Daredevel7]

You can opt out of paying child support if you take care of the child.

 

[Steinhauer]

You can opt out of paying child support if you take care of the child.

A lot of men are attempting that right now. You have stated that under current laws, that the man in the OP could get out of paying child support.

That is fallicious, since he is being forced to pay child support under current laws.

Women have the right to "opt out" by abortion. Currently, there are no "opt-out" options for men ..... period.


edit to add: In fact, I am helping a gentleman right now do just that (gain custody of his year and 7 month old son). The mother is unfit and has taken the baby away from him and his family (and even her own family).