Man won't submit to security, TSA won't let him fly. Who's right?

Israeli airport gives rare glimpse into security
Nov. 2, 2010, 3:38 p.m. CDT
Associated Press

BEN-GURION AIRPORT, Israel (AP) — Airport security around the world isn't good enough, an Israeli airport official said Tuesday while showing international experts Israel's near-legendary methods as a possible solution.

Israel, which prides itself on airport and airplane security, showed off robots and procedures to keep passengers safe. One method has been condemned in other countries — profiling.

Nahum Liss of the Israeli Airports Authority said Israel's heavily fortified international airport is the most protected in the world, speaking as authorities on three continents were investigating cargo bombs intercepted at airports last week in Britain and Dubai.

A confident Liss told about 50 visiting security experts that security procedures at Ben-Gurion International Airport "are built in order to confront this kind of threat."

Israel is known for its stringent airport security, the result of a string of Palestinian attacks on Israeli planes in the 1970s.

Before approaching the ticket counter, passengers are thoroughly questioned by "selectors" who look for travelers who match a suspicious profile.

"In the U.S., profiling is a bad word," Liss said, but he defended the practice, saying it is done by "intelligent, motivated" university students who served in Israel's military and can identify passengers who could pose a potential risk.

Liss said that heightened screening of passengers and carry-on luggage in international airports has pushed terror organizations to look for other vulnerable areas to attack at airports. He said many of the world's airports do not properly secure their perimeters.

"We need to protect our back door as well," said Liss, offering a look at an advanced technique the Israelis are working on.

The visitors, including experts from the U.S. and Europe, watched as security officers staged a live simulation, stopping three armed "terrorists" who broke through a rear gate.

Then they observed an unmanned vehicle patrolling the airport perimeter by remote control — a technology soon to be introduced at the Israeli airport.

Routine security procedures start far away from the terminal.

Before even entering the airport, all cars are stopped for a security check by armed guards. Cameras scan license plates to match them with a database of suspicious vehicles. Security officials said it's one of the many security filters passengers pass before boarding flights, some of them unknown to the passengers and many others still kept secret.

The Israeli airport's spokesman's unit said the main terminal is equipped with 700 closed-circuit cameras and is fortified against explosions. The large glass wall at the front and even the trash cans inside are bombproof, they said.
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Israeli airport gives rare glimpse into security | nola.com
 
it would be sad if we have that in here.
 
Full-body scanners are waste of money, Israeli expert says

By Sarah Schmidt, Canwest News Service April 23, 2010

A leading Israeli airport security expert says the Canadian government has wasted millions of dollars to install "useless" imaging machines at airports across the country.

"I don't know why everybody is running to buy these expensive and useless machines. I can overcome the body scanners with enough explosives to bring down a Boeing 747," Rafi Sela told parliamentarians probing the state of aviation safety in Canada.

"That's why we haven't put them in our airport," Sela said, referring to Tel Aviv's Ben Gurion International Airport, which has some of the toughest security in the world.

Sela, former chief security officer of the Israel Airport Authority and a 30-year veteran in airport security and defence technology, helped design the security at Ben Gurion.

He told MPs on the House of Commons transport committee via video conference from Kfar Vradim, Israel, that he wouldn't reveal how to get past the virtual strip-search scanners, but said he can provide briefings to officials with security clearance.

Canada this year bought 44 body scanners for major Canadian airports -- three of them for Vancouver International. Each machine cost $250,000 and is being use for secondary screening to detect non-metallic threats, unless the passenger prefers a physical pat-down.

CATSA, the Canadian agency in charge of screening airline passengers, declined to provide comment on Sela's analysis.

Junior Transport Minister Rob Merrifield, who is responsible for the agency, defended the $11-million investment in the machines.

"Full-body scanners are used by dozens of countries around the world and are considered one of the most effective methods of screening," Merrifield said in a statement.

Sela testified it makes more sense to create a "trusted traveller" system so pre-approved low-risk passengers can move through an expedited screening process. That would leave more resources in the screening areas, where automatic sniffing technology would detect any explosive residue on a person or their baggage.

Behavioural profiling also must be used instead of random checks, he said.

"Having a random search at the airport is like Russian roulette," said SelaPolitical scientist Mark Salter, an aviation security expert at the University of Ottawa, testified alongside Sela. He told MPs he disagreed with Sela's take on full-body scanners, calling the machines a "genuine leap forward" because they not only detect current threats, such as liquid explosives, but also the next generation of non-metallic threats.

"It is a much better mousetrap," Salter said.
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Full-body scanners are waste of money, Israeli expert says
 
Do scanners and pat downs take into consideration that the explosive material may not be something hidden at all? It could be the suicide bomber himself. That is, chemicals that are impregnated into the skin as a lotion, woven into the fabrics of clothing, etc. It might not be what's inside a container but the container itself. Chemical "sniffers" might be more useful than visual scanners.

It reminds me of this old story:

"One day a guard stopped a worker who was walking out of the dockyard gates pushing a wheelbarrow with a suspicious looking package in it. The guard opened the package and found it contained nothing but some old bits of rubbish, sawdust and floor-sweepings.

The next day he stopped the same worker who was again pushing a wheelbarrow containing a suspicious looking package. Once more it contained nothing of any value.

The same thing happened several days in a row, until the guard finally said, 'OK, I give up. I know you are up to something, but I just can't tell what. Please, I promise not to arrest you, but put me out of my misery; tell me what you are stealing.'

'Wheelbarrows, 'smiled the worker, 'I'm stealing wheelbarrows.' "
 
A leading Israeli airport security expert says the Canadian government has wasted millions of dollars to install "useless" imaging machines at airports across the country.

"I don't know why everybody is running to buy these expensive and useless machines. I can overcome the body scanners with enough explosives to bring down a Boeing 747," Rafi Sela told parliamentarians probing the state of aviation safety in Canada.
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Which is why behavior profiling, random security checks, and technology offer a much better security system with several security layers along the way. The U.S. could learn a thing or two from Ben Gurion airport. Problem is that we have idiots here.
 
Too bad some people do not realize once you enter the airport and subject to security checks, and on board to fly on your plane do you lose some of your rights, especially when it comes to nekkid body scanners for the sake of travelers' security. Behavior profiling? No such thing on losing your freedom on that aspect. It is NOT the same thing as simply profiling.

Civil Rights Coalition: TSA Violates Travelers' Rights | CommonDreams.org
 
kokonut said:
Too bad some people do not realize once you enter the airport and subject to security checks, and on board to fly on your plane do you lose some of your rights, especially when it comes to nekkid body scanners for the sake of travelers' security. Behavior profiling? No such thing on losing your freedom on that aspect. It is NOT the same thing as simply profiling.

Civil Rights Coalition: TSA Violates Travelers' Rights | CommonDreams.org
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would you like to explain to us on typical backgrounds of Ben Gurion International Airport's security guards and TSA agents? and also the trainings they receive?

oh and how many international airport does Israel has? and us?
 
A 54-year-old Missouri City man experienced similar treatment when he was going through security at Fort Lauderdale Airport.

Thomas Mollman was subject to a groping by a TSA officer that was tantamount to sexual molestation.

“I was wearing shorts at the time – between the underwear, right on the skin, all the way around the back, all the way around my front, 360 degrees, touched inappropriately,” he said.

“This was an assault. This was no different than a sexual assault,” said KTRK Legal Analyst Joel Androphy.

The level of abuse appears to be getting worse on an almost daily basis. First TSA agents use the back of their hands, then they outright grope you with the front, and now they are being trained to put their hands down traveler’s pants. What’s next? Mandatory bodily probes?

Even as the resistance to airport oppression grows, Big Sis and the TSA are responding by making the pat down procedures more invasive. Napolitano has figuratively said to the American people ‘let them eat cake’ as she slaps them in the face.

Given the fact that the TSA’s own woeful background checks for their own employees allows rapists and pedophiles to get jobs as pat down agents, will you allow TSA workers to put their hands down the pants of your daughter or wife?

UPDATE: Owen JJ Stone appeared on The Alex Jones Show today to discuss the incident and how the TSA goon ‘touched his junk’ by specifically patting his backside and testicles while his hand was inside Stone’s pants – video of the interview coming soon.
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TSA Now Putting Hands Down Fliers’ Pants

Loss of freedom anyone? Not to mention a violation of privacy. And people screamed about behavior profiling was inappropriate and their supposed loss of freedom? Rigggghhhtt.

Common sense, people. Use it.

Doh!
 
Oh, my! I just heard on TV about an older guy who had his pants unzipped and the TSA agent looked down the front of his pants, in the public screening area (not a private room).

They mentioned that people with pacemakers can't use the backscatter screening, so they have to be patted down. That got me to wondering--can people with CI's use the backscatter screening? :dunno:
 
Reba said:
Oh, my! I just heard on TV about an older guy who had his pants unzipped and the TSA agent looked down the front of his pants, in the public screening area (not a private room).

They mentioned that people with pacemakers can't use the backscatter screening, so they have to be patted down. That got me to wondering--can people with CI's use the backscatter screening? :dunno:
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:dunno: I did wear my hearing aid......
 
Jiro said:
would you like to explain to us on typical backgrounds of Ben Gurion International Airport's security guards and TSA agents? and also the trainings they receive?
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I haven't found the details yet but here's a little info:

"'In the U.S., profiling is a bad word,' Liss said, but he defended the practice, saying it is done by 'intelligent, motivated' university students who served in Israel's military and can identify passengers who could pose a potential risk."

oh and how many international airport does Israel has? and us?
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Obviously, the USA has more airports, more people passing thru the airports, and more variety of passengers and destinations.
 
TXgolfer said:
:dunno: I did wear my hearing aid......
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That's not implanted. :)

I know that CI wearers can't go thru the walk-thru metal detector but have to be hand wanded, so that's why I was curious.
 
Reba said:
That's not implanted. :)

I know that CI wearers can't go thru the walk-thru metal detector but have to be hand wanded, so that's why I was curious.
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I know.....that is why I said :dunno:

Funny this is such an issue when sporting events and some nightclubs have been doing pat downs for years.
 
TXgolfer said:
I know.....that is why I said :dunno:

Funny this is such an issue when sporting events and some nightclubs have been doing pat downs for years.
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They actually reach into your pants and "touch your junk" in front of everyone?
 
Reba said:
I haven't found the details yet but here's a little info:

"'In the U.S., profiling is a bad word,' Liss said, but he defended the practice, saying it is done by 'intelligent, motivated' university students who served in Israel's military and can identify passengers who could pose a potential risk."

Obviously, the USA has more airports, more people passing thru the airports, and more variety of passengers and destinations.
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Yes, obviously. Yet Ben Gurion has been doing this for years and there were plenty of time for airports in the U.S. to learn about their techniques helping ensure travelers' safety and security WITHOUT the need to touch/fondle/caress/squeeze somebody's junk. What a joke TSA has become. Watch airline stocks tank after the holidays. Common sense, folks. Common sense.
 
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