Do I Understand?

Jillio
You could do what John Howard Griffin did to find out what it is to be black in 1959 (Black Like Me - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia). If you can mimic deaf voice, go for it and maybe write a book on it. Sorry, the title "Deaf like me" is already taken. It is not possible for you to be a kid again (sorry again) to get more deaf perception in school setting(s).
 
That is really a pretty good idea! I have never tried to mimic a deaf voice, but I sure can recognize one quickly. The closest I guess I have come to that would be attending Silent Dinners and different deaf activities. And of course, having my house set up for my son with lights for the dorrbell, and the smoke detectors, and CC on T.V., etc. Sometimes when he is home for holidays, I almost forget I can hear 'cuz I will go for a couple of days without using voice, etc.
 
You can do the voice but don't forget to ask people to repeat what they said. Don't respond to anything behind you. You know deaf people pretty well. Study them really well before you pull this off.
You won't understand 100% what it is like to be deaf unless you're deaf. The most you might get is maybe 90%.
The educators will have to come with a better teaching method again and again until the deaf people are 100% satisfied.
 
You can do the voice but don't forget to ask people to repeat what they said. Don't respond to anything behind you. You know deaf people pretty well. Study them really well before you pull this off.
You won't understand 100% what it is like to be deaf unless you're deaf. The most you might get is maybe 90%.
The educators will have to come with a better teaching method again and again until the deaf people are 100% satisfied.

It would really take a lot of concentration because I am so used to being hearing. I'd have to practice before I tried to pull something like that off.

I agree. The educators jsut keep trying this differnt thing and that different thing, and I believe the answer is right in front of them. No need to make up different systems.....Bi-Bi is the answer.
 
Whoo hoo! Thanks for asking your question! ;)

" Inthe thread, District Files Appeal Against Deaf Student, post # 1401, it was said that I do not seek to understand the deaf community at all. I replied that I would leave that question to the deaf members of AD to answer.

So here's the question....do I, as a hearing person, attempt to gain an understanding of deafness from the deaf perspective?

Honest answers, please, as I consider this a learning experience."

Hi Jillo again, ;-)

I must say this from the bottom of my heart - I'll give you my rating of your knowledge and understanding our deafness and Deaf life.Your rating would be 100.0. At first I never knew you (of course) or have a chance to chat with you. I usually wait and see how it goes before I say anything. Some people are playing people's mind games and lied about it - that is how I knew and have very strong instinct feelings. I am so lucky to have this strong instinct feelings to be more useful than depending on my deaf ears. That is why I was hoping that we will meet each other someday if we get a chance as I have mentioned it once before in other topic. This case of meeting each other that we are here that is nothing to do with a favoritsim. Some self hatred deaf/ hearing need to back off. Dont let them stop you that easily. ;)

That's why I just wait for the right time to get to know their own thinking when I feel confident with a person who have a very positive outlook and full of knowledge about our Deaf culture. That is so wonderful to have someone like you.. YOU HAVE A HUGE DEAF HEART and CONCERN of Deaf children's self esteem / emotional/mental condition. You respect and feel not right for us to have our plights of suffering more than 200 years. Deaf children's need that should come first. After all, the parents looked for the easy way out and don't have real communication with their own Deaf children's needs. That should comes first from day one until now. That's their own naturally communication not audism people's communication of Hearing Standard only.

No matter if they can speak fair or good they still have the communication barrier between the parents and Deaf children or Deaf and Hearing people in this society. That hasn't changed a bit for years in our Deaf Education.

Anyway, I have read many posts you wrote, It is so amazing for a hearing person who does really listen so much about us and our true feelings from our Deaf experiences and our Deaf Education. You know the meaning of what real communication is all about. It's not just speech or orally speaking itself that helps undestand different kinds of lip movement with devices we have anyhow. I feel that it is very encouragement to have those Deaf children to read and write as soon as in early age if the parents are willing to learn ASL that will make a big difference for those Deaf children with ASL.

1. It s so true most of us Deaf children do not understand the concept of English language in some ways because we did not have American Sign Language that helps us to understand the CONCEPT of English language. So this way we could memorize everything as much as we could in the classroom and homework / study so we could pass the tests. I couldn't imaged how dare Audism people thinks they know everything! I ll give you an example - one guy who graduated Deaf school with valedictorian and guess what? He cannot write like me. He is very Deaf and had no ASL in the classroom.. UMMPPH Audism people are being so stupid to make him to use the oral method only.

2. NO American Sign Language in the classroom in public mainstream school while there are many Deaf kids who cannot hear with devices. How dare they let Deaf kids have no real communication while they were forced them to lipread that is not 100 percent to understand? They forced them to speak while hearing kids do not understand them as usual. I think it's very selfish of Audism to try to make us more disabled for nothing.

3. Keep it up what you are doing. You did a wonderful job. I want to say thank you for a big support and understanding where we are coming from. You are a good listener and have the concern of our self esteem and mental health that is important to you as I can see it very much. You are the one I never seen the kind of hearing person with so positive an outlook. Your son is very lucky to have you as a thoughtful and respectful mother of a Deaf son. You allowed him to be himself as a whole Deaf person as is. You taught him to cope and face his own deafness that should be a very positive outlook for him to live with.

Other thing - people cannot expect every Deaf person can hear everything. Also they cannot determine that NO deaf people are Deaf in this society. So they have the right to be with us all along instead of trying to destroy our Deaf community as well as I dont need to destroy Blind people's community because they are blind and wont be able to see the colors. So therefore it s same concept for deaf people who cannot hear or are "able to" hear that needs to have our visual languages and their Tactile Sign Language .I just learned Deaf/ Blind people who feel a real communication of tactile sign language. That is so amazing for them. It is called "Tactle" because it's American Sign Language that helps Deaf Blind people. It's a real communication that we have. We have he right to feel comfortable and express our true feelings without having a struggle or frustration in the converstation. People cannot expect Deaf/Blind to hear everything but the might be able to hear something because of being aware of that which helps him in a way. Some Deaf/Bblind don't want anything to do with it because they think it's nonsense for them to hear with all those noise pollution that is very annoying for them in many ways.

So there are many reasons for us not wanting deaf kids to hear. We can feel and we can understand other like music or sounds and they enjoy it. That doesnt mean they can hear like a hearing people.. Thats the whole point here. People need to be willing to seek the deep truth from me as a d/Deaf and ex HOH with too many artificial languages that confused me to learn English language. It's a real big time failure for many d/Deaf children as far as I am not talking about latened deaf people that cannot compare between d/Deaf and Latened Deaf in some ways. I know some latened deaf are not able to hear with any devices. That is why it is important to have ASL / ES that combines BI BI languages. That way we can get the equal education for all of us. If you dont agree it's still failure for Deaf Education because of audism people wont listen at all. That is a real domination over Deaf edcuation that turns me off .

That s what it's all about Deaf Natural Abilities and Adaptations that we can communicate with Hearing people in many ways while Hearing people are not able to understand us and our oral speaking. And, not do so very well in many ways while we are able to hear our devices. Who doesn't understand what real communication is all about for those Deaf children's Deaf Education? That doesnt limit us to learn more educational with ASL. Voices or nonvoices doesnt matter anymore ;) Ask yourself ;) It's already evident in that article that people ignored the whole truth.

We do not need the carts for each classrooms for each Deaf children in each Public/MainStream school. That is outrageous to spend all the money of our taxpayers. American Sign Language doesn't cost you or damage anything that harms Deaf children's Mind, Body, and Soul - which belongs to them not you. I strongly feel that no one can cross a person's boundaries is the answer.

I feel that all teacher or parents should learn ASL while they are dealing with or working with them. Therefore there it must having to be a real communication between both - not the third parties. That is not how we deal with deaf children. That is not who she or he is from a start.

"Then the whole thing is child abuse of their rights from day one. This goes all along in our Deaf education. They destroyed our goals to be successful. They are too afraid and there is much evidence of this of d/Deaf who are successful without devices. Why is that? Ask yourself again. "

BIG YES, keep learning new things since you are a nice open-minded person with a good heart. Guess what? You are a very liberated lady and stand up for what you truly saw as the truth all those years in the Deaf community. Dont give up, Jillo for Deaf children' s best interest that should come first. ;)

"Pure, Simple, Natural, Honest Total Communication; loving bonds between Deaf and Hearing people in this diverse world." Quote, Fact of Sweetmind's Beliefs in Natural Method:ASL. It tells you that there is "two way street" for Hearing and d/Deaf people.

Many thanks! ;)
Sweetmind
 
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Hi Jillo again, ;-)

I must say this from the bottom of my heart - I'll give you my rating of your nowledge and understanding our deafness and Deaf life.Your rating would be 100.0. At first I never knew you (of course) or have a chance to chat with you. I usually wait and see how it goes before I say anything. Some people are playing people's mind games and lied about it - that is how I knew and have very strong instinct feelings. I am so lucky to have this strong instinct feelings to be more useful than depending on my deaf ears. That is why I was hoping that we will meet each other someday if we get a chance as I have mentioned it once before in other topic. This case of meeting each other that we are here that is nothing to do with a favoritsim. Some self hatred deaf/ hearing need to back off. Dont let them stop you that easily. ;)

That's why I just wait for the right time to get to know their own thinking when I feel confident with a person who have a very positive outlook and full of knowledge about our Deaf culture. That is so wonderful to have someone like you.. YOU HAVE A HUGE DEAF HEART and CONCERN of Deaf children's self esteem / emotional/mental condition. You respect and feel not right for us to have our plights of suffering more than 200 years. Deaf children's need that should come first. After all, the parents looked for the easy way out and don't have real communication with their own Deaf children's needs. That should comes first from day one until now. That's their own naturally communication not audism people's communication of Hearing Standard only.

No matter if they can speak fair or good they still have the communication barrier between the parents and Deaf children or Deaf and Hearing people in this society. That hasn't changed a bit for years in our Deaf Education.

Anyway, I have read many posts you wrote, It is so amazing for a hearing person who does really listen so much about us and our true feelings from our Deaf experiences and our Deaf Education. You know the meaning of what real communication is all about. It's not just speech or orally speaking itself that helps undestand different kinds of lip movement with devices we have anyhow. I feel that it is very encouragement to have those Deaf children to read and write as soon as in early age if the parents are willing to learn ASL that will make a big difference for those Deaf children with ASL.

1. It s so true most of us Deaf children do not understand the concept of English language in some ways because we did not have American Sign Language that helps us to understand the CONCEPT of English language. So this way we could memorize everything as much as we could in the classroom and homework / study so we could pass the tests. I couldn't imaged how dare Audism people thinks they know everything! I ll give you an example - one guy who graduated Deaf school with valedictorian and guess what? He cannot write like me. He is very Deaf and had no ASL in the classroom.. UMMPPH Audism people are being so stupid to make him to use the oral method only.

2. NO American Sign Language in the classroom in public mainstream school while there are many Deaf kids who cannot hear with devices. How dare they let Deaf kids have no real communication while they were forced them to lipread that is not 100 percent to understand? They forced them to speak while hearing kids do not understand them as usual. I think it's very selfish of Audism to try to make us more disabled for nothing.

3. Keep it up what you are doing. You did a wonderful job. I want to say thank you for a big support and understanding where we are coming from. You are a good listener and have the concern of our self esteem and mental health that is important to you as I can see it very much. You are the one I never seen the kind of hearing person with so positive an outlook. Your son is very lucky to have you as a thoughtful and respectful mother of a Deaf son. You allowed him to be himself as a whole Deaf person as is. You taught him to cope and face his own deafness that should be a very positive outlook for him to live with.

Other thing - people cannot expect every Deaf person can hear everything. Also they cannot determine that NO deaf people are Deaf in this society. So they have the right to be with us all along instead of trying to destroy our Deaf community as well as I dont need to destroy Blind people's community because they are blind and wont be able to see the colors. So therefore it s same concept for deaf people who cannot hear or are "able to" hear that needs to have our visual languages and their Tactile Sign Language .I just learned Deaf/ Blind people who feel a real communication of tactile sign language. That is so amazing for them. It is called "Tactle" because it's American Sign Language that helps Deaf Blind people. It's a real communication that we have. We have he right to feel comfortable and express our true feelings without having a struggle or frustration in the converstation. People cannot expect Deaf/Blind to hear everything but the might be able to hear something because of being aware of that which helps him in a way. Some Deaf/Bblind don't want anything to do with it because they think it's nonsense for them to hear with all those noise pollution that is very annoying for them in many ways.

So there are many reasons for us not wanting deaf kids to hear. We can feel and we can understand other like music or sounds and they enjoy it. That doesnt mean they can hear like a hearing people.. Thats the whole point here. People need to be willing to seek the deep truth from me as a d/Deaf and ex HOH with too many artificial languages that confused me to learn English language. It's a real big time failure for many d/Deaf children as far as I am not talking about latened deaf people that cannot compare between d/Deaf and Latened Deaf in some ways. I know some latened deaf are not able to hear with any devices. That is why it is important to have ASL / ES that combines BI BI languages. That way we can get the equal education for all of us. If you dont agree it's still failure for Deaf Education because of audism people wont listen at all. That is a real domination over deaf edcuation that turns me off .

That s what it's all about Deaf Natural Abilities and Adaptations that we can communicate with Hearing people in many ways while Hearing people are not able to understand us and our oral speaking. And, not do so very well in many ways while we are able to hear our devices. Who doesn't understand what real communication is all about for those Deaf children's Deaf Education? That doesnt limit us to learn more educational with ASL. Voices or nonvoices doest matter anymore ;) Ask yourself ;) It's already evident in that article that people ignored the whole truth.

We do not need the carts for each classrooms for each Deaf children in each Public MainStream school. That is outrageous to spend all the money of our taxpayers. American Sign Language doesn't cost you or damage anything that harms Deaf children's Mind, Body, and Soul - which belongs to them not you. I feel that all teacher or parents should learn ASL while they are dealing with or working with them. Therefore there it must having to be a real communication between both - not the third parties. That is not how we deal with deaf children. That is not who she or he is from a start.

"Then the whole thing is child abuse of their rights from day one. This goes all along in our Deaf education. They destroyed our goals to be successful. They are too afraid and there is much evidence of this of d/Deaf who are successful without devices. Why is that? Ask yourself again. "

BIG YES, keep learning new things since you are a nice open-minded person with a good heart. Guess what? You are a very liberated lady and stand up for what you truly saw as the truth all those years in the Deaf community. Dont give it, Jillo. ;-)

Many thanks! ;)
Sweetmind

Awwww....you touched my heart, Sweetmind! I have no intention of giving up. But I will keep trying to learn and understand more.

You don't need tothank me for anything. I am only doing what I should be doing. I feel that it is the Deaf community I should be thanking for opening my eyes and giving me and my son the gift of ASL and their friendship. It has enriched my life. I'm just trying to repay my debt.:giggle:
 
No, Pek, I am second party, as I not only have a Deaf son, but numerous deaf/Deaf friends and acquaintences that I relate to on a ppersonal basis. It is those personal ties that led tothe professional development. Through those personal ties, I say that I had the abiltiy and the talents to help make the changes I see as necessary from a personal perspective. So, I am very much second party, and even much closer in my association that the typical hearing parent of a deaf child who has no ties to the deaf community themselves. I am involved not just because I have a Deaf son. That is waht started it, to be sure. But I have moved even beyond that to personal association that has nothing to do with my son. It is not just a part of his life that I share in, it is a part of my life, as well. A very valuable part, I might add, because it has made me a better person who has developed a tolerance and a respect for all differences.

jillio,

First of all, this revelation is news to me, as you never mentioned it, neither did anyone else, especially when you and jackie were going at it on another thread. Second, since you are a parent of a deaf child, you are indeed second party (deaf/hoh is first party). But, here's the difference now . . . when you advocate for other deaf people/children, you are third party. Just like when you consult an attorney for possible litigation, he/she becomes third party, but acts on behalf of first party.

Third, I think you owe me an apology, as well as to jackie, for keeping that information. I presumed you had no ties whatsoever to deaf people, other than working for them. I don't appreciate wearing egg by someone who should know better and sneaking around here incognito.
 
And that is exactly what I have said all along, rd . . .

Sorry, I disagree, jillio. This is NOT what you've said all along. Go back to that thread that you clowns had closed and you have the mentality of "my way or my way, I insist!" Go back and read the entire thread, as I won't discuss this any longer with you. I've lost too many nights worth of sleep because of it.
 
jillio,

First of all, this revelation is news to me, as you never mentioned it, neither did anyone else, especially when you and jackie were going at it on another thread. Second, since you are a parent of a deaf child, you are indeed second party (deaf/hoh is first party). But, here's the difference now . . . when you advocate for other deaf people/children, you are third party. Just like when you consult an attorney for possible litigation, he/she becomes third party, but acts on behalf of first party.

Third, I think you owe me an apology, as well as to jackie, for keeping that information. I presumed you had no ties whatsoever to deaf people, other than working for them. I don't appreciate wearing egg by someone who should know better and sneaking around here incognito.

Sorry that you were offended by not knowing Ihad a deaf son. I thought it was general knowledge by now.

And you are right, when I advocate for other deaf individuals,it is a different situation. But my experience and knowledge gained from ahving spent 21 years in a second party status give an advantage. And, I might add, I never advocate without permission of the one I am advocating for.
 
Sorry, I disagree, jillio. This is NOT what you've said all along. Go back to that thread that you clowns had closed and you have the mentality of "my way or my way, I insist!" Go back and read the entire thread, as I won't discuss this any longer with you. I've lost too many nights worth of sleep because of it.

I have read the entire thread, pek. Evidently you haven't. If you had, you would have realized that you are the "clown" that requested that the thread be closed.

Your choice not to discuss anything with me. Oh, well.......
 
You can do the voice but don't forget to ask people to repeat what they said. Don't respond to anything behind you. You know deaf people pretty well. Study them really well before you pull this off.
You won't understand 100% what it is like to be deaf unless you're deaf. The most you might get is maybe 90%.
The educators will have to come with a better teaching method again and again until the deaf people are 100% satisfied.

:gpost:
 
I have read the entire thread, pek. Evidently you haven't. If you had, you would have realized that you are the "clown" that requested that the thread be closed.

Your choice not to discuss anything with me. Oh, well.......

Hey, you should have said something. I've kept up with the conversation. I pm'ed Miss-Delectable about it, as I said. After that, things got really personal with each other. And speaking of clowns . . because of what you said, I have serious questions, as you think it's funny to be here incognito. I'm not incognito. You didn't even say anything. So what's up with that? I'm not mad, just a little disappointed in you, jillio. I feel you let me down.
 
Sorry that you were offended by not knowing Ihad a deaf son. I thought it was general knowledge by now.

And you are right, when I advocate for other deaf individuals,it is a different situation. But my experience and knowledge gained from ahving spent 21 years in a second party status give an advantage. And, I might add, I never advocate without permission of the one I am advocating for.

Okay. I forgive you. I don't keep track of who has what and don't go chasing everyone around here from thread to thread. I just don't have that kind of time, especially with school starting this week and financial aid problems that were worked out today, much to my relief. I was a little upset with you and I'm sorry for calling you a troll. I've deleted my comment.
 
Hey, you should have said something. I've kept up with the conversation. I pm'ed Miss-Delectable about it, as I said. After that, things got really personal with each other. And speaking of clowns . . because of what you said, I have serious questions, as you think it's funny to be here incognito. I'm not incognito. You didn't even say anything. So what's up with that? I'm not mad, just a little disappointed in you, jillio. I feel you let me down.

I haven't been incognito, Pek. You really need to stop accusing me of something I haven't done. I have mentioned my deaf son in any number of threads, including the one in which you are making reference. I don't use him as an example in all of my posts, because that is simply anecdote. I prefer to back up my position with research that has influenced me in my decisions. My son is now an adult, and a sophomore in college.

And if you are concerned about someone being incognito, why did you respond "Good Posting" to the reply from Buffalo suggesting that I indeed go incognito in order to gain a more complete understanding. You aren't making a lot of sense right now.
 
Okay. I forgive you. I don't keep track of who has what and don't go chasing everyone around here from thread to thread. I just don't have that kind of time, especially with school starting this week and financial aid problems that were worked out today, much to my relief. I was a little upset with you and I'm sorry for calling you a troll.

Apology accepted.
 
. . . You won't understand 100% what it is like to be deaf unless you're deaf. The most you might get is maybe 90%.
The educators will have to come with a better teaching method again and again until the deaf people are 100% satisfied.

This is how it should read, not what it said earlier and my good posting. Sorry.
 
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