When are we allowed to let Hearing people join our culture and all.

[gnulinuxman]

Gnu, what makes you think i force my daughter to speak??? I am a mother who made the best choice for MY daughter. Obviously i made the right choice for her because she loves talking and singing and listening to music. If it bothered her to hear and she she decided to not use the implant anymore ,then it would be her choice. At least i know i did what i had to do to make things easier for her later in life. I'm not saying all deaf people are dependent on others but i dont want my daughter to have to rely on interpreters and such. Obviously a CI or HA is not for everybody but you need to stop bashing people who actually have success stories. You only seem to put your 2 cents in when ripping on a parent who's child is succeeding with a CI. I don't even know why i bother with you anyways. Talk to me when you grow up and have a child of you own.

^^^^Perfect parent syndrome: the belief that no parent could ever do wrong.^^^^

The ulterior motive for the CI is more often than not "YAY! My daughter can hear! I am off the hook now! I don't need to learn to sign!" It is what lots of parents of implanted children are afraid to admit, esp. when they get this defensive.

There's a book out there called Great Deaf Americans who were INCREDIBLY successful without cochlear implants. Check it out sometime--you may be in for a surprise that hey--maybe this CI thing isn't the only choice.

 

[ismi]

Ever notice that the ones without kids are the ones with the most advice on parenting?

 

[Gemtun]

^^^^Perfect parent syndrome: the belief that no parent could ever do wrong.^^^^

The ulterior motive for the CI is more often than not "YAY! My daughter can hear! I am off the hook now! I don't need to learn to sign!" It is what lots of parents of implanted children are afraid to admit, esp. when they get this defensive.

There's a book out there called Great Deaf Americans who were INCREDIBLY successful without cochlear implants. Check it out sometime--you may be in for a surprise that hey--maybe this CI thing isn't the only choice.

Excuse me - that was uncalled for. "YAY! My daughter can hear! I am off the hook now! I dont need to learn to sign!"

Has anyone ACTUALLY said these words? If not, then stop jumping to harsh judgements about their decisions.

What is even more worse - you are NOT a parent yet yet you think you are entitled to judge other parents harshly. Wait until you become a parent before you realize what parents actually go through.

 

[Gemtun]

Ever notice that the ones without kids are the ones with the most advice on parenting?

Indeed :roll:

 

[loml]

dropping the friendly......

ismi

Ever notice that the ones without kids are the ones with the most advice on parenting?

I second that.

GNU through his own confession is a deviant hearing person. He fits the bill imo, as an adjective and a noun.

adj: Differing from a norm or from the accepted standards of a society.

n: One that differs from a norm, especially a person whose behavior and attitudes differ from accepted social standards.

I have my own list of adjectives and nouns, for GNU.

 

[loml]

Gnu, what makes you think i force my daughter to speak??? I am a mother who made the best choice for MY daughter. Obviously i made the right choice for her because she loves talking and singing and listening to music. If it bothered her to hear and she she decided to not use the implant anymore ,then it would be her choice. At least i know i did what i had to do to make things easier for her later in life. I'm not saying all deaf people are dependent on others but i dont want my daughter to have to rely on interpreters and such. Obviously a CI or HA is not for everybody but you need to stop bashing people who actually have success stories. You only seem to put your 2 cents in when ripping on a parent who's child is succeeding with a CI. I don't even know why i bother with you anyways. Talk to me when you grow up and have a child of you own.

Kayla123,

 

[Gemtun]

Gnu, what makes you think i force my daughter to speak??? I am a mother who made the best choice for MY daughter. Obviously i made the right choice for her because she loves talking and singing and listening to music. If it bothered her to hear and she she decided to not use the implant anymore ,then it would be her choice. At least i know i did what i had to do to make things easier for her later in life. I'm not saying all deaf people are dependent on others but i dont want my daughter to have to rely on interpreters and such. Obviously a CI or HA is not for everybody but you need to stop bashing people who actually have success stories. You only seem to put your 2 cents in when ripping on a parent who's child is succeeding with a CI. I don't even know why i bother with you anyways. Talk to me when you grow up and have a child of you own.

Well said! Dont let a few scare you away. Most of us (deafs) do support you.

 

[rockdrummer]

^^^^Perfect parent syndrome: the belief that no parent could ever do wrong.^^^^

The ulterior motive for the CI is more often than not "YAY! My daughter can hear! I am off the hook now! I don't need to learn to sign!" It is what lots of parents of implanted children are afraid to admit, esp. when they get this defensive.

There's a book out there called Great Deaf Americans who were INCREDIBLY successful without cochlear implants. Check it out sometime--you may be in for a surprise that hey--maybe this CI thing isn't the only choice.

Dude, you don't have a clue what you are talking about. I bet you don't even have children. You really come across like you are some sort of expert on deaf but yet you are hearing. Again, you don't have a clue. I know your girlfriend is deaf but remember that her experiences and beliefs don't speak for everyone and they certianly (in your case) don't expose you to what it's like to be deaf. Obviously you are anti CI. Tha'ts fine and it's your choice but your parent bashing is out of line. Even if you have walked a mile in my shoes it's still not your place to judge me or anyone for that matter. Try to conduct yourself with some respect for parents who are faced with a very difficult decision. And even if you don't agree with their choice you can still express that without being judjemental, condesending, belittling, and immature. No I am not talking about your response above specifically. I have read your posts and you respond in those manners many times. I have been through this process and I can tell you for a fact that your statements above are totally wrong. Expand your mind a bit and entertain the fact that for SOME, the CI has actually helped them.

 

[Angel]

Even if you have walked a mile in my shoes it's still not your place to judge me or anyone for that matter.

Exactly, that's what I've always say, " walk a miles in someone's shoes before making such a judgement "...

You go dude!

 

[jillio]

There is a blind culture, and culture doesn't require a separate language (unless you think that British and American society are identical ...).

Perhaps you should educate yourself a bit more. The identifying factor for culture is a shared language. Society is not the same as culture. And English spoken in Great Britian, and English spoken in America is not the same.
There is not a blind culture. They share the culture of the group with whom they associate. They adopt that spoken language. Braille is not a language, it is merely a tactile way to represent English. I suggest checking out a book or two from the library on cultural anthropology. Get back to me when you have a valid point to make.

 

[jillio]

Jillio, beautiful story! You have done a wonderful job raising your son. The Deaf Culture is very friendly to those who don't come in with high-and-mighty "I'm better because I can speak! Why should I sign?" attitudes. I learned that when I asked my fiancee to teach me to sign. She introduced me to this wonderful culture and I thank her for doing so.

Thanks, gnu! If I did a good job it is because the Deaf community opened their hearts to us.

 

[ismi]

Perhaps you should educate yourself a bit more. The identifying factor for culture is a shared language. ... There is not a blind culture. They share the culture of the group with whom they associate. They adopt that spoken language. Braille is not a language, it is merely a tactile way to represent English.

Don't condescend to tell me to educate myself - I understand cultural formation just fine, and I know that Braille is not a language. Also, belonging to one culture - for example, Deaf - doesn't preclude belonging to another - American, or regional (southern, midwestern, West Coast).

You mention that British and American English are different; this is somewhat true. Perhaps a better example would be to compare Americans from the Deep South with those from the West Coast. Both of those have their shared language (English), even if they have some dialectal differences. However, although the two regions are culturally very different, they still belong to American culture, Western (i.e., European-derived) culture, and so on.

Culture is not solely language, although language is a big part of it. Rather, culture is defined by shared experiences, worldviews, and values.

 

[Boult]

Dude, you don't have a clue what you are talking about. I bet you don't even have children. You really come across like you are some sort of expert on deaf but yet you are hearing. Again, you don't have a clue. I know your girlfriend is deaf but remember that her experiences and beliefs don't speak for everyone and they certianly (in your case) don't expose you to what it's like to be deaf. Obviously you are anti CI. Tha'ts fine and it's your choice but your parent bashing is out of line. Even if you have walked a mile in my shoes it's still not your place to judge me or anyone for that matter. Try to conduct yourself with some respect for parents who are faced with a very difficult decision. And even if you don't agree with their choice you can still express that without being judjemental, condesending, belittling, and immature. No I am not talking about your response above specifically. I have read your posts and you respond in those manners many times. I have been through this process and I can tell you for a fact that your statements above are totally wrong. Expand your mind a bit and entertain the fact that for SOME, the CI has actually helped them.

 

[Cloggy]

Dude, you don't have a clue what you are talking about. I bet you don't even have children. You really come across like you are some sort of expert on deaf but yet you are hearing. Again, you don't have a clue. I know your girlfriend is deaf but remember that her experiences and beliefs don't speak for everyone and they certianly (in your case) don't expose you to what it's like to be deaf. Obviously you are anti CI. Tha'ts fine and it's your choice but your parent bashing is out of line. Even if you have walked a mile in my shoes it's still not your place to judge me or anyone for that matter. Try to conduct yourself with some respect for parents who are faced with a very difficult decision. And even if you don't agree with their choice you can still express that without being judjemental, condesending, belittling, and immature. No I am not talking about your response above specifically. I have read your posts and you respond in those manners many times. I have been through this process and I can tell you for a fact that your statements above are totally wrong. Expand your mind a bit and entertain the fact that for SOME, the CI has actually helped them.

What are the odds on this being ignored by GNU?

 

[Victorias mom]

What are the odds on this being ignored by GNU?

And if he does answer, he will start ranting about Perfect Parent Syndrome again. He tried to lay that on me too. Telling me I don't love my daughter so I have to get her a CI so I can love her. Please! He has a lot to say about parenting, it's amazing how much someone without children can say about parenting choices. I am tired of hearing that hearing parents don't love their children, or are ashamed. It's a ridiculous statement. He claims it makes us look suspisious when we respond defensively. What does he expect? GNU, how would you feel if we told you that you don't love your fiance? Would you sit back and let people say that to you, or would you respond and tell us we don't know what we are talking about. My guess is it would annoy you and make you defensive. Honestly, I hope you never accuse anyone else here of not loving their children. It just makes you look ignorant and childish.

 

[gnulinuxman]

Dude, you don't have a clue what you are talking about. I bet you don't even have children. You really come across like you are some sort of expert on deaf but yet you are hearing. Again, you don't have a clue. I know your girlfriend is deaf but remember that her experiences and beliefs don't speak for everyone and they certianly (in your case) don't expose you to what it's like to be deaf.

You're coming across as an expert too, yet you hear too. Your son isn't the only deaf person out there either.

Obviously you are anti CI.

Three posts where I wished people good luck on their CI operations:
http://www.alldeaf.com/showthread.php?p=552991#post552991
http://www.alldeaf.com/showthread.php?p=547562#post547562
http://www.alldeaf.com/showthread.php?p=528743#post528743

I do NOT mind people getting them for themselves if it's their decision. What I do mind is parents forcing it on kids (and also some people are claming that nobody is forced to get them when in fact they really are forced by parents) and the "I can hear, you can't! :P " attitude I often see (most people who have it deny having it) I know Deaf Culture needs to let up on the CI bashing a little, but implantees and parents need to let up on the Deaf Culture bashing as well.

Tha'ts fine and it's your choice but your parent bashing is out of line. Even if you have walked a mile in my shoes it's still not your place to judge me or anyone for that matter. Try to conduct yourself with some respect for parents who are faced with a very difficult decision. And even if you don't agree with their choice you can still express that without being judjemental, condesending, belittling, and immature. No I am not talking about your response above specifically. I have read your posts and you respond in those manners many times. I have been through this process and I can tell you for a fact that your statements above are totally wrong. Expand your mind a bit and entertain the fact that for SOME, the CI has actually helped them.

Are you trying to say parents are all perfect? Hmmm...the most common reaction to deaf children is crying and "What did I do wrong?" and "Oh no!" I understand that some deaf people do like the CI. That's fine. What does bother me are the "It's all Deaf Culture's fault for bashing my kid!" and "It's all Deaf Culture's fault for hating me! They should know it's better to hear!" It is NEVER that direct, but in a subtle way, lots of hearing people and implantees are saying those things. It's a two way street.

 

[Cheri]

I am tired of hearing that hearing parents don't love their children, or are ashamed. It's a ridiculous statement.

Do you want to hear a true story? My mom was one of those hearing people just don't have any unconditional love to give from the day she recovered by many doctors, that my sister and I were losing our hearing and it was very possible we would become deaf that was at the age of five. My mother took it so hard, harder enough to wanted to leave us behind and walk away from us forever. I've heard so much stories by family relatives and my mom herself, she never accepted us the way we were from that day forward. She've always been so embarrased of us, she would tell her co-workers that she have two daughters at home that aren't her daughters, that her daughters were switched at birth. She have never been to any of my school activities nor took us anywhere for a ride with her. She didn't want me having deaf friends either, that was part of her house rules.

Life with her was so hard, that I couldn't possible breathe, It's hard to love someone like my mother repeatedly who doesn't love back or even seem to care. I'm her daughter for gawd sake! She always treated my sister and I like a second-class people. This had been going on for 35 long years going on 36. I'll never be her daughter as she says.

When I see the way gnulinuxman speaked out about CI on deaf children. I somewhat feel the same, because, when think of my mother, I think all hearing parents are so much alike, when a deaf child is welcome to the world, Parents rush into trying to "fix" a deaf child by getting a CI. How do I really know that they love their deaf children unconditional. I cannot seek in their heart to find out. But, I'll take their word for it.

 

[Victorias mom]

Do you want to hear a true story? My mom was one of those hearing people just don't have any unconditional love to give from the day she recovered by many doctors, that my sister and I were losing our hearing and it was very possible we would become deaf that was at the age of five. My mother took it so hard, harder enough to wanted to leave us behind and walk away from us forever. I've heard so much stories by family relatives and my mom herself, she never accepted us the way we were from that day forward. She've always been so embarrased of us, she would tell her co-workers that she have two daughters at home that aren't her daughters, that her daughters were switched at birth. She have never been to any of my school activities nor took us anywhere for a ride with her. She didn't want me having deaf friends either, that was part of her house rules.

Life with her was so hard, that I couldn't possible breathe, It's hard to love someone like my mother repeatedly who doesn't love back or even seem to care. I'm her daughter for gawd sake! She always treated my sister and I like a second-class people. This had been going on for 35 long years going on 36. I'll never be her daughter as she says.

When I see the way gnulinuxman speaked out about CI on deaf children. I somewhat feel the same, because, when think of my mother, I think all hearing parents are so much alike, when a deaf child is welcome to the world, Parents rush into trying to "fix" a deaf child by getting a CI. How do I really know that they love their deaf children unconditional. I cannot seek in their heart to find out. But, I'll take their word for it.

I am so sorry that you and your sister had to go through that. No child should ever have to feel that way, especially because of a parent's attitude. I don't understand some people, and I have no doubt that are people like your mother out there. I feel sorry for people like that, because she had 2 beautiful daughters and didn't love you guys the way you should have been loved. Children bring such joy, and she apparently would not let herself feel that. There are so many people who can't have children and would give their right arm for a child. Those people would feel blessed with a child with or without hearing, sight, etc.

I have no problem with people stating facts, like yourself. Or even someone giving their educated opinion, like you did. What I don't like is someone who does not know me, flat out telling me I don't love my child. I am on this site trying to find info out, and get advice. If I didn't love my daughter, I would not be doing this. My daughter is a beautiful little 5 month old, I wouldn't change her for the world!! I didn't expect her to be deaf, and it did surprise and upset us. This was something that never crossed our minds. Our entire family is hearing, why wouldn't she hear? We are definetly nothing like your mother, you can take my word on that. I just want the best for her, and right now I am doing the best thing for her. Trying the hearing aids to see how she responds, which happens to be very little.

It is important the way a person says something. You may feel very similiar to the way GNU feels, but the way you approach it is different. I respect everyone's opinion, and if it is said nicely and is an educated opinion, that it needs to be listened to. If it is rude, then the opinion doesn't mean much to me.

Thanks for sharing your story.

 

[Cheri]

I am on this site trying to find info out, and get advice. If I didn't love my daughter, I would not be doing this.

You're correct, You wouldn't be here if it wasn't for your daughter.

I didn't expect her to be deaf, and it did surprise and upset us.

That is pretty much every parents reaction would be at the begin, It's very common.

I just want the best for her, and right now I am doing the best thing for her.

I'm most certainly you are. Everyone wants best for their children, What is best anyways? We think we know what's best for our children, but we don't always make the right decision. I am a parent myself, Do I know I've made the best choice for my children? I dunno, at least I gave them life, I love them unconditional, that's what's most important.

 

[Victorias mom]

I'm most certainly you are. Everyone wants best for their children, What is best anyways? We think we know what's best for our children, but we don't always make the right decision. I am a parent myself, Do I know I've made the best choice for my children? I dunno, at least I gave them life, I love them unconditional, that's what's most important.

You are very right! Love is the most important thing you can give your children.