What do you agree that Sex-offender parents pose dilemma for schools?

[Maria]

ty Byrdie but unfortunately in the juvenile justice system there is no fair trial. I have learned alot over the years.

In the juvenile justice system trials are done the same as they would be in adult court believe this or not!

In the juvenile justice system trials are not heard by a jury of 12 men and women they are heard by a single trial judge.

If things had been done the same in the juvenile justice system as it is done in adult court. Then I truly believe my son and I would have had a fighting chance.

Tell me why it is in adult court that if I had accused you of rape, my whole past sexual history would have been brought out to life by your lawyer? Why is it that in juvenile court this is not so? The child my son was accused of *raping* was blamed 4 yes FOUR different times of raping and molesting other children!!! Why is that child still wandering around free and living with his mother, and never faced the inside of the court room? WHAT IS THIS TEACHING OUR CHILDREN???

To me it is teaching them that some people are favored while others are not. As for the foster father killing his 10 year old foster daughter, there was no plea bargain deal, he pleaded self defense and the judge agreed with that and gave him 3 years for INVOLUNTARY manslaughter!

Why would a grown man need to use such extreme measures of self defense against a 10 year old girl? It was even said that he didnt stab her just once but a total of 4 times! Does this sound like self defense to you?

Byrdie while you say your sorry that I am going through this. I appreciate that I do, I just wish you could know and see the injustices done every single day in our courtrooms!

My dear Bear,

See the bold highlights above, I believe it has to do with United Nations, the one who created " unconstitutional " laws for all courts. I don't see " constitution " laws ( Bill of Rights, Freedom of Speech, and so on ) anywhere anymore. It's eating ( erosion ) away everywhere in the United States...even, in schools where the zero tolerances are created and most of them doesn't make sense. Same with juvenile justice system. It doesn't make sense, either. It will make people pissed or balked or protested. They are creating chaotics everywhere and even, attempting to break up their marriages, family, and all from the good.

I find this very interesting about something, I just realized that everything that is about in the bible, they created everything opposite from the bible what the bible teach. I don't mean to bring the " bible " up, knowing that I am not supposed to talk about " religion " here - but, I am trying to show what the states are doing to our children, schools and even, campuses - I mean, everywhere where we see that there's something wrong out there. I will give you one example and you get the rest to get the idea : We want peace. They create the opposite from the peace to war. Everything that are backward. That's what makes the people NOT to understand and confused. They will keep protesting or fighting for their children or their rights. I can understand your situation when you fight for your son. I blame this on United Nations for creating nonsense laws.

I am worried about your son's safety when he comes home in March next year, because I don't trust people out there. When he comes home, please stay with him at all costs. Protect him as much as you can. You are his mother that he only has.

When I mentioned about " United Nations " -- that's IMO and observance. I am sure you are a good mother, Bear.

 

[Byrdie714]

ty Byrdie but unfortunately in the juvenile justice system there is no fair trial. I have learned alot over the years.

In the juvenile justice system trials are done the same as they would be in adult court believe this or not!

In the juvenile justice system trials are not heard by a jury of 12 men and women they are heard by a single trial judge.

If things had been done the same in the juvenile justice system as it is done in adult court. Then I truly believe my son and I would have had a fighting chance.

Tell me why it is in adult court that if I had accused you of rape, my whole past sexual history would have been brought out to life by your lawyer? Why is it that in juvenile court this is not so? The child my son was accused of *raping* was blamed 4 yes FOUR different times of raping and molesting other children!!! Why is that child still wandering around free and living with his mother, and never faced the inside of the court room? WHAT IS THIS TEACHING OUR CHILDREN???

To me it is teaching them that some people are favored while others are not. As for the foster father killing his 10 year old foster daughter, there was no plea bargain deal, he pleaded self defense and the judge agreed with that and gave him 3 years for INVOLUNTARY manslaughter!

Why would a grown man need to use such extreme measures of self defense against a 10 year old girl? It was even said that he didnt stab her just once but a total of 4 times! Does this sound like self defense to you?

Byrdie while you say your sorry that I am going through this. I appreciate that I do, I just wish you could know and see the injustices done every single day in our courtrooms!

I am going to answer your questions in order as much as I can...

* In adult court, the defense lawyer can inquire about your sexual experiences to demonstrate the kind of person you are. Also when this tactic is being used, they are also seeing if the sexual health matches the accused. Example: A man accused of raping a woman. The man has a STD, the woman doesn't. If the woman was raped by the man with an STD and didn't use protection, why doesn't she have an STD? It's to raise reasonable doubt in the court's eyes.

*The reason why that one child who has been accused of raping other children is still wandering around free is because there is insufficient evidence supporting that accusation.

* As for the involuntary manslaughter of the foster father against his 10 year daughter and getting 3 years is due to a number of reasons: the psychological/mental health of the 10 year old, the circumstances leading up to the said event, plea bargaining, etc. Also, question for you: what would you do if a 10 year old is coming at you with a knife? Kids are unpredictable.

* I have seen situations in the courtroom that don't even get mentioned in everyday press that would make one's skin crawl.

It's not the best system and there is always room for improvement, but its the best we have at the moment.

 

[Byrdie714]

They only get compensation from the state if they choose to file a civil lawsuit for wrongful conviction and imprisonment.

And money makes up for the time lost with family? How do you decide how much a year is worth?

And, oops, I'm sorry just doesn't cut it.

The amount is usually decided between the two parties, the State and the person that was jailed for wrongful imprisonment. They both usually sign a confidential agreement not detailing what the terms are as well.

I agree jillio, sometimes I wonder if it's worth it.

 

[Byrdie714]

The judicial system does not function in an equitable manner. And most of the time it has nothing to do with law, but with SES, race, and abiltiy to but buy oneself a lesser sentence through high priced legal representation. And, if our justice system is so effective, how do you account for the discrepancies in prison populations?

* There are more people now.

* The ageing population.

* Repeat offenders.

* "3 Strikes, You're Out" method isn't working. (That is whole different thread topic.....)

* Society is more aware of crimes now a days then they were 20 years ago. (i.e. sexual harrassment, drugs, etc.)

This is only the tip of the iceberg....

 

[Byrdie714]

Their apology is not enough nor a small compensation from the state, They had to stay locked up for something they did not do and the system failed them by taking all those years away from them. no amount of money or an apologies can make that up to them.

Nothing can but a fair compensation by the State and the charges expunged on their record is a start.

Remember, you are also the State. Example:

" Please rise, Honorable John Doe presiding. People of Ohio VS. Santa Claus..."

You are the People of Ohio.

 

[Byrdie714]

My dear Bear,

See the bold highlights above, I believe it has to do with United Nations, the one who created " unconstitutional " laws for all courts. I don't see " constitution " laws ( Bill of Rights, Freedom of Speech, and so on ) anywhere anymore. It's eating ( erosion ) away everywhere in the United States...even, in schools where the zero tolerances are created and most of them doesn't make sense. Same with juvenile justice system. It doesn't make sense, either. It will make people pissed or balked or protested. They are creating chaotics everywhere and even, attempting to break up their marriages, family, and all from the good.

I find this very interesting about something, I just realized that everything that is about in the bible, they created everything opposite from the bible what the bible teach. I don't mean to bring the " bible " up, knowing that I am not supposed to talk about " religion " here - but, I am trying to show what the states are doing to our children, schools and even, campuses - I mean, everywhere where we see that there's something wrong out there. I will give you one example and you get the rest to get the idea : We want peace. They create the opposite from the peace to war. Everything that are backward. That's what makes the people NOT to understand and confused. They will keep protesting or fighting for their children or their rights. I can understand your situation when you fight for your son. I blame this on United Nations for creating nonsense laws.

I am worried about your son's safety when he comes home in March next year, because I don't trust people out there. When he comes home, please stay with him at all costs. Protect him as much as you can. You are his mother that he only has.

When I mentioned about " United Nations " -- that's IMO and observance. I am sure you are a good mother, Bear.

*United Nations????

*When your son is being released, you need to look into the possibility of relocating to somewhere else if you want your son to start new again. If you stay where you are, it will only make things worse as everything will be a constant reminder.

 

[Bear]

Byrdie I have already moved. Now imagine if my son had had to register as a sex offender, thank god he doesn't but if he had, then we would most likely be legislated out of our home.

This is another point I am bringing up repeatedly in this thread. The sex offender registry is not working as it was meant to. When are we as a people, gonna say obviously this is not working? Let's toss it out and start all over again with something that will work?

You offer up some very good arguements for the system, but one thing you are outright neglecting to mention is bias. Now you may want to deny that bias happens within our current system, but sadly you would be wrong. Favoritism is played out in court almost every single day.r

Some people do not do sentences to fit the crime simply because they are celebrities, friends with the judge, or a big political supporter.


Do you deny that if I had been rich and could have afforded to fight this system and keep fighting that things would not have turned out differently???

I know they would have, because in our old hometown money does talk there.

Our old hometown has faced many investigations into the city in the past due to corruption. Sad to say, they need to be investigated again.

Its not a conspiracy theory, it is fact. Many people will tell you about the corruption in that town. And those same people aren't having trouble with them like I am.

Some people in that town are simply held above the law. They definitely pick on the people they dont like. There have been several lawsuits against the police department for harrassment. And Im sure there will be more.

In that town, it is not about whats right or wrong, but about who you know and how much money you have.

The childrens services department in that town is held above the law. You wouldnt believe the stuff that department gets away with. They have come into the news several times within the last few years alone. And still operating!

 

[Byrdie714]

Byrdie I have already moved. Now imagine if my son had had to register as a sex offender, thank god he doesn't but if he had, then we would most likely be legislated out of our home.

This is another point I am bringing up repeatedly in this thread. The sex offender registry is not working as it was meant to. When are we as a people, gonna say obviously this is not working? Let's toss it out and start all over again with something that will work?

You offer up some very good arguements for the system, but one thing you are outright neglecting to mention is bias. Now you may want to deny that bias happens within our current system, but sadly you would be wrong. Favoritism is played out in court almost every single day.r

Some people do not do sentences to fit the crime simply because they are celebrities, friends with the judge, or a big political supporter.


Do you deny that if I had been rich and could have afforded to fight this system and keep fighting that things would not have turned out differently???

I know they would have, because in our old hometown money does talk there.

Our old hometown has faced many investigations into the city in the past due to corruption. Sad to say, they need to be investigated again.

Its not a conspiracy theory, it is fact. Many people will tell you about the corruption in that town. And those same people aren't having trouble with them like I am.

Some people in that town are simply held above the law. They definitely pick on the people they dont like. There have been several lawsuits against the police department for harrassment. And Im sure there will be more.

In that town, it is not about whats right or wrong, but about who you know and how much money you have.

The childrens services department in that town is held above the law. You wouldnt believe the stuff that department gets away with. They have come into the news several times within the last few years alone. And still operating!

Small town poltics and the "Good Ol' Boy" network, I am familiar with as I am also from a small town in Ohio. I agree that it is disgusting.

( In italics ) What isn't working with the sexual offender registry? If the publics wants to know, they can access those records via internet, in Ohio--E-SCORN. It's a safety tool for parents with children.

( In bold ) Unfortunately who doesn't have bias? Everyone has bias even when you say you don't. I am not going to lie, the court system has bias as well because it's run by people like you and me.

Favoritism does have affect on the judge. If one is belligerent towards the judge, they will throw the book at you. But if one is nice and does everything that the judge wants, they will go lenient on you. May even dismiss your case.

Remember the old saying in college, " The hand that writes on the board is the hand that controls your grade? "

We have a similiar saying in the court system: " The hand that controls that gravel is the one that can control your life."

 

[Angel]

:roll:

Everyone does get a fair trial! I would gladly trade places with Bear if I could but I can't-- I'm not Bear.

Yet the one thing I can do is give advice on "working the system".

Are you a lawyer? how do you really know that everyone get a fair trial? and if you know soo much about justice system, why don't you tell us exactly what they do there and what kind of help do they offer for these children?

 

[Angel]

Oh Byrdie714? I suggest you to buy a book called "The Innocent Man." I almost brought it today but sadly I didn't have enough money.

Also I could pull up many stories about innocent people behind bars, and how the system fail to protect them.

So you say everyone gets a fair trial? oh pleazzzzzzzzze :roll:

 

[jillio]

* There are more people now.

* The ageing population.

* Repeat offenders.

* "3 Strikes, You're Out" method isn't working. (That is whole different thread topic.....)

* Society is more aware of crimes now a days then they were 20 years ago. (i.e. sexual harrassment, drugs, etc.)

This is only the tip of the iceberg....

Sorry, but none of that explains the discrepancies in the prison population. And, if the jsutice system was so effective, redicivism would go down, not up.
More people and an aging population does not explain the disparity in sentencing and conviction in certain populations.

 

[jillio]

Small town poltics and the "Good Ol' Boy" network, I am familiar with as I am also from a small town in Ohio. I agree that it is disgusting.

( In italics ) What isn't working with the sexual offender registry? If the publics wants to know, they can access those records via internet, in Ohio--E-SCORN. It's a safety tool for parents with children.

( In bold ) Unfortunately who doesn't have bias? Everyone has bias even when you say you don't. I am not going to lie, the court system has bias as well because it's run by people like you and me.

Favoritism does have affect on the judge. If one is belligerent towards the judge, they will throw the book at you. But if one is nice and does everything that the judge wants, they will go lenient on you. May even dismiss your case.

Remember the old saying in college, " The hand that writes on the board is the hand that controls your grade? "

We have a similiar saying in the court system: " The hand that controls that gravel is the one that can control your life."

And the justice system, if functioning the way it is intended, is supposed to be free of bias. That is not to say that the judges and lawyers do not have personal bias, but that they cannot allow it to affect the deciding of sentences and cannot use it as an excuse for not providing effect legal counsel. Unfortunately, it occurs far too often, and is an outright violation of right of due process.

I find it a bit odd, if you are working within the justice system as you implied with that "we have a saying", that you don't know that its called a gavel. Gravel is something you put on the driveway.

 

[Bear]

You say judges cannot play favoritism?? Then explain the golf buddy syndrome? Some lawyers hope for a certain judge simply cause they are close to the judge or that judge is lenient on certain crimes. And POLITICS plays a huge role in sentencing in a voting year.

 

[Maria]

You say judges cannot play favoritism?? Then explain the golf buddy syndrome? Some lawyers hope for a certain judge simply cause they are close to the judge or that judge is lenient on certain crimes. And POLITICS plays a huge role in sentencing in a voting year.

Was it from the jury to make the decisions for verdict or was it from the judge directly that make the decisions ?

 

[Reba]

Maybe we should start a new thread concerning the trial system?

Anyway, if our present system is so flawed, and there are so many "innocent" people in prison, what should we do? Believe every prisoner who claims to be "innocent"? Let all the prisoners out of jail? Quit prosecuting crimes? Overturn every guilty verdict? What's the solution?

 

[jillio]

:roll:

Everyone does get a fair trial! I would gladly trade places with Bear if I could but I can't-- I'm not Bear.

Yet the one thing I can do is give advice on "working the system".

If it is possible to "work the system" then that in and of itself proves that the system is inherently unfair and flawed.

 

[jillio]

You say judges cannot play favoritism?? Then explain the golf buddy syndrome? Some lawyers hope for a certain judge simply cause they are close to the judge or that judge is lenient on certain crimes. And POLITICS plays a huge role in sentencing in a voting year.

Exactly. Decisions have often been made, and plea bargains agreed to between judges and lawyers before the defendent ever appears in court. Waht do you think is going on in judge's chambers prior to a hearing? They aren't back there talking about the weather.

 

[jillio]

Maybe we should start a new thread concerning the trial system?

Anyway, if our present system is so flawed, and there are so many "innocent" people in prison, what should we do? Believe every prisoner who claims to be "innocent"? Let all the prisoners out of jail? Quit prosecuting crimes? Overturn every guilty verdict? What's the solution?

Applying policy in an equitable manner would be a start.

 

[shel90]

:roll:

Everyone does get a fair trial! I would gladly trade places with Bear if I could but I can't-- I'm not Bear.

Yet the one thing I can do is give advice on "working the system".

I just finished reading John Grisham's book "The Innocent Man." It woke my eyes up about people getting a "fair" trial. I suggest you read it..BTW it is a non-fiction book so the events in the book happened in real life. I was shocked by how corrupt the police, the fingerprinting dept, the lawyers and the judges were in that one town in Oklahoma.

 

[shel90]

They usually get a letter of a apology and suitable compensation from the State.

In that book I read, the innocent men who got released after DNA proved their innocence never get any letter nor formal apologies from the state, the police, the lawyers, nor even the judges.