cochlear implants

[Cloggy]

NO way for legally deaf that become a hearing person or functionally hearing 100 percent with Devices unless a person is latened deaf but it s still no promise to get their hearing back.. I do not believe it .. PERIOD!!!!

Even a hearing person will not hear 100%, so you are absolutely right. I have trouble understanding conversations in noisy environment and my ears are excellent.

But why do you not believe members on this board that do very well with their hearing aids or CI?
In effect, you are calling them liars!

 

[sr171soars]

Even a hearing person will not hear 100%, so you are absolutely right. I have trouble understanding conversations in noisy environment and my ears are excellent.

But why do you not believe members on this board that do very well with their hearing aids or CI?
In effect, you are calling them liars!

Yep, that is the impression I get too! I don't know if SM could admit that there is a broad...very broad spectrum of outcomes when using some form of assistance for deafness.

 

[sr171soars]

I'm sorry but I have a CI and while I'm not a 100% "functional hearing" person now, I come DAMN close! Why 3 months post activation, I was using a phone to converse with friends and family! I know from a biological standpoint I'm clinically deaf if I'm not wearing my processor - but I wear it every waking moment that I can, and I LOVE being able to hear.



Your letting YOUR bad experiences color your opinion on how it will be for everybody. News flash for you - I have friends who were born deaf and they have PERFECT speech. And not just 1 or 2 people but MANY. How would you explain that? One of my best friends is a very successful ultrasound technician and she has fantastic speech. How is that an "audist attitude" when its proven that many people who are born deaf CAN learn to speak concisely? Just because YOU didn't doesn't mean its a total failure and should never be attempted with anyone else.



You can chose to not believe it - but the evidence has been presented to you time and time again- look at the posters who have discussed the success rates of their children. I believe it was Cloggy who said her 3 year old daughter can use the phone, perfectly repeats what is told to her, and even uses intonation! That's pretty close to being "functionally hearing with the assistance of a CI" in my eyes! (And I'm so thrilled for her!)

I was going to post a reply but you took care of it nicely!

 

[sr171soars]

I'm going to have to take a break, and walk away from this thread - this is, without a doubt, the most judgemental, accusatory, and asinine comment I have read in YEARS.

If her daughter WANTS to integrate with other deaf people the opportunity is THERE....how dare you say she took her daughter's rights away. With her CI she has MORE chances at communication than without it. Why can't YOU respect her choice and the fact her daughter is happy, and let them live their own lives? They're not telling YOU what to do.

This touches on the real issue of all the "back and forth" arguments and disagreements with CIs for children (and of course for adults too but they won't admit that). Fundamentally, certain people believe that deaf is "natural" and there should be no attempt to alter the person's basic state of deafness. A CI does that technically speaking whereas a HA doesn't (In truth - both do but one can be removed without a "trace"). In any case, if you are deaf, one should accept that reality and embrace it.

Like those who argue otherwise, I believe that is an outdated and outmoded way of thinking. We need to give anybody the chance to join the hearing world where the majority of people live and be a part of that community. There will always be those who don't want to or doesn't work for and that should be accepted as well. I think the key word is flexibility so everybody can just be cool with the choices one makes. As an aside, I think that is happening but you always have "them".

As we can see, the war is far from being over but I do believe it is a rearguard fight as technology marches on and most of these arguments will be moot point. Les, anybody misunderstand me, there will probably still be a deaf community in some form or fashion. But for those who choose (or least attempt to) otherwise, let it come....

 

[Passivist]

This touches on the real issue of all the "back and forth" arguments and disagreements with CIs for children (and of course for adults too but they won't admit that). Fundamentally, certain people believe that deaf is "natural" and there should be no attempt to alter the person's basic state of deafness. A CI does that technically speaking whereas a HA doesn't (In truth - both do but one can be removed without a "trace"). In any case, if you are deaf, one should accept that reality and embrace it.

Like those who argue otherwise, I believe that is an outdated and outmoded way of thinking. We need to give anybody the chance to join the hearing world where the majority of people live and be a part of that community. There will always be those who don't want to or doesn't work for and that should be accepted as well. I think the key word is flexibility so everybody can just be cool with the choices one makes. As an aside, I think that is happening but you always have "them".

As we can see, the war is far from being over but I do believe it is a rearguard fight as technology marches on and most of these arguments will be moot point. Les, anybody misunderstand me, there will probably still be a deaf community in some form or fashion. But for those who choose (or least attempt to) otherwise, let it come....

The problem is pretty basic, everyone supports a lost cause ! even if they don't agree with it, they will fight for the right of people to say it, so it drags on, because nobody will say OK we take your point, we respect it, but enough is enough, and that cause is lost.. I am just sad there is so much fear about the whole thing from the cultural and signing sector, it is this what drives them, not others choice, the fear, that many peers might some day opt out of the whole thing, leaving those who cannot benefit well and truly alone, it's a powerful driving force, which could be addressed by teaching deaf at day one, there has to more options open to them than a deaf world, and give them wherever possible the tools to do the communication job (And without the politics).

 

[Boult]

Thank you for your honest. It s kinda sad to limit those d/Deaf children to play a "rough" sport. As for a swimmer with their device cannot go deeper in the water that will ruin your device inside your head. Thats scuba diver that CIer people cannot have that.

Actually a ci user can go scuba diving as long it is recreational type. I can go swimming even deep in swimming pool of any size and depth. The only thing that ci user cannot do in water is DEEP SCUBA DIVING (that's different from (RECREATIONAL SCUBA DIVING). the difference is the Atmosphere depth. You cannot go deep than 20 meter without life support anyway. water will not ruin the device. the device is tightly sealed. the only thing that can ruin while in water is implosion (opposite of explosion) is if go very deep than 25 meters then the device will shrink and cause damage. so from surface of water to 20 meters no harms!

So yes CI'ers can do scuba diving or snorkeling or swimming but not deep scuba diving. get it.

 

[Boult]

My Freedom implant is made of titanium and platinum. Both are pure metals and do not "corrode". Besides - the ONLY part of my implant that is invasive is the electrode loop that is inside my cochlea. EVERYTHING ELSE resides OUTSIDE the head! Have you ever watched a cochlear implantation? Have you researched exactly what's involved? I've seen one LIVE. The transmitter itself simply rests in a shallow "bowl" that's carved into the bone. Its not INSIDE the head or in the brain, and its removable (you can even with minor surgery remove the metal center of it in order to have an MRI!).

They've done massive research with regards to the way the head reacts to metals and have found time and time again it is safe - why else do you think they use metal clips and screws to hold together the plates of the head when they have to do brain surgery on someone, or if they've cracked their head open from an accident? All you have to do is talk to adults who were implanted as a child and find out from them. So YES the research is there.

I understand your fears - nobody is FORCING your child to get an implant. But if somebody does make the choice to have their child implanted you should respect that choice. They are doing what they believe is best for their child, and that should be of no consequence to you.

Yes, the device's casing is titanium but the casing is coated with silicone so no harms to internal organs. and the life of internal implants can run more than 10 yrs or more as long the electronics inside the device last. I know one lady who had her first implant died after more than 22 yrs. and got reimplanted. I know I posted that somewhere on AD years ago.

Neecy is right, the device is not inserted beyond the skull's wall. It actually sit on the surface of skull which is recessed into bowl like area. There is no metal screw to hold down the device. It is secured by non-dissolving threads threaded thru a series of hole around the edge of recessed bowl and it hold the device in place.

 

[Momoftwo]

She is not talking about your daughter's ability to speak, She is talking about your words of putting in that your child is hearing, when your daughter is not hearing, She only hears when she has a CI on, but not the same as a hearing person. You know being deaf was not a tragedy, There are best educational out there for the deaf, Oral, Total Communication, Mainstream, Deaf education. You never gave your daughter a chance to experience her role of being deaf, It's almost like telling your daughter she isn't good enough as being deaf. Just because you are hearing you want your daughter to be you, When she is not you. She is her own person. She's special because she is deaf. You took her rights away.




Stands for "Rolling my eyes"

AMEN!!!!! I totally agree with you.

CI is no big deal and that's why I'm not interested in debating about CI. Like some women like to use make up and some other women think using make up is bad. Or....some people like to drink beer and some other people think drinking the beer is bad. It's all about choices. CI is not WOW - just say "oh, CI helps few people hear better and that's it".

It's silly to argue over CI. But overall, CI is out of question.

NUMBER ONE is human being with being so healthy. Being deaf is so what. Being deaf is NOT awful, NOT sad, etc. Being deaf is part of celebration because it shows you that you are a very strong person that can handle it very well. Deaf people have stronger to handle than hearing people. So, deaf people should be very proud of being accomplished!

 

[Cloggy]

CI is no big deal and that's why I'm not interested in debating about CI. Like some women like to use make up and some other women think using make up is bad. Or....some people like to drink beer and some other people think drinking the beer is bad. It's all about choices.

WOW, :jaw: what a comparison..... I really don't know what to say!

 

[Gemtun]

She is not talking about your daughter's ability to speak, She is talking about your words of putting in that your child is hearing, when your daughter is not hearing, She only hears when she has a CI on, but not the same as a hearing person. You know being deaf was not a tragedy, There are best educational out there for the deaf, Oral, Total Communication, Mainstream, Deaf education. You never gave your daughter a chance to experience her role of being deaf, It's almost like telling your daughter she isn't good enough as being deaf. Just because you are hearing you want your daughter to be you, When she is not you. She is her own person. She's special because she is deaf. You took her rights away.
QUOTE]

Excuse me but having a CI does not mean that the person is not Deaf or deaf anymore. The person is STILL deaf with a CI. A CI is just a freakin' TOOL!

I am growing tired of seeing people making such harsh judgments such as above mentioned. We have our own rights or choices as much as you have your own rights or choices so why are you bashing this woman?

My 11 year old niece is STILL deaf - she speaks and hears wonderfully with her CI and she DOES sign. She DOES still go to deaf events, etc. The only difference between her and the other kids who dont have CIs is that my niece has ALL tools.

You mentioned Oral educaton - so that is what my niece is doing exactly. Why cant she use a CI to help with her Oral education? Must she suffer with her two HA's that would not help her like a CI would? Why deprive her right of having a better tool to assist with her in Oral Education???

I remember suffering through schools all of my life as my HA's were not good enough, event hough I was a brilliant lipreader, but had I a CI back then, I would have done much better at school. I would not have gone to school every morning with an upset stomach.

You overlooked the fact where Cloggy said that her daughter does sign. I dont see where she is depriving her daughter of being deaf. Her daughter will ALWAYS be deaf or Deaf with excellent speech skills. We keep forgeting that Deafness is not only of hearing loss itself but identity that goes along with it.

CI does not cure period - why cant folks get it?! I dont think it was appropriate that you said that she took her daughter's rights away. Parents have every right to make decisions for their kids. You would not appreciate it if someone was telling you that you are taking your son's right away either. You are doing your best period for your sons as much as Cloggy is for hers.

Remember - its a TOOL, not a CURE.

 

[Cheri]

Gemtun,

You haven't read the entire thread, Cloggy have said it more than three times that her daughter was born deaf and now is hearing. So, I already knew that CI is not a cure. I kept telling her that, it doesn't matter how you look at my post, I have every right to express my feelings regarding about children and I am not bashing on her. I always had been standing up for children rights for their voices to be heard since I've became a member of this forum. My heart, my thoughts and my mind doesn't change that fact how I feel.

 

[Gemtun]

AMEN!!!!! I totally agree with you.

CI is no big deal and that's why I'm not interested in debating about CI. Like some women like to use make up and some other women think using make up is bad. Or....some people like to drink beer and some other people think drinking the beer is bad. It's all about choices. CI is not WOW - just say "oh, CI helps few people hear better and that's it".

It's silly to argue over CI. But overall, CI is out of question.

NUMBER ONE is human being with being so healthy. Being deaf is so what. Being deaf is NOT awful, NOT sad, etc. Being deaf is part of celebration because it shows you that you are a very strong person that can handle it very well. Deaf people have stronger to handle than hearing people. So, deaf people should be very proud of being accomplished!

Excuse me but you said yourself " It is silly to argue over CI." But aren't you arguing your point by comparing this to people wearing makeup or people drinking beer?! I see this as contradictory.

CI issue itself will always be a controversey - if you don't like this and think it is easily comparable to wearing makeup or drinking beer, then don't bother coming into this thread to post. It is a very serious issue that affects every aspect of society.

 

[Gemtun]

Gemtun,

You haven't read the entire thread, Cloggy have said it more than three times that her daughter was born deaf and now is hearing. So, I already knew that CI is not a cure. I kept telling her that, it doesn't matter how you look at my post, I have every right to express my feelings regarding about children and I am not bashing on her. I always had been standing up for children rights for their voices to be heard since I've became a member of this forum. My heart, my thoughts and my mind doesn't change that fact how I feel.

I am not bashing you for your own beliefs - that is the difference. You can reach out to others without bashing them. If you use such strong language, you will never be able to help them change their attitudes or values. Instead you will make them defensive and cling onto their own attitudes.

You rolled your eyes - that is a bashing attitude too. How else someone else could read your post and really be affected by your beliefs if you roll your eyes and make such strong statements as "youre taking away your daughter's rights." ?

 

[Cloggy]

Gemtun,

You haven't read the entire thread, Cloggy have said it more than three times that her daughter was born deaf and now is hearing. So, I already knew that CI is not a cure. I kept telling her that, it doesn't matter how you look at my post, I have every right to express my feelings regarding about children and I am not bashing on her. I always had been standing up for children rights for their voices to be heard since I've became a member of this forum. My heart, my thoughts and my mind doesn't change that fact how I feel.

Cheri, you are right. I did say that. But the problem is in the definition of "deaf" and "hearing". I asked you several times for it, but to no effect. Please put your thoughts here.

Wondering what you mean with "So, I already knew that CI is not a cure."

 

[Gemtun]

rockdrummer,
There is nothing wrong with people feeling this way included myself. Nobody had said anything about outlawing parents rights to deciding what's best for their children.
QUOTE]

Then please explain this, Cheri. Your previous posts didnt express this? Didn't you tell Cloggy that she took away her daughter's rights?

You even said that there is nothign w ong with people feeling this way - so then that means there was nothing wrong with Cloggy or other people feeling about getting CI for their kids, too.

 

[Momoftwo]

Excuse me but you said yourself " It is silly to argue over CI." But aren't you arguing your point by comparing this to people wearing makeup or people drinking beer?! I see this as contradictory.

CI issue itself will always be a controversey - if you don't like this and think it is easily comparable to wearing makeup or drinking beer, then don't bother coming into this thread to post. It is a very serious issue that affects every aspect of society.

Too bad!

 

[Gemtun]

Too bad!

Nice way of debating, indeed.

 

[Cloggy]

Too bad!

And you are how old?

 

[Gemtun]

Gemtun,

You haven't read the entire thread, Cloggy have said it more than three times that her daughter was born deaf and now is hearing. So, I already knew that CI is not a cure. I kept telling her that, it doesn't matter how you look at my post, I have every right to express my feelings regarding about children and I am not bashing on her. I always had been standing up for children rights for their voices to be heard since I've became a member of this forum. My heart, my thoughts and my mind doesn't change that fact how I feel.

I may not have read the entire thread but I have read enough to understand what is going on. Her definition of deafness is different from yours. Everyone has their OWN perspective of deafness. We jump to conclusions before we even ask others what they MEAN by their OWN definition. The word hearing and deafness are sooooo broad - every one of us approach these words with totally different background, experiences and values.

Please help me clarify this. You said this:There are best educational out there for the deaf, Oral, Total Communication, Mainstream, Deaf education in an earlier posting.

You did not address other parts of my posting - why is it okay for kid to have ORAL or Mainstream education but cant have a CI to help benefit with it?? I see no sense in your endorsing Oral and Mainstreamed Educational settings yet think a kid should not have a CI to use while in Oral or Mainstreamed Educational setting?

 

[Cheri]

You did not address other parts of my posting - why is it okay for kid to have ORAL or Mainstream education but cant have a CI to help benefit with it?? I see no sense in your endorsing Oral and Mainstreamed Educational settings yet think a kid should not have a CI to use while in Oral or Mainstreamed Educational setting?

When my parents recovered that I became deaf at the age of five, My dad did some digging in educational, gather information that fit right for me as a deaf person, I know that for matter of fact that hearing parents with deaf children have no knowledge what to do until they start digging through. Parents also need to understand the importance of being flexible, in meaning when a deaf child is born into a family, they have to find ways to communicated with their child, by using sign language, finding the right education. CI is the least on a child's list just because hearing parents want their deaf child to hear because a deaf child is missing out the meaning to hear. That's not even accepting the child who he/she is as a person, a person who is deaf.

Decisions do not need to be made immediately, when a child has not yet experience their role in trying the education that I mention above. What happened to even trying those education out to see how much a child would developed, instead they jump onto CI implant to avoid the disappointing that might overcome. I always believe a child should be involved in a discussion regarding any changes that would effect them for life. (Which meaning CI)

It's very common for hearing parents who have deaf children who have no experience with deafness, until they search some information. But to be honest no deaf person is the same as another deaf person, Like I said before each person is different on their skills of learning. There are pros and cons.

Fortunately, I'm very lucky that I can be able to speak well spoken English language where most hearing people understands me, I know sign language, I know how to read lips, I can hear sounds not 100 percent. I've been to oral schools, I've been to mainstream, I've been to total communcation schools. CI was not required for me to know all what I've learn when I was growing up. Any deaf can learn that too. It's never too late.