Best way to develop oral skills?

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Daredevel7 said:
Oh, all of the above!!! Many times.

Who said that growing up oral is easy? I never denied that I didn't go through what many oral kids do. Like I said, I am not promoting oralism. It definitely isn't for the many or perhaps even all. However, I also am wary of the repercussions of surrounding yourself in ASL most of the time in school. ASL is a wonderful language for the deaf, but it seems to me that once school's over, some of them get frustrated and it's too late to do anything since they are adults now.
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Same can be said for the ones that have oral skills, and still can not hear. They are missing out a lot as well.
 
jillio said:
Your question, Daredevel:

Are you saying to forget about developing oral skills, then?

My response:

No, dear, that is not what I am saying, nor will you be able to find where I have ever said that.


Looks pretty definitive to me.
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Let's try again. Here is a MORE definitive question: Are you in favor for developing oral skills (lipreading, AVT, and/or speaking well enough) in deaf children (moderate to profound) before the age of 6?
 
Daredevel7 said:
Let's try again. Here is a MORE definitive question: Are you in favor for developing oral skills (lipreading, AVT, and/or speaking well enough) in deaf children (moderate to profound) before the age of 6?
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Yes.
 
Daredevel7 said:
Okay, I guess I am not going to get a concrete answer from Jillio pertaining to whether she's for oral skills or not.

Let's say that I ask someone who is 100% in favor for ASL all the way if he is also in favor of developing oral skills in kids. If he says yes and you ask why, ANY answer he gives is basically a direct insult/attack or even a depressing thought to the deaf people who do not speak well. Think about it. How can you be in favor of oral skills without insulting many deaf people?

I suspect that's why no one talks about being in favor...
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I don't think people are that easily insulted. I have had more than one person without speech skills tell me how lucky I am that I can speak.
 
Daredevel7 said:
They are only missing out if they pretend to hear.
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Pretending to hear? OMG! I can not believe you just said that!

It is not about pretending to hear, It is about NOT BEING ABLE TO HEAR.


Oral or not!! You are still deaf.

CI, HA, ATV training or what not. A deaf person is still a deaf person...

A HOH person is still a HOH person..

It is not about pretending!! ASL or Oral.
 
Daredevel7 said:
Let's try again. Here is a MORE definitive question: Are you in favor for developing oral skills (lipreading, AVT, and/or speaking well enough) in deaf children (moderate to profound) before the age of 6?
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I amnot in favor of AVT under any circumstances. The specifics of the methodology are far too limiting.

Of course I am in favor of developing oral skills. My own son has oral skills, and received speech therapy for many years. Am I in favor of an oral only environment in order to develop those skills. Absolutely not. It puts a deaf child at a disadvantage, particularly when, if the child is predisposed to develop oral skills, and oral only environment is not necessary to do so. My son also has above average speech reading skills. I do not have a problem with that. They are but one of the tools in his tool box. He can pull them out and use them anytime he chooses. Should he have to use them 24/7 just because he has them. No, absolutely not. Those skills are useful, but they still rely on his weakest sense. He should be permitted to utilize his strengths, just as non-deaf do.

The whole point is, my son did not have to sacrifice his nativity in ASL in order to develop more than adequate oral skills to be used when needed, or when he chooses. In the educational arena, my concern was access to the curriculum, not access to speaking.
 
Bottesini said:
I don't think people are that easily insulted. I have had more than one person without speech skills tell me how lucky I am that I can speak.
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I also said depressing thought, which could also fall under "She's so lucky..."

(Is that a Britney Spears song?)
 
Babyblue said:
Pretending to hear? OMG! I can not believe you just said that!

It is not about pretending to hear, It is about NOT BEING ABLE TO HEAR.


Oral or not!! You are still deaf.

CI, HA, ATV training or what not. A deaf person is still a deaf person...

A HOH person is still a HOH person..

It is not about pretending!! ASL or Oral.
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But, what I thinks she means is, if you don't hear something, ask someone to repeat, don't just nod your head and pretend.
 
Daredevel7 said:
I also said depressing thought, which could also fall under "She's so lucky..."

(Is that a Britney Spears song?)
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I guess I am not that empathetic. It just seemed like a statement of fact that things sometimes are easier if you have speech skills.

People do discuss these things. It is just a fact of life and it should not be depressing.

I don't know any songs at all. I can't hear song lyrics. That is a fact. It does not depress me. If you like Britney Spears that's ok. :)
 
It was in response to my post regarding having given a definitive answer. She was re-phrasing her original question to me.
 
Babyblue said:
Pretending to hear? OMG! I can not believe you just said that!

It is not about pretending to hear, It is about NOT BEING ABLE TO HEAR.


Oral or not!! You are still deaf.

CI, HA, ATV training or what not. A deaf person is still a deaf person...

A HOH person is still a HOH person..

It is not about pretending!! ASL or Oral.
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*taken aback* :shock:

I meant if they just let it go. They weren't able to understand it and didn't do anything about it. Perhaps I should have said "pretending to understand". I've done that many times. Maybe I should have learned ASL and got an interpreter? But I get the strong feeling that I speak the way I do because I was in a mainstream school with daily interaction with my hearing friends. Generally, is it worth it? No. Is it worth it to me? Yes.
 
faire_jour said:
I thought she was asking the general "you".
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If you caught it or read it properly.. your language observations SHOULD have told you that Daredevel's question was directly aimed at jillio...

This is why sometimes I think people need to clarify what they are saying.

Like I'm noticing Babyblue is referring to speech for those completely deaf, deaf as in cannot hear anything.
While Daredevel was questioning universally about all deafs, including HOH who can hear.


How about it from this perspective.
If you want your child to become an aspiring Deaf Actor on TV or Movies (that he talks in) or a famous AUTHOR, ORAL SKILLS at a young age seem to be the key since those professions are tied with the hearing world.

If you don't see your son/daughter doing such things, you may not have as high of a need for oral progression. I don't know what are some common deaf jobs, so I won't go about naming them. Of course we can do many things equally the same as our hearing counterparts.


This is why we are arguing about this and that; everyone has a different understanding of everything until you speak clearly in a definitive form of what you are saying!!!
 
Bottesini said:
I guess I am not that empathetic. It just seemed like a statement of fact that things sometimes are easier if you have speech skills.

People do discuss these things. It is just a fact of life and it should not be depressing.

I don't know any songs at all. I can't hear song lyrics. That is a fact. It does not depress me. If you like Britney Spears that's ok. :)
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ehhh... She also sings..

Opps, I did it again!!! something to that effect. :giggle:
 
Bottesini said:
I guess I am not that empathetic. It just seemed like a statement of fact that things sometimes are easier if you have speech skills.

People do discuss these things. It is just a fact of life and it should not be depressing.

I don't know any songs at all. I can't hear song lyrics. That is a fact. It does not depress me. If you like Britney Spears that's ok. :)
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OH GOD PLEASE NO!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
I rarely listen to music, but I know a surprising amount of song titles....

Yes, you're right about "It is just a fact of life and it should not be depressing." It just seems that way sometimes. Not to me though.
 
Daredevel7 said:
OH GOD PLEASE NO!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
I rarely listen to music, but I know a surprising amount of song titles....

Yes, you're right about "It is just a fact of life and it should not be depressing." It just seems that way sometimes. Not to me though.
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So now you are pretending you dont like Britney Spears?:giggle:
 
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