Add lithium to drinking water

[jillio]

I never said you die from lithium deficiency. You're distorting what I said. I said it may cause suicides and murder and that means taking life away. It is impossible to be deficient since it's everywhere. We just may not get enough of it! It's same with many nutrients - many have all the nutrients, just some are not high enough to confer protection or optimal health.

It is paternalism? Well, tough that I want to see more lives saved.

Then how is it to save lives? Because you definately said it could save lives.

Lithium deficiency has never been implicated in the incidence of suicide. Lithium deficiency has never been implicated in the commission of murder.

What about autonomy? Do you have no regard for that? I bet if yours was threatened, you would be singing a different tune.

 

[netrox]

So you're discounting the people who go to magical springs that are loaded with lithium for their wives because that is basic homeopathy. Sounds good to me.

Um, do you know what homeopathy is?

 

[posts from hell]

Um, do you know what homeopathy is?

Going by the generally accepted usage of the word. I see it all the times here in town. And not to mention the way you used it as well.

 

[jillio]

Health effects of Lithium

Effects of exposure to Lithium: Fire: Flammable. Many reactions may cause fire or explosion. Gives off irritating or toxic fumes (or gases) in a fire. Explosion: Risk of fire and explosion on contact with combustible substances and water. Inhalation: Burning sensation. Cough. Laboured breathing. Shortness of breath. Sore throat. Symptoms may be delayed. Skin: Redness. Skin burns. Pain. Blisters. Eyes: Redness. Pain. Severe deep burns. Ingestion: Abdominal cramps. Abdominal pain. Burning sensation. Nausea. Shock or collapse. Vomiting. Weakness.

Effects of short-term exposure: The substance is corrosive to the eyes, the skin and the respiratory tract. Corrosive on ingestion. Inhalation of the substance may cause lung oedema. The symptoms of lung oedema often do not become manifest until a few hours have passed and they are aggravated by physical effort. Rest and medical observation is therefore essential. Immediate administration of an appropriate spray, by a doctor or a person authorized by him/her, should be considered.

Routes of exposure: The substance can be absorbed into the body by inhalation of its aerosol and by ingestion. Inhalation risk:Evaporation at 20°C is negligible; a harmful concentration of airborne particles can, however, be reached quickly when dispersed.

Chemical dangers: Heating may cause violent combustion or explosion. The substance may spontaneously ignite on contact with air when finely dispersed. Upon heating, toxic fumes are formed. Reacts violently with strong oxidants, acids and many compounds (hydrocarbons, halogens, halons, concrete, sand and asbestos) causing fire and explosion hazard. Reacts violently with water, forming highly flammable hydrogen gas and corrosive fumes of lithium hydroxide.


Read more: Lithium (Li) - Chemical properties, Health and Environmental effects

 

[netrox]

Health effects of Lithium

Effects of exposure to Lithium: Fire: Flammable. Many reactions may cause fire or explosion. Gives off irritating or toxic fumes (or gases) in a fire. Explosion: Risk of fire and explosion on contact with combustible substances and water. Inhalation: Burning sensation. Cough. Laboured breathing. Shortness of breath. Sore throat. Symptoms may be delayed. Skin: Redness. Skin burns. Pain. Blisters. Eyes: Redness. Pain. Severe deep burns. Ingestion: Abdominal cramps. Abdominal pain. Burning sensation. Nausea. Shock or collapse. Vomiting. Weakness.

oh noes! :roll:

 

[jillio]

oh noes! :roll:

Hey, I personally don't enjoy puking. Maybe you do. And I am a bit concerned with the flammable properties for more than one reason. Especially since I have seen virtually nothing that indicates that putting lithium in drinking water could provide even a minimum benefit to anyone. In short, in a cost benefit analysis, the risks outweight any perceived benefit.

 

[netrox]

And you'll see the same health hazhards for virtually all elements. :/

potassium - damn.... explosives use it. Let's call for less potassium in soil!

 

[Beowulf]

Sighhh. What gets me is that once you give them an inch, they will take a mile. How many freaking chemicals do we add to the water before everyone is happy as clams on lithium?

 

[netrox]

Sighhh. What gets me is that once you give them an inch, they will take a mile. How many freaking chemicals do we add to the water before everyone is happy as clams on lithium?

As much as you can to make them happy and not kill others.

Suppose I develop a cure that kills one out of 100 people who have terminal illness, would you take it?

 

[jillio]

And you'll see the same health hazhards for virtually all elements. :/

potassium - damn.... explosives use it. Let's call for less potassium in soil!

Difference being, there are definate and proven side effects to potassium deficiency. Still, when used as a supplemnent, it is generally prescribed by a physician, not just sprinkled onto everyone's food.

 

[jillio]

]As much as you can to make them happy and not kill others. [/B]
Suppose I develop a cure that kills one out of 100 people who have terminal illness, would you take it?

You didn't actually say that as a way to support your position did you? And then you claim it isn't paternalistic?
Suppose I decide that you need a certain chemical to control that line of thinking. I should be able to force it on you without your consent?

 

[Beowulf]

As much as you can to make them happy and not kill others.

Suppose I develop a cure that kills one out of 100 people who have terminal illness, would you take it?

What a completely useless question. I know beyond a shadow of a doubt you never will, so how can I answer?

 

[netrox]

What a completely useless question. I know beyond a shadow of a doubt you never will, so how can I answer?

It's a hypothetical question. Just answer.

 

[jillio]

It's a hypothetical question. Just answer.

So was mine. Just answer.

 

[Beowulf]

It's a hypothetical question. Just answer.

Find the hypothetical cure and then I will.

 

[netrox]

You didn't actually say that as a way to support your position did you? And then you claim it isn't paternalistic?
Suppose I decide that you need a certain chemical to control that line of thinking. I should be able to force it on you without your consent?

What makes you think trace amount of lithium will control your thinking? :/

I am getting tired of this thread. It's ridiculous where it has become and frankly, there are more pressing issues to worry about than lithium in water such as obesity, heart disease, and cancer and also encouraging them to eat better (and that translate to more lithium in diet anyway!)

 

[deafskeptic]

Health effects of Lithium

Effects of exposure to Lithium: Fire: Flammable. Many reactions may cause fire or explosion. Gives off irritating or toxic fumes (or gases) in a fire. Explosion: Risk of fire and explosion on contact with combustible substances and water. Inhalation: Burning sensation. Cough. Laboured breathing. Shortness of breath. Sore throat. Symptoms may be delayed. Skin: Redness. Skin burns. Pain. Blisters. Eyes: Redness. Pain. Severe deep burns. Ingestion: Abdominal cramps. Abdominal pain. Burning sensation. Nausea. Shock or collapse. Vomiting. Weakness.

Effects of short-term exposure: The substance is corrosive to the eyes, the skin and the respiratory tract. Corrosive on ingestion. Inhalation of the substance may cause lung oedema. The symptoms of lung oedema often do not become manifest until a few hours have passed and they are aggravated by physical effort. Rest and medical observation is therefore essential. Immediate administration of an appropriate spray, by a doctor or a person authorized by him/her, should be considered.

Routes of exposure: The substance can be absorbed into the body by inhalation of its aerosol and by ingestion. Inhalation risk:Evaporation at 20°C is negligible; a harmful concentration of airborne particles can, however, be reached quickly when dispersed.

Chemical dangers: Heating may cause violent combustion or explosion. The substance may spontaneously ignite on contact with air when finely dispersed. Upon heating, toxic fumes are formed. Reacts violently with strong oxidants, acids and many compounds (hydrocarbons, halogens, halons, concrete, sand and asbestos) causing fire and explosion hazard. Reacts violently with water, forming highly flammable hydrogen gas and corrosive fumes of lithium hydroxide.


Read more: Lithium (Li) - Chemical properties, Health and Environmental effects

mmm. I guess this isn't such a good idea to add it to water just for this reason alone. Just how much lithium is needed for this reaction? I would be be up for this idea only if there's been extenisitive studies showing benefits.

 

[jillio]

What makes you think trace amount of lithium will control your thinking? :/

I am getting tired of this thread. It's ridiculous where it has become and frankly, there are more pressing issues to worry about than lithium in water such as obesity, heart disease, and cancer and also encouraging them to eat better (and that translate to more lithium in diet anyway!)

I didn't say it did. I asked you if I decided that it would be in your best interest o have a chemical in your body that would change that way of thought, should I have the right to insist that you take it?

You did not answer the question. It is very pertinent to you deciding that lithium would be a benefit to an entire population, and then removing their choice regarding ingesting it. Both violate autonomy and are paternalistic.

 

[posts from hell]

What makes you think trace amount of lithium will control your thinking? :/

I am getting tired of this thread. It's ridiculous where it has become and frankly, there are more pressing issues to worry about than lithium in water such as obesity, heart disease, and cancer and also encouraging them to eat better (and that translate to more lithium in diet anyway!)

Take some lithium and come back here all happy then.

 

[posts from hell]

BTW - I fired an email to a Deaf chemist with a terminal degree of his opinion.

His position is with the department of reclamation working with water.

Hope we hear from him soon.