Why - Why the Medical Society constantly pressure on the Parents?

[jillio]

Not all children who are deaf or hoh have IEPs and that data would not be available. If they are mainstreamed without accommodations then there is not record on testing that they are deaf. If you have any state data, since I can't find any, please give a link.

And, if they are mainstreamed without accommodation, chances are their reading levels are below those that are receiving accomodations for their needs. There are numerous studies that have comapred deaf mainstreamed students readinglevels to those of their hearing peers, and in particular, deaf mainstreamed oral students. The findings are consistent: the highest academically functioning deaf students are those that have a strong foundation of signed language facillitating their learning of orally based language.

 

[jillio]

Where are your stats? Back up your claim, and there is a difference between a child in a mainstream setting such as my daughter who receives all of her instruction orally as opposed to the child in my other daughter's class who receives all of her instruction through an ASL interpreter. Same school, same program two very different ways of receiving that instruction. So again, show us the stats.

I have presented the stats on numerous occasions, as well as the research that supports it. You are the one claiming amazing success in oral only programs. It is incumbent upon you to furnish those stats, and the research to support your claims. To date, you, nor any of the other oral only advocates, have done so.

 

[vallee]

And, if they are mainstreamed without accommodation, chances are their reading levels are below those that are receiving accomodations for their needs. There are numerous studies that have comapred deaf mainstreamed students readinglevels to those of their hearing peers, and in particular, deaf mainstreamed oral students. The findings are consistent: the highest academically functioning deaf students are those that have a strong foundation of signed language facillitating their learning of orally based language.

You can't make that arguement without current data. My current experience at my school does not support that comment.

 

[jillio]

You can't make that arguement without current data. My current experience at my school does not support that comment.

Okay, there are numerous current studies.

 

[vallee]

Okay, there are numerous current studies.

Show current data comparing students in school of the deaf and students who are without accommodations. I code in the special education sheets for state testing and there is not a place for deaf/hoh without accommodations on state scan sheets. I don't know how they can find the data since the score do not id the student as deaf/hoh.

 

[jillio]

Show current data comparing students in school of the deaf and students who are without accommodations. I code in the special education sheets for state testing and there is not a place for deaf/hoh without accommodations on state scan sheets. I don't know how they can find the data since the score do not id the student as deaf/hoh.

What I said was there are numerous studies comparing deaf mainstreamed students totheir hearing peers. You were the one that brought up the issue of deaf mainstreamed students without accommodations. What I said was, "They are no doubt reading below their deaf peers with accommodations." That is a matter of common sense. A child who is being given accommodations to meet their needs will no doubt perform better than a child with no accommodations when groups are compared. The research is out there.

 

[vallee]

And, if they are mainstreamed without accommodation, chances are their reading levels are below those that are receiving accomodations for their needs. There are numerous studies that have comapred deaf mainstreamed students readinglevels to those of their hearing peers, and in particular, deaf mainstreamed oral students. The findings are consistent: the highest academically functioning deaf students are those that have a strong foundation of signed language facillitating their learning of orally based language.

This is what you said. I asked for a link to the studies since if you make a statement like that, then you provide a link.

 

[jackiesolorzano]

and yet it is ok for so many to continue to be deprived of a llanguage? That is my whole point. I dont think that is ok.

What is "success" anyway? Remmy what another ADer said about being so successful but inside, she was dying. There could be many of those who feel that way but nobody knows it. Deaf kids are so good at fooling people around them on what is going on with them inside.

Again for the 100th time, some of my friends and I grew up orally only without any exposure to sign language and we all wish we had sign language in the educational setting. Would have made learning so much easier and more fun for all of us. Yet, we were considered "successes" because we kept quiet about our suffering inside.

I do remember that post. And I have several e-mails with her. We even came up with a time frame where we are going to meet in person. This is the type of person that deaf children need to be around. Someone that had a bad experience but understands that just because she went through this badly does not mean that all deaf children will go throw it. And she was kind enough to write out her experiences so that my children could read about it. And there is plans for my children to communicate with her. What a kind caring person to take time to do this for my children. I wanted to make sure that I respect my children and their choices. And wanted to make sure that my children understood that it was perfectly OK with me if they wanted to switch to signing only. I wanted to start a discussion with my children. And I wanted them to know that I would love, respect, and support their choices in life. DB thank you again and please do not ever leave the teaching field. I would have loved for my children to have a teacher like you.

 

[jackiesolorzano]

THANK YOU jillo!
I see this a LOT with parents who are pro-oral. They think that the reason why literacy rates with dhh kids are so low is b/c of ASL and other "traditional" deaf ed interventions. They see the very high achievers who are rather promeniet in the oral deaf organizations, and they think that ALL oral kids can acheive as well as those kids.
I'm not surprised that you see a lot of high achiever types.........but the thing is, its not nessarily due to methodology...........it's due to the fact that many if not most AG Bell types are basicly very high achiever types. (and high achiever for ANYONE)

You kept talking about high achievers and the reason some children succeed is because they come from a high socio eco level but let me assure you that that is not who we are. My children were on SSI, CCS, and Medi-cal we start this adventure. When my kids were born I was an high school graduate, my husband not. Yeah, now we are higher up but that took a lot of work.

 

[jillio]

This is what you said. I asked for a link to the studies since if you make a statement like that, then you provide a link.

I am paraphrasing what I know of the research, I did not quoite any research. Technically, a link is required only if one cites a particular study, or quotes the quthor of that study. However, I will go back and dig up all of the articles that I have referenced in any number of posts, if that is what you need. But it is nothing that I haven't already referenced in the past. In addition, it will be expected that you provide links and citations for all of your claims, as well.

 

[jillio]

You kept talking about high achievers and the reason some children succeed is because they come from a high socio eco level but let me assure you that that is not who we are. My children were on SSI, CCS, and Medi-cal we start this adventure. When my kids were born I was an high school graduate, my husband not. Yeah, now we are higher up but that took a lot of work.

DD was referrring to high achiever children, not parents.

 

[shel90]

I do remember that post. And I have several e-mails with her. We even came up with a time frame where we are going to meet in person. This is the type of person that deaf children need to be around. Someone that had a bad experience but understands that just because she went through this badly does not mean that all deaf children will go throw it. And she was kind enough to write out her experiences so that my children could read about it. And there is plans for my children to communicate with her. What a kind caring person to take time to do this for my children. I wanted to make sure that I respect my children and their choices. And wanted to make sure that my children understood that it was perfectly OK with me if they wanted to switch to signing only. I wanted to start a discussion with my children. And I wanted them to know that I would love, respect, and support their choices in life. DB thank you again and please do not ever leave the teaching field. I would have loved for my children to have a teacher like you.

Did u forget how we all were respectful of you when you first joined? Do u know why things changed or have u forgotten?

Remember, that I first applaud you for raising your kids so well? Maybe it is time for you to go back to the thread about CART and find out why things changed the way they did.

 

[jillio]

Did u forget how we all were respectful of you when you first joined? Do u know why things changed or have u forgotten?

Remember, that I first applaud you for raising your kids so well? Maybe it is time for you to go back to the thread about CART and find out why things changed the way they did.

 

[rick48]

DD was referrring to high achiever children, not parents.

Actually she was referring to people at organizations such as AGB:


"They see the very high achievers who are rather promeniet in the oral deaf organizations, and they think that ALL oral kids can acheive as well as those kids.
I'm not surprised that you see a lot of high achiever types.........but the thing is, its not nessarily due to methodology...........it's due to the fact that many if not most AG Bell types are basicly very high achiever types. (and high achiever for ANYONE)"

Not really sure what she means except that she thinks that being a high achiever has nothing to do with methodology but that all those who are in AGB are high achievers but then she thinks that all those in AGb are oral.

So if A=B and B=C then A=C?

Too late to worry about this stuff.

 

[rick48]

Did u forget how we all were respectful of you when you first joined? Do u know why things changed or have u forgotten?

Remember, that I first applaud you for raising your kids so well? Maybe it is time for you to go back to the thread about CART and find out why things changed the way they did.

Shel,

Maybe you were respectful to Jackie and I believe that you were but limit that comment to just yourself for I do not believe that everyone was respectful towards her and especially her children.
Rick

 

[jillio]

Actually she was referring to people at organizations such as AGB:


"They see the very high achievers who are rather promeniet in the oral deaf organizations, and they think that ALL oral kids can acheive as well as those kids.
I'm not surprised that you see a lot of high achiever types.........but the thing is, its not nessarily due to methodology...........it's due to the fact that many if not most AG Bell types are basicly very high achiever types. (and high achiever for ANYONE)"

Not really sure what she means except that she thinks that being a high achiever has nothing to do with methodology but that all those who are in AGB are high achievers but then she thinks that all those in AGb are oral.

So if A=B and B=C then A=C?

Too late to worry about this stuff.

Fallicous reasoning on your part. Read the post agian,and try toundestand that AGB types refers to oral high achievers. Familiarize yourself with the language.

 

[jillio]

Shel,

Maybe you were respectful to Jackie and I believe that you were but limit that comment to just yourself for I do not believe that everyone was respectful towards her and especially her children.
Rick

Nope. Everyone supported her.

 

[shel90]

Shel,

Maybe you were respectful to Jackie and I believe that you were but limit that comment to just yourself for I do not believe that everyone was respectful towards her and especially her children.
Rick

I posted in #156 telling Jackie that I would never tell her or any other parents what to do with their kids and that I was just offering my reasons for why I have my views. I emphased that I wasnt condemning her or anything but then after that things just got ugly right after that. Oh well.

 

[loml]

Show current data comparing students in school of the deaf and students who are without accommodations. I code in the special education sheets for state testing and there is not a place for deaf/hoh without accommodations on state scan sheets. I don't know how they can find the data since the score do not id the student as deaf/hoh.

vallee - I have tried to obtain data from the education department of my province regarding various deaf/hoh stats. We have an act here called the FOIPA - Freedom of Information and Privacy Act. Basically what it comes down to is that the numbers are less than 10 for some searches and they will not provide any information, for fear that you may identify the child. Nor do the schools identify deaf/hoh with/without accomodations residential or mainstream.

"numerous current studies" - should be interesting.

 

[jillio]

vallee - I have tried to obtain data from the education department of my province regarding various deaf/hoh stats. We have an act here called the FOIPA - Freedom of Information and Privacy Act. Basically what it comes down to is that the numbers are less than 10 for some searches and they will not provide any information, for fear that you may identify the child. Nor do the schools identify deaf/hoh with/without accomodations residential or mainstream.

"numerous current studies" - should be interesting.

Your "province"....are you in Canada?