Tax between Europe and any countries in the world

[Reba]

Interesting article:
http://www.freedommag.org/english/spegerm/page18.htm

Church taxes was a product of the Nazi Party in order to pacify the Churches about the activities of the Nazi Party.

Wow! That is a very interesting article. Thanks for the link.

 

[Reba]

All of Germans screamed with happy when WWII are over... They are happy to be free from Nazi time...

That certainly is an interesting perspective.
All the news reports I ever saw showed the Germans crying, confused, upset, and in shock when they lost the war. I never saw any Germans celebrating the end of WWII.

 

[kuifje75]

That certainly is an interesting perspective.
All the news reports I ever saw showed the Germans crying, confused, upset, and in shock when they lost the war. I never saw any Germans celebrating the end of WWII.

I wouldn't say all Germans were screaming of happiness. But I think it is safe to say that a majority of Germans were fed up of the Nazi Party, but they just didn't dare say anything. People would get executed for being vocal against the Nazi Party. The Scholl brother and sister founded a resistance group in the Munich University called die Weiße Rose, and printed about 4 or 5 flyers condeming the party. Then one day, they were "discovered" and executed within a day or two.

Here's an article on the White Rose group:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/White_Rose

I have the film about this group. It's an interesting film.

So many people I talked with when I was in Germany, they said that they were so glad that the Nazi Government was gone. It was a dicatorship, and very hard living in this totalarism regime.

Here is a famous song associated with the White Rose Group:

The thoughts are free, who can guess what they are,
they fly by, like nightly shadows.
No one can know them, no hunter can shoot it.
It stays like this: the thoughts are free!

I think what I want and what pleases me,
yet all in the silence, and as it is fitting for.
My wish, my desires can be refused by nobody,
it stays like this: the thoughts are free!

I love the wine, my woman above all,
She pleases me the best when alone.
I am not alone with my glass of wine,
my woman also there: the thoughts are free!

And one casts me in a dark dungeon,
that all, that are the works done in vain.
Because my thoughts rip the closets
and the walls into two, the thoughts are free!

About that, I want to always renounce the worry
and I want also never again plagued with silly ideas.
One can laugh and joke inside the heart
And think of that: the thoughts are free!

 

[Reba]

I wouldn't say all Germans were screaming of happiness. But I think it is safe to say that a majority of Germans were fed up of the Nazi Party, but they just didn't dare say anything. People would get executed for being vocal against the Nazi Party. The Scholl brother and sister founded a resistance group in the Munich University called die Weiße Rose, and printed about 4 or 5 flyers condeming the party. Then one day, they were "discovered" and executed within a day or two.

Yes, I have greatest admiration for the German resistors. I know that many of them fought underground, plotted against Hitler, risked their lives to protect Jews, etc. It was so hard because they never really knew who they could trust, and they were so outnumbered.

 

[Liebling:-)))]

http://www.religiousfreedom.com/Conference/Germany/warnke.htm

This is an interesting read on Church taxes in Germany.

http://www.natcath.com/NCR_Online/archives/012999/012999f.htm
Church taxes in Europe

http://www.dw-world.de/dw/article/0,1564,1168497,00.html
Germans leaving the church to avoid Church taxes

Keep in mind that this is purely voluntarily. People of other faith other than Protestant and Catholic are not required to pay Church taxes. That is why it is important to declare your religion on the Anmeldesformular (city residency registeration paper?). My status as Nichtglaubiger (non-believer) made it clear that I don't participate in the Church.

Thank you for interesting link which it's good for the readers here.

 

[Liebling:-)))]

Interesting article:
http://www.freedommag.org/english/spegerm/page18.htm

Church taxes was a product of the Nazi Party in order to pacify the Churches about the activities of the Nazi Party.

Very interesting... *speechless*

I asked my hubby about this yesterday and also hearing co-workers, too. They don't beleive until they read your link.... *speechless* because we know for a long time that Hilter hates reglious, he got his people to burnt every bibles in 1933.

 

[Liebling:-)))]

How come the church members themselves don't take care of their church?

Simple is the churches support their people.

Yes, I know how expensive church renovation is. This summer our church must pay $80,000 to replace part of the parking lot. We also monthly support almost 90 missionary families all-over the world. Our church has 272 member families, and we pay for everything ourselves. I church would never accept government money.

Yes, I can understand that Europe and America have different systems. They share our taxes to any churches where they need for their renovation, support, etc. Every churches treat the same and fair.
How many churches in your area?
People went to same churches and support them instead of share support money with other church?

I believe what you say. I just am curious why churches "beg" government for money. It is not the responsibility of governments to support churches. If a church is important to God's people, they will take care of it themselves. The best thing the government can do is keep "hands off".

they need money for church renovation. Support money from people are not enough to finance churches renovation. I really don't know how much British people donate the church because it's voluntarily. All what I know is: They asked Government for the support

If the churches can't support themselves, maybe they should close.

I find it's sad. I understand why we pay church taxes because they treat all churches same and fair instead of depend on same church and let other church closing down.

 

[Liebling:-)))]

What is the doctrine of the Evangelisch/Protestant church? How are the beliefs different from British and U.S.? We have three missionary families in Germany, so this is interesting to me.

Check this link:
Number of Lutherans worldwide and also explanation

Germany – 25.8 million Lutherans in the world.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lutheran

 

[Liebling:-)))]

Yes, you were right. I should say "many" or "most", not all, K75.

I wouldn't say all Germans were screaming of happiness.

Reba,
I questioned ALOT of hearing and deaf Germans about their experience in Nazi times. ALL what they said to me that they are real happy and feel free from Nazi time.

 

[Reba]

Originally Posted by Reba
How come the church members themselves don't take care of their church?

Simple is the churches support their people.

I'm sorry, I don't understand your answer to my question. Do you mean churches give money to people?

How many churches in your area?

In my local area there are hundreds of churches.
I just checked the on-line phone book directory, and it shows 1,046 churches and 8 synagogues listed in my area. Some are very large, some medium, some small.
http://yp.bellsouth.com/?mkt=CHSC&heading=churches&srch=X&from=TLPP

This is another list but I think it is out-of-date because it uses the old phone area codes.
http://www.marinersguide.com/regions/southatlantic/charleston.sc/churches.html

People went to same churches and support them instead of share support money with other church?

Members pay the support for the church they belong to and attend. For example, the members of Citadel Square Baptist Church pay for the support of that church building, staff, expenses, and their missionaries. The members of the Charleston Unitarian Church pay for their building and staff and expenses. The members of Aldersgate United Methodist Church pay for their building and staff and expenses.

they need money for church renovation. Support money from people are not enough to finance churches renovation.

I can understand that sometimes the very old historic church buildings might want public renovation money because they are important historical sites for the community. But in general, people support their own churches because of their beliefs, not for the buildings.

 

[Liebling:-)))]

I'm sorry, I don't understand your answer to my question. Do you mean churches give money to people?

Yes, who work for the church example, cleaner, gardener, etc.
Church taxpayers paid their earns.
The church also support kindergardens, too. (something like that church theatre, etc.
They paid an interpreter for me once.
The people who visit the church and donate little money voluntarily.

In my local area there are hundreds of churches.
I just checked the on-line phone book directory, and it shows 1,046 churches and 8 synagogues listed in my area. Some are very large, some medium, some small.
http://yp.bellsouth.com/?mkt=CHSC&heading=churches&srch=X&from=TLPP

This is another list but I think it is out-of-date because it uses the old phone area codes.
http://www.marinersguide.com/regions/southatlantic/charleston.sc/churches.html

hundreds Too many

We have only one church in village where we live and 4 churches in local area which it's 3 miles away from village where I live.

I can understand that sometimes the very old historic church buildings might want public renovation money because they are important historical sites for the community. But in general, people support their own churches because of their beliefs, not for the buildings.

Interesting! Take care of church (buildings) are important to us.

 

[Reba]

Yes, who work for the church example, cleaner, gardener, etc.
Church taxpayers paid their earns.
The church also support kindergardens, too. (something like that church theatre, etc.
They paid an interpreter for me once.
The people who visit the church and donate little money voluntarily.

Our church members pay the salaries for the pastors (senior, assistant and youth), admin staff, maintenance staff, full-time music director, pianists, organists, and accountant.

Volunteers serve as deacons, ushers, choir members, orchestra members, interpreters, sound booth, nursery workers, Sunday School teachers, AWANA (kids) leaders, greeters, parking lot patrol, and children's ministry.

Church members pay for taking care of the buildings, utilities, and grounds (landscaping).

Tuition pays for the Christian school director, school office staff, high school principal, elementary school principal, teachers, coaches, and school supplies.

In my local area there are hundreds of churches.

hundreds Too many

We have only one church in village where we live and 4 churches in local area which it's 3 miles away from village where I live.

How can there be too many? If the people want to establish and support their church, then it is allowed. We can't force people to be stuck with just a few churches. They need to have freedom to start new churches, if they want.

Interesting! Take care of church (buildings) are important to us.
us.

We believe it is good stewardship to take of our buildings and have a safe, comfortable place to meet. But buildings are not the most important part of a church. They are just buildings. People are the most important part of a church.

 

[Reba]

I forgot to add that members also pay the salaries of the school superintendent and kitchen staff. Also, the members support many missionary families all over the world (including Germany).

Last fiscal year, our church members gave over $1.2 million to support our church. That does not include the missionary money (that is counted separately).

At last night's church business meeting, we voted to pay up to $100,000 to redo part of the church parking lot.

 

[Reba]

Reba,
I questioned ALOT of hearing and deaf Germans about their experience in Nazi times. ALL what they said to me that they are real happy and feel free from Nazi time.

Interesting. I am now watching the History Channel on TV. The program is about how the Nazis brainwashed the German children to be loyal to Hitler and Nazi beliefs. All the children really wanted to attend the special Nazi schools. They were taught to worship Hitler, not God. It was awful.

During the interviews with the boys (now old men), they told how much they loved Hitler and were very excited to be Nazis.

"Youth of the Third Reich" is the program:
"Permanent indoctrination of an entire nation had to begin with the young. Nazi leaders acted accordingly with the goal of establishing Nazi ideology as the norm for a whole generation. Many former members of Nazi youth organizations now realize that, although they were not aware of it at the time, compassion and all humanitarian attitudes towards life were systematically driven out of them. We show how they were brought to the stage where they would follow the Führer without question."

Ugh! They just showed that the German kids used to go on school field trips to the concentration camps. The camp leaders told the kids about gassing and burning the Jews. They showed them shrunken heads. So the Germans did know what was happening in the camps before and during the war.

 

[kuifje75]

Interesting. I am now watching the History Channel on TV. The program is about how the Nazis brainwashed the German children to be loyal to Hitler and Nazi beliefs. All the children really wanted to attend the special Nazi schools. They were taught to worship Hitler, not God. It was awful.

During the interviews with the boys (now old men), they told how much they loved Hitler and were very excited to be Nazis.

"Youth of the Third Reich" is the program:
"Permanent indoctrination of an entire nation had to begin with the young. Nazi leaders acted accordingly with the goal of establishing Nazi ideology as the norm for a whole generation. Many former members of Nazi youth organizations now realize that, although they were not aware of it at the time, compassion and all humanitarian attitudes towards life were systematically driven out of them. We show how they were brought to the stage where they would follow the Führer without question."

Ugh! They just showed that the German kids used to go on school field trips to the concentration camps. The camp leaders told the kids about gassing and burning the Jews. They showed them shrunken heads. So the Germans did know what was happening in the camps before and during the war.

Yes... That group was called the Hitlersjunge (Hitler's Youth). Prior to the rise of the Nazi Party, there were many youth groups in Germany. As Nazi became powerful, they closed down all youth groups and mandatoried that the children join the Hitler's Youth group only.

The White Rose group, they all also started in the Hitler's Youth groups. Hans Scholl was so involved with it, until one day when the group went to the Nazi Party Rallies in Nuremburg. After that he was disappointed about the Hitler's Youth and started to think differently after that. He formed with the other boys illegal groups, and eventually the White Rose Group.

In Hitler's Youth schools, they would have some kind of social studies class studying the racial differences between different people, and why the Aryan population is the most superior of all. They had all kinds of charts, pictures, etc... explaining the differences between different races. There are examples of that at the Holocaust Museum in Washington D.C.

Hitler's Youth children were very scary. They were so brainwashed that they would even betray their own parents to the Nazi party, if their parents complained about Hitler or the Nazi Party. They are trained as spies to overhear conversations and to report anything that sounded like dissent opinions. It's a pretty sad chapter in the German history.

Equally sad was our treatment of the African Americans prior to 1960s, with our KKK groups killing Af. Americans. And to think that eugenics started in the US before it spread to Germany!!! We have our share of evil sciences too.

 

[Liebling:-)))]

Yes, that's right K75.

Nazi consider their people as criminal and then excuted if they disowned Hilter. They were very scared of him in Nazi time. They have to say nice things about Hilter and MUST like him.

Germans must always say "Heil". Nazi consider their people as criminal if they don't say "Heil" and then excuted.

Why they MUST say "Heil" because it's Hilter who made unemployment into 00.00. It's him who made everything for his people in his country.

It's him who made the list of German names which the people are allow to name their babies, not foreign names etc. More lists................. It's no freedom for the Germans in Nazi's time.

The sick babies must be dead because Hilter don't like to see "disabled" in his country.

I remember to watch the true movie about Hilter Youth. The man who had experienced as Hilter Youth and still never forget what he was forced to do what they say and was shock when he saw jews in the train. It got him vomit. I am going to search the website to find out about him then will link here. I would recommend you to buy DVD... It's very good movie.

 

[kuifje75]

It's him who made the list of German names which the people are allow to name their babies, not foreign names etc. More lists................. It's no freedom for the Germans in Nazi's time.

The sick babies must be dead because Hilter don't like to see "disabled" in his country.

Maybe we should split this Nazi discussions here off from Church topic? It's a fascinating subject to discuss...

Yes, Hitler created the Lebensborn program, where he would ask the German women to have a baby each year to give to the country. In order to be able to give this baby to the country, one had to be racially pure, and to have a racially pure father. Sometimes female students who went to school and did not want to have babies yet, were kind of forced by the Party and paired with German soldiers to reproduce and have baby. I think the goal for this was to have a population of racially pure citizens for Hitler's "Thousand Years Reich."

Yes, eugenics were very much the law in Germany as much as it was in America. Germans would castrate people who are suspected to carry the gene of disability and so on. Deaf people were forced to be sterilised, so that they would not have deaf offsprings. So, it is not just the Jewish people, but a wide range of people which were affected by the laws of the Nazi Party.

 

[Liebling:-)))]

Maybe we should split this Nazi discussions here off from Church topic? It's a fascinating subject to discuss...

Yes, we should split this Nazi issue here with other threads or create a new thread.

Like this

http://www.alldeaf.com/showthread.php?t=13612&page=1&pp=20&highlight=Nazi

http://www.alldeaf.com/showthread.php?t=16668&highlight=Hilter+Youth

http://www.alldeaf.com/showthread.php?t=9114&highlight=Hilter+Youth

OR

Create a new thread.

I don't mind to discuss with anyone over Nazi time or any other countries, too.

I am thinking about how to add a new thread because it should not only Nazi history but anywhere in the world, too... ???

 

[Reba]

Here is a breakdown of our sales tax:

 

[Liebling:-)))]

Here is a breakdown of our sales tax:

Interesting...


I see that every states have different sales taxes in America but why use this word like this "state tax, county tax and trans. tax"?

What's this?