SEE is a language... It's English...

[jillio]

I'm a little bit unhappy that Beclak has painted me of doing wrong by my daughter for the intensity of her ASL immersion and of judging that others who don't take my path as being in error.

I absolutely disagree with her view on both of these points, my perspective is very much the opposite.

Did you catch the victim syndrome from too much association with FJ?

 

[GrendelQ]

Uhh...I have yet to find any specialist who is as fluent as a Native Signer. Duh.

Really? I know quite a few fluent specialists who work with my daughter. Unless you are somehow implying that being Deaf and specialist are mutually exclusive.

 

[jillio]

Oh we already tried suggesting that. We got told no way, not interested. this was just a week ago or so.

Pretty good sign someone doesn't want to get to know us.

 

[shel90]

I think a war would break out if we had an orgy! Too many jealous lovers.

No orgies...lots of orgasms. That would bring absulote peace and love all over, wouldnt it?

I couldnt sign in SEE for what happens during sex. I have to use ASL with all the expressions to get the message across.

 

[deafskeptic]

No orgies...lots of orgasms. That would bring absulote peace and love all over, wouldnt it?

I couldnt sign in SEE for what happens during sex. I have to use ASL with all the expressions to get the message across.

k I get. It better not be in total darkness.

 

[jillio]

Really? I know quite a few fluent specialists who work with my daughter. Unless you are somehow implying that being Deaf and specialist are mutually exclusive.

Where exactly did I imply that?

And I will still say that I have yet to see a "specialist" as fluent as a native signer.

If a child is exposed to native signers on a social basis, there is no need for a "specialist" to teach ASL. They acquire it naturally as any language should be acquired.

 

[GrendelQ]

You support giving deaf children a language model that has been proved ineffective and oralism.


Those are what caused so many deaf children to suffer. So, why are you unhappy?

Bilingual education has not been proven ineffective and including spoken language along with ASL as part of a child's life is not oralism.

 

[shel90]

Bilingual education has not been proven ineffective and including spoken language along with ASL as part of a child's life is not oralism.

But you arent against oralism or SEE, arent you?

 

[GrendelQ]

Where exactly did I imply that?

And I will still say that I have yet to see a "specialist" as fluent as a native signer.

If a child is exposed to native signers on a social basis, there is no need for a "specialist" to teach ASL. They acquire it naturally as any language should be acquired.

And I still say that I have seen several specialists who are. Just lucky, I guess.

And you can argue against formal ASL instruction, and learning conducted in ASL, but I find it works best for my daughter.

 

[GrendelQ]

But you arent against oralism or SEE, arent you?

I'm not against learning methods that other people use. I put my efforts towards being for my daughter and what works for her. And you know that the method I support for my daughter is bilingual education: ASL and English.

 

[BecLak]

Csign, don't feel singled out. I'd have thought AD would be a "safe haven," a welcoming environment for a family putting effort into providing an ASL immersion experience for a child, a place where I might find others doing the same. There are not very many here, surprisingly.

Here we find that the parents of deaf children providing bilingual environments are told to take themselves off to a hearing aid forum, and I'm being scolded by a hearing person and an oral deaf adult with little if any interest in ASL up to a year or two ago for putting all of this 'directed parent-child' effort into bringing an 'overload' of ASL to my child's life. Seems like a lot of arguing for arguments's sake when you've got posters advocating to keep families with deaf kids apart from the Deaf and let the child pick up whatever language is in use in the neighborhood or local school rather than making a conscious decision to incorporate ASL in her life and provide fluent specialists in the process.

I wasn't referring to ASL, but English. You haven't read my posts at all if you say I have little interest or put little importance on sign language (I'm Australian, by the way - so it would be AUSLAN for me and I am also learning ASL too. It is because of the so-called professionals advising my hearing family to put me in mainstreamed oral only schools and not even mentioning that I had the option to learn sign language and go to Deaf school. On top of that, these 'professionals' told my family that I was HOH and as long as I wore hearing aids I would be fine. (I am in fact, severely deaf) Surprise, surprise it was not because I showed little interest in sign language and the Deaf community. I was never introduced or exposed to either until 18 months ago. Not every country is as blessed as the USA to have such public knowledge or exposure of the Deaf community and sign language.

Now, I am catching up on what I missed, now I am learning AUSLAN and yes ASL is on my list too. I sooo wished I had sign language at a young age - that's what comes naturally to me, its VISUAL. As for English, yes, I achieved it successfully, but with my own 'sweat' and with the support of my loving family. I made English as visual as I could for me as I was learning it. (May I add, I am the only one deaf in my family; both my parents and my late brother; then now with my husband and 7 children. None of whom had been exposed to sign language but have accomodated me as much as what had been in their power to and they will continue to do so).

 

[posts from hell]

k I get. It better not be in total darkness.

It better be.. So I can feel the descriptors.

 

[shel90]

I'm not against learning methods that other people use. I put my efforts towards being for my daughter and what works for her. And you know that the method I support for my daughter is bilingual education: ASL and English.

You know why I am against oralism even though it appeared to "work" for me?

It was killing me daily but NOBODY..I mean nobdy could even guess.

 

[jillio]

And I still say that I have seen several specialists who are. Just lucky, I guess.

And you can argue against formal ASL instruction, and learning conducted in ASL, but I find it works best for my daughter.

I've never argued against formal ASL instruction. I would love to see all hearing parents and sibs of deaf kids take ASL classes.

I would also love to see ASL as the language of instruction for all deaf kids. I insisted on it for my own kid.

 

[jillio]

You know why I am against oralism even though it appeared to "work" for me?

It was killing me daily but NOBODY..I mean nobdy could even guess.

And that is the point. Parents and teachers develop a false sense of what is really going on with their kids.

 

[GrendelQ]

I wasn't referring to ASL, but English.

Then why direct your message specifically to me? And why emphasize the error of putting my child in the hands of professionals for her language learning -- she goes to a deaf ASL-based school?

 

[deafskeptic]

You know why I am against oralism even though it appeared to "work" for me?

It was killing me daily but NOBODY..I mean nobdy could even guess.

For me being oral was reading everything in sight in order to make up for what I missed in mainstream. I had to do a lot of guesswork in order to understand what everyone said to me.

There were no note takers for me or terps for me in those days. It was not till I was a teen that anything got closed captioned. It meant I had to be pulled out of class to work on my speech.

It's putting up with endless neverminds when you fail to understand what the other person said to me. People will be more interested in your speech than if you can understand THEM.

And that's jut a partial list of what being oral meant for me.

 

[posts from hell]

For me being oral was reading everything in sight in order to make up for what I missed in mainstream. I had to do a lot of guesswork in order to understand what everyone said to me.

There were no note takers for me or terps for me in those days. It was not till I was a teen that anything got closed captioned. It meant I had to be pulled out of class to work on my speech.

It's putting up with endless neverminds when you fail to understand what the other person said to me. People will be more interested in your speech than if you can understand THEM.

And that's jut a partial list of what being oral meant for me.

oh nevermind

 

[GrendelQ]

I've never argued against formal ASL instruction. I would love to see all hearing parents and sibs of deaf kids take ASL classes.

I would also love to see ASL as the language of instruction for all deaf kids. I insisted on it for my own kid.

If a child is exposed to native signers on a social basis, there is no need for a "specialist" to teach ASL. They acquire it naturally as any language should be acquired.

?

 

[BecLak]

Oh by the way, we are not 'singling out' anyone. It is a general misconception of the majority of the hearing world that we are addressing, your little 'club' are not the only ones. That is what AD is all about Deaf having a voice so there would be better understanding in the hearing world. Unfortunately, you are just in the number that 'don't get it'. Ignorance is no longer bliss, Be Educated - (and I am not referring to general Education, university degrees or such) Knowledge is not just WHAT you know, but how it is applied and understood.