Returning soldiers struggle to find therapists

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akoutsourais said:
Is there any difference? Bush was placed in a unit that was known for priveldge kids who didn't want to go....
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I just want to understand clearly what webexplorer was posting. I can't comment on posts if I don't understand them. I wasn't aware of anyone needing to "hide" their adult children from serving in the military if there is no draft. No one now is forced to enlist, so why would they need to "hide"? He specifically said, "...many Congress families 'hide' their adult-children not to send them to Iraq." He's not referring to past wars.
 
akoutsourais said:
Ok, come one. I've been watching the Benderman case. Being tried in the Military is much harder on the Defendent that being tried in a civilian case (which I think is biased towards the prosecution in most cases also). Please don't act like everything is so black and white.
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Of course it's hard. Of course it's not always morally "fair". Of course all parties don't always play by the rules. People lie, misrepresent or hide facts, and intimidate witnesses.

I said, they didn't lose their rights. They lost their cases. Some of the above might be the reasons they lost their cases. Or maybe their cases didn't have merit. I don't know. We haven't laid out the particulars to each and every case. If there was illegal "hanky panky" involved in any of the cases, then that should be dealt with.

It's the same problem with accusations of crimes against our service men and women serving in the war zones. Many of them don't get fair treatment either. They have to depend on fundraisers for their defense expenses. They have to face condemnation by the press and political loudmouths who want to picture military people in the worst light possible before charges are even formalized.

It works both ways.
 
Reba said:
I posted: "None of them were drafted."

You responded: "Really?"

That sure seems like you doubted the truth of my statement about the draft.
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No, it has nothing do with doubt. All what I share what I know from the rumors and some news from the TV... I has the feeling from those situation that it's not really voluntarily.

See this example:

US Army forces 50,000 soldiers into extended duty
Want To Go To War? | US Army forces 50,000 soldiers into extended duty

Do you really expect anyone to believe that a person enlisting in the U.S. military during the years since the war began didn't realize that they might need to go to that war?
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Soldier's duty: Say no to illegal war
Soldier's duty: Say no to illegal war

US Troops Told They Can't Leave Army
'Stop-loss orders' keep soldiers in service if their units are set to be deployed to Afghanistan or Iraq. Officials call move 'finger in the dike.'
'Finger in the Dike': US Troops Told They Can't Leave Army

5500 US deserters : We won’t fight in Iraq
5500 US deserters : We won't fight in Iraq

Thousands of troops say they won't fight
Voters For Peace: The power to end the war and prevent future wars of aggression

Soldiers Against Iraq War Refuse To Fight
informationliberation - Soldiers Against Iraq War Refuse To Fight

Three U.S. Soldiers Refusing to Fight Speak Out Against the Iraq War

CARL WEBB: Well, I joined. I signed a contract for three years, which would have ended in August of 2004. So, by July, I was very, very happy. I was saying good-bye to everyone in my unit. On several occasions throughout the three years, I had been approached about reenlisting and I always had turned them down. So, in July, I was really happy, until I got a phone call from my sergeant.

CARL WEBB: Yes. I had one more drill to complete. And my sergeant called and said she had bad news. And she said that you're going to Iraq. And immediately I was confused. I said, well, did the unit get activated all of a sudden? She said no. The unit hasn't been activated, we're staying, but you are not going to be allowed to finish your contract. You're being extended and loaned to a different unit, which is going to Iraq..... and further read in those link... (worth to read them and listen their side).

Democracy Now! | Three U.S. Soldiers Refusing to Fight Speak Out Against the Iraq War

Withdrawal?
Withdrawal? - Occupation and Rule in Iraq - Global Policy Forum - UN Security Council

Poll Shows 2/3 of Americans Want Withdrawal of US Troops from Iraq
By Code Pink 3.16.07

Poll Shows 2/3 of Americans Want Withdrawal of US Troops from Iraq


Iraq Veterans Against The War

Google-Ergebnis für http://www.williambowles.info/gispecial/2006/0306/290306/image001.jpg

Are you deny those links and defend for Government and facts?

Your co-worker is a lawyer, or what? What is your co-worker's definition of a "general" war? The Iraqi war is "illegal" to whom, and under what statutes?
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wow, very interesting... it come from you.... :eek3: Come on... Everyone knows it...

I am asking you few questions.

What is the reason why Bush sent soliders to Iraq for? Is it because Bush thought Saddam and his people are responsible for attack your country (9/11)? Few years later after that, they found out that 9/11 is not Saddam and his people's responsiblity. It's Bush's big mistake for sent soliders there to death and also kill Iraqi people as well... Is it legal war or what? :hmm: It's war crime, he did. He should be arrest for war crime after Saddam's arrest but he doesn't... I really don't understand why they didn't arrest Bush...

Ohhh wait a minute... It's not 9/11 reason why Bush sent soliders to there but what? OIL. Bush lied to soliders... later they learn that it's not 9/11 reasons... Everyone knows it.

I guess you don't understand the American legal system.
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I guess you don't understand what human right is about. You are only interesting in fact and law... I support soliders's interest and their rights to fight against government. Sadly the court didn't give them right.

They had the right to contest their contracts. They went thru the legal process, and the case was decided against them.

People have the right to present their cases. There is no "right" to always win the case.
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Really? see links... I support the soliders for fight their rights against government. Sadly they lost their cases against Government.
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Reba said:
I don't know why you are so paranoid and self-centered.
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*scratch my head*

It's you who is paraniod and self-centered, not me. I don't require anyone for link or proof but accept their posts. If they want to link or get someone is their voluntarily...

I feel that you don't want to hear the negative but positive. Everything in life what we have is negative and positive. I do not see your feeling on negative and postive but one side on fact and government ...?

Not every post is an "all about me" post.
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Huh? I only post when I has a knowledge. I don't post if I don't have any knowledge. I see nothing wrong when anyone make their own posts and share their feeling for anyone... I really don't see why you have the problem for that...

It doesn't bother me when people require supporting proof of my posts. I'm happy to oblige whenever I can. It's not a big deal.
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It's you. I don't but accept any posts what they make. If I see something wrong with their posts then don't post or question them instead of demand the links and proof from them. It's me. Remember each person is different.

We just thought it would be interesting to read the full viewpoints from currently enlisted military people, the people who are most directly involved with the war. If they posted directly, we could chat back and forth with them.
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I cannot promise to get one of them to register here. All what I get from them or their links is okay. I'm sorry if my posts what I know from them is not meet your satisfy.

It's not a requirement; just a request.
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Okay
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akoutsourais said:
The rumors aren't true. Some liberals want the draft back, thinking that it will stop the war. Republicans and most Dems do not want the draft. I don't want a draft as I know it will still be mostly poor kids dying, only this time they were forced to do so.
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It's good to know that the rumors is not true but check those link, I provided toward Reba.
 
webexplorer said:
My troops are getting killed everyday. A large number of soldiers were sent to several hospitals in Germany and other part of Europe. It is not in the newspapers. They deserve to go home and stay with their family. They are part of my American families. It is more important for us to protect our country. Why don't you ask your injured soldier-friends where they stayed in the hospital? You will be surprised.

Many terrorists are not afraid to be killed because of their blessing God so that they could go to the heaven. They are really sick mind.
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Yes, very true... many soliders were delivered to clinics here in Germany from Iraq.
 
Liebling:-))) said:
Simple answer:

See those link, I provided in my previous post to Jazzy.

10 Ways to Protect Your Child From the ASVAB - by Dr. Teresa Whitehurst
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:confused: How does that link relate to my question about people hiding their adult children from the military?

The statement was:

"A few years ago, Michael Moore said that many Congress families 'hide' their adult-children not to send them to Iraq. Even, it is same for Bush/Dick's adult-children. I did not realized that."

That has nothing to do with the ASVAB.
 
Reba said:
:confused: How does that link relate to my question about people hiding their adult children from the military?

The statement was:

"A few years ago, Michael Moore said that many Congress families 'hide' their adult-children not to send them to Iraq. Even, it is same for Bush/Dick's adult-children. I did not realized that."

That has nothing to do with the ASVAB.
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Yes I have read between her and your post. "hide" I guess she mean is "protect"
 
Liebling:-))) said:
No, it has nothing do with doubt. All what I share what I know from the rumors and some news from the TV... I has the feeling from those situation that it's not really voluntarily.
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Enlisting is 100% voluntary. No one is forced to enlist. Ask your Army friends.


Are you deny those links and defend for Government and facts?
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None of your links refute what I posted about voluntary enlistment. Your links are about people wanting to get out of the military, after they have voluntarily enlisted. Two totally different situations.

I don't dispute that some people change their minds and want to get out. I don't dispute that some people didn't analyze the fine print of the contracts before signing them. I don't dispute that some people are unhappy or disappointed with situations. I don't dispute that sometimes the people in the bureaucracy of the military mess up people's lives.


wow, very interesting... it come from you.... :eek3: Come on... Everyone knows it...
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"Everyone" knows it, huh?

... He should be arrest for war crime after Saddam's arrest but he doesn't... I really don't understand why they didn't arrest Bush...
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Maybe you should ask your lawyer co-worker to explain the reason to you.


I guess you don't understand what human right is about. You are only interesting in fact and law... I support soliders's interest and their rights to fight against government. Sadly the court didn't give them right.
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If you don't have facts and laws, how do you protect human rights? Every country has laws, and makes judgments on the basis of facts and laws, including the U.S.A., and including Germany. Soldiers have to obey the laws just like other Americans, just like Germans. If we don't agree with the laws, we should move to change the laws. We also need to ensure that the people enforcing the laws are ethical, and hold them accountable.
 
Liebling:-))) said:
Yes I have read between her and your post. "hide" I guess she mean is "protect"
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Either way, it still has nothing to do with the ASVAB.

I thought Webexplorer is a guy. :confused:
 
Reba said:
Enlisting is 100% voluntary. No one is forced to enlist. Ask your Army friends.
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Yes I know that soliders sign the contract volunatarily. Afterward they found out that's not what they thought. (see my previous post and also link as well).

None of your links refute what I posted about voluntary enlistment. Your links are about people wanting to get out of the military, after they have voluntarily enlisted. Two totally different situations.
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That's what I am talking about is it's not what they thought as they sign the contract volunatarily and found out the truth and want to get out...

I don't dispute that some people change their minds and want to get out. I don't dispute that some people didn't analyze the fine print of the contracts before signing them. I don't dispute that some people are unhappy or disappointed with situations. I don't dispute that sometimes the people in the bureaucracy of the military mess up people's lives.
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Really? I do feel that you defend Government accord your posts here and other threads under war and polities section.

You said to me in previous post: "How are you supporting the troops if you are against their mission? That is NOT support. That is opposition to the troops.

How can you be anti-war and yet draw a paycheck from what you consider to be warmongers? That doesn't make sense."

What's this? It look like that you know a little about soliders who are also anti-war, too.




"Everyone" knows it, huh?
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Maybe you should ask your lawyer co-worker to explain the reason to you.
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Don't pretend that you didn't know anything or try to act as you didn't know anything.


If you don't have facts and laws, how do you protect human rights? Every country has laws, and makes judgments on the basis of facts and laws, including the U.S.A., and including Germany. Soldiers have to obey the laws just like other Americans, just like Germans. If we don't agree with the laws, we should move to change the laws. We also need to ensure that the people enforcing the laws are ethical, and hold them accountable.
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I think you still can't get it. The soliders themselves feel being betray by Government thru sign the contract... I would advise soliders to not sign the contract yet until their lawyer or legal adviser examine their contract first before let them to sign...
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Reba said:
Either way, it still has nothing to do with the ASVAB.
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Okay, let webexplorer answer your post if it's not link what you are talking about.


I thought Webexplorer is a guy. :confused:
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Yes I thought the same as you all the time that Webexplorer is "he" until I saw her posts somewhere that "he" really is "she"... :giggle:
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Reba - Please watch this Michael Moore's clip movie. Note: Sorry, it has no closed caption on the internet. You can borrow it from a library, and it has CC.

Fahrenheit 9/11 Trailer



ha ha ha. I'm both woman and man. I am over 100 years old, and I have seen the world. My old times were marvelous. I live on a very old farm and rocking my chair looking out the porch. What a beautiful sky! No one interrupts me. I'm very thankful. Amen.
 
Well, when draft is start serve then we would get bigger news on nationwide and bad news for male employees that who is under 25 years old then they can losing their good job and forced to send in military service with low paying. It does same if male employees who enjoy to work at wal-fart then losing their job due confirmed for drafted and miss this companies so badly.

I think that don't going be happen...

Like if one guy who is 22 years old and graduated from BA/BS at college then became gaming program (high paying job), such as graphic design and work on future games until draft is start then they get letter and got drafted then they are screwed up and lose the job then struck at military service.
 
webexplorer said:
Reba - Please watch this Michael Moore's clip movie. Note: Sorry, it has no closed caption on the internet. You can borrow it from a library, and it has CC.

Fahrenheit 9/11 Trailer
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Thanks for the link. That's OK, I could hear the audio. :)

That's an advertising trailer for Moore's movie. It's not a documentary or news clip. It's an ad.

In the trailer, Moore implies that no Congressmen would encourage his or her son or daughter to join the military. That's not the same meaning that Congressmen are "hiding" or even preventing their adult children from serving in Iraq. There is no need to hide or prevent anyone from joining the services. Enlisting is voluntary. No one is forced to join. There is no draft, so no one can be forced to sign up. The draft ended in 1973.


ha ha ha. I'm both woman and man. I am over 100 years old, and I have seen the world. My old times were marvelous. I live on a very old farm and rocking my chair looking out the porch. What a beautiful sky! No one interrupts me. I'm very thankful. Amen.
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:lol:
 
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