Police: 20 Feared Dead After Florida Nightclub Terror Attack

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AlleyCat said:
What's with the constant grinning in all your posts? You're being disrespectful in threads like these. SMH.
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Yes, it does hurt my feeling but I decide to ignore him instead of confront him, it won't change him after Calvin talked to him.
 
Steinhauer said:
It seems to me that you are trying to blame the GOP for the shooting in Orlando.

What if a GOPer was bullied online and committed suicide?
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Both President GWB and President Obama proposed the law to prohibit any weapon sales and explosives to anyone on terror watch list... both times were rejected by GOP as an assault on American citizen's constitutional rights.

Omar Mateen was on FBI's watch list and because his background check was clean... he was cleared to buy any firearm. Because his ex-wife never reported to police about domestic violence... his record remained clean. Florida has one of the strictest domestic violence law in the country. One single DV charge/arrest (except misdemeanor) would automatically prohibit him from obtaining a firearm and most likely get fired from his private security firm.
 
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Steinhauer said:
1) The shooter was a terrorist. If not a member of ISIS, he was clearly inspired by ISIS and pledged allegiance to them.
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yes. he was fantasized by these terrorists and filled his head with full of homophobic and racist thoughts. His coworker from a private security firm had quitted the job because of him. He was reported for his "unhinged and unstable" behavior and always talked about killing people but the company did nothing about it.

Steinhauer said:
2) The shooter was a security guard that went through extensive background checks.
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yes.

Steinhauer said:
3) The shooter had a 'class G' firearms license, granting greater carry permissions (apparently - according to the media) than would be associated with a regular security guard carry permit.
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yes.

Steinhauer said:
4) This club was a gun free zone - enforced by security personnel and metal detectors.
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irrelevant. and inflammatory. a straw man argument.

Steinhauer said:
5) Shots started at 2am, police stormed in at 5am. That is three hours that people were alone with an active shooter, unable to defend themselves.
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and......?

Steinhauer said:
6) ISIS took responsibility for the incident, making it an act of war - not some domestic dispute from a drunken spouse.
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ISIS claims responsibility for ANY violence toward America even though they never did it. ISIS's #1 weapon is dispensing fear and propaganda thru social medias. you just fell for its trap.

Steinhauer said:
background checks, and GFZ's do nothing to prevent gun violence.

Mr. President, do you still consider ISIS to be JV league?
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Nothing we can do about a crazed lunatic with delusional, disturbing thought especially those with clean history and no criminal record. His ex-wife stated that he aspired to be a police officer and had applied for police academy. That's why he worked as a security guard for several years.

smells like a cop wannabe... a reject... reminds me of George Zimmerman, perhaps?
 
Jiro's rebuttal is the very reason I will never support the Democratic Party and their agenda. He would much rather demonize Christians over a wedding cake than condemn a radical Islamist for murdering 50 gays and injuring 53 others. In fact, the Democratic Party would much rather blame the NRA and assault weapons than the violent ideology of the shooter.

We can also infer that from the George Zimmerman analogy, that no reasonable or coherent understanding exists within the confines of Jiro's skewed logic of the motive behind the Orlando shooting. Now, you have had your chance, more than once, to find Zimmerman guilty of something .... anything ... and you have failed to realize you cannot flim-flam the Zim-Zam.

The shooter pledged allegiance to ISIS and ISIS claimed credit for the attack, and yet, this goes completely ignored.

Perhaps you can blame this on an obscure youtube video, as ISIS is just a JV League Team.
 
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Omar Mateen. What do we know about him? He was an American citizen. 29 years old. Born and raised in America. New Yorker native. He was married to a very beautiful girl from NJ in 2009 and then divorced her in 2011 in Florida. His ex-wife stated that he was a very private person, abusive, and mentally unstable. He was not religious either.

Omar was employed as a juvenile prison security guard by G4S Secure Solutions since 2007 - one of the largest private security firm in America (I'm guessing that by tomorrow morning when the stock market opens, the parent company of G4S will take some hit). Perhaps that's where he received firearm training from - not ISIS or any terrorist organization. He had a criminal justice degree from a local college. He aspired to be a police officer. He was just as American as just like any of us.

Late in his 20’s (few years ago)... he started to appear in FBI's radar in 2013 for a very faint tiny weak string just because of some hateful comment he made to his coworkers relating to terrorists... and again in 2014 about a possible tie with Floridian suicide bomber who went to Syria - just because Omar expressed a sympathy for him. The government - Homeland Security, FBI, and bunch of other 3-letter acronyms had found zero (direct and indirect) connection between Omar and any terrorist organization. He had never traveled to any Muslim country nor received any instruction/training from any terrorist organization.

Like any other American citizens… Omar was entitled to his Amendment Two. He was able to LEGALLY acquired weapons because he was not a criminal, he had a clean history, and PLUS he had a security officer license. HOWEVER - Omar was on FBI’s terror watch list for some time. President Obama had once again proposed a bill to prohibit any weapon sales to anyone on terror watch list but the Republican Party has repeatedly rejected that bill. President GWB first proposed this bill and Republican Party had rejected it. And because his ex-wife did not report domestic violence to police... Omar's background record remained clean and clear.

Now... let's do some math. Take out the "Muslim name" from this equation. Take out “ISIS”. What do you get? You get hateful people with hateful views toward a specific group of people - Jewish people, gay people, abortion doctors, Muslim people, and bunch more. In this case, hateful people like Omar Mateen and James Howell hated gay people. Who is James Howell? the one who just got arrested for attempting to massacre people at gay pride parade in LA. Police discovered explosive devices, chemical weapon, and multiple assault weapons in his car.

So what is this about? Not ISIS. Not Muslim people. Not terrorism. This is about an attack on GLBT community - an act of hate by Omar Mateen and James Howell. There is a huge difference between people who have received training and instruction from terrorist organization and people who “sympathized” and/or follow terrorist organization for their hateful ideology and this is what we call a lone wolf…. and a terrorist wannabe.

So is this a case of a lone wolf self-radicalizing or a mentally unstable lunatic with deranged hateful views - a ticking bomb? I believe it's the latter.
 
Steinhauer said:
Jiro's rebuttal is the very reason I will never support the Democratic Party and their agenda. He would much rather demonize Christians over a wedding cake than condemn a radical Islamist for murdering 50 gays and injuring 53 others. In fact, the Democratic Party would much rather blame the NRA and assault weapons than the violent ideology of the shooter.

We can also infer that from the George Zimmerman analogy, that no reasonable or coherent understanding exists within the confines of Jiro's skewed logic of the motive behind the Orlando shooting. Now, you have had your chance, more than once, to find Zimmerman guilty of something .... anything ... and you have failed to realize you cannot flim-flam the Zim-Zam.

The shooter pledged allegiance to ISIS and ISIS claimed credit for the attack, and yet, this goes completely ignored.

Perhaps you can blame this on an obscure youtube video, as ISIS is just a JV League Team.
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It will not going happen if you leave LGBT people alone and don't ask the government to denounce or mistreat them because of their sexual orientation so we don't have to deal with war over anti-LGBT and pro-LGBT.

More hate will make LGBT people more stronger, anyway.
 
hoichi said:
so now your stating its the occurrence of the event "usually" that makes him mentally ill.

considering how many mentally ill people we have in society, and since the only reason you state for this guy being mentally ill is the scale of his attack, and that's its unusual, isnt it odd we are not having more mentally ill people do this?

besides that.
we do have
him stating who he is killing for
and
those whom he stated he killed for, actually confirm it and state he did it for them

i'm usually the guy on the defence ...
but really man
given what we have
to claim roger rabbit or micky mouse is just..
well

its more then a stretch..
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Basing it on what his ex wife and her family has said about his mental stability or instability.

We are averaging about one of these shootings ever two months, so it's not like they are a rare occurrence. It will only be a few days or maybe a couple months before someone else will try and "break" this guys record.

Normal people just don't go into work, schools, nightclubs etc. and start killing innocent people.
 
Foxrac said:
It will not going happen if you leave LGBT people alone and don't ask the government to denounce or mistreat them because of their sexual orientation so we don't have to deal with war over anti-LGBT and pro-LGBT.

More hate will make LGBT people more stronger, anyway.
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I am confused as to where the "hate" was in my post? Or, for that matter, any post I have made.

1) I believe homosexuals should have the right to defend themselves with appropriate force - especially at night clubs that are gun free zones, as they are targeted by hateful and violent people

2) I believe a private business owner should not be forced to go against their avowed religious beliefs, as this is a violation of the 1st Amendment
 
Steinhauer said:
I am confused as to where the "hate" was in my post? Or, for that matter, any post I have made.

1) I believe homosexuals should have the right to defend themselves with appropriate force - especially at night clubs that are gun free zones, as they are targeted by hateful and violent people

2) I believe a private business owner should not be forced to go against their avowed religious beliefs, as this is a violation of the 1st Amendment
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You used to make strong anti-LGBT statements so some members could find you to be hate, even you don't see as hate. If you don't like LGBT people so it is simply to leave them alone - no more discussion. It is none of your business and you should worry about your family, not ours.

Florida has law that ban bars or clubs from allowing anyone with guns for safety reason because gun and alcohol aren't mixed, also they supplied with armed security guards and metal detector so I don't believe this law will going change because they don't want to see shootout in bars or clubs in long term when compare to rare shooting massacre. The terrorists may have a lot of powerful weapons that could blow the place away and people with OC or CCW may not have capacity to defeat terrorists without SWAT or military (National Guard) so I don't think that strengthen the gun laws will going thwart the terrorist attack because terrorists could increase their size to make extremely destruction, put your situation in danger. It looks like security guards may have to be retrained to make more aggressive like carrying M16 instead of handgun only. I'm not scared to see anyone carried M16 because I used to visit bases frequently that where troops are supplied with M16. It is difficult to predict the shooting massacre and it isn't reality as you thought - there is no best solution.

I only support exemption for religious institutions, that it.
 
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Slight correction. I do not believe marriage can be redefined to mean what you want it to mean. Marriage is between a man and a woman.

You are the one who sees that as hateful. You also are the one who has openly stated you hate the GOP. It seems you don't have any of this tolerance for those whom you disagree with.

That is being bigoted. Look up the definition for that word, and no, you cannot redefine it to mean what you want it to mean. Words have meanings.
 
Steinhauer said:
Slight correction. I do not believe marriage can be redefined to mean what you want it to mean. Marriage is between a man and a woman.

You are the one who sees that as hateful. You also are the one who has openly stated you hate the GOP. It seems you don't have any of this tolerance for those whom you disagree with.

That is being bigoted. Look up the definition for that word, and no, you cannot redefine it to mean what you want it to mean. Words have meanings.
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Simply, just leave to your religion and we have no interest to get involved with your religion so the marriage could be redefined with everything, also you only care about religious marriage but I only care about civil marriage, that's two of different meanings.

Speaking about hate and bigot, I'm not interested to discuss with you further and I'm going deal with my family issue so there is enough discussion with you.

I'm going praying for all victims that were killed and wounded in worst mass shooting and it is rough for all of their families.
 
Jiro said:
Omar Mateen. What do we know about him? He was an American citizen. 29 years old. Born and raised in America. New Yorker native. He was married to a very beautiful girl from NJ in 2009 and then divorced her in 2011 in Florida. His ex-wife stated that he was a very private person, abusive, and mentally unstable. He was not religious either.

Omar was employed as a juvenile prison security guard by G4S Secure Solutions since 2007 - one of the largest private security firm in America (I'm guessing that by tomorrow morning when the stock market opens, the parent company of G4S will take some hit). Perhaps that's where he received firearm training from - not ISIS or any terrorist organization. He had a criminal justice degree from a local college. He aspired to be a police officer. He was just as American as just like any of us.

Late in his 20’s (few years ago)... he started to appear in FBI's radar in 2013 for a very faint tiny weak string just because of some hateful comment he made to his coworkers relating to terrorists... and again in 2014 about a possible tie with Floridian suicide bomber who went to Syria - just because Omar expressed a sympathy for him. The government - Homeland Security, FBI, and bunch of other 3-letter acronyms had found zero (direct and indirect) connection between Omar and any terrorist organization. He had never traveled to any Muslim country nor received any instruction/training from any terrorist organization.

Like any other American citizens… Omar was entitled to his Amendment Two. He was able to LEGALLY acquired weapons because he was not a criminal, he had a clean history, and PLUS he had a security officer license. HOWEVER - Omar was on FBI’s terror watch list for some time. President Obama had once again proposed a bill to prohibit any weapon sales to anyone on terror watch list but the Republican Party has repeatedly rejected that bill. President GWB first proposed this bill and Republican Party had rejected it. And because his ex-wife did not report domestic violence to police... Omar's background record remained clean and clear.

Now... let's do some math. Take out the "Muslim name" from this equation. Take out “ISIS”. What do you get? You get hateful people with hateful views toward a specific group of people - Jewish people, gay people, abortion doctors, Muslim people, and bunch more. In this case, hateful people like Omar Mateen and James Howell hated gay people. Who is James Howell? the one who just got arrested for attempting to massacre people at gay pride parade in LA. Police discovered explosive devices, chemical weapon, and multiple assault weapons in his car.

So what is this about? Not ISIS. Not Muslim people. Not terrorism. This is about an attack on GLBT community - an act of hate by Omar Mateen and James Howell. There is a huge difference between people who have received training and instruction from terrorist organization and people who “sympathized” and/or follow terrorist organization for their hateful ideology and this is what we call a lone wolf…. and a terrorist wannabe.

So is this a case of a lone wolf self-radicalizing or a mentally unstable lunatic with deranged hateful views - a ticking bomb? I believe it's the latter.
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sleeper cell
noun
Popularity: Bottom 40% of words
Definition of sleeper cell
  1. : a terrorist cell whose members work under cover in an area until sent into action


Have you researched his father? You do know he was a Taliban sympathizer right? And both his parents were immigrants from Afghanistan?

Ensign Takeo Yoshikawa was a sleeper agent for Japan. So was Bernard Julius Otto Keuhn (as well as his children, even his 11 year old son).

We are at war Jiro. Get your head out of the sand.
 
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Steinhauer said:
sleeper cell
noun
Popularity: Bottom 40% of words
Definition of sleeper cell
  1. : a terrorist cell whose members work under cover in an area until sent into action
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Did you come across any material revealing a strong connection between Omar Mateen and terrorist organization? and that he had received training and instruction from a terrorist organization?

Steinhauer said:
Have you researched his father? You do know he was a Taliban sympathizer right? And both his parents were immigrants from Afghanistan?
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Taliban sympathizer. How so? Exactly what role did he play for Taliban? You will find pretty much thousands of Afghanistan refugees/immigrants who had "swore" oath to Taliban and they did it out of fear for their safety. It's better than getting killed, right?

But let me guess... it doesn't matter to you and they are considered as Taliban sympathizers and terrorists, right?

Steinhauer said:
Ensign Takeo Yoshikawa was a sleeper agent for Japan. So was Bernard Julius Otto Keuhn (as well as his children, even his 11 year old son).
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fascinating.... 1941... and 1942.... can't even find any Islamic sleeper agent in America?

Steinhauer said:
We are at war Jiro. Get your head out of the sand.
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who said we weren't? nobody did.
 
Are you completely ignoring ISIS, yet again?

Oh wait ... don't answer that question. We both know that is what you are doing.

Have you come across any material evidence indicating he was not pledging allegiance to ISIS, and any material evidence indicating ISIS is not taking COMPLETE responsibility for this "ISLAMIC TERRORIST ATTACK"?

Thanks .. that was a very straight forward and simple question, I will await for your continued efforts to completely thwart and misconstrue what I asked.
 
Steinhauer said:
Are you completely ignoring ISIS, yet again?

Oh wait ... don't answer that question. We both know that is what you are doing.

Have you come across any material evidence indicating he was not pledging allegiance to ISIS, and any material evidence indicating ISIS is not taking COMPLETE responsibility for this "ISLAMIC TERRORIST ATTACK"?

Thanks .. that was a very straight forward and simple question, I will await for your continued efforts to completely thwart and misconstrue what I asked.
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ah so you're saying Omar Mateen has received training and instruction from ISIS to execute this disgusting acts of terrorism?
 
seb said:
Absolutely, but they usually aren't out shooting a hundred people! Since the shooter is dead they aren't going to be able to prove it one way or another other than witness statements from his ex wife, her family, his family, friends(if he had any) etc.. Even though this guy was on the watch list, he was still able to purchase lethal weapons. Just be prepared for someone going out to try and beat this nut cases record.
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That crossed my mind, too, as the news keeps saying "worse mass killing"...
 
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