Obama supporters?

[Liebling:-)))]

Liebling paid 5.5% for unlimited health care for herself and her family. My son paid 1.5% for someone else's health care, and had none of his own. That's the fact that you seem to be ignoring.

Exactly!

 

[shel90]

Liebling paid 5.5% for unlimited health care for herself and her family. My son paid 1.5% for someone else's health care, and had none of his own. That's the fact that you seem to be ignoring.

That is really bad!

 

[Jiro]

Liebling paid 5.5% for unlimited health care for herself and her family. My son paid 1.5% for someone else's health care, and had none of his own. That's the fact that you seem to be ignoring.

I'm not ignoring it at all. I'm just saying we should abolish it instead so that you can pay for it yourself, not for others.

and correct me if I'm wrong... while it sounds great about Germany's health care system.. free for all (sort of).... isn't Germany's economy really sensitive and has a relatively high unemployment rate? That's not gonna bode well with American way aka capitalism.

 

[Hwy99]

I know we agree mostly in several debate posts in the past but I disagree with your post here... It doesn´t mean that I hurt or upset you when I disagree with you.... What´s debate for...

Yes I am getting what you try to explain us about but Jillo is right that workers/employers work to pay tax for SSI, medicard, etc.

Accord EU countries, you do not need to pay universe healthcare IF you are out of work but you need to focus US universe healthcare what Obama plan for all Americans... what if they are out of work?





No, you are not ignorant but that´s just you beleive differently.

Thank you for giving an positive reply. Due to her ignorant to my positive reply to her, I guess she doesn't care.

 

[Liebling:-)))]

I'm not ignoring it at all. I'm just saying we should abolish it instead so that you can pay for it yourself, not for others.

and correct me if I'm wrong... while it sounds great about Germany's health care system.. free for all (sort of).... isn't Germany's economy really sensitive and has a relatively high unemployment rate? That's not gonna bode well with American way aka capitalism.

I think I explained at other thread that unemployment rate in Germany was decrease from 13% to 7,5% now.

During counsellor Helmut Kohl´s time, economy was bad... He is the same as McCain who support rich people... It make Germans go out of Germany to buy things cheaply that´s how hurt economy... He lost election to counsellor Gerhard Schröder. He work on Kohl´s debt and tried to improve unemployment rate and economy but he failed... Now counsellor Angela Merkel did it sucessful to reduce unemployment rate and improve economy. We buy German things to support economy.

 

[jillio]

I'm not ignoring it at all. I'm just saying we should abolish it instead so that you can pay for it yourself, not for others.

and correct me if I'm wrong... while it sounds great about Germany's health care system.. free for all (sort of).... isn't Germany's economy really sensitive and has a relatively high unemployment rate? That's not gonna bode well with American way aka capitalism.

Oh, I see. Then there should be no health care available for those who are low income or unemployed or disabled because they cannot pay for it themselves?

If 1.5% of my income will help to provide health coverage for a child living in poverty, so be it. Take another 4% to make up the 5.5%, and use it to provide affordable health insurance for me. Don't take 1.5% of my income for someone else's care, and leave me with too little disposable income to purchase insurance for myself, or to pay for medical costs out of pocket. To pay for self insured coverage would be one hell of a lot more than an additional 4%. That is the point.

 

[jillio]

I know we agree mostly in several debate posts in the past but I disagree with your post here... It doesn´t mean that I hurt or upset you when I disagree with you.... What´s debate for...

Yes I am getting what you try to explain us about but Jillo is right that workers/employers work to pay tax for SSI, medicard, etc.





Thank you for giving an positive reply. Due to her ignorant to my positive reply to her, I guess she doesn't care.

Ah, but you are wrong. I care a great deal that there are people who are going to work every day in this country that are unable to afford a basic necessity like health care insurance for themselves or their families. I care very much that they are no more than one accident away from becoming destitute. I care very much that infectious disease is on the rise because mothers can't afford to take their child to the doctor for antibiotics. I care very much that there are elderly who have to make a choice between being able to eat and being able to take medicine that keeps them alive. Oh, yes, Puyo.....I care a great deal.

 

[Hwy99]

Ah, but you are wrong. I care a great deal that there are people who are going to work every day in this country that are unable to afford a basic necessity like health care insurance for themselves or their families. I care very much that they are no more than one accident away from becoming destitute. I care very much that infectious disease is on the rise because mothers can't afford to take their child to the doctor for antibiotics. I care very much that there are elderly who have to make a choice between being able to eat and being able to take medicine that keeps them alive. Oh, yes, Puyo.....I care a great deal.

Again, what about my answer to your question?

 

[jillio]

I think I explained at other thread that unemployment rate in Germany was decrease from 13% to 7,5% now.

During counsellor Helmut Kohl´s time, economy was bad... He is the same as McCain who support rich people... It make Germans go out of Germany to buy things cheaply that´s how hurt economy... He lost election to counsellor Gerhard Schröder. He work on Kohl´s debt and tried to improve unemployment rate and economy but he failed... Now counsellor Angela Merkel did it sucessful to reduce unemployment rate and improve economy. We buy German things to support economy.

And, at 7.5% unemployment, people are still able to receive health care despite being out of work. We are at 5.8%, and people are loosing their homes, are unable to receive basic medical attention, and cannot provide for their families.

 

[jillio]

Again, what about my answer to your question?

Your answer to my question was that you did not think it was right that I did not have health care, nor that my son did not have health insurance. You say that everyone should have the choice to pay into the system.

Okay, let's expand on that. I am given the choice, and I choose not to pay into a system to help provide care for someone else. I take that money, and I invest it, and I put it in a fund in case I have future medical expenses. However, because I have chosen to do this, it means that now, you no longer have Medicare to pay for your medical expenses. Are you satisfied with that solution?

 

[Liebling:-)))]

And, at 7.5% unemployment, people are still able to receive health care despite being out of work. We are at 5.8%, and people are loosing their homes, are unable to receive basic medical attention, and cannot provide for their families.

Yes, that´s right. They are still get healthcare when they are out of work. They still get the equal medical treatment as workers/employers/business owners.

No, they won´t become homeless when they are out of work but they get social assistance.

Yes, I know about US system and find really sad... It would be great when anyone open their mind and give Obama the chance to try something new and change America or whatever. Why not try something instead of ignore and think Obama did impossible, etc. etc. etc. They keep on saying that Obama is inexperience, etc. etc.... but they forget quickly about Arnold Schwazenberger... Look at Arnold Schwarzenberger - He doing CA very well when he has no political experience background... :roll:

 

[jillio]

The Problem
Millions of Americans are uninsured or underinsured because of rising medical costs: 47 million Americans — including nearly 9 million children — lack health insurance with no signs of this trend slowing down.

Health care costs are skyrocketing: Health insurance premiums have risen 4 times faster than wages over the past 6 years.

Too little is spent on prevention and public health: The nation faces epidemics of obesity and chronic diseases as well as new threats of pandemic flu and bioterrorism. Yet despite all of this less than 4 cents of every health care dollar is spent on prevention and public health.

Barack Obama's Plan
Quality, Affordable and Portable Coverage for All
Obama's Plan to Cover Uninsured Americans: Obama will make available a new national health plan to all Americans, including the self-employed and small businesses, to buy affordable health coverage that is similar to the plan available to members of Congress. The Obama plan will have the following features:
Guaranteed eligibility. No American will be turned away from any insurance plan because of illness or pre-existing conditions.
Comprehensive benefits. The benefit package will be similar to that offered through Federal Employees Health Benefits Program (FEHBP), the plan members of Congress have. The plan will cover all essential medical services, including preventive, maternity and mental health care.
Affordable premiums, co-pays and deductibles.
Subsidies. Individuals and families who do not qualify for Medicaid or SCHIP but still need financial assistance will receive an income-related federal subsidy to buy into the new public plan or purchase a private health care plan.
Simplified paperwork and reined in health costs.
Easy enrollment. The new public plan will be simple to enroll in and provide ready access to coverage.
Portability and choice. Participants in the new public plan and the National Health Insurance Exchange (see below) will be able to move from job to job without changing or jeopardizing their health care coverage.
Quality and efficiency. Participating insurance companies in the new public program will be required to report data to ensure that standards for quality, health information technology and administration are being met.
National Health Insurance Exchange: The Obama plan will create a National Health Insurance Exchange to help individuals who wish to purchase a private insurance plan. The Exchange will act as a watchdog group and help reform the private insurance market by creating rules and standards for participating insurance plans to ensure fairness and to make individual coverage more affordable and accessible. Insurers would have to issue every applicant a policy, and charge fair and stable premiums that will not depend upon health status. The Exchange will require that all the plans offered are at least as generous as the new public plan and have the same standards for quality and efficiency. The Exchange would evaluate plans and make the differences among the plans, including cost of services, public.
Employer Contribution: Employers that do not offer or make a meaningful contribution to the cost of quality health coverage for their employees will be required to contribute a percentage of payroll toward the costs of the national plan. Small businesses will be exempt from this requirement, and will receive a new Small Business Health Tax Credit that helps reduce health care costs for small businesses.
Support for Small Businesses: Barack Obama will create a Small Business Health Tax Credit to provide small businesses with a refundable tax credit of up to 50 percent on premiums paid by small businesses on behalf of their employees. This new credit will provide a strong incentive to small businesses to offer high quality health care to their workers and help improve the competitiveness of America’s small businesses.
Mandatory Coverage of Children: Obama will require that all children have health care coverage. Obama will expand the number of options for young adults to get coverage, including allowing young people up to age 25 to continue coverage through their parents' plans.
Expansion Of Medicaid and SCHIP: Obama will expand eligibility for the Medicaid and SCHIP programs and ensure that these programs continue to serve their critical safety net function.
Flexibility for State Plans: Due to federal inaction, some states have taken the lead in health care reform. The Obama plan builds on these efforts and does not replace what states are doing. States can continue to experiment, provided they meet the minimum standards of the national plan.
Lower Costs by Modernizing The U.S. Health Care System
Reducing Costs of Catastrophic Illnesses for Employers and Their Employees: Catastrophic health expenditures account for a high percentage of medical expenses for private insurers. The Obama plan would reimburse employer health plans for a portion of the catastrophic costs they incur above a threshold if they guarantee such savings are used to reduce the cost of workers' premiums.
Helping Patients:
Support disease management programs. Seventy five percent of total health care dollars are spent on patients with one or more chronic conditions, such as diabetes, heart disease and high blood pressure. Obama will require that providers that participate in the new public plan, Medicare or the Federal Employee Health Benefits Program (FEHBP) utilize proven disease management programs. This will improve quality of care, give doctors better information and lower costs.
Coordinate and integrate care. Over 133 million Americans have at least one chronic disease and these chronic conditions cost a staggering $1.7 trillion yearly. Obama will support implementation of programs and encourage team care that will improve coordination and integration of care of those with chronic conditions.
Require full transparency about quality and costs. Obama will require hospitals and providers to collect and publicly report measures of health care costs and quality, including data on preventable medical errors, nurse staffing ratios, hospital-acquired infections, and disparities in care. Health plans will also be required to disclose the percentage of premiums that go to patient care as opposed to administrative costs.
Ensuring Providers Deliver Quality Care:
Promote patient safety. Obama will require providers to report preventable medical errors and support hospital and physician practice improvement to prevent future occurrences.
Align incentives for excellence. Both public and private insurers tend to pay providers based on the volume of services provided, rather than the quality or effectiveness of care. Providers who see patients enrolled in the new public plan, the National Health Insurance Exchange, Medicare and FEHBP will be rewarded for achieving performance thresholds on outcome measures.
Comparative effectiveness research. Obama will establish an independent institute to guide reviews and research on comparative effectiveness, so that Americans and their doctors will have the accurate and objective information they need to make the best decisions for their health and well-being.
Tackle disparities in health care. Obama will tackle the root causes of health disparities by addressing differences in access to health coverage and promoting prevention and public health, both of which play a major role in addressing disparities. He will also challenge the medical system to eliminate inequities in health care through quality measurement and reporting, implementation of effective interventions such as patient navigation programs, and diversification of the health workforce.
Insurance reform. Obama will strengthen antitrust laws to prevent insurers from overcharging physicians for their malpractice insurance and will promote new models for addressing errors that improve patient safety, strengthen the doctor-patient relationship and reduce the need for malpractice suits.
Lowering Costs Through Investment in Electronic Health Information Technology Systems: Most medical records are still stored on paper, which makes it hard to coordinate care, measure quality or reduce medical errors and which costs twice as much as electronic claims. Obama will invest $10 billion a year over the next five years to move the U.S. health care system to broad adoption of standards-based electronic health information systems, including electronic health records, and will phase in requirements for full implementation of health IT. Obama will ensure that patients' privacy is protected.
Lowering Costs by Increasing Competition in the Insurance and Drug Markets: The insurance business today is dominated by a small group of large companies that has been gobbling up their rivals. There have been over 400 health care mergers in the last 10 years, and just two companies dominate a full third of the national market. These changes were supposed to make the industry more efficient, but instead premiums have skyrocketed by over 87 percent.
Barack Obama will prevent companies from abusing their monopoly power through unjustified price increases. His plan will force insurers to pay out a reasonable share of their premiums for patient care instead of keeping exorbitant amounts for profits and administration. His new National Health Exchange will help increase competition by insurers.
Lower prescription drug costs. The second-fastest growing type of health expenses is prescription drugs. Pharmaceutical companies are selling the exact same drugs in Europe and Canada but charging Americans more than double the price. Obama will allow Americans to buy their medicines from other developed countries if the drugs are safe and prices are lower outside the U.S. Obama will also repeal the ban that prevents the government from negotiating with drug companies, which could result in savings as high as $30 billion. Finally, Obama will work to increase the use of generic drugs in Medicare, Medicaid, and FEHBP and prohibit big name drug companies from keeping generics out of markets.
Fight for New Initiatives
Advance the Biomedical Research Field: As a result of biomedical research the prevention, early detection and treatment of diseases such as cancer and heart disease is better today than any other time in history. Barack Obama has consistently supported funding for the national institutes of health and the national science foundation. Obama strongly supports investments in biomedical research, as well as medical education and training in health-related fields, because it provides the foundation for new therapies and diagnostics. Obama has been a champion of research in cancer, mental health, health disparities, global health, women and children's health, and veterans' health. As president, Obama will strengthen funding for biomedical research, and better improve the efficiency of that research by improving coordination both within government and across government/private/non-profit partnerships. An Obama administration will ensure that we translate scientific progress into improved approaches to disease prevention, early detection and therapy that is available for all Americans.
Fight AIDS Worldwide. There are 33 million people across the planet infected with HIV/AIDS. As president, Obama will continue to be a global leader in the fight against AIDS. Obama believes in working across party lines to combat this epidemic and recently joined Senator Sam Brownback (R-KS) at a large California evangelical church to promote greater investment in the global AIDS battle.
Support Americans with Disabilities: As a former civil rights lawyer, Barack Obama knows firsthand the importance of strong protections for minority communities in our society. Obama is committed to strengthening and better enforcing the Americans with Disabilities Act (ADA) so that future generations of Americans with disabilities have equal rights and opportunities. Obama believes we must restore the original legislative intent of the ADA in the wake of court decisions that have restricted the interpretation of this landmark legislation.

Barack Obama is also committed to ensuring that disabled Americans receive Medicaid and Medicare benefits in a low-cost, effective and timely manner. Recognizing that many individuals with disabilities rely on Medicare, Obama worked with Senator Ken Salazar (D-CO) to urge the department of health and human services to provide clear and reliable information on the Medicare prescription drug benefit and to ensure that the Medicare recipients were protected from fraudulent claims by marketers and drug plan agents.
Improve Mental Health Care. Mental illness affects approximately one in five American families. The National Alliance on Mental Illness estimates that untreated mental illnesses cost the U.S. more than $100 billion per year. As president, Obama will support mental health parity so that coverage for serious mental illnesses are provided on the same terms and conditions as other illnesses and diseases.
Protect Our Children from Lead Poisoning. More than 430,000 American children have dangerously high levels of lead in their blood. Lead can cause irreversible brain damage, learning disabilities, behavioral problems, and, at very high levels, seizures, coma and death. As president, Obama will protect children from lead poisoning by requiring that child care facilities be lead-safe within five years.
Reduce Risks of Mercury Pollution. More than five million women of childbearing age have high levels of toxic mercury in their blood, and approximately 630,000 newborns are born at risk every year. Barack Obama has a plan to significantly reduce the amount of mercury that is deposited in oceans, lakes, and rivers, which in turn would reduce the amount of mercury in fish.
Support Americans with Autism. More than one million Americans have autism, a complex neurobiological condition that has a range of impacts on thinking, feeling, language, and the ability to relate to others. As diagnostic criteria broaden and awareness increases, more cases of autism have been recognized across the country. Barack Obama believes that we can do more to help autistic Americans and their families understand and live with autism. He has been a strong supporter of more than $1 billion in federal funding for autism research on the root causes and treatments, and he believes that we should increase funding for the Individuals with Disabilities Education Act to truly ensure that no child is left behind.

More than anything, autism remains a profound mystery with a broad spectrum of effects on autistic individuals, their families, loved ones, the community, and education and health care systems. Obama believes that the government and our communities should work together to provide a helping hand to autistic individuals and their families.

Barack Obama | Change We Can Believe In | Health Care

 

[Liebling:-)))]

Interesting articles

Hillary saying all the right things
Hillary saying all the right things - First Read - msnbc.com


Don´t know much about the economy
'Don't know much about the economy...' - First Read - msnbc.com

 

[Jiro]

Oh, I see. Then there should be no health care available for those who are low income or unemployed or disabled because they cannot pay for it themselves?

If 1.5% of my income will help to provide health coverage for a child living in poverty, so be it. Take another 4% to make up the 5.5%, and use it to provide affordable health insurance for me. Don't take 1.5% of my income for someone else's care, and leave me with too little disposable income to purchase insurance for myself, or to pay for medical costs out of pocket. To pay for self insured coverage would be one hell of a lot more than an additional 4%. That is the point.

do you have a short-term memory? I repeatedly said to revise the health care system to make it affordable. Don't forget that in Europe - they do not heavily subsidize the gas as much as we do... which is one of reasons how they can afford to do universal health care. UK heavily subsidized the medicines.

As for low income or unemployed or disabled people... that's what Social Security tax and revised tax system are for. Like I said - with the revised tax system, the rich people will be paying MORE than now... that should be enough to cover the tab for these unfortunate people. Please try to remember what I said. It's getting tiring to repeat it at least 5x already.

 

[BradB08]

Nor does it seem to be understood that because I work, and my taxes go to pay another's medical costs, my income is such that I can neither get free health care nor afford to be self insured. It's okay for me to support someone else at the expense of not being able to take care of my own needs.:roll:

And I have been paying taxes longer than many members of this forum have been alive.

I'd rather take that amount that I pay for Medicare/Medicaid and put it towards my own health insurance in the form of Universal Healthcare.

 

[BradB08]

Your answer to my question was that you did not think it was right that I did not have health care, nor that my son did not have health insurance. You say that everyone should have the choice to pay into the system.

Okay, let's expand on that. I am given the choice, and I choose not to pay into a system to help provide care for someone else. I take that money, and I invest it, and I put it in a fund in case I have future medical expenses. However, because I have chosen to do this, it means that now, you no longer have Medicare to pay for your medical expenses. Are you satisfied with that solution?

That's exactly what I'd rather do. Screw paying for someone else. What about my bills?

 

[jillio]

do you have a short-term memory? I repeatedly said to revise the health care system to make it affordable. Don't forget that in Europe - they do not heavily subsidize the gas as much as we do... which is one of reasons how they can afford to do universal health care. UK heavily subsidized the medicines.

As for low income or unemployed or disabled people... that's what Social Security tax and revised tax system are for. Like I said - with the revised tax system, the rich people will be paying MORE than now... that should be enough to cover the tab for these unfortunate people. Please try to remember what I said. It's getting tiring to repeat it at least 5x already.

And revising the health care system is exactly what Obama proposes to do.

SS does not provide for health care. Medicare/Medicaid do. SS certainly does not allow people the disposable income necessary to purchase health insurance.

 

[Jiro]

Yes, that´s right. They are still get healthcare when they are out of work. They still get the equal medical treatment as workers/employers/business owners.

No, they won´t become homeless when they are out of work but they get social assistance.

I have to ask you. How long can the government keeps paying for unemployed people? Is there a time limit? We do have same program in here to help the unemployed.

Yes, I know about US system and find really sad... It would be great when anyone open their mind and give Obama the chance to try something new and change America or whatever. Why not try something instead of ignore and think Obama did impossible, etc. etc. etc. They keep on saying that Obama is inexperience, etc. etc.... but they forget quickly about Arnold Schwazenberger... Look at Arnold Schwarzenberger - He doing CA very well when he has no political experience background... :roll:

then he should be Governor of Illinois!!! I'm sorry but President of United States is far more big deal than governor job. You're talking about the fate of the world - especially military. Look at JFK. Young and inexperienced... and what happened? yea there you go. I can live with Obama being a Governor but President? no sir. Not yet. Prove it to me first. Everybody's gotta start at bottom. Apparently - Obama's being arrogant.

 

[Foxrac]

It is not 50 percent that is taking out of my paycheck, FYI. It would bankrupt me if it were true.

Some percentage out of the income taxes which come from our paychecks goes into the health care costs.

I means if included with universal health center at overall, it will be more bigger for middle and high class due USA is very huge country and need have sufficient funds to support universal health center.

 

[BradB08]

then he should be Governor of Illinois!!! I'm sorry but President of United States is far more big deal than governor job. You're talking about the fate of the world - especially military. Look at JFK. Young and inexperienced... and what happened? yea there you go. I can live with Obama being a Governor but President? no sir. Not yet. Prove it to me first. Everybody's gotta start at bottom. Apparently - Obama's being arrogant.

:roll::roll::roll::roll:

Is that the best you can do? Repeat talking points?