Husband of pregnant woman wants her off life support

Yes, I know that. :lol:

Some members may wonder why I didn't post so much because this topic made me very interest to discuss.

It is no fun to post on my iPhone - small screen, a lot of zoom and not easy access to multitasking.
I don't like posting from a phone either.
 
From Secular Pro-Life

In November, Erick Munoz’s wife Marlise, who was 14 weeks pregnant, suffered a blood clot and is still in the hospital hooked up to machines. Doctors say she is brain dead and will never recover. Erick Munoz believes the baby will have defects and the baby’s life won’t be worth living. Her husband says his wife clearly stated she never wanted to be on life support. Erick Munoz wants to “honor his wife’s wishes” and remove her from life support which would kill her and their unborn baby. However, Texas law prevents the removal of a pregnant woman from life support and Erick Munoz is publicly voicing his opposition. [...]

First, when Marlise Munoz told her husband she never wanted to be on life support, did she think about the possibility that she may be pregnant when it happened? Did she consider that if kept alive, her unborn child may be able to survive? I’m going to guess she probably didn’t think about that, and I’m also going to guess that if she knew being kept alive now would give her child a chance at life, she would be willing to stay on life support at least long enough for the baby to be delivered. I know it must pain Erick Munoz to see his wife hooked up to a bunch of tubes, but I can’t figure out why on earth he would value his wife’s wishes more than the life of his baby.

So, he wants to sentence his child (or if you prefer, "parasitic bug", for medical word) to death, but I don't recall his wife ever said, "Yeah, if I'm pregnant on life support, unplug me and kill the baby (or parasitic 'virus', if preferred a medical proper word)."

But, someone made a point that the parents might never thought of that happened to their marriage. Reba and Shel90 are right; they did sign up the agreement, but it seems they probably didn't attention the contract. If the [baby/blobs of disposable tissue] is healthy, the father might change his opinion...

I'm not so sure that the husband knows what his wife's wishes really are in this exact case... She doesn't want to be on life support, yes, I get that. But, the parasite is 18 weeks in what the interview said, and she was originally injured on Nov 26th. So, the tissue was already at about 13 weeks. She could have had an abortion if she wanted one, but apparently, that didn't occur. So, how does he know that she didn't already have a desire to have this parasite? If she did, how does he know that she would want their offspring to be killed as result of taking her off of life support? From her viewpoint, it appears to be two conflicting desires, to keep their parasite and to be taken off life support. I question that if he really knows where she would land when thinking through this situation...

But, how does he know that she would have wanted to end her life to end her offspring's life? If she chose this parasite to live, don't you think her last dying wish would be to give life to her baby/parasitic tissue? Isn't that what "pro-choice" people are all about when it comes to pregnancy? Wanted or unwanted babies?? You would think if he truly loved her, he would love her child(ren) as well, right? Where is his love for this offspring? Once this child/offspring is born, it's going to go to him. Not sure how I feel about that considering he wants that child dead...

I just hope the baby/virus made it to come out as a healthy child/offspring without health issues...

PS: Yes, I treated their "baby" like a parasitic disease because I saw you, Paul, "corrected" Sten, so I don't want you to correct me for 'not using a medical proper.' I get that you AD'ers still believe the fetus is just a "clump of cells" until the offspring 'magically transforms' into a baby by simply leaving the womb. OK, I get that... There is no need to correct me now, anyway.
 
woahaha long time since ive missed a train.........you lost me, the all you black adders, and sacks and cells and stuff
maybe i need a drink (scratches head)
 
Oh yeah he needs to lawyer up, not just to try to stop it. But if they continue with life support he needs to sue the state and hospital later. He is going to have a astronomical medical bill later. Oh yeah, I'd be sending that on to the state and hospital to pay, you wanted to keep her "alive" for the baby to be delivered, here you go here's your bill. He should also sue for disability support and care as well. Between being without oxygen fir howver long the fetus was and being born so prematurely that fetus is guaranteed to have medical issues, probably lots of them. Yeah the state and hospital can take care if that as well. If nature had been allowed to take it's course they both be buried by now.
 
unless something about baby we dont know They must done scans see if viable pregnancy,If it is then baby should be given a chance
 
should the baby be killed if it did? if your gonna kill it for brain damage why not for deafness?
the hearing world wont make that distinction if left to its own devices
given history

Arughh............this is why I HATE hardcore disabilty rights types.
They hear brain damage and they think "oh...the kid's gonna be like a kid with cerebal palsy." You're discriminating against those cute wittle mentally handicapped children and adults who make EVERYONE feel better!"
Brain damage can ALSO be severe.....and not just talking about "high functioning but still severe."......There are children and babies who have such severe brain damage,it's like they don't even HAVE a brain,and are basicly in a persistant vegatative state
 
I think in situation like this there is no right or wrong answer. If it were me, I'd allow the mother to stay on life support. However, I would definitely take legal action to ensure that the financial burden is handled and does not ruin me. The child is likely (not definitely) to have defects. It would be a shame for a single Father to have a newborn and mile high medical bill to deal with.
 
I think in situation like this there is no right or wrong answer. If it were me, I'd allow the mother to stay on life support. However, I would definitely take legal action to ensure that the financial burden is handled and does not ruin me. The child is likely (not definitely) to have defects. It would be a shame for a single Father to have a newborn and mile high medical bill to deal with.

and PROFOUND defects too! People need to stop using the term defects/disabilties as a general term. There is a PLETHORA of difference between say a kid who may have relatively mild issues vs someone with such profound issues,they're in a PVS....Using the general term disabilty for people with extreme profound disabilties,makes the general public think EVERYONE with a disabilty is so impaired!
 
and PROFOUND defects too! People need to stop using the term defects/disabilties as a general term. There is a PLETHORA of difference between say a kid who may have relatively mild issues vs someone with such profound issues,they're in a PVS....Using the general term disabilty for people with extreme profound disabilties,makes the general public think EVERYONE with a disabilty is so impaired!

That's a good point. Every situation is different.
 
I would let them go. I don't think this fetus can grow normally in this condition. Keep her body on ventilator is extremely bad for a fetus. A fetus receives toxins from a decomposing body. The body of a mother has an ability to send oxygen to a fetus. The cell membranes transfer oxygen to the blood, then it flows to fetus. But, do you know what necrosis can do to a pregnant body? Necrosis is so fast! Her body is already turning mush. Arteries walls are already dooming. Fetus sits in middle of the blob is getting toxins. Ventilator even won't stop her from mushing. Look up necrosis. It's awful. Any professional in health care would tell you so.
 
Judge: Take brain-dead woman off ventilator

Husband wants to bury wife

(CNN) -
A Texas judge ordered a hospital on Friday to remove a pregnant and brain-dead woman from respirators and ventilators by 5 p.m. Monday.

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The hospital can appeal the decision.

On Friday, John Peter Smith Hospital acknowledged for the first time that Marlise Munoz, who is being kept on a respirator under Texas law, has been brain dead since November 28 and that the "fetus gestating inside Mrs. Munoz is not viable," according to court documents released before a Friday hearing.

The woman's husband has repeatedly made these claims in his efforts to have her removed from the machines so the family can bury her.

Erick Munoz contends doctors told him his wife "had lost all activity in her brain stem" and an accompanying chart stated that she was "brain dead." He has further called her "nothing more than an empty shell" who should be left to rest in peace.

The overarching, complicated issue of whether the pregnant woman should be kept on a ventilator, as prescribed by Texas law, has been the subject of debate.

The wrenching story started with a pregnant woman found unconscious on her kitchen floor. In the more than eight weeks since then, lying supine in a hospital bed, the 33-year-old became the focus of an intense, emotional debate about who is alive, who is dead, and how the presence of a fetus possibly changes the equation.

Hospital spokesman J.R. Labbe said last month that doctors are simply trying to obey a Texas law that says "you cannot withhold or withdraw life-sustaining treatment for a pregnant patient."

But to Munoz's husband, Erick, she is not a patient because she is not alive. He and other family members say the hospital should abide by her wishes -- which weren't written down but, they say, relayed verbally to them -- and not have machines keep her organs and blood running.

In an affidavit filed Thursday in court, Erick Munoz said little to him now is recognizable about Marlise. Her bones crack when her stiff limbs move. Her usual scent has been replaced by the "smell of death." And her once lively eyes have become "soulless."

"Over these past two months, nothing about my wife indicates she is alive," Erick Munoz said. "... What sits in front of me is a deteriorating body."

Husband: 'Obscene mutilation of a deceased body'

It should have been a happy time for Marlise and Erick Munoz, two trained paramedics awaiting the arrival of their second child.

Then everything came crashing down around 2 a.m. on November 26, when she was rushed to the north-central Texas hospital.

Once there, Erick Munoz said, he was told his wife "was for all purposes brain dead." The family also says the fetus may have been deprived of oxygen.

In his lawsuit, Munoz claims subsequent measures taken at the hospital -- and, in turn, the state law used to justify them -- amount "to nothing more than the cruel and obscene mutilation of a deceased body against the expressed will of the deceased and her family."

The family's attorneys more recently said that Marlise's fetus "is distinctly abnormal," suffering from hydrocephalus and "deformed to the extent that the gender cannot be determined."

"Quite sadly, this information is not surprising due to the fact that the fetus, after being deprived of oxygen for an indeterminate length of time, is gestating within a dead and deteriorating body, as a horrified family looks on in absolute anguish, distress and sadness," attorneys Jessica Janicek and Heather King said in a statement.

The hospital and the Tarrant County District Attorney's Office, which said it will defend the medical facility, have not offered the same level of detail as members of the Munoz family.

But earlier this month, Labbe did tell CNN that his hospital believed "the courts are the appropriate venue to provide clarity, direction and resolution in this matter."

Judge: Take brain-dead woman off ventilator | Health - Home
 
How horrible for the family. I cant imagine.
 
Arughh............this is why I HATE hardcore disabilty rights types.
They hear brain damage and they think "oh...the kid's gonna be like a kid with cerebal palsy." You're discriminating against those cute wittle mentally handicapped children and adults who make EVERYONE feel better!"
Brain damage can ALSO be severe.....and not just talking about "high functioning but still severe."......There are children and babies who have such severe brain damage,it's like they don't even HAVE a brain,and are basicly in a persistant vegatative state

I'm not sure what what your statement has to do with my post.
Indeed you are correct there are some children born that in the end they are just vegetables.
But what really is the numbers of these? To me really it's not about the babies born as vegetables. Once we make it easy fort he gov to do away with what ever it deems as unwanted or unworthy to live it won't just stop with vegetable babies.
History demonstrates this fairly clearly.
Why would the hearie world just stop it's cost effective and monetary approach to being born and having the right to live?
If we do away with vegetable babies, and do away with those born so deformed they are such. Burden and waste on the tax payers, how long will it be when others are targeted?
The first laws passed by nazi Germany were against the Deaf not Jews. Once they found it easy to target the deaf others int eh end were targeted and the list grew. There is a lesson here for us.
 
Arughh............this is why I HATE hardcore disabilty rights types.
They hear brain damage and they think "oh...the kid's gonna be like a kid with cerebal palsy." You're discriminating against those cute wittle mentally handicapped children and adults who make EVERYONE feel better!"
Brain damage can ALSO be severe.....and not just talking about "high functioning but still severe."......There are children and babies who have such severe brain damage,it's like they don't even HAVE a brain,and are basicly in a persistant vegatative state

As disability rights advocate, I'm focus on deaf, blind and deafblind.

For brain damaged - OMG.
 
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