Explosions at Boston Marathon finish line

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CrazyPaul said:
No, the younger guy told FBI that they didn't work for any terrorist group and they were on their own. It may be a truth or lie.
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thats what i want to know if there is any updated words from the younger boys allegation. eh.
 
whatdidyousay! said:
I am going to find it very hard to believe anything a terrorist said!
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would it help if FBI and intelligence community have found nothing? no connection at all. they believe the brothers were working on their own.
 
Jiro said:
would it help if FBI and intelligence community have found nothing? no connection at all. they believe the brothers were working on their own.
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yeah and did they say why they did that to hurt over 200 people for what? No i didnt read about this one today at all.
 
Frisky Feline said:
yeah and did they say why they did that to hurt over 200 people for what? No i didnt read about this one today at all.
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we don't know yet. If I remembered correctly - Dzhokhar had 4 flashbangs thrown at him. I think he's most likely deaf and may have some brain damage.

right now - he's communicating by paper & pen.
 
can you all image if hearing people are required to know ASL when they were born.. so for example, the younger boy couldnt be able to speak due to his throat being wounded. so ASL is the perfect example. :P
 
this is where I got most of my info from -

Should criminal investigations be crowdsourced? - CNN.com
(CNN) -- Reddit general manager Erik Martin has had a busy few days.

His popular website, which thrives on real-time message boards and contributions by users on a variety of topics, received record traffic -- as well as pointed criticism -- for its treatment of the Boston Marathon bomber case.

In particular, critics took Reddit to task for what they perceived as its overeager determination to help authorities identify suspects in the many images of the scene being shared online. One group of redditors, as the site's users are known, speculated that Sunil Tripathi, a Brown University student who has been missing since last month, could be a possible suspect. Tripathi's family temporarily took down a Facebook page asking for help finding him after they were bombarded by ugly comments.

Other Reddit users focused on two young men with heavy-looking bags, one of whom wore a blue track suit. The New York Post even splashed a photo of the two marathon spectators on its front page with the headline, "Bag Men: Feds seek these two pictured at Boston Marathon." The guy in the track suit turned out to be a 17-year-old suburban Boston track star who told The Associated Press he was afraid to leave his house because of the scrutiny.

Reaction was quick and scathing. The Atlantic's Alexis Madrigal wrote a column called "Hey Reddit, Enough Boston Bombing Vigilantism," and followed it up with a story on how the names of two innocent people got repeated in a viral loop on social media. Alex Pareene addressed the issue in a similar Salon column, "The Internet's shameful false ID."

The moderator of a subreddit, or comment thread titled findbostonbombers, which had been set up to crowdsource the identities of the bombers, apologized.

Martin agrees with some of the criticism.

"The crowdsourced, more criminal investigation was very volatile and fraught with problems, and, obviously, wrong," he told CNN in an interview Monday. "That was something we all wished hadn't happened."

He posted a note on the site that went into more detail.

"We hoped that the crowdsourced search for new information would not spark exactly this type of witch hunt. We were wrong," it read. Noting the site's rule against widely sharing personal information, it added, "The search for the bombers bore less resemblance to the types of vindictive internet witch hunts our no-personal-information rule was originally written for, but the outcome was no different."

Canvassing the Internet

But, Martin adds, Reddit did a lot of good as well.

Another subreddit, devoted to aggregating the news as it happened, is only the second thread in the site's history -- after President Obama's "Ask Me Anything" page -- to outpace Reddit's mainpage in traffic. The site overall peaked at 270,000 visitors -- 50% higher than its usual -- when bombing suspect Dzhokhar Tsarnaev was captured Friday night.

Reddit's ability to stay current is one of the site's great advantages, writes Time's Jared Newman.

"As a massive community on the hunt for interesting things, it can canvas the Internet in ways that a single news organization or reporter cannot," he wrote.

Redditors also used Boston-area threads to let visitors know what streets were passable and closed, worked to get pizzas to hospitals and emergency workers, helped find hotel rooms for stranded visitors and even arranged a meetup at a park for playing with dogs.

That's the thing about crowdsourcing and social media, says cybersecurity expert Doug White: The media are only as good as their contributors.

In general, getting more people involved can be beneficial to law enforcement, says White, the head of the Forensic, Applied Networking & Security Lab at Rhode Island's Roger Williams University.

"Initially, it helps," he says. "My experience is that, with any piece of evidence, the more people who look at it, the more likely you are to get a different viewpoint. The more eyes that see it, the better off you are."

A new protocol?

On the other hand, Internet participation is so new that law enforcement isn't sure how to handle it, he says. It's like the old-fashioned police-tip lines, except on a much bigger scale. (After the FBI released photos of the bombing suspects, its website received more than 300,000 tips per minute, according to news reports.)

Like eliminating bugs from software programs, it takes time to weed the cranks out of the system -- and, in a fast-moving case like Boston, the cranks went viral, as all the false IDs and dead ends indicated.

"I think there's a lot of issues with doing this, but I hope these people have a protocol," White says.

Oscar Baez, a 24-year south Florida law enforcement veteran, agrees that participants on sites such as Reddit should funnel their theories and suggestions to authorities.

"On the computer, you can do whatever you want to, as long as you don't interfere with somebody's rights," says Baez, who now heads a private firm called Executive Tactical Training. "I always say, give us the information, let us do the legwork, let us do the computer work, let us do everything."

It's not just for reasons of privacy and proper legal protocol, he adds. People can get hurt. Baez has had tipsters call who tell him they've been conducting surveillance on suspects, which makes him furious.

"What if they're following the real suspect? What if they're following a murderer? Once that person realizes there's somebody following them, the chances are pretty good they're going to get hurt," he says. And hiding behind a computer is no promise of safety, he adds: "Even contacting that person online can still be traced back to you."

Media mixups

As with past episodes -- such as the naming of the wrong suspect in the Newtown massacre -- the frantic pursuit of information can come perilously close to mob justice.

The subreddit board, interestingly, was aware of how things could go wrong. Throughout last week's chain of events, two of the most popular entries were dedicated to Richard Jewell, the man falsely accused of the Atlanta Centennial Olympic Park bombing, and a link to an Errol Morris video on "Umbrella Man," a figure who has been wrongly named in a number of JFK conspiracy theories.

Both functioned as warnings for what could happen when gut reaction overwhelmed calm rationality.

Oops777, the redditor who set up findbostonbombers in the first place, kept trying to rein in both Reddit users and the news media.

"Media Outlets, please stop making the images of potential suspects go viral, then blaming this small subreddit for it," he titled one post. "Until the media got involved, none of the images were going anywhere but to the FBI."

But maintaining control is always going to be a challenge on such free-flowing sites, says Reddit's Martin.

"I don't think we can fix the basic problems with human behavior," he says.

But, he adds, "We can certainly mitigate it. If we can make sure to channel people's desire to help and adrenaline-fueled activity into things that are clearly positive and aren't fraught with as many dangerous (possibilities), that should be the aim for any future crisis."
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Jiro said:
I'm particularly very disturbed at how police has illegally performed numbers of house searches. the homeowners and family members were forced out of their own homes with their hands up at gunpoint.
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Me too, Jiro. Me too... regardless of the reason it happened, if martial law in a major US city doesn't scare people just a little bit, they're probably comfortable with totalitarianism. Martial law in Boston didn't catch the suspect. Some guy that ventured outside his house to check on his boat caught the suspect.

I'm less concerned with this incident than I am of other blatant abuses of authority, but every little incremental step that possibly condones or even encourages unchecked authority needs to be viewed with alarm and caution. Here's a fun little glimpse into what life will be like if we keep overlooking abuses of authority, that happened:

Reporters are being told to move away from the scene. A police officer told a reporter: "If you want to live, turn off your cell phone."
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Police converge on neighborhood outside Boston | National & World News | Seattle News, Weather, Sports, Breaking News | KOMO News

So having your cell phone on yesterday, as a reporter, was evidently enough justification for that cop to kill someone. These are the people we're giving unchecked authority to. I bet that story doesn't get non-stop coverage on CNN today, huh?

Then there's this:

An indication of the complex investigation ahead came, when an Obama administration official told NBC News that Tsarnaev would not be given a Miranda warning when he is physically able to be interrogated after receiving medical treatment.

Instead, the official said, the government will invoke a legal rule known as the "public safety exception," which will enable investigators to question Tsarnaev without first advising him of his right to remain silent and to be afforded legal counsel.
If they can take away one citizen's rights, they can take away yours. You may not go out and bomb anything/anyone, but they have the power to shift definitions whenever they want.
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What's next: The interrogation of the Boston bombing suspect - Open Channel

Here's something to think on:

But this is what strikes one the most, pondering all of the above: the police state did not catch the suspect. The borg did not catch the suspect. Martial law did not catch the suspect. People forced to stay in their homes did not catch the suspect. Warrantless searches did not catch the suspect.

Like the government's initial failure (or worse) to identify and apprehend the suspects before the bombing, the government also failed in its military assault on an entire city.

Let us never forget that Dzhokar Tsarnaev was discovered by a private citizen, who happened to go out and check on his boat (i.e. violating the lockdown order of the cops), see a body inside of it, and call the cops. In other words, the police state achieved nothing but the psychological conditioning of the population: when we, the state, decide any particular event is important enough, you will lose every single right including possibly the right to life if you resist.
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Martial Law in Boston Did Not Catch the Suspect « LewRockwell.com Blog

Writing in the Washington Times Communities section, Thomas Mullen sums it up nicely:

19-year-old Boston Marathon bombing suspect Dzhokar Tsarnaev is in custody. Assuming that Tsarnaev is indeed guilty of these crimes, a very real threat to public safety has been taken off the streets. That’s the good news.

The bad news is that the Tsarnaev brothers have taken the last vestiges of a free society in America down with them.

The Bill of Rights was already on life support before this tragedy. Before the dust settled after 9/11, the 4th Amendment had been nullified by the Patriot Act. The 5th and 6th Amendments were similarly abolished with the Military Commission Act of 2006 and the 2012 NDAA resolution, which contained a clause allowing the president to arrest and indefinitely detain American citizens on American soil without due process of law.
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Folks... this legacy is the real Boston tragedy. The Rubicon has been crossed.

Alea iacta est
 
Frisky Feline said:
yeah and did they say why they did that to hurt over 200 people for what? No i didnt read about this one today at all.
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Oh, their motive was to defend Islam. I don't know what it's all about. I think maybe the older brother was pissed off about Afghanistan and Iraq wars.
 
...Sean Collier, 26, of Somerville, Mass., was an officer at the Massachusetts Institute of Technology. He was found shot in his vehicle on the campus late Thursday night as authorities pursued two brothers named as suspects in Monday's deadly marathon attack...

Collier sustained multiple gunshot wounds, according to the Middlesex District Attorney in Massachusetts. He was transported to Massachusetts General Hospital, where he was pronounced dead.

Collier crossed paths with the two suspects, Dzhokhar and Tamerlan Tsarnaev, at approximately 10:20 p.m. Thursday night, authorities said — roughly five hours after the FBI released surveillance photos of the two men they say planted twin bombs near the finish line of Monday's Boston Marathon, killing three people and wounding 176.

The suspects shot Collier on the MIT campus in Cambridge, Mass., following an altercation, according to authorities. They then allegedly carjacked a Mercedes SUV, holding the driver hostage for a half hour before freeing him at a gas station in Cambridge, according to sources.

On their way to the neighboring town of Watertown, they tossed explosive devices outside the SUV’s window, officials said. In a long exchange of gunfire between the suspects and authorities, a transit officer, Richard Donahue, was seriously injured...

In a tragic coincidence, Collier and Donahue were "actually really good friends” who graduated from the same 26-member police academy class together three years ago, according to Milton, Mass., police officer Michael Delaney, who went to the academy with them.

"It's bizarre," Delaney said. "To take two of them out of there, it's a decent percentage."

Delaney, 36, said both Collier and Donahue lived in Somerville. He remembered Collier as a "technology nerd."

"He was definitely the smartest kid in the class. He built us a website that the instructors didn't know about, but we used as a forum to communicate with each other outside of class." Delaney said. "Sometimes [the teachers] weren't so clear on the instructions. It helped ensure that no one screwed up."

Delaney said he heard on the news last night that an MIT officer had been shot, and he immediately texted Collier. When his friend didn't text back, he started to worry. Hours later, he found out from a Facebook group he and other police officers from the academy are in that Collier was shot....
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Officials: 'Dedicated officer' gunned down by Boston Marathon suspects at MIT - U.S. News
 
NitroHonda said:
Reporters are being told to move away from the scene. A police officer told a reporter: "If you want to live, turn off your cell phone."
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So having your cell phone on yesterday, as a reporter, was evidently enough justification for that cop to kill someone....
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I took it that the officer was warning the reporter of the danger of cell phones triggering the explosives that were in the area. I didn't read anything about the cop threatening to kill the reporter.

The cop told the reporter to turn off the phone, not to turn off the camera or quit taking notes. He wasn't preventing the reporter from reporting.
 
Reba said:
I took it that the officer was warning the reporter of the danger of cell phones triggering the explosives that were in the area. I didn't read anything about the cop threatening to kill the reporter.

The cop told the reporter to turn off the phone, not to turn off the camera or quit taking notes. He wasn't preventing the reporter from reporting.
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not threatening to kill the reporter. just want to be able to kill the bomber without being seen on camera or by reporters.
 
Reba said:
I took it that the officer was warning the reporter of the danger of cell phones triggering the explosives that were in the area. I didn't read anything about the cop threatening to kill the reporter.

The cop told the reporter to turn off the phone, not to turn off the camera or quit taking notes. He wasn't preventing the reporter from reporting.
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I hope that it went down exactly as you said. Unfortunately, I'm going to keep on wearing my tinfoil hat for this one. I am immensely alarmed by the gradual loss of our rights since the Patriot Act was enacted enabling our "Protect to Serve" units in assisting with that. Shoot, the Coast Guard has been doing tactical drills from helicopters in Galveston and Miami!

I just have very little faith in where we're ultimately headed as a country.
 
NitroHonda said:
Folks... this legacy is the real Boston tragedy. The Rubicon has been crossed.

Alea iacta est
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As I said, "In exigent circumstances, or emergency situations, police can conduct warrantless searches to protect public safety. This exception to the Fourth Amendment’s probable cause requirement normally addresses situations of “hot pursuit,” in which an escaping suspect is tracked to a private home. But it might also apply to the events unfolding in Boston if further harm or injury might be supposed to occur in the time it takes to secure a warrant. A bomber believed to be armed and planning more violence would almost certainly meet such prerequisites.

Furthermore, police may enter a private residence to provide emergency assistance to an occupant—which may include apprehending a suspected terrorist who also happens to be inside. And if they plan to make an arrest in someone’s home, they can undertake a “protective sweep” of the dwelling first to confirm that no weapons or accomplices are stashed away where they can do damage later."

Boston bomber manhunt: Is the Watertown door-to-door search by police for Dzhokhar Tsarnaev legal? - Slate Magazine
 
VacationGuy234 said:
As I said, "In exigent circumstances, or emergency situations, police can conduct warrantless searches to protect public safety. This exception to the Fourth Amendment’s probable cause requirement normally addresses situations of “hot pursuit,” in which an escaping suspect is tracked to a private home. But it might also apply to the events unfolding in Boston if further harm or injury might be supposed to occur in the time it takes to secure a warrant. A bomber believed to be armed and planning more violence would almost certainly meet such prerequisites.

Furthermore, police may enter a private residence to provide emergency assistance to an occupant—which may include apprehending a suspected terrorist who also happens to be inside. And if they plan to make an arrest in someone’s home, they can undertake a “protective sweep” of the dwelling first to confirm that no weapons or accomplices are stashed away where they can do damage later."

Boston bomber manhunt: Is the Watertown door-to-door search by police for Dzhokhar Tsarnaev legal? - Slate Magazine
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In other words... they can do whatever the hell they want.
 
NitroHonda said:
In other words... they can do whatever the hell they want.
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No, they can only search if there is a real threat. They can't just come to someone's house and search it, there must be an imminent public safety issue.

EDIT: A guy who is throwing bombs, hijacking cars and has killed innocent people would certainly rise to that level, I think. Personally, I think it was overkill, but it is what it is.
 
Jiro said:
not threatening to kill the reporter. just want to be able to kill the bomber without being seen on camera or by reporters.
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Except the cop told him to turn off his phone, not his camera.

I think you're reading a lot more into this than what he actually said. Besides, the cop didn't prohibit the reporter from reporting his quote, did he?
 
NitroHonda said:
...the Coast Guard has been doing tactical drills from helicopters in Galveston and Miami!..
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So what does that indicate to you? What did the Coast Guard say about it?
 
VacationGuy234 said:
As I said, "In exigent circumstances, or emergency situations, police can conduct warrantless searches to protect public safety. This exception to the Fourth Amendment’s probable cause requirement normally addresses situations of “hot pursuit,” in which an escaping suspect is tracked to a private home. But it might also apply to the events unfolding in Boston if further harm or injury might be supposed to occur in the time it takes to secure a warrant. A bomber believed to be armed and planning more violence would almost certainly meet such prerequisites.

Furthermore, police may enter a private residence to provide emergency assistance to an occupant—which may include apprehending a suspected terrorist who also happens to be inside. And if they plan to make an arrest in someone’s home, they can undertake a “protective sweep” of the dwelling first to confirm that no weapons or accomplices are stashed away where they can do damage later."

Boston bomber manhunt: Is the Watertown door-to-door search by police for Dzhokhar Tsarnaev legal? - Slate Magazine
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That makes sense. No time to get a search warrant from a judge while the criminal is around killing people in a house somewhere. I doubt that those residents even complained about it.
 
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