EVIDENCE of being deaf with Hearing Aid device

[Liebling:-)))]

The Kennedy School doesn't do that. While they do bi-bi education, it has nothing to do with deaf/HOH or signing.

 

[Cloggy]

Cloggy, that Harlan Lane quote came from his book, The Mask of Benevolence.

I know, I read it, great book when you want information regarding Deaf culture. Terrible when you want info regarding CI. The book is almost 20 years old.
So the information about Deaf culture is still valid.
The information about CI is old. In the time when the book was written, at 40Mbyt harddisk was spupreme and with 133 MHz you had top of the bill....
Same with CI.

So, I recommend it to anyone in order to learn about Deaf culture.

 

[gnulinuxman]

The Kennedy School doesn't do that. While they do bi-bi education, it has nothing to do with deaf/HOH or signing.

does THAT mean???

 

[gnulinuxman]

I know, I read it, great book when you want information regarding Deaf culture. Terrible when you want info regarding CI. The book is almost 20 years old.
So the information about Deaf culture is still valid.
The information about CI is old. In the time when the book was written, at 40Mbyt harddisk was spupreme and with 133 MHz you had top of the bill....
Same with CI.

So, I recommend it to anyone in order to learn about Deaf culture.

So why does your sig say the opposite?

 

[ayala920]

does THAT mean???

I believe ismi means that the school is not for deaf students, so their bi/bi program isn't ASL/English. Ismi, correct me if I'm wrong.

 

[Boult]

Deaf Education


http://www.asl.org/about.htm

Dedicated both to its American educational philosophy and to its diverse student body, which represents about 50 nationalities, ASL offers a rigorous curriculum with a sophisticated global perspective. The School seizes every possible advantage of its location in the heart of the world's most international city, whether through in-class visits by noted London residents or day and overnight trips in the city, Britain and continental Europe.


ASL is the oldest American school in London and remains the only non-profit American school in England. The School is organized into three school divisions, Lower, Middle and High School, ensuring developmental and age-appropriate settings for our students. Over the years, we have developed a strong school culture that emphasizes the intellectual and moral growth of our students. Very quickly our students absorb the values of the School — a commitment to excellence, intellectual self-reliance, eagerness to assume responsibility, an appreciation for diversity and a global perspective. Experiential learning opportunities — learning by doing — are integrated throughout the curriculum, creating an environment where students are encouraged to take educational risks.
The outstanding ASL faculty are closely involved with our students, not only in the classroom, but as coaches, advisors, mentors and friends. They foster an atmosphere of true learning that encourages our students to engage in rigorous intellectual activity and independent thinking.
With a student body representing many nationalities, the School is strongly committed to bringing an international and multi-cultural perspective into all aspects of School life. We also recognize that we are a cultural and community center for Americans in London and work to help families making the transition to life in London.

The School is committed to a partnership between school and family providing an environment of openness, responsiveness and communication – an environment that places the child’s well-being at the center.

Accreditation

Accredited by the European Council of International Schools and the Middle States Association of Colleges and Schools.

Mission statement • Strategic Plan • Philosophy & Objectives • History • Calendar 2005–2006 • Calendar 2006–2007

For those who got confused by ismi and other's saying this is not school for deaf. you need to go to main page and you will notice it is hearing school that teach students the american way... hence the name "American School in London" Sweetmind mistook it for a deaf school due to the name "ASL" It makes me wonder if she really browse the site? go see for yourself http://www.asl.org ! No where in that site mention the word "deaf"

See those highlighted in Bold is what ismi meant;

The primary "audience" is American children whose parents are diplomats (and sometimes military) or are otherwise stationed in London by the government. They do accept students from other nations, but that's their primary focus.

 

[Boult]

Having a signed version of Bon Jovi's music is just like reading the KJV Holy Bible rather than reading the Holy Bible in the original language.

It's just a translation of the real thing.

with beats and muffled sounds to supplement it that's it...

 

[Cloggy]

So why does your sig say the opposite?

Because HL's signature is from a Deaf standpoint, saying that the mother should adjust.
My viewpoint (hearing) is that when the parent is adjusting, the child is being prepared for a deaf identity. It would have fitted with that 2% of the world population and only later would have the possibility to reach out to the other 98%. (His quote assumes the parent learning sign. Not teaching the child to "read" oral speech.)

HL wrote the book in a time that for a profound deaf person the options were still oral and sign (or both), but allways profound deaf. In that setting I can see that the parent has to adjust. Either by spending time on sign or by spending time on oral education, but this would still be the child adjusting.
Now, there is a choice. The choice is profound deaf with the choices stated above OR be able to hear. With this in mind the child will have to adapt to the rest of the world.

But it's more logical for me that for someone in a country where English is the only language used (mostly)
We had the choice between Profound deaf, with the child having to cope with different languages (at least 3). We could not expect our friends and family to learn sign at a level that she would have. The first years that would work but beyond 4 years of age the child is so fluent that a person that is not in direct contact with her would not be able to follow. This would be freinds and family. The only fluent conversation she would have would be with us (in sign or oral) and her deaf culture.
The other choice is to have the child adapt. When she is understanding speech, can hear, she will be able to learn the different languages and communicate with all.

Obviously, there are other options like many on the board have experienced, but the above is just to illustrate why I change Harlan Lane's quote.

 

[Boult]

Evidence right there that even Deaf people love music and enjoy it without hearing aids or cochlear implants!

uhh she wrote that so it is not part of the article.. **shrug**

Yeah, they do miss something in the music... It is well known that profound deaf loves hard rocks due to beats not the lyrics. What if they got attracted to heavy beats and nods his head till he/she found out it is a satan music eh..

I watched my sisters' ballet many time with full orchestra in 70's and 80's, I don't get it. now with CI, I get it. My father loved Tito Schipia, a Tenor, growing up telling my dad not to play the music in family room.. but had to tolerate, that was with HA. Now, after my visit to my dad this Feb, he still play them, I enjoyed it with my CI. Because with HA, it sound muddled to me and can't make it out. with CI, I can tell he is "speaking" in the song because Tenor tends to sing in high frequency. With my HA I can't get those in.

My dad has huge collection of Tito Schipa than anyone else because he made CD's from all those old vinyls for Tito Schipa's son in Italy so he can sell them to all Tito Schipa lovers and he get royalties from sales. I do have the CD collections that my dad gave to me. ( http://www.titoschipa.it/catsrengl.htm the first one mentioning 30 CDs ) I am well known to love Classical Rock in my family, what I mean by Classical Rock is Emerson, Lake & Palmer type of music, they use two type of music into one Classical instruments and rock instruments. http://www.emersonlakepalmer.com/

My oldest brother has huge collections of Salsa musics both in vinyls and CDs almost fill the room!

and rest of my siblings they all loves musics so I hear the music everyday in the household growing up! all kinds!

Ok enough rambling for me eh..

 

[ismi]

Ayala and Boult are correct. English-ASL aren't the only choices of languages and cultures for a bilingual/bicultural education.

 

[gnulinuxman]

uhh she wrote that so it is not part of the article.. **shrug**

Yeah, they do miss something in the music... It is well known that profound deaf loves hard rocks due to beats not the lyrics. What if they got attracted to heavy beats and nods his head till he/she found out it is a satan music eh.. [...]

I like instrumental and video game music more than other types because they don't have lyrics, and I am hearing... I prefer beats over lyrics myself.

 

[gnulinuxman]

Ayala and Boult are correct. English-ASL aren't the only choices of languages and cultures for a bilingual/bicultural education.

Gotcha.

 

[deafmedicalpoet]

music

I like instrumental and video game music more than other types because they don't have lyrics, and I am hearing... I prefer beats to lyrics myself.

I second that because I listen to music , but the same kind as gnulinuxman only a few others too. I am deaf but I listen through my hand and feel the vibrations.

Deaflinuxgeek

 

[SmiLe ImL]

u deaf are so weird almost feel like a blind person.

 

[Fragmenter]

I didn't know you were fluent in Hebrew, Aramaic, and Greek...

Wouldn't you rather read the Bible in the original language as it was intended?

I guarantee no self-respecting music artist would officially endorse their music in another language.

I completely miss the point of music but every hearing person I know can't live without music. They also thought you, as a hearing person, liking the beats over lyrics were funny... then "funny" became "abnormal" They say it's not music until both goes hand in hand.

They say they don't understand where you are coming from.

 

[Fragmenter]

I second that because I listen to music , but the same kind as gnulinuxman only a few others too. I am deaf but I listen through my hand and feel the vibrations.

Deaflinuxgeek

Please post original material. It's like you pick up every crumb left behind by Dan.

 

[Sweetmind]

Originally Posted by Liebling))
Yes, I notice we have many bicultural/bilingual education for deaf, HOH and CI children here in Germany.


The Kennedy School doesn't do that. While they do bi-bi education, it has nothing to do with deaf/HOH or signing.

Liebling is correct in her statement that it is he best way to have bicultural/bilingual education for all Deaf chidren s rights. I dont believe this person who said that it has nothing to do with Deaf children s signing. **scratching my head** I guess she has no idea about the Deaf community itself where educated people understand our needs to have the better education for Deaf children’s needs.

Of course Deaf people stood up and strongly believe in our ASL that should be included in our classrooms that hasnt happened for many years and years because of oral rules. Now there are only few Deaf schools with the opportunity to have BI BI langauges today, that is very slow paced, to change our Deaf Education needs. Now you can see many deaf oralists/HOH do not read well or understand the concept of meanings in many ways.

I, personally, strongly believe that ASL is the best choice for Deaf children s equal rights you cannot expect them to hear everything with the devices as I have already proved it from the start.

You know America is far behind while other Deaf schools in other countries are ahead of us after all they succeeded with Deaf Education where they focus Deaf children s equal rights. They have a better attitude than anyone here as I can see.

But Sweetmind that is like sending an article about people having fun playing wheelchair basketball to disabled people and telling them that they don't need anything to help them further with mobility in life outside of the game!

I saw that article simply as showing ASL users having fun at a concert, that's all. I'm glad they had a great time that night. However it still doesn't address all the issues of every day life that deaf people have to face in employment, day to day contact with the hearing world etc etc.

Where have you been? You have too many illusions from the culturally egocentric hearing version. You were influeneced by audism. I can see you dont read very well what I have posted about ASL cirriculum.
Also your comparison with wheelchair users is not used in the right context here because of course they need a wheelchair to be mobile but that is not the same as being deaf because we can still be alive and alert with ASL we dont need devices...they dont always do their job...wheelchairs do.

What's so wrong about using a device to enable that?

Whats so wrong with living without devices?

I ve had experience with HA to hear that I cannot lie about however I did not hear everything like people expected me to. I was in trouble all the time...because people truly believed I could hear because I speak very well and they wont accept that I am deaf. Why give mixed messages...CI corporation lies about alot of things about our deafness in a negative way to make people believe that CI are so Great...but it is not! We all are the same..we cannot hear everything...so there is no difference.

Deaf people who sign only already could enjoy music to a limited degree - you have signing choirs and deaf people can dance to music with a strong beat for example. It's not a big deal. But it is that - limited. Some people enjoy listening to instrumental pieces for example. Music is more than just lyrics

So what? because I have already adapted with the feelings of music/sound.

why should I tell that to Cloggy? He and I have spoken extensively here and in emails about his daughter. I know his reasons for wanting her implanted and music is NOT the most importnt one - its just a perk. Her being able to fully communicate with both the deaf and hearing world, speak etc is his highest priority - all you have to do is read his many posts about Lottie to know that

I am involved in the Hearing community everyday and I have no devices. So what is your point?

Deaf ppl are more like sardine can only lives in underwater very different separated from ppl outside of the world.

I disagree with this remark...you make it sound like deaf people are Hermits or recluses. Im sure there are a few because they werent provided with good service or reccomendations. i have helped some people like that who were very happy with the information I gave them and they have changed their lives.

Deaf can only feel the beat from the music but nuthin more than that anything else with a vocal singer.

I can feel the different sounds of voice, drums, piano, all kinds of instruments by the different vibrations without HAs. I have already accepted myself and learned to adapt. It is better than nothing. I can hear more loud music without HA’s because it is normal sounds.

This is a bit late in the thread, but I think it's important to mention. Sweetmind: the ASL you mentioned in two posts upthread (titled "Deaf Education" and "Deaf Sports vs. Hearing Sports") does not stand for American Sign Language. It's the American School in London - my mom taught there for several years; I'm named after one of her students. They don't sign, and they aren't a school for the deaf. The primary "audience" is American children whose parents are diplomats (and sometimes military) or are otherwise stationed in London by the government. They do accept students from other nations, but that's their primary focus. Schools similar to this exist all over the world, and in many countries, provide a place for American and other children to meet and learn about each other's cultures. The Kennedy School in Berlin is another good example of this (my mom taught there, too). They do bi-bi (bicultural/bilingual) education - in English and German

I am aware that in this case ASL is not american sign language I posted this here because these are the things that Deaf schools should have for their deaf students with or without multiple disibilities.

ASL is the oldest American school in London and remains the only non-profit American school in England. The School is organized into three school divisions, Lower, Middle and High School, ensuring developmental and age-appropriate settings for our students. Over the years, we have developed a strong school culture that emphasizes the intellectual and moral growth of our students. Very quickly our students absorb the values of the School — a commitment to excellence, intellectual self-reliance, eagerness to assume responsibility, an appreciation for diversity and a global perspective. Experiential learning opportunities — learning by doing — are integrated throughout the curriculum, creating an environment where students are encouraged to take educational risks.
The outstanding ASL faculty are closely involved with our students, not only in the classroom, but as coaches, advisors, mentors and friends. They foster an atmosphere of true learning that encourages our students to engage in rigorous intellectual activity and independent thinking.
With a student body representing many nationalities, the School is strongly committed to bringing an international and multi-cultural perspective into all aspects of School life. We also recognize that we are a cultural and community center for Americans in London and work to help families making the transition to life in London

I am aware that in this case ASL is not american sign language I posted this here because these are the things that Deaf schools should apply for their deaf students with or without multiple disibilities. Why cant Deaf students have this in their schools? Mainstream/Hearing schools do not accomodate for the deaf students with what they are provided at a deaf school. Why do we need interpreters all day in the classrooms...there is no bonding between teacher and students...that is what I dont agree with because they are taught to depend on an interpreter...when out of school there will not be an interpreter by their side for every conversation so what are they to do? It costs more to pay for interpreter services that to just have a deaf school. As far as my deaf sports post...I was trying to point out that deaf teams compete with hearing teams in leagues, tournaments etc...but it is hard to communicate with them so why not let deaf teams compete against other deaf teams? Why cant we have that? To feel Equally challenged? I have ZERO tolerance for people that totally ignore people's special needs.

This thread is where Mookie and gnulinuxman are talking about multiple disibilitiy people that need Deaf role models.
http://www.alldeaf.com/showthread.php?p=531138#post531138


ASL extremists with a cold hearted have no idea what we went through as deaf oralists.
Oral extremists with a cold hearted lie to themselves and they are not open like myself they cover up their problems as though everything is perfect..Deaf can do anything except hear and dont lie about the deaf community. To them it is horrible but to me it is fine..Why blame deaf people’s true language and lie that we can hear everyhting with devices for years and years. This is erroneous information. The problem has nothing to do with ASL or being deaf or deaf schools.

I think she drinks Haterade every day.

Actually my drink of choice is Coca cola Classic thank you!

If you wants everyone's respects then you needs to respects them also...

I have noticed that people do not let deaf people tell the truth about their experiences as a deaf oralist like myself. Just because they are friends with me or agree with me and my opinions...Though they never showed disrespect to others they were attacked...so share that quote with some of the other members who like to attack people based on friendships or similar opinions here because they need to hear it. You expect me to agree with everything you believe? I have too many experiences to just jump on your bandwagon so people will like me. Id rather the truth be heard. I would rather be deaf than use the devices and oraliam all the time...I have a freedom of choice.

Originally Posted by Liebling))I see nothing wrong to have agreement to disagreement each other.

It doesn´t mean that I´m closed mind when I´m disagree to implant babies to toddler with CI and beleive to give my child´s choice when he/she is old enough. I respect eveyone when I´m disagree with their decision to implant babies to toddler with CI.

I 100% agree with this quote....you took the words right out of my mouth!

My point is that the code of medical ethics says do not harm... that includes Deafness...they DID damage deaf childrens residual hearing that is NOT allowed because it is not a fix to the problem. They cannot compare ears to bodyparts because it is not related to sound.Deaf children can hear with a hearing aid but they cannot hear everything so why force a CI upon them.


Thank you!
Sweetmind

 

[gnulinuxman]

Wouldn't you rather read the Bible in the original language as it was intended?

No.

I guarantee no self-respecting music artist would officially endorse their music in another language.

Wrong. Desi Arnaz sang many of his songs in the original Spanish and in English (like Babalu).

I completely miss the point of music but every hearing person I know can't live without music. They also thought you, as a hearing person, liking the beats over lyrics were funny... then "funny" became "abnormal" They say it's not music until both goes hand in hand.

See??? That's why I like Deaf Culture--I hate the hearing culture (but NOT necessarily the ability to hear). My Deaf friends like me and understand me. I don't give a care what hearing idiots say about me. (Hey, that's why I'm a DEVIANT!)

They say they don't understand where you are coming from.

My Deaf friends do. Again, I don't give a care what the hearing world thinks of me.

 

[Fragmenter]

Cool. That is You.

About Desi, he himself sang these songs. No third party translation, correct?

 

[ismi]

Sweetmind: what made you pick the American School in London, then? The stuff you quoted on their site - the same things are said in the brochures of just about every private or charter school in the country, and most public schools have the same things in their mission statement. The American School in London is *no* different from any other school in that regard.

And as for the statement that I don't know what bi-bi is - again, my mother taught for years at the Kennedy School in Berlin. When you expand bi-bi to bilingual-bicultural, you aren't specifying a language or culture. A school that describes itself as bi-bi could be English/ASL, German/DGS, Cantonese/HKSL English/German, French/Swahili, Spanish/Basque, or any of a zillion other choices. The Kennedy School in Berlin is a bilingual-bicultural institution with English and German as the languages, and American and German as the cultures.