doctors cannot ask about guns

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souggy said:
Okay. Want to talk about Second Amendment? What about the First Amendment? Is it a violation of free speech to talk to your children in a certain manner? Do we need to defend the notion of free speech to the extreme so we won't get falsely accused of child abuse?
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you might want to check on First Amendment. What you just said above has no relation to First Amendment.

souggy said:
Seriously, how is being asked if you own a gun or not a violation of the right to bear arms?
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it can LEAD to violation of rights to bear arms all because of a mark on file.
 
jillio said:
Then you would complain that doctors were assuming that you didn't use proper precaution because they gave you a pamplet.
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then doctors should give me a contact information to people who know their stuff.
 
Jiro said:
you might want to check on First Amendment. What you just said above has no relation to First Amendment.


it can LEAD to violation of rights to bear arms all because of a mark on file.
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"Can lead". Rain could lead to my front lawn turning into a pond inhabited by a flock of ducks, too, but it sure as hell isn't probable.:roll: Use some of that common sense you claim to be in favor of. Chances are much greater that a discussion of gun safety is more likely to prevent an accident than it is to result in widewpread confiscation of firearms.

A drunk driver might make it home safely without injuring or killing anyone else. So we should not worry about drunk drivers, right?
 
Jiro said:
you might want to check on First Amendment. What you just said above has no relation to First Amendment.


it can LEAD to violation of rights to bear arms all because of a mark on file.
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Why did you think I made such hyperbole?

Your rationale of defending the rights to bear arms is similar to the extreme case of the right to free speech. I see Americans defend BOTH to the extreme.
 
jillio said:
I can't see that many doctors would not refer a 10 day old infant who fell from a distance long enough to cause a visable swollen place on their head that would not report the incident to children's services.
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A common medical condition.

"The lump was later found to be a cephalohematoma – a common condition which often results from a problematic labour."

jillio said:
The doctor doesn't decide whether abuse occurs or not. They have no say in whether the child is removed from the home. They just say, "Hey, I just treated a 10 day old infant with a bump on the head and the mother says the infant fell. You might want to check out the safety of the environment." Social services decides whether there is cause to investigate.

But a 10 day old infant that has fallen doesn't concern you? A 10 day old infant can't even roll over yet, Jiro. How the hell does one fall?
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Oh it does concern me when a 10-day old infant fell but it concerns me even more when parents are being accused of child abuse.

How can a doctor not think of a common medical condition called cephalohematoma? That doctor should be stripped of medical license. Sorry but accusation is very serious and cephalohematoma is a common medical condition resulting from complicated birth... meaning this is medical 101.

so I take it very serious when it comes to accusation. I will rain hell and fire if I'm being falsely accused of something. I will see to no end that one especially doctor will lose his/her job especially if this kind of medical cases are common.
 
souggy said:
Why did you think I made such hyperbole?

Your rationale of defending the rights to bear arms is similar to the extreme case of the right to free speech. I see Americans defend BOTH to the extreme.
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Your hyperbole makes no sense. I don't follow. One resorts to using rhetoric hyperbole when one is losing his case. Just like Bradey Campaign :cool2:
 
Jiro said:
A common medical condition.

"The lump was later found to be a cephalohematoma – a common condition which often results from a problematic labour."



Oh it does concern me when a 10-day old infant fell but it concerns me even more when parents are being accused of child abuse.

How can a doctor not think of a common medical condition called cephalohematoma? That doctor should be stripped of medical license. Sorry but accusation is very serious and cephalohematoma is a common medical condition resulting from complicated birth... meaning this is medical 101.

so I take it very serious when it comes to accusation. I will rain hell and fire if I'm being falsely accused of something. I will see to no end that one especially doctor will lose his/her job especially if this kind of medical cases are common.
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So how do you think a 10 day old infant gets a big old bump on their head, Jiro? You think the parent has no responsibility in that injury? What, the 10 day old infant was crawling around the house and accidentally hit a table leg?

The condition you speak of is generally detectable immediately after birth. This was a 10 day old baby. You are way out of your league here.
 
jillio said:
What are you talking about?
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How can you not know what I'm talking about?

You said "Then you would complain that doctors were assuming that you didn't use proper precaution because they gave you a pamplet."

Simple - give me a contact information to people who know their stuff to ensure that I won't be complaining about it.
 
jillio said:
So how do you think a 10 day old infant gets a big old bump on their head, Jiro? You think the parent has no responsibility in that injury? What, the 10 day old infant was crawling around the house and accidentally hit a table leg?
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cephalohematoma
 
jillio said:
Duh. That is the reason the pediatricians are asking the question: to promote discussions of gun safety around children with parents who own guns.:roll:
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I guess you missed my post about that. I'll repeat. I said that asking about guns does NOT promote gun safety. If anything, it might make them defensive. Also, for those who don't have guns in the home, they still need to learn gun safety.

Asking is someone has a gun doesn't teach gun safety. Providing gun safety information to ALL the patients teaches safety without incrimination.
 
jillio said:
"Can lead". Rain could lead to my front lawn turning into a pond inhabited by a flock of ducks, too, but it sure as hell isn't probable.:roll: Use some of that common sense you claim to be in favor of. Chances are much greater that a discussion of gun safety is more likely to prevent an accident than it is to result in widewpread confiscation of firearms.

A drunk driver might make it home safely without injuring or killing anyone else. So we should not worry about drunk drivers, right?
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Drunk Driving is illegal. period.

Owning a gun in a household with children is not illegal but there are organizations and people out there who want to make it illegal.
 
Reba said:
I guess you missed my post about that. I'll repeat. I said that asking about guns does NOT promote gun safety. If anything, it might make them defensive. Also, for those who don't have guns in the home, they still need to learn gun safety.

Asking is someone has a gun doesn't teach gun safety. Providing gun safety information to ALL the patients teaches safety without incrimination.
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Bingo. If doctor suspects patients of owning a gun, then please do feel free to TELL us. Give us a pamphlet or contact information for gun safety course but do NOT ASK us.
 
jillio said:
...A drunk driver might make it home safely without injuring or killing anyone else. So we should not worry about drunk drivers, right?
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Now that you mention it, do doctors ask kids about their parents' drinking habits? Is there booze in the house?
 
Reba said:
I guess you missed my post about that. I'll repeat. I said that asking about guns does NOT promote gun safety. If anything, it might make them defensive. Also, for those who don't have guns in the home, they still need to learn gun safety.

Asking is someone has a gun doesn't teach gun safety. Providing gun safety information to ALL the patients teaches safety without incrimination.
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Asking does open the door to discussion about gun safety.

So, pediatricians should be doing a discussion of gun safety with parents even when it does not apply. Okay. And we'll see the cost of examination go way up and the time of service go way down.

Yeah, makes much more sense then just asking a simple question to see of the discussion applies.
 
Jiro said:
Bingo. If doctor suspects patients of owning a gun, then please do feel free to TELL us. Give us a pamphlet or contact information for gun safety course but do NOT ASK us.
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The best way is to inform all patients equally.
 
Reba said:
Now that you mention it, do doctors ask kids about their parents' drinking habits? Is there booze in the house?
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The doctors are not asking the kids about guns either. They are asking the adults. The discussion on gun safety is aimed at the adults, not the kids.:roll:
 
jillio said:
I guess you missed this part of the article you referenced.

Dee Crawford, 19, contacted her health visitor and midwife for advice after her son, Michael, suffered a fall at home.

Read more: 'My baby was put in care after I was wrongly accused of abuse': Mother's nightmare after doctor misdiagnosis | Mail Online

She freaking called because she said the baby fell!

Now, back to my question, "How does a 10 day old infant fall?"
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Don't you think it's possible for a parent to accidentally drop his/her baby?
 
Reba said:
The best way is to inform all patients equally.
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Riiiight. And then you would complain that assumptions are being made that all parents have guns in the home.
 
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