Deaf view on a CI kid... its a bummer..

[Liebling:-)))]

I think ALL hearin' parent/s should LEARN sign language for the sake of a deaf child. It also will help a deaf child to KNOW that she/or he is NOT alone who is deaf. ASL is somethin' that it will represent to this deaf child that there's many DEAF people out there where she/or he will meet someday. That's HOW the ASL is introduced. Without ASL, it will NEVER be introduced for the deaf child to meet new DEAF people when the deaf child grows up.

I believe that a deaf child has that rights to get to know what's the " other " side of the world really is.

Yes I second that. I know from my experience and wish my parents should do that.

 

[Liebling:-)))]

I said "How are hearing parents going to communicate with their CI children when they're not wearing their implants" if their hearing parents are NOT REQUIRED to learn sign language?




Take sign language classes, or look it up, it not so hard to do..




Yes but it still does not answer my question....

*sigh* I know...

She didn't answer my question about lileracy... but denial. It look like that she don't know what she should answer to our questions.

 

[Liebling:-)))]

I'm just thriller that none of these hearing parents here are like you, it seem you would put yourself first before your deaf child, how sad....

*nodding sadly* I noticed from her posts that the fact come first before deaf child/adult's feeling.

 

[Liebling:-)))]

My reason for thinking the parents should make an effort to learn sign is different. I am much more concerned with the language deprivation issues if the children werent able to pick up on spoken language and end up language delayed. That's my primary reason...for immersing the Deaf culture, I know it is not realistic for every child cuz some live in places where there are no other deaf children for hundreds of miles out. It would be a nice bonus.

I know it is hard for parents to learn and become fluent in it right away which is why I advocate for BiBi programs at the educational setting and be the role model for ASL or signing rather than put the burden on the parents. However, I have seen the differences in children's language development when their parents do learn sign. It should be about the child's needs first and language development is very very critical for future success with literacy.

Yes I also support BiBi, too.

 

[Liebling:-)))]

I never applied that sign language is the universal, but sign language can be added for the most useful tool to communicate and receive information. And Parents should introduce deaf children to language as early as possible which meaning both signs and speech, not sign only, not speech only but both. It helps the child's development of language skills.

Exactly...

Fuzzy think "hear" itself help to develop children's language and speech skill.

 

[Liebling:-)))]

I concur.....and not just success with literacy, but with the soicalization and psychological development of children as well.

Yes I second that... I agree that it's not just literacy but socialization and psychological development as well.

Depend on good and bad evironment.

 

[Liebling:-)))]

yes, but who says it's REQUIRED of parents to sign? that was my question.
and since when a deaf child is unable to obtain sign language and participate in deaf culture if the parents does not sign?


I understand where are you coming from, but if the child does not want to sign, it wants to speak, how is forcing it to use a sign language being productive?
It's only a child, who can return to SL at any later point in life. Most likely - sooner than later.

Due my experience, I believe that the parents should have both languages to expose their deaf child with speech and sign/visit deaf community and let them mix with all children an earlier.

Until their child feel what he/she really wants... either oral without or with sign.

 

[Liebling:-)))]

yes, but the parent is not the only person who can teach a child sign langauge. a parent can, for example pay for signing lessons and take the child to deaf playgrounds etc, without needing to learn SL himself.
That it would be more reasonable for the parent to learn it also, IS A WHOLE DIFFERENT STORY.


Fuzzy

I know many hearing parents of HA or CI users around here. They expose to learn sign language quickly thru deaf community and meet the deaf parents of deaf children... contact with them... become good friends with them... I hearing parents for that.

At first they went to signing lessons and get more information there how to contact deaf parents...

 

[Liebling:-)))]

Besides I think it was you who told me that some hearing children of deaf parents are delayed in their oral langauge development, and don't speak until they start preschool or kindergarten. or special help comes home and help these children. something like that.

Yes I didn't forget that I stated in other thread. I shared out of my experience that some deaf parents neglect to develop their hearing children with language/speech skill. I am not one of them.

It's also the same thing to some hearing parents to their deaf or hearing children as well.

 

[Audiofuzzy]

Liebling, I am very sorry but discussing with you became frustrating to me, I seem not to be able to communicate well with you.


You so COMPLETELY misunderstand EVERYTHING I say, that this is unbeliveable.
You miss my point on EVERY subject I am trying to clear up for you, and every time we start anew,
and I don't know what can I do do get my point accros to you.
What is even sadder, and worse, you are convinced you are right. Every time when I think "this is it. she should get it now" - with your 'BINGO' you are just plain out killing me- you couldn't be SO more off the point.
I asked you over and over and over HOW DO YOU DESCRIBE SOUND, how do you describe color, and not even ONCE did you reply HOW.


can you hear a passing airplane? then you can describe and repeat/immitate the sound. airpalne makes: "wrroooo" (or whatever)

can you hear the bird's voice? No? then you CAN'T describe nor immitate it, period.

anything else is IRRELEVANT to this subject.
I only asked about how do you repeat A or B or C if you CAN'T hear it.




It's not bad enough that you have no clue what I am talking about, now you are spreading your ASSUMED opinions about me. I am getting a headache because of you.

Fuzzy think "hear" itself help to develop children's language and speech skill.

That is not ALL I think, though - you ASSUMED this is what I think, the way you ASSUMED about Neecy,

even though Neecy ALWAYS said the same thing over and over. ALWAYS. same as me.
nobody pays attention to what she says, though. or me or Cloggy or Rick, for that matter. like I've said- everybody are looking for what they WANT to see.

Do you rememeber our discussion about cat food, and what HAM is?
Is like that all over again, with EVERY single subject we are now discussing. And like with HAM, you are convinced you are right, and I am wrong, not understanding YOU. it's the exact opposite, Liebe.

I am sorry but I am unable to talk with you.
Maybe somebody who can understand written/hearing English well can translate my posts to you into ASL. I am very sorry but I don't see how can I get my message to you.


I give up.



There is one other thing I wanted to tell you though:

I'm sorry that I thought wrong about you for support only speech. Now I understood after read some of your posts after your post here. I am glad that you support both speech and sign.

No matter what our differences are (me and you) I always admired (and still do) your honesty, your open mind, your patience, your calmness, your good nature, and your readiness to admit when you are wrong. You are a very nice person Liebling and a great mother.

You are the only person who said SORRY to Neecy for misunderstanding and misinterpreting her, and I applaud you for that. At least you had decency and are being honorable to admit you were wrong about her.
You did what any decent person should do, not just posted some idiotic emoticon.

Kudos to you Liebling


Fuzzy

 

[Audiofuzzy]

How is that related to my general opinion of ASL for the deaf children of the hearing parents ? and how is that excluding the full immersion in ASL and deaf culture if parent himself doesn't sign?

Take sign language classes, or look it up, it not so hard to do..

I am sorry Angel but I am confused here - I am asking
1/
""How is that related to my general opinion of.... """

RELATED -

Main Entry: related
Function: adjective
Date: circa 1663
1 : connected by reason of an established or discoverable relation
2 : connected by common ancestry or sometimes by marriage
3 : having close harmonic connection —used of tones, chords, or tonalities
— re·lat·ed·ly adverb
— re·lat·ed·ness noun


and
2/
- why is it assumed that non-signing parent will not let his child sign?


and you are sending me off to signing classes?

I don't understand?

Fuzzy

 

[Liebling:-)))]

Liebling, I am very sorry but discussing with you became frustrating to me, I seem not to be able to communicate well with you.

You are the one who tried to twist/deny our posts. We tried to convince you about sign and speech languages skill but you keep on talking about "hear". I can see that we talk different.

You so COMPLETELY misunderstand EVERYTHING I say, that this is unbeliveable.

You miss my point on EVERY subject I am trying to clear up for you, and every time we start anew,

I do understood your posts but I don't have to follow your post when I see different as you. I prefer to say something different than bash/insult you for your posts.

and I don't know what can I do do get my point accros to you.
What is even sadder, and worse, you are convinced you are right. Every time when I think "this is it. she should get it now" - with your 'BINGO' you are just plain out killing me- you couldn't be SO more off the point.

Yes, I bingo because you see that the children need to know with the help from the parents, not hear itself.

I asked you over and over and over HOW DO YOU DESCRIBE SOUND, how do you describe color, and not even ONCE did you reply HOW.

can you hear a passing airplane? then you can describe and repeat/immitate the sound. airpalne makes: "wrroooo" (or whatever)

can you hear the bird's voice? No? then you CAN'T describe nor immitate it, period.

anything else is IRRELEVANT to this subject.
I only asked about how do you repeat A or B or C if you CAN'T hear it.

I repeat that I am not interesting what and how exact sounds they hear... All what I am interesting is they are happy to hear anything and can phone with HA.

I answered your question at other thread few minutes ago.

It's not bad enough that you have no clue what I am talking about, now you are spreading your ASSUMED opinions about me. I am getting a headache because of you.

I am afraid that you make many incorrect assumptions in your previous posts that's because you beleive in fact before feeling. I am not only one who see it.

That is not ALL I think, though - you ASSUMED this is what I think, the way you ASSUMED about Neecy,

Well, I know many of Neecy's posts to support hearing parents without consider her own feeling/view in the past until her post for a first time yesterday. I apologized her because she said that she did posted many times in the past that she support both sign and speech. It could be that I overlooked her posts because I haven't visit CI threads for a long time.

Assumed? Look yourself and your posts... You make many incorrect and false assumptions and accusation toward Shel90's, Cheri's, Jillo's and others' posts.

Do you still want to insisit that I misunderstood or assume what you said in your posts?

Oh my dear!!!!!!!

even though Neecy ALWAYS said the same thing over and over. ALWAYS. same as me.

You and Neecy made posts in different way.

nobody pays attention to what she says, though. or me or Cloggy or Rick, for that matter. like I've said- everybody are looking for what they WANT to see.

I would say the same thing to some hearing posters as well who don't want to see our experiences either.

Do you rememeber our discussion about cat food, and what HAM is?
Is like that all over again, with EVERY single subject we are now discussing. And like with HAM, you are convinced you are right, and I am wrong, not understanding YOU. it's the exact opposite, Liebe.

Excuse me please... I know what ham is because ham is my favorite meat all my life. That's problem is we talk different.

I am sorry but I am unable to talk with you.
Maybe somebody who can understand written/hearing English well can translate my posts to you into ASL. I am very sorry but I don't see how can I get my message to you.


I give up.

I am sorry that you give up and claimed that I misunderstood you... No, I understand you prefect but you talk in scientistic way which I doesn't. I talk about natural feeling, socialization and psychological logical and also philosophical as well.

The problem is we talk different.

No matter what our differences are (me and you) I always admired (and still do) your honesty, your open mind, your patience, your calmness, your good nature, and your readiness to admit when you are wrong. You are a very nice person Liebling and a great mother.

You are the only person who said SORRY to Neecy for misunderstanding and misinterpreting her, and I applaud you for that. At least you had decency and are being honorable to admit you were wrong about her.
You did what any decent person should do, not just posted some idiotic emoticon.

Kudos to you Liebling

for nice compliment. I am a person who prefer to give them examples in different way when I see different as them than insult/bash/belittle to prove them wrong and make false assumptions and accusation etc toward them.

Sometimes I have to follow what the posters said and agree or disagree with them.

 

[Audiofuzzy]

THIS is also HAM, Liebling:

I see you already forgot.

Fuzzy

ps.

for example;

You are the one who tried to twist/deny our posts. We tried to convince you about sign and speech languages skill but you keep on talking about "hear". I can see that we talk different.

That is because I didn't want to talk about sign and speech.
I wanted to talk about what "sound" is, and how do you hear sound.

Fuzzy

 

[Liebling:-)))]

Yes I know for a long time that ham come from pork... So?

 

[Liebling:-)))]

That is because I didn't want to talk about sign and speech.
I wanted to talk about what "sound" is, and how do you hear sound.

Fuzzy

Exactly, I know you talk about hear, sound. I already answered your question about how deaf parents to explain their hearing children about bird singing at other thread and explain what/how deaf children are being exposed to know what kind of sound they have by hearing parents when they wear CI or HA. I cannot hear what the sounds alike because my parents neglect to describe what the sound alike but my hubby's parents.

 

[Cheri]

Yes its a parent's choice. I'm not a parent. If I were, I would CHOSE sign and speech. I prefer that, but I can't force MY beliefs on somebody else, can I? There's a difference between supporting something, and saying that everybody has to agree with me.

I'm not even asking or telling you to thrown your beliefs down their throats, But, remind nor encourage the parents to use both communication skills that is available to them to use with their child isn't going to hurt anyone. If I had a blind child, I would take any advices from a person who had a blind child. That's me.

 

[Liebling:-)))]

I'm not even asking or telling you to thrown your beliefs down their throats, But, remind nor encourage the parents to use both communication skills that is available to them to use with their child isn't going to hurt anyone. If I had a blind child, I would take any advices from a person who had a blind child. That's me.

yes, me too.

 

[Cheri]

yes, but who says it's REQUIRED of parents to sign? that was my question.
and since when a deaf child is unable to obtain sign language and participate in deaf culture if the parents does not sign?

If the parents don't sign, what other communication method should a parent use when a implant is turned off on a child? writing notes back and forth? That's pathetic. It's a waste of time, can you image how much time that will take?

If you're saying parents are not required to sign, then that means the child will be far behind on their language skills because they don't get enough language support at home. *smh*

You seem to have plenty of support for hearing parents but what about deaf children?

 

[Cheri]

Exactly...

Fuzzy think "hear" itself help to develop children's language and speech skill.

Yea and what she isn't aware of is that cochlear implant person and a hearing person are not alike, cochlear implant takes some time and a great deal of effort to pick up sounds. It doesn't make you hear just like that when you snap your finger. It takes a lot of practice to learn how to hear through the cochlear implant. It's her problem that she doesn't have the knowledge of how cochlear implant really works.

 

[Angel]

first you screwed up with Neecy, now you want to do that to me?
would you please refrain for twisting and manipulating sentences so you can look good?

Would you please refrain from making assumptions ...*I* already apologized to Neecy because I misunderstood her post , there's no way I was trying to manipulating or twisting her sentences....