California Bill AB 2027

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faire_jour said:
It is you who believes there is only one right way to raise and educate a deaf child. I believe that many different things work for different children.
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I believe nothing of the kind. Which is why I say it was a narrow perspective.
 
jillio said:
Define successful. That is a wide and varied term, and one that is extremely subjective.
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First would be happy. But then from there it would mean living up to their personal potential. Of course that is very individual, but generally they would be equal to hearing peers in language, educational and vocational success, etc.
 
Koko, but you have ASL and are good at it........just rarely used, eh?
 
faire_jour said:
First would be happy. But then from there it would mean living up to their personal potential. Of course that is very individual, but generally they would be equal to hearing peers in language, educational and vocational success, etc.
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Do I believe a deaf child can be happy without ASL? Sure. But, then again, happy is subjective and largely a self created concept. Living up to personal potential. Personal as in character wise, or personal as in ability to achieve academically and occupationally? Equal to hearing peers in langauge, vocational success, and academically? What if their potential actually places them in the position of being able to far surpass their hearing peers' performance. Then equal to is not living up to their potential. In other words, a child who is not provided the tools they need to access their environment will always be stunted in their achievement, simply because they do not have the tool necessary. I personally am not satisfied when a deaf child with an IQ of 140 performs at an average level. They are capable of so much more.
 
Frisky Feline said:
I thought you do know ASL or sign language, not without ASL.
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The question is whether or not a deaf person can grow up to be successful without ASL, not whether or not ASL is useful. I grew up without German, and I did fine, but if I learn German as an adult it doesn't mean I was incomplete without it.
 
faire_jour said:
The question is whether or not a deaf person can grow up to be successful without ASL, not whether or not ASL is useful. I grew up without German, and I did fine, but if I learn German as an adult it doesn't mean I was incomplete without it.
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Again, you are going to have to start quantifying. And useful things contribute to success.
 
faire_jour said:
The question is whether or not a deaf person can grow up to be successful without ASL, not whether or not ASL is useful. I grew up without German, and I did fine, but if I learn German as an adult it doesn't mean I was incomplete without it.
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That comparison doesn't make sense. Where did you grow up in the States that German was important?

Your comparison would make more sense if you grew up... in say Quebec.
 
Tousi said:
Koko, but you have ASL and are good at it........just rarely used, eh?
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Right, sort of. I began signing well into my adulthood when I first attended Gallaudet for 3 years. None of my signing had anything to do with my success today in terms of what I do and have done. I owe my successes to my hearing aid, my auditory-oral upbringing, the ability to hear well and communicate among my hearing peers and such that laid the groundwork for my past and future successes. Though I am successful in my ability to communicate with others using sign language. But in terms of academic, work, the ability to interact with the hearing population, I've been successful with that. All without the need of signing. So, yes, to answer F_J question, one can be successful without ASL. It is an area that's quite subjective and several factors are involved in making it work.
 
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faire_jour said:
The question is whether or not a deaf person can grow up to be successful without ASL, not whether or not ASL is useful. I grew up without German, and I did fine, but if I learn German as an adult it doesn't mean I was incomplete without it.
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I was referring to his quote "without ASL". I know he did know ASL. I wasn't talking about his being successful.

everyone can be successful with or without ASL only if they work hard for being successful is what it is all matter. But their self esteem is something that I don't know about, from my own experience. I am not going to discuss from there because I am no expert at it.
 
kokonut said:
Right, sort of. I began signing well into my adulthood when I first attended Gallaudet for 3 years. None of my signing had anything to do with my success today in terms of what I do and have done. I owe my successes to my hearing aid, my aural-oral upbringing, the ability to hear well and communicate among my hearing peers and such that laid the groundwork for my past and future successes. Though I am successful in my ability to communicate with others using sign language. But in terms of academic, work, the ability to interact with the hearing population, I've been successful with that. All without the need of signing. So, yes, to answer F_J question, one can be successful without ASL. It is an area that's quite subjective and several factors are involved in making it work.
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See there. Evidence that self report is notoriously innacurrate.
 
kokonut said:
Right, sort of. I began signing well into my adulthood when I first attended Gallaudet for 3 years. None of my signing had anything to do with my success today in terms of what I do and have done. I owe my successes to my hearing aid, my aural-oral upbringing, the ability to hear well and communicate among my hearing peers and such that laid the groundwork for my past and future successes. Though I am successful in my ability to communicate with others using sign language. But in terms of academic, work, the ability to interact with the hearing population, I've been successful with that. All without the need of signing. So, yes, to answer F_J question, one can be successful without ASL. It is an area that's quite subjective and several factors are involved in making it work.
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what made you attend to gallaudet? just your own curiosity?
 
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