worried woman

[shel90]

It's true that parents have different parents style but parenting bribes is not teaching the children from right and wrong, that means the child is not capable of good behavior without bribery. Is that how you want to teach your child? It won't teach the children about respect and responsibilities. You're only teaching that child to do things to get $$

And that the child will expect $$ from everyone!

 

[Cheri]

And that the child will expect $$ from everyone!

Yup

 

[Oceanbreeze]

I was there. It happened to me and I saw everythin'.

I was in that room when I was 17 years old. I saw everythin' what doctor did. He used vacuum to pull 12 weeks old fetus out and the fetus was already dead in an almost full of blood in a container. The fetus' limbs were torn apart, floatin' in the blood. The nurse told me that it will go to the tiolet to flush away when I asked her what she do with it. The container was covered with a white cloth and it sat on the top of the vacuum before the nurse took it off. I can see very clear that the fetus already have 10 fingers/toes, arms, legs, and a whole body - a very tiny fetus that could fit in your bare hand. Its eyes were developed but, both eyes were shut.

FYI, I was there to experience this cruel. I was NOT in biological waste room, but I was in that room for a short of time of biological waste, because of the abortion was taken place and it was in a container with almost full of blood.

This dead fetus' mother was me. I was forced to experience this cruel when it happened. Of course, I wasn't asleep when the abortion was performed. My body was sedated like a " drunk " but, my head stayed alert like I know what was goin' on. I was fully aware of every detail that was goin' on in that room.

I'm really surprised that you saw everything. That's usually not the case. Normally, they either use a general anesthetic or even if she remains awake, they give enough medication that the woman doesn't remember what happens afterward. This is standard procedure. I'm very surprised this wasn't done since you were so young.

Very surprised.

 

[Hwy99]

Of course the baby doesn't get any choice and responsible because they can't do that but mother. Are you suggest that baby should get any choice which mean that mother don't have to raise the baby into responsblie adult? Without mother's responsibly influence, the baby would get nothing... Right?

That's why I support women's choice because they are the responsible parents, not baby.

I am not suggesting anything, I just was saying that I do understand what Maria mean..

Also I wouldn't say that parents have the right decision to abort... It's kinda of unknown because the parents doesn't know what it's like to have a child yet, they are just feel like they are not ready to have the baby. It's seems hyprocisty to call them as responibility while they don't want the baby.

What I was trying to say, there are no responibility desire for the parents while they choose to not have the baby.

In mother's womb is a fetus = fetus removal... it's a legal.

Outside of mother's womb is a baby/children = commit murder if they kill babies/newborn... it's an illegal.

Actually I only say that because Jazzy told me that we can illegalize it to prevent the mothers from abort the baby, what I mean by that is that if we illegalize the abortion, the mothers could had done much worse like killing born children.

 

[Hear Again]

And that the child will expect $$ from everyone!

exactly!

 

[Hear Again]

It's true that parents have different parents style but parenting bribes is not teaching the children from right and wrong, that means the child is not capable of good behavior without bribery. Is that how you want to teach your child? It won't teach the children about respect and responsibilities. You're only teaching that child to do things to get $$

 

[Hear Again]

It's reward for good behavior and hard work. Not only she got financial rewards but praise as well.

It teaches them the lesson of good behavior and hard work pays off in life and that they would be successful. And she was.

what it teaches them is to expect money everytime they exercise good behavior. if i could have received money for all of the good grades i received in school or the good behavior i practiced as a child (especially in staying away from drugs and alcohol), i'd be a rich woman right now. giving your children money (whether it is only done once or many times) is simply NOT the way to teach them the difference between right and wrong.

 

[Hear Again]

Good for you.

real original, byrdie. :roll:

 

[Hear Again]

With all due respect. This is still a bribe. It suggests a reward or pay off. What lesson does that teach? Don't get me wrong, I am a sucker for my kids too! But we must try to teach principals and this can not be achieved with the promise or suggestion of money. But on merits and behavior.

i couldn't agree more! children should be rewarded based on a point system of earning rights to pleasureable activities.

 

[Hear Again]

I understand that. Each parents have a different parenting style to rise a child, I suppose so.

...which is why children who are given money for good behavior *always* expect that in return without really understanding the difference between right and wrong.

 

[damienmommy]

*nodding sadly* your story remind me of my one year younger sister. She lost her life to overdose drugs at 2 years ago.

It's true story:

My Dad & siblings urged my teenage sister to abort except me (yes, I regretted it and do wish to listen my Dad & siblings... ), my step-mother and Roman Catholic Grandmother. We urged her to keep a baby... We have big row... My Dad said that it's not his responsibly to finanice her... My Grandma, step-mother & I suggest that she should give the baby up for an adoption if she doesn't feel ready to be responsible mother... My Dad against it and said that a lot of mothers changed their mind to keep the baby instead of give up for an adoption... I (stupidity and fool) gave my Grandmother and step-mother right to consider as a murder if she decided to abort a baby... Those word "murder" make my sister feel bad... she decided to continue with pregnancy and prepare for adoption... After birth, she changed her mind and want to keep the baby... 6 months later after birth she fall in pregnant again by same father... and then two years later pregnant again by another man. She struggled with 3 little children... She received none of famliy's support... she felt being tied down and look jealous to me and my hubby... we have good jobs, travelled oversea, house, cars... she was very depressed.... until one day, she smoked weed out of curiously and make her feel good... until she abused the drugs and neglect their 3 small children... Her boyfriend took 3rd child with him to his parents house and take custody of him... Leave my sister alone with 2 little children... CPS took 2 children away from her... Their 2 little children turn into aggressive and trouble with police dozen of times... My nephew mugged the people for money... Awfully a lot of problem.... We worked hard to help my sister to be clean from hard drugs... to think about her children... she was a bad mother... until she died of overdose at 2 years ago. I got a fax from my Dad last week telling me that my 23 years old nephew is in jail for 15 months...

Do my sister's children deserve kind of life to face their drug addiction mother like that ? Is it fair?

I guess it would be different story IF we all suggest her to abort a child without make her feel bad.... She would act like me... get job, education, married, travel, house, later to have children when she feel ready... etc.

I miss my one year younger sister... she was one who can do with sign language... Her 44th birthday was at 3 weeks ago... What a waste life... she was young...

My sister's death got me think twice and agree to respect women's choice and support them no matter either they decide to want to keep the baby or not... It's their body and feeling either they feel ready to be responsible parent or not... We should not FORCE or INFLUENCE anyone's decision or CALL anyone murder or whatever but should RESPECT women's decision.

OH MAN!!! im so sorry to heard abt ur story..:-( So awful! it hitted my heart now.

 

[Liebling:-)))]

I actually didn't said both of your sister's kids, one of her kids, I meant. ^_^;

Yes, I know you didn't said but I. You asked about nephew or niece... I didn't answer your question because we don't know which sex of unborn child, my sister first expected until she gave the birth to a baby boy.

Wow, your sister and my sister were pretty similar situations in an opposite way (my sister used to hate her mother, now not anymore). Again, I'm truly sorry about everything, but hey - at the least, you did the best thing to support her and tried do your best for her. Right?

Yes, my Dad, brother & I done awfully a lot for her. (I'm sure that you remember my one of three threads about her one year before my sister died of drug overdose.) I know that she tried sooo hard to clean from drug habit and drink methadone to reduce the drug habit but she empty full of methadone bottle and thought it helps her but it burnt in her body up to brain to end her life...

Okay - you said, "I only said that they do not deserve to have kind of life with their mother like that." If she do not deserve it, then why did you say, "I guess it would be different story IF we all suggest her to abort a child [your nephew or niece; not sure which one is your sister's firstborn child] without make her feel bad.... She would act like me... get job, education, married, travel, house, later to have children when she feel ready... etc. " So, whole of your own post (#197) is sounds it would be much better life of your own sister if she choose an abortion. Well, I would understand if you think her life will be much better if one of two kids is not there... You are just... near-excatly said what my sister said in an ooposite way too.

Yes I know what I said in my post #197 and responsed your post to explain you why I said this and tried to explain that it doesn't mean that my nephews and niece deserved to be abort when I said in my post #197 "I guess it would be different story IF we all suggest her to abort a child without make her feel bad.... She would act like me... get job, education, married, travel, house, later to have children when she feel ready... etc. " I can understand and respect that you beleive fetus come first before mother's life but to me, my sister's life come first before her under 12 weeks old fetus.

You did not answer my questions in my previous posts... Is it fair to let my nephews and niece suffer? Is it fair?

I answer my question myself... Yes, it's unfair because my nephews and niece do not deserve kind of life like that... Their childhood are terrible one... but they are glad that they have us... I them tight when I saw them.... I cried when I left England for go home to Germany... We contact via email time to time... My Dad, brother & niece came to visit to us last year...

*nods in understandment* Respect & support are pretty importance.

Exactly my point, that's what my sister did said in first place that she want abortion but my step-mother, Granny and I stopped her and make her feel bad... It's my stupidity mistake for disrespect her... I SHOULD respect her decision and support her choice... It's ABOUT her life, not everyone... and she know for the sure that she do not feel ready to be responsible mother... but she got soft spot and change her mind for keep baby instead of give him up for an adoption after give the birth to baby boy.

 

[Liebling:-)))]

Originally Posted by Cheri
It's true that parents have different parents style but parenting bribes is not teaching the children from right and wrong, that means the child is not capable of good behavior without bribery. Is that how you want to teach your child? It won't teach the children about respect and responsibilities. You're only teaching that child to do things to get $$

And that the child will expect $$ from everyone!

Yes, I second that.

 

[Liebling:-)))]

I am not suggesting anything, I just was saying that I do understand what Maria mean..

Yes, I know you interpreted Maria's post for us but I only ask you for your view.

Also I wouldn't say that parents have the right decision to abort... It's kinda of unknown because the parents doesn't know what it's like to have a child yet, they are just feel like they are not ready to have the baby. It's seems hyprocisty to call them as responibility while they don't want the baby.

The fact, it's responsible to raise a child, not hyprocisty... that's why Gyn. did not abort the fetus for woman straight way but send them to cousnellor accord German law up to 12 weeks limit to help women to think twice... / decision...

Who take care of child's welfare? Of course parent(s)...

Who support child with education? Of course parent(s)

Who support child with warm and foods? Of course parent(s)

Who work to earn the money to take care of child? Of course parent(s)

Who discipline the child? Of course parent(s)

Who fianance the child? Of coures parent(s)

Who give the child love and attention, he/she need? Of course parent(s)

Everyone knows it's very responsible if you want to raise a child... that's why some women are not ready to be responsible... ...

Women KNEW from their feeling that they are not ready to be responsible mother like example about my sister...if we force them to keep baby ...

It would turn into irresponsblie parents like this...

Don't bother to take care of child's welfare...

Neglect child's future education.

Neglect child's love needs and warm.

No money to support child with foods, etc...

Neglect discipline the child

Abuse the child

Kill the child

What I was trying to say, there are no responibility desire for the parents while they choose to not have the baby.

I know myself because I'm parent of 2 teenagers ... We don't feel ready to be parents yet after married in 1985... Do we must to have a baby when we don't feel ready to be responsible parents? We prefer to not do that yet until 7 years later in 1992 then we feel ready.... I noticed many people create babies because they want to be parents and think babies are dolls or think they MUST have a baby instead of think twice and focus their future responsible as parents to child...

Actually I only say that because Jazzy told me that we can illegalize it to prevent the mothers from abort the baby, what I mean by that is that if we illegalize the abortion, the mothers could had done much worse like killing born children.

Exactly... it's about women's life...

 

[Liebling:-)))]

I'm really surprised that you saw everything. That's usually not the case. Normally, they either use a general anesthetic or even if she remains awake, they give enough medication that the woman doesn't remember what happens afterward. This is standard procedure. I'm very surprised this wasn't done since you were so young.

Very surprised.

Normally yes, some friends I know did like what you described here... They gave patients enesthetic shot to sleep without pain during operation to remove less than 12 weeks old fetuses.

I am surprised, too after read Maria's post and thought at first that it could be different as here in Europe because it's normally that women should not see everything what and how the doctor did with fetuses until your post come...

After 12 weeks old fetus, they gave patient drugs to break the labor to push dead fetus... My friend had experienced from birth to 6 months old dead fetus without enesthetic shot... She buried him.

 

[Liebling:-)))]

what it teaches them is to expect money everytime they exercise good behavior. if i could have received money for all of the good grades i received in school or the good behavior i practiced as a child (especially in staying away from drugs and alcohol), i'd be a rich woman right now. giving your children money (whether it is only done once or many times) is simply NOT the way to teach them the difference between right and wrong.

Yes, that's right... I don't reward my boys with gift or money for their good grades or behavior but praise them with my love and attention.

 

[Liebling:-)))]

OH MAN!!! im so sorry to heard abt ur story..:-( So awful! it hitted my heart now.

yes, it's very sad... I have 3 threads about my sister... One of 3 threads was one year before my sister died... to ask ADers for feedback how to help my sister to be clean from drugs... I got positive feedback from ADers to feed my Dad and brother... Unfortunlately, ADer's postiive feedback doesn't help my sister because drugs was too powerful in her body than herself...

 

[Liebling:-)))]

...which is why children who are given money for good behavior *always* expect that in return without really understanding the difference between right and wrong.

Exactly, the children will never learn what right or wrong but would expose them into selfish and spoil brat... and will think they can get everything what they wants...

 

[Byrdie714]

It's true that parents have different parents style but parenting bribes is not teaching the children from right and wrong, that means the child is not capable of good behavior without bribery. Is that how you want to teach your child? It won't teach the children about respect and responsibilities. You're only teaching that child to do things to get $$

And that the child will expect $$ from everyone!

Not necessairly.

what it teaches them is to expect money everytime they exercise good behavior. if i could have received money for all of the good grades i received in school or the good behavior i practiced as a child (especially in staying away from drugs and alcohol), i'd be a rich woman right now. giving your children money (whether it is only done once or many times) is simply NOT the way to teach them the difference between right and wrong.

Sorry that you didn't get to experience it but to tell me how to raise my kid is none of your concern.

real original, byrdie. :roll:

Like totally. :roll:

i couldn't agree more! children should be rewarded based on a point system of earning rights to pleasureable activities.

Thus by earning money they can buy some of the things that brings pleasure into their lives. :roll:

 

[Byrdie714]

when i have children, i don't plan on bribing them with money -- whether their behavior is good or bad. i was never given money for good grades or good behavior and yet i never did drugs, alcohol or smoked. i turned out just fine.

How dare you give us advice about raising children when you don't have children in the first place?

If you want me to take your advice seriously--get knocked up--come back in a couple of years and then tell us how to raise them.

Don't assume and that is what you are doing.

Jeez! :roll: