Trayvon Case Investigation

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Michael Jackson

oh I thought so but I got confused since MJ is dead and his doctor is the one who is guilty but now I just realized now that you were referring to MJ's pedophile case. wow I completely forgot about it. can't believe how long ago it was.
 
She (CSign) has a point regarding this. It has more to do with political correctness of word usage than the actual principle behind the fifth amendment.

Take it to example with the Clinton situation many years ago.
By this logic of innocence, Clinton is apparently innocent, because he was never charged or guilty of it - end of story.
However, there are a lot of folks who continue to believe and refute so otherwise. Stating that "Clinton is/was innocent" can definitely cause an argument over present date matters in the issue.

It's a pretty much wording issue(s). Find a better way to state in your opinion the subject will not be charged of anything unless you are looking for a challenge over simple choices of words.

Clinton admitted to it.
 
oh snap!

and also... we still hold Casey Anthony guilty even though she was acquitted :hmm:

Some may, I don't. I don't consider OJ guilty either. If the system finds them not guilty then they are not guilty. Also of note. "Not guilty" and "innocent" are not the same thing.
 
She (CSign) has a point regarding this. It has more to do with political correctness of word usage than the actual principle behind the fifth amendment.

Take it to example with the Clinton situation many years ago.
By this logic of innocence, Clinton is apparently innocent, because he was never charged or guilty of it - end of story.
However, there are a lot of folks who continue to believe and refute so otherwise. Stating that "Clinton is/was innocent" can definitely cause an argument over present date matters in the issue.

It's a pretty much wording issue(s). Find a better way to state in your opinion the subject will not be charged of anything unless you are looking for a challenge over simple choices of words.

On slight correction. Clinton was charged.... However he was not convicted.
 
Some may, I don't. I don't consider OJ guilty either. If the system finds them not guilty then they are not guilty. Also of note. "Not guilty" and "innocent" are not the same thing.

although civil court did hold him responsible for wrongful deaths.
 
On slight correction. Clinton was charged.... However he was not convicted.

My apologies for the mistake, yes Clinton was charged.

The point is, it is a misnomer with popular culture depending on the context of the conversation when people consider a defendant innocent unless proven guilty. This definition surely does not work in conjunction outside the court of law with all these recently mentioned cases; OJ, MJ, Clinton, Anthony, and further et. al examples that can be brought forth.

It's probably safer to protect oneself (again outside of a court of law), as the Sen. voted on Clinton: "not proven" unless we're all looking forward to additional redundant posts explaining why a case should have been or would have been. I am pretty sure there was a case with the SC that brought forth an accepted, explicit usage of the term.
 
Some may, I don't. I don't consider OJ guilty either. If the system finds them not guilty then they are not guilty. Also of note. "Not guilty" and "innocent" are not the same thing.

It rather to be tragic and I don't want to say something.

I feel sorry for victims that killed by OJ Simpson and Casey Anthony.

Something is wrong with prosecutors or court.
 
George Zimmerman new judge: Ken Lester named new judge in Zimmerman murder case - Orlando Sentinel
SANFORD – Circuit Judge Kenneth Lester, Jr., who's been on the bench 15 years and has a great deal of experience with high-profile murder cases, on Wednesday was assigned the George Zimmerman murder case.

It was originally given to Circuit Judge Jessica Recksiedler, but she recused herself Wednesday after Zimmerman's attorney asked her to step aside because of a possible conflict of interest: Her husband is the law partner of Mark NeJame, who's been hired to comment on the case for CNN.


All criminal cases in Seminole County are assigned by chance, based on a rotation system. Next up in that rotation was Circuit Judge John Galluzzo. He, though, could not accept the case because he formerly practiced law with Zimmerman's attorney, Mark O'Mara.

O'Mara is also the godfather of one of Galluzzo's four children.

So Galluzzo stepped aside, passing the case to the next judge: Lester.

He has already made plans to preside at Zimmerman's bond hearing. It'll start at 9 a.m. Friday and be in Recksiedler's courtroom, 5D at the Seminole Criminal Justice Center.

Dozens of news organizations are expected to be there. Zimmerman's case has become a cause célèbre and one of the most racially divisive in the country.

He shot and killed Trayvon Martin, an unarmed black 17-year-old Feb. 26, as the teenager walked through Zimmerman's Sanford neighborhood. Critics accused Zimmerman of racial profiling and Sanford police of botching their investigation.

When police did not immediately arrest him, protesters took to the streets in cities across the country.

Special Prosecutor Angela Corey, the state attorney in Jacksonville, ordered Zimmerman's arrest April 11 on a charge of second-degree murder.

Lester, 58, was elected judge in 1996 by challenging an incumbent.

He is popular with attorneys, including Wayne Klinkbeil, who was an assistant public defender assigned to Lester's courtroom in 1997. Lester, he said, is a very good judge.

He is consistent and a tough sentencer, Klinkbeil said, "very in control of his courtroom, very straightforward."

In court, Lester is very by-the-book. He calls defendants "sir," and expects people to be on time. On Jan. 18, 2005, he had at least three defendants taken into custody when they showed up for court late.

The judge's daughter, Alexandra Lester, 26, a member of the Florida Bar, said she has never saw her father agonize over a ruling.

"He basically told me it should not be hard to make the right decision if you follow the law," she said.

The judge has a great deal of experience with criminal trials, including high-profile cases. He gave Michael Reynolds two death sentences plus a life prison sentence for beating and stabbing a Geneva couple and their 11-year-old child to death in 1998.

Lester sentenced ax murderer and handyman John Michael Buzia to death in the slaying of a 71-year-old Oviedo man.

And Lester eased into the outside world a schizophrenic killer, Stephanie Gardner, an Oviedo woman who had been locked in a state mental hospital for a decade after being found not guilty by reason of insanity in the shooting deaths of her mother and father.


Lester ordered her released to a Jacksonville group home in 2001.

In 1992, while in private practice, he helped keep the man who tortured and murdered 5-year-old Ursula Sunshine Assaid from being released early from state prison, said long-time friend and former state legislator Gary Siegel.

Donald McDougall was about to be released after serving 10 years of a 34-year sentence, but Lester, Siegel and others traveled to Tallahassee on Christmas Eve, met with the state's corrections chief and an assistant Florida attorney general and lobbied to keep McDougall locked up.

That prompted then-Attorney General Bob Butterworth to order a halt to some early releases and a roundup of some inmates who had earlier been set free.

Lester grew up in Orlando, the son of an engineer and executive secretary.

His hero, said his daughter, was his father, Kenneth Lester Sr., a World War II veteran and Glenn L. Martin Co. engineer who raised his family in Orlando and died last week. They talked by phone every day, she said.

The judge graduated from Boone High School in 1971, having competed on its basketball, track and swim teams.

He enlisted in the U.S. Navy at age 17 and was deployed to Vietnam. When he returned, he went to college, earned a degree in accounting then went to law school at the University of Florida.

He was in private practice 17 years.

Siegel had a law office in the same building as Lester for 15 years and, for a time, lived a few blocks away. He would pop into Lester's house unannounced, plop down in the living room and ask Lester to play the piano.

"And he'd play 'The Long and Winding Road,' which was my favorite, and 'Michelle,' other Beatles tunes .. and he played well."

"He's a great guy," Siegel said, "a decent guy. A lot of these people, they get on the bench, they change. … He hasn't changed."

Lester is married Dorothy Sedgwick, a long-time homicide prosecutor at the State Attorney's Office in Orange County.

They have two grown children.
 
based on what you said - you are perfectly within your right to defend yourself.
but like I told you - the major difference between him and you is that you have a training and badge... and you're a cop.

Zimmerman doesn't and he's a cop-wannabe.

Nothing about this means that Zimmerman is a cop wannabe. Maybe he is sick & tired of crime and wanted to do something about it. Maybe he thought he was protecting his neighborhood.
 
Nothing about this means that Zimmerman is a cop wannabe. Maybe he is sick & tired of crime and wanted to do something about it. Maybe he thought he was protecting his neighborhood.

Regardless, we do not have access to all of the evidence and reports available to us to make that assessment or determination. And for anyone to say that about a cop wannabe means one mind is already made up on what has happened and that he's guilty.
 
The Florida Governor wants to review State gun laws to make sure this incident does not happen again. I think that is wise. Maybe they can start by allowing open carry to be legal. I doubt a teenager would approach someone to start a fist fight if they saw a gun holstered to their belt.
 
The Florida Governor wants to review State gun laws to make sure this incident does not happen again. I think that is wise. Maybe they can start by allowing open carry to be legal. I doubt a teenager would approach someone to start a fist fight if they saw a gun holstered to their belt.

Then again teenagers can be idiots, too, with a false sense of immortality.
 
Then again teenagers can be idiots, too, with a false sense of immortality.

So can meth addicts, that is why I OC with a .45 in some areas. I am licensed to carry openly and concealed. I don't always carry. But some parts of town I won't even think of going without one.
 
Regardless, we do not have access to all of the evidence and reports available to us to make that assessment or determination. And for anyone to say that about a cop wannabe means one mind is already made up on what has happened and that he's guilty.
Also, even if someone is a "cop wannabe" that doesn't mean he wants to shoot and kill people. Most cops don't want to shoot and kill people.
 
The Florida Governor wants to review State gun laws to make sure this incident does not happen again. I think that is wise. Maybe they can start by allowing open carry to be legal. I doubt a teenager would approach someone to start a fist fight if they saw a gun holstered to their belt.
I'm not so sure that open carry is a solution.
 
My apologies for the mistake, yes Clinton was charged.

The point is, it is a misnomer with popular culture depending on the context of the conversation when people consider a defendant innocent unless proven guilty. This definition surely does not work in conjunction outside the court of law with all these recently mentioned cases; OJ, MJ, Clinton, Anthony, and further et. al examples that can be brought forth.

It's probably safer to protect oneself (again outside of a court of law), as the Sen. voted on Clinton: "not proven" unless we're all looking forward to additional redundant posts explaining why a case should have been or would have been. I am pretty sure there was a case with the SC that brought forth an accepted, explicit usage of the term.

The Supreme Court's ruling in Clinton v. Jones led to the District Court's hearing of Jones v. Clinton, which led to the Lewinsky scandal, when Clinton was asked under oath about other workplace relationships, which led to charges of perjury and obstruction of justice and the impeachment of Bill Clinton.

On April 12, 1999, Wright found Clinton in contempt of court for "intentionally false" testimony in Jones v. Clinton, fined him $90,000, and referred the case to the Arkansas Supreme Court's Committee on Professional Conduct, as Clinton still possessed a law license in Arkansas.[1]

The Arkansas Supreme Court suspended Clinton's Arkansas law license in April 2000. On January 19, 2001, Clinton agreed to a five-year suspension and a $25,000 fine in order to avoid disbarment and to end the investigation of Independent Counsel Robert Ray (Starr's successor). On October 1, 2001, Clinton's U.S. Supreme Court law license was suspended, with 40 days to contest his disbarment. On November 9, 2001, the last day for Clinton to contest the disbarment, he opted to resign from the Supreme Court Bar, surrendering his license, rather than facing penalties related to disbarment.

In the end, Independent Counsel Ray said:

"The Independent Counsel’s judgment that sufficient evidence existed to prosecute President Clinton was confirmed by President Clinton’s admissions and by evidence showing that he engaged in conduct prejudicial to the administration of justice."

More specifically, the Independent Counsel concluded that President Clinton testified falsely on three counts under oath in Clinton v. Jones. However, Ray chose to decline criminal prosecution in favor of what the Principles of Federal Prosecution call "alternative sanctions". This included being impeached:

"As a consequence of his conduct in the Jones v. Clinton civil suit and before the federal grand jury, President Clinton incurred significant administrative sanctions. The Independent Counsel considered seven non-criminal alternative sanctions that were imposed in making his decision to decline prosecution: (1) President Clinton’s admission of providing false testimony that was knowingly misleading, evasive, and prejudicial to the administration of justice before the United States District Court for the Eastern District of Arkansas; (2) his acknowledgement that his conduct violated the Rules of Professional Conduct of the Arkansas Supreme Court; (3) the five-year suspension of his license to practice law and $25,000 fine imposed on him by the Circuit Court of Pulaski County, Arkansas; (4) the civil contempt penalty of more than $90,000 imposed on President Clinton by the federal court for violating its orders; (5) the payment of more than $850,000 in settlement to Paula Jones; (6) the express finding by the federal court that President Clinton had engaged in contemptuous conduct; and (7) the substantial public condemnation of President Clinton arising from his impeachment."

Clinton v. Jones - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
 
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