Psycho-social issues

jillio said:
Towards parents and family, not society as a whole. I see much more of the "they did the best they could" sentiment than "its all their fault" sentiment.
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Oh, true . I try not to let my hostility show. :P
 
jillio said:
Yes, exactly. When the stress gets to be too much, sometimes the only way to get away from what would otherwise be unbearable is to dissociate yourself emotionally, and sometimes mentally, from it.
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Is this dissociation a bad thing or is it just a thing, like a small hang-up?
 
jillio said:
Towards parents and family, not society as a whole. I see much more of the "they did the best they could" sentiment than "its all their fault" sentiment.
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exactly!

How can you blame a parent that thought they were doing the best for their child.
 
Dixie said:
Is this dissociation a bad thing or is it just a thing, like a small hang-up?
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It's just a thing in your case. We all dissociate from time to time. Unless you are loosing blocks of time where you have no memory, or it begins to interfere with say, your ability to form an emotional bond with close others, I would say it is nothing to be concerned about. Given all that you do, you are bound to need a "vacation" from the stress from time to time. When you can't actually get away, your body helps you out by taking a short break.
 
Babyblue said:
exactly!

How can you blame a parent that thought they were doing the best for their child.
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That's just it. You can't. And very, very few ever would. There is a world of difference between blaming a parent, and saying, "This is the way my life was, so let's educate parents now so that they have more information than my parents were given. We had to learn the hard way, but that isn't necessary now."
 
jillio said:
That's just it. You can't. And very, very few ever would. There is a world of difference between blaming a parent, and saying, "This is the way my life was, so let's educate parents now so that they have more information than my parents were given. We had to learn the hard way, but that isn't necessary now."
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That is exactly where the difference is!!

To be honest...

as many know my mother is in the medical field.

So it took her a long time to realize that their is more to deafness than just learning how to "hear" and "speak"

She learned that it was not easy for me. She ended up seeing my frustrations.

She does blame herself at times. Due to my Twin brother. She felt she was so wrapped up with his issues.

Still today.. she does.... :(
 
Babyblue said:
That is exactly where the difference is!!

To be honest...

as many know my mother is in the medical field.

So it took her a long time to realize that their is more to deafness than just learning how to "hear" and "speak"

She learned that it was not easy for me. She ended up seeing my frustrations.

She does blame herself at times. Due to my Twin brother. She felt she was so wrapped up with his issues.

Still today.. she does.... :(
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Unfortuately, that is one of the hazards of being a parent. I think most of us, as parents, will look back and wonder "Was there more I could have done?" I think that holds true for all parents, not just parents of deaf kids. But, as parents, the question we really need to ask ourselves is, "Did I do everything I knew to do?" or "Did I do the best I could under the circumstances?" I think the vast majority of parents can say "Yes, I did the best I could with the information I had and the resources available to me." There is no shame and no guilt in that. But, and this is a big but, if better information and more resources are available now, parents need to be in a position to take advantage of that.
 
jillio said:
Unfortuately, that is one of the hazards of being a parent. I think most of us, as parents, will look back and wonder "Was there more I could have done?" I think that holds true for all parents, not just parents of deaf kids. But, as parents, the question we really need to ask ourselves is, "Did I do everything I knew to do?" or "Did I do the best I could under the circumstances?" I think the vast majority of parents can say "Yes, I did the best I could with the information I had and the resources available to me." There is no shame and no guilt in that. But, and this is a big but, if better information and more resources are available now, parents need to be in a position to take advantage of that.
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Bold statement is exactly what I have told my mom.

I have told her she raised me to be a good person. And she knows it.



Like you said... Any parent will always wonder. I am sure I will in the future when my kids grow up. :aw:

I love my mother very much.. She did the best she could with what she had. I do not hold any resentment towards her. How could I? Knowing she will lay down her life for me.
 
wow, you created very good thread with positive information here, Jillio!

I will be back for re-read the whole thread carefully tomorrow (German Public Holiday).
 
flip said:
I think it is more of a case what happened and less what they did. First, Sweden have a small population, less than 10 millions. This leaves less room for diverse philosophies in education. Second, they got a national governed institute for special needs in education. This institute follows circiliums for public schools, but with some small changes, depending on handicap. For deaf people, they offer bilingual education, as that's what the universtity and professors recommends. Earlier it was more oral style education, but that changed with new findings in research. That's my understanding of the swedish education system. If it wasn't for the old big institute of special needs education, bilingual education would perhaps not been offered to all deaf people in sweden.

One big difference between states and sweden is perhaps that sweden rely more on experts, while in the states, the customers allways are right, and in this case, the customers are the parents, not deaf people themselves, unfortunately.
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How ever you want to pose the question doesn't matter. The reason I asked the question the way I did was to perhaps use them as a model to potentially do the same in the US.
 
Daredevel7 said:
To me, oralism is simply being raised in an oral environment. My mom never denied me anything except sign at an early age, which I am sure people think is cruel itself. However, she bought a CC decoder as early as she could, got a TTY for me and any other accommodations I could get. She talked to my teachers to make sure they face me. She also introduced me to other deaf people who signed. We even took an ASL class together once.

Some of the stuff I hear about oralism such as hands being smacked when signing, forced to watch TV w no CC, "pretending" not to be deaf, and so on... that's supposed to describe oralism? That's what I mean by my idea being different from others.

I understand that the type of people who are ashamed of their child being deaf would tend to go for oralism, and these people probably would do the things mentioned in the previous paragraph. That's a shame.
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This is why I believe that you will not have the same outcome for any given child. It depends on many variables including how "oralism" is implemented. I honestly don't believe there are any standards which might be part of the problem. I think there may be some people that choose oralism for their child because they "are ashamed of their child being deaf" but I don't agree that is the motivating factor in all cases and I would hope it's not the case for the majority. If it was then I do agree with you that it is sad. If a parent is ashamed of their child for any reason I would expect there will be psychosocial issues for that fact alone.
 
jillio said:
It just occurred to me.....you already know that your stories tug at my heart in a big way. It makes me incredibly sad that children would be put in the position of feeling these emotions and this kind of rejection and isolation. It truly breaks my heart, and is one of the motivating factors in my life to continue to work for change that will prevent it continuing to happen to deaf children. It just is not acceptable in my book.

However, I am also incredibly proud of each and every one of you for having had such strength of character that you were able to overcome such horrendous obstacles that were put in front of you through no fault of your own. You are all amazing people, and I stand in awe much of the time for what you have conquered. Not your deafness, we all know that doesn't need to be conquered, it simply needs to be lived with. But your courage, your sense of forgiveness, your strength, your honesty in telling your stories...it never ceases to amaze me. I hate the fact that anyone has had to endure some of the things you all have endured, and at the same time, have such a profound admiration for you for the way you have dealt with it. My hat is off to all of you. I am truly blessed to have had the opportunity to get to know such amazing people, and each and every one of you affects my life in a positive way. Thank you for being who you are.:ty:
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I would have to second that. I am thankful to all of you for sharing your experiences as it has opened my eyes to things that I may not have considered. Ignorance is something that I try my best to overcome. I believe any reasonable person with an open mind that is exposed to accurate information can make good decisions. As a parent of a deaf child I have to take in and make decisions on more information that I ever imagined. When I first found out my child was deaf I never imagined that how to raise and educate a deaf child was such a controversial subject with so many options.
 
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I won't lie. This thread did bring back a flood of painful memories of my childhood...however, it's a good thing for me to reflect back and remember. It helps me keep my job as an educator of deaf and hard of hearing children in perspective.

You're right, Rockdrummer. So many options...and so little definite answers. How frustrating it can be for some parents. I feel for them...I do.
 
jillio said:
Pointing out the cons of a system can hardly be classified as "bashing". You might want to keep in mind without standards for deaf ed, there are no standards for oralism, either. That is a huge problem.

Regarding academics, the vast majority of states are now using the state mandated curriculum. Where the standards are sadly lacking, is when we accept an environment that hinders the psycho-social growth and development process of a select group of students. Deaf schools have measures to insure this growth written into their mission statements, and they, by and large, have programs to facilitate such. Mainstream schools have such programs available to hearing students. The need for deaf students to have these needs addressed equitably is what has to be addressed. Self contained programs do a better job than do full inclusion situations, but they are often still lacking.

BTW....this thread was not intended to "bash" anything. It's purpose is to support that which some oralists continue to maintain does not exist. Obviously, these conditions do exist, they continue to impact negatively the educational and psycho-social development of many, many deaf children, and they need to be addressed, not ignored.
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Thos who ignore facts like these should not be in the field of Deaf Ed.
 
rockdrummer said:
How ever you want to pose the question doesn't matter. The reason I asked the question the way I did was to perhaps use them as a model to potentially do the same in the US.
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Ok, I tried to speculate on why sweden got a strong bi-bi. I am not sure if sweden got a "model" one can copy.

To me, the swedish nationwide bilingual education, that is headed by the institute of special education, and the american state deaf schools, aren't that different. Most american state deaf schools claims to be bilingual. Bilingual education is offered at some few schools in the largest cities in sweden. Smaller contained classes outside the cities exists. A lot of similaries with the american deaf ed. Honestly, to me, american deaf people seem to romantice the swedish bi-bi system sometimes. You got excellent schools, like Maryland School of the Deaf.

But oralism seems to be almost non-existing in sweden. The assocation of hard of hearing people in sweden recommends sign language for their members. The institute of specal education strongly recommends sign language. Bilingual schools offer oral(oracy?) classes and speech lessons. No big deal. Few people says sign language is bad.

The strong acceptance of sign language is probably the secret of the swedish "model".

That's my understanding, and why the "swedish model" have more to do with mentality than a system. It's also my understanding that this is what NAD, DBC, AFA and the other deaf acitivists are trying to do in USA.
 
flip said:
Ok, I tried to speculate on why sweden got a strong bi-bi. I am not sure if sweden got a "model" one can copy.

To me, the swedish nationwide bilingual education, that is headed by the institute of special education, and the american state deaf schools, aren't that different. Most american state deaf schools claims to be bilingual. Bilingual education is offered at some few schools in the largest cities in sweden. Smaller contained classes outside the cities exists. A lot of similaries with the american deaf ed. Honestly, to me, american deaf people seem to romantice the swedish bi-bi system sometimes. You got excellent schools, like Maryland School of the Deaf.

But oralism seems to be almost non-existing in sweden. The assocation of hard of hearing people in sweden recommends sign language for their members. The institute of specal education strongly recommends sign language. Bilingual schools offer oral(oracy?) classes and speech lessons. No big deal. Few people says sign language is bad.

The strong acceptance of sign language is probably the secret of the swedish "model".

That's my understanding, and why the "swedish model" have more to do with mentality than a system. It's also my understanding that this is what NAD, DBC, AFA and the other deaf acitivists are trying to do in USA.
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I know there are some systems that have worked remarkably well in other countries that can't be duplicated in America... for ie - Sweden's deaf program. Switzerland's gun program. Netherlands' health care program. One wonders why it cannot work in here. I have couple theories - the advantage that these countries have over America is its much less diversity and a smaller population thus easier to implement a "one-for-all" policy.

:dunno:
 
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