Oral school

Is it ok?

  • Yes

    Votes: 19 29.7%

  • No

    Votes: 31 48.4%

  • Maybe or sometimes

    Votes: 14 21.9%
  • Total voters
    64
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jillio said:
Good job on the research ladies! (Shel, HA, and Flip). The empirical evidence is there, and you three did a great job of showing that. It's truly a shame that people choose to ignore it.
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:ty: Jillio. :)

I agree. It would be nice if people could read posts in full before responding to them.
 
Hear Again said:
How do you expect me to answer your question if you don't quote my post in full? You might want to follow your own advice. :)
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Follow my own advice? I did quoted you, I just didn't quoted the whole source that you copied and pasted off of---one of my links that I had provided on this thread.

I don't see the differences, if you refuse to answer my question, then that's fine. I'm not going to dwell on it.

Moving on.... :)
 
Cheri said:
Follow my own advice? I did quoted you, I just didn't quoted the whole source that you copied and pasted off of---one of my links that I had provided on this thread.
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How do you expect me to answer you if you don't include the citation?

It isn't necessary to quote the entire citation. A paragraph or two would have been sufficient.

By the way, I'm not dwelling on anything. I'm simply requesting that you follow your own advice by including a few sentences of my post so that I have some idea of what you are talking about.
 
Nice links, but the first one is an abstract from the dept. of communications at a university, the second is an editorial, and the 3rd is a news report. None of these are sources regarding educational theory, and the contextual use of the term within these pieces do not imply that such is an accepted educational theory. I'm not surprised at all that those who have knowledge of educational theory have not heard of the "failure model" as an acceptable model of education.
 
Got 4 years of studies of Special Ed for hearing/deaf kids for my BA degree and 2 years of Deaf Ed for my MA and I have never heard of that terminology.

It is not used at any of the workshops I attend yearly for my certification updates.

This is the first time I have heard of it and it is here on AD.
 
Anything to disagree with me....whatever, I made it up.

It is a term that people use to explain how many schools feel like they don't need to provide services to a child until they fall behind and then withdraw all services when the child becomes age appropriate. Then they wait until the child fails again to restart services. It encourages failure, instead of success.
 
The "failure model" is the idea that kids don't need services or a specialized education until AFTER they become delayed. That you have to wait until they are behind before they get help.
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Isn't that exactly what Oral Only education does? Creates the condition of delay?
I believe you make a better argument for ASL than you think.
 
faire_jour said:
Anything to disagree with me....whatever, I made it up.

It is a term that people use to explain how many schools feel like they don't need to provide services to a child until they fall behind and then withdraw all services when the child becomes age appropriate. Then they wait until the child fails again to restart services. It encourages failure, instead of success.
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If people are using that term, obviously I missed it.


Anyways, I am not quite understanding this...the schools dont provide services to the child until they fall behind and then withdraw all services.....

How can they withdraw services if the child doesnt have services in the first place?

Can u rephrase that so I can understand it better? Thanks.
 
faire_jour said:
Anything to disagree with me....whatever, I made it up.

It is a term that people use to explain how many schools feel like they don't need to provide services to a child until they fall behind and then withdraw all services when the child becomes age appropriate. Then they wait until the child fails again to restart services. It encourages failure, instead of success.
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No one said you made it up, faire_jour. We are simply saying that it is not a term used to describe educational theory and models. Applying it to an educational model is innappropriate.

However, if it is used usingyour definition, it would apply to the oral and mainstream programs perfectly. Needs are not addressed, appropriate acommodations are not made, and when the child falls behind, they are sent to the Deaf school so they can be caught up.
 
shel90 said:
If people are using that term, obviously I missed it.


Anyways, I am not quite understanding this...the schools dont provide services to the child until they fall behind and then withdraw all services.....

How can they withdraw services if the child doesnt have services in the first place?

Can u rephrase that so I can understand it better? Thanks.
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A kid comes to school, he is behind, so they give him services, catch him up, assess him, say he is caught up, and then drop all services, and he falls behind again.
 
faire_jour said:
A kid comes to school, he is behind, so they give him services, catch him up, assess him, say he is caught up, and then drop all services, and he falls behind again.
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Seems like this applies for deaf schools that have the purpose of mainstreaming kids. That is, if they have a high "failure" rate in mainstreaming kids.
 
Daredevel7 said:
Seems like this applies for deaf schools that have the purpose of mainstreaming kids. That is, if they have a high "failure" rate in mainstreaming kids.
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Iam not sure what u mean by this. Can u clarify? Thanks
 
I am getting confused myself. First of all, I haven't even tried to look up "failure model" because I know there's gonna be so many results. (I personally think of failure model as a stress/strain in a material thing.) Second of all, Jillio interpreted from an opposite perspective from Faire Jour's. Jillio interpreted failure model as "Try it until you fail" which is why she said "that applies to oral programs and mainstream schools", but I think Faire Jour meant failure model as "We will only help you if you fail." Well that's my interpretation anyway. The only example I can think of is a deaf school that has the purpose of mainstreaming kids. The reason why they are in that school in the first place is that they "failed" at a mainstream school. So they get the kids "caught up" to their own grade and sent them away to mainstream school.

I am sure I either clarified things or made things worse... :D
 
Daredevel7 said:
I am getting confused myself. First of all, I haven't even tried to look up "failure model" because I know there's gonna be so many results. (I personally think of failure model as a stress/strain in a material thing.) Second of all, Jillio interpreted from an opposite perspective from Faire Jour's. Jillio interpreted failure model as "Try it until you fail" which is why she said "that applies to oral programs and mainstream schools", but I think Faire Jour meant failure model as "We will only help you if you fail." Well that's my interpretation anyway. The only example I can think of is a deaf school that has the purpose of mainstreaming kids. The reason why they are in that school in the first place is that they "failed" at a mainstream school. So they get the kids "caught up" to their own grade and sent them away to mainstream school.

I am sure I either clarified things or made things worse... :D
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That's not the purpose of Deaf schools..the purpose of Deaf schools are just like any schools...to educate children.
 
faire_jour said:
A kid comes to school, he is behind, so they give him services, catch him up, assess him, say he is caught up, and then drop all services, and he falls behind again.
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I do not agree with this approach. I have never seen it in practice, at least not to my knowledge.
 
shel90 said:
That's not the purpose of Deaf schools..the purpose of Deaf schools are just like any schools...to educate children.
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No I meant a deaf school WITH the specific purpose of mainstreaming kids. To use specialized attention to get them age appropriate. I KNOW for sure that several schools do this.
 
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