Mass shooting in San Bernardino, CA

diehardbiker said:
Exactly, thats what I am saying.
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no that's not what you said. you contradicted yourself and you're confusing yourself :dizzy:
 
diehardbiker said:
You add "street" with gang, its more specific kind of gang your speaking of.

Its much easier to get rid of street gangster, gangsters on foreign countries where we called them terrorist is on much larger scale than street gangster, so since government failed to eliminate smaller gang, how could they eliminate the larger gangster thats in foreign countries?
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No I didn't add 'street' gang CNN did ! I was just using CNN title . I have no idea how they would do that , people were talking about gang vs. terrorists and I google this to see what I would get and I found this web site . I did say if this was true we need to reach street gangs before Isis does , we have a kids in streets gangs and according to this link I posted gang members want something 'bigger and badder' and Isis fit the bill. I agree if we can't eliminate smaller gang how do we eliminate Isis ? I said this group of women for peace in my city . I asked how can they get world peace when they can't even get it in their city .
 
Use military as LEO is called martial law and that was happen in New Orleans after Katrina, also that's rare and usually reserved for disasters.
 
whatdidyousay! said:
No I didn't add 'street' gang CNN did ! I was just using CNN title . I have no idea how they would do that , people were talking about gang vs. terrorists and I google this to see what I would get and I found this web site . I did say if this was true we need to reach street gangs before Isis does , we have a kids in streets gangs and according to this link I posted gang members want something 'bigger and badder' and Isis fit the bill. I agree if we can't eliminate smaller gang how do we eliminate Isis ? I said this group of women for peace in my city . I asked how can they get world peace when they can't even get it in their city .
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Your getting the right idea on what I was thinking. The problems we are having right now is much bigger than ever and they are basically everywhere. This is not something new, we once had terrorist issues century ago, and it is just repeat on history book, the last time world contain terrorist back then was when every countries gets united, thus successfully thwart terrorist. As of right now, we have too many enemies around the world, all for one thing... M O N E Y.

I believe the damages goes back to the treaty of Versailles, and that is where modern terrorist is taking advantage of. This is why I couldn't see how US going to wipe out terrorist.
 
Meanwhile, back in California:

Picture of innocence: Baby orphaned by terrorists at center of custody battle

Suspicion surrounds the family of the jihadist couple who last week massacred 14 people in a terror attack at a Southern California office party -- but there is one family member whose innocence is absolute: the couple's 6-month old girl, left orphaned by her murderous parents, and whose fate will be decided by Family Court.

The girl, whose name is not being released, is in the custody of San Bernardino County Child Protective Services, blissfully unaware of the carnage and misery wrought by her parents, Syed Rizwan Farook and Tashfeen Malik, last Wednesday. Although experts predicted the baby will not be raised by blood relatives, her aunt and uncle moved to gain custody at a Family Court hearing Monday.

"The family is naturally distraught at the separation and are eagerly awaiting to obtain custody of the 6-month-old girl," Council on American-Islamic Relations’ Los Angeles branch said in a statement.

The next hearing is set for January, and the baby likely will be placed with a foster family until then. CAIR attorney Fatima Dadabhy, who represented the family, said its priority is to ensure the baby is placed with a Muslim foster family.

The Monday hearing was closed to the public, said San Bernardino County spokesman David Wert, citing to confidentiality concerns. He said the county is “unable to confirm or deny the existence of a dependency proceeding or whether we are providing services to a particular child.”

The radical Muslim couple reportedly left the girl at their Redlands home with Farook’s mother, Rafia Farook, Wednesday, telling her they were headed to a doctor's appointment. Instead, they drove a rented SUV to the Inland Regional Center, a state social services facility in nearby San Bernardino, where Farook’s co-workers were having a holiday party. Dressed in tactical gear and toting AR-15 assault rifles, they stormed the building and gunned down his co-workers.

Months earlier, Farook’s colleagues at the San Bernardino County Health Department had held a baby shower for the young couple.

In the days following the attack, Farook’s sister Saira Khan and her husband, Farhan Khan, expressed horror and shock at his actions. Farook and Saira Khan's mother, Rafia, who appeared in Family Court Monday with Saira, has not spoken to the press but reportedly told authorities that – despite living in the home with her son, daughter-in-law and baby granddaughter – had no idea of the couple’s radical orientation or murderous intentions.

Farhan Khan, who confirmed to FoxNews.com that the baby was not released to the family Monday, said he and his wife have two children of their own. The couple told ABC News they know that shielding the baby from the knowledge of her parents' unspeakable act will one day become impossible.

"For the time being, we want her to enjoy her innocence," Saira Khan said. "You know, we don't want her to know everything, but I think eventually she will find out probably on her own."

Investigators are believed to be dubious of claims of total ignorance by certain family members, and that skepticism could prompt a Family Court judge to decide it is in the best interests of the baby for her to not be raised by blood relatives, said California-based criminal defense attorney Troy Slaten.

Investigators will be closely looking at the grandmother and the rest of the family, Slaten said, but the grandmother will be a particular target given that she resided with them and “was probably at least aware of all the preparations they were making.” Family court advocates could use this during family court proceedings to push for custody outside the family circle, he said.

“If there is any evidence of even tacit knowledge, involvement or participation, it would certainly give a Family Court judge concern over placing a child in that environment,” Slaten said.

Fellow attorney David Wohl, who has 25 years working on family custody cases in the Riverside area, said the “idea that the family of terrorists knew nothing about their propensity toward jihad or their plans is absurd.”

“I doubt very much the child in question will be placed with the family members,” he said, adding that thorough background checks and home evaluations are critical before any such placements can occur and that the process could take “months” as all relatives will need to be evaluated coinciding with the terrorist investigation and who knew what.

“They will also have to do a background check that could include information as to what the people did before they immigrated to the U.S.,” he said. “Were they a member of a radical mosque, etc.? That could take weeks and even months to evaluate.

The skepticism among officials, locals and the media is growing given that weapons, a stockpile of bomb-making materials and thousands of rounds of ammunition were discovered in the couple’s home. Also under sharp and evolving scrutiny is that almost $28,500 deposited into Farook’s bank account weeks before the lethal rampage – and at least three $5,000 transfers to Rafia Farook in the days leading up to the attack, in what a source described to Fox News as a key indicator of “pre-meditation.”

“Sometimes there is the notion that a son can do no wrong and no one wants to think of their son as ever doing something like that,” said a source connected to the Farook family. “But more and more there are things that don’t add up.”
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Baby orphaned by terrorists in custody battle
 
Jiro said:
no that's not what you said. you contradicted yourself and you're confusing yourself :dizzy:
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I thought so too! I'm still trying to make heads or tails of what he's saying. First he says one thing and then he says another and calls them the same thing.
 
The radical terrorist movement is like a cancer and will continue to spread until you kill all of them. The problem with getting rid of the Taliban, ISIS, Al Qaeda, etc. is that the western governments don't think of it in those terms and they don't want to do what needs to be done and that is kill each and every one of them, to stop the spread of violence, if you leave one behind you end up with someone who goes out and finds others to join the movement, they have to all be killed to stop them. The other problem is the west doesn't go after the people (clerics) who are preaching the hate and kill them too, as long as you allow these people to live you will have terrorists and terrorist movements.
 
This is what it's about.

ISIS as an Islamic Salafist-jihadi organization

ISIS is a Salafist-jihadi Islamic organization, part of the Sunni Islamic extremist faction which seeks to restore early Islam’s days of glory through jihad, a holy war directed against internal and external enemies. The Salafist movement perceives the time of the Prophet Muhammad as ideal and the first Caliphs who succeeded him as role models (the Arabic word Salaf means ancestor or first generation). The modern Salafist movement began in Egypt, a result of the desire to purify Islam of its flaws and return to what was perceived as the Golden Age of Islam.

Initially, the Salafist movement focused on religious studies and the winning of hearts and minds (da‘wah) as a way of creating an Islamic society and a state ruled by Islamic law. However, within the Salafi movement an extremist faction called Salafiyya Jihadiyya (i.e., jihadi Salafism) developed, from which Al-Qaeda and the global jihad organizations, including ISIS, have emerged. An ideologically important contribution to the development of the movement was made by Sayyid Qutb (1906-1966), an Egyptian ideologue whose ideas inspired the establishment of Islamic organizations that supported violent struggle (including the Egyptian Islamic Jihad, led by Ayman al-Zawahiri, Bin Laden’s successor as leader of Al-Qaeda).

From a Salafist-jihadi perspective, Muslims must strive to disseminate and implement Islam in all areas of life by liberating the lands of Islam from other cultures (especially Western culture) through jihad (holy war), which is perceived as the personal duty (fard ‘ayn) of every Muslim. Thus Muslim must fight the enemies of Islam through violent and uncompromising military struggle. Moreover, according to the Salafist-jihadi perception, the enemies of Islam are not only external (mainly the US and the West), but also Arab regimes that cooperate with the West or secular Arab regimes that are considered “infidel.” Therefore, according to Salafist jihadists, Islamic religious law justifies overthrowing them. . .

On June 29, 2014, ISIS posted a pair of videos (in English and in Arabic), expressing its ambition to annul the Sykes-Picot Agreement and “shatter” the borders of the nation-states established in the Middle East following it. The English-language video is entitled “The End of Sykes-Picot.” It includes a map showing the Iraq-Syria border and states that a single Islamic state with no national borders has now been established. According to the video a single supranational Muslim state will be established, to be headed by a single Caliph, Abu Bakr al-Baghdadi, who always says he breaks down barriers. The video adds that with the help of Allah, they will break down the barriers in Iraq, Jordan, Lebanon and in all countries, until they reach Jerusalem, with the help of Allah (Youtube.com). . .

The roots of ISIS’s hostility to the United States, the West and Western values

ISIS is intensely hostile to the United States, other Western countries, Israel and the values of the modern liberal West (democracy, pluralism, freedom of the individual, freedom of worship, equal rights for women, etc). Anti-Americanism and hostility to the West and its values are not unique to ISIS. It is one of the salient characteristics of radical Islam, in both its Sunni (Al-Qaeda) and its Shi’ite formats (Iran’s Khomeinist regime). The Al-Nusra Front, Al-Qaeda’s branch in Syria, is no different from ISIS in that respect. The source of their hostility to the United States is not only political. The depth of their hostility is reflected by a total rejection of American culture (the ultimate expression of modernity) and Western culture in general. This culture is perceived as a dangerous temptation threatening to poison the Islamic world. It is a temptation Muslims are liable to become addicted to and therefore is perceived as more dangerous. . .

The concept of takfir (denouncing a person as an infidel thereby enabling his execution) and its implications

Hezbollah leader Hassan Nasrallah frequently refers to Salafist-jihadi Islamic organizations (the most prominent of which are ISIS and the Al-Nusra Front) as “takfir groups” (jama‘at takfiriyya), i.e., groups that declare a Muslim or group of Muslims as infidels because they do not adopt the Sunni radical concept of Islam (as it is perceived by those who make the declaration). The declaration means “infidels” may be executed, so it is a serious accusation and permits the killing of individual people and groups. ISIS and similar Salafist-jihadi Islamist organizations translate the concept into executions and harassment of Shi’ites, Christians, Yazidi and members of other ethnic and religious communities. . .

Beginning the implementation of the vision: declaring the Islamic Caliphate

On June 29, 2014, ISIS spokesman Abu Muhammad al-Adnani declared the establishment of the Islamic Caliphate, headed by Caliph Abu Bakr al-Baghdadi. . .

Al-Baghdadi’s calls for jihad and his vision of the Islamic takeover of the world

ISIS emphasizes jihad as its chosen means to overthrow the regimes in Iraq and Syria, establish the Islamic Caliphate, and fight against its many internal and external enemies until the implementation of the vision, an Islamic takeover of the entire world (and symbolically, “the occupation of Rome,” the symbol of Christianity). That was reflected in the tape distributed by Abu Bakr al-Baghdadi shortly after the declaration of the Caliphate. . .
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Much, much more:

ISIS ideology and vision and implementation
 
Considering the enemies the free world has faced, and has vanquished.
I fail to see why isis seems to some to be some unbreakable, or an enemy that cant be defeated.

Look

The nazis were no push overs.

They went down.

The imperial japanese where no push overs. They went down.

Why isis cant be put down is simply one of will.

The west doenst have the will to do it
So it wont

Its really that simple.


That stated.
Their is still nazis, and there is still imperial japanese.

Just like their will always be salafist jehadis...

That doesnt mean do nothing is the best option.

Until the west gets its head out of its ass..

Sad to state do nothing will be the way of things...
Ominous
 
hoichi said:
Considering the enemies the free world has faced, and has vanquished.
I fail to see why isis seems to some to be some unbreakable, or an enemy that cant be defeated.

Look

The nazis were no push overs.

They went down.

The imperial japanese where no push overs. They went down.

Why isis cant be put down is simply one of will.

The west doenst have the will to do it
So it wont

Its really that simple.


That stated.
Their is still nazis, and there is still imperial japanese.

Just like their will always be salafist jehadis...

That doesnt mean do nothing is the best option.

Until the west gets its head out of its ass..

Sad to state do nothing will be the way of things...
Ominous
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As I agree with you, I also must state that Nazi and Japanese were nations while isis is not... They are multiple groups throughout the world... Sure there are heavier populations but... No nation to really take down... As for the the needs of the West... Would love for that to happen... But that is not likely to happen...
 
Well, the Nazi and Japanese's approach was different from ISIS. The Nazi and Japanese kept things secret like Emperor won't show his face to the public, the executions, the bizarre experiments and the camps. ISIS exposes everything. Look at these public execution videos. They don't hide everything, including expressing their bizarre ideas. They use internet as a weapon..
 
not sure they bizarre just down right evil.They put cage females in market square 6 to 46 apparently 46 the cut of age for rape but first they make them have the female circumcision.Aslong as they preying when raping muhummed says it ok.not sure can get anymore evil.The Japs and Nazie did some evil things I thought they coud not be more depraved then along comes Taliban who as evil but ISIS I think man can't get anymote depraved
 
Barbaro said:
Well, the Nazi and Japanese's approach was different from ISIS. The Nazi and Japanese kept things secret like Emperor won't show his face to the public, the executions, the bizarre experiments and the camps. ISIS exposes everything. Look at these public execution videos. They don't hide everything, including expressing their bizarre ideas. They use internet as a weapon..
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Interesting thought. Makes you wonder how the Japanese and the Nazi/Third Reich regimes would have played out if the internet had been around during those times- faster and more exposure??
 
Jezie said:
As I agree with you, I also must state that Nazi and Japanese were nations while isis is not... They are multiple groups throughout the world... Sure there are heavier populations but... No nation to really take down... As for the the needs of the West... Would love for that to happen... But that is not likely to happen...
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Nazism is an ideology at this time without a nation due to the free world doing what it had to, to put an end to its reign on power.

Isis. Holds teritory. It holds cities, it has an infrastructure, it has a superstructure, it has its own jurisprudence, it has its own economy, it sells oil it produces..

It has a captiol...
Minw as well start there....it has everythinga state has, it after all declares itself to be and acts as a state..




Its more then just wee groups in isolated cities..


It should for those who chariash freedom be stopped.

Just as the nazis were stopped.
The ideology wasnt..
That still lives and grows..
Same with radical islmasist..
The issue here most ignore. Is radical islmasit of various types recieve huge amounts of state sanction and support cromvarious islamic state actors for various reasons...


I fail to see why the free world shouldnt do the workd a favour.
Considerng we have dead anka, and dead frenchies, to at leastbwg the question
What is to be done.
Its retoeical..of course
As
Clearly..
Nothing will..

The imperial japanese indeed had their hands on the state, but it was also an ideology that even now to many...is a strong force...

Both the above reality did not stop the free world from doing what it had to..

Nor should it now.
 
Barbaro said:
Well, the Nazi and Japanese's approach was different from ISIS. The Nazi and Japanese kept things secret like Emperor won't show his face to the public, the executions, the bizarre experiments and the camps. ISIS exposes everything. Look at these public execution videos. They don't hide everything, including expressing their bizarre ideas. They use internet as a weapon..
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Right.
It exposes everything...even attacks cointries capitols and cities....

As the world does nothing

As for the imperial japanese .
They actually didnt make much a secret of their goals and aims.
The west was instrumental in the imperial japanese rise, it can be argued strongly the west due to its imperlism was directly responsible for japan militerising as an expansionist nation, which was of course the direct opposite of the tokoguwa policy of isolation that held sway for a couple of hundred years..

But the japanse could see things through their thin screen of isolation...
And they saw the west conquer nation after nation, after nation.
Once perry showed up with his ships..
It was clear as crystal if japan did not modernise and do it soon.
They were next.

It was no secret.
They even helped the west put down the boxer rebelllion...(why boxing day exists for those that dont know)

It was only after her victory over russia that. The imperial japanese realised they could stand against he west and win...

Really...
They didnt have much choice.
They are and were not the type to iddly get conquered.
Without a fight to the end...
And thus we all know where it led..

Germany.
The nazis didnt make much a secret of it either.
They just were ignored mostly and not taken at their word until it was too late..
The nazi were fairly clear with their goals and aims. From the start. They indeed hid the actuall doings, but they were fairly loud and clear from the get go what they wanted..

Hitler made no secret of it in mein kampf.

It was just ignored
To the worlds peril.

Which is the lesson here.

For those willing to look
 
I think the goals of the Germans and Japanese during WWII were not secret but their techniques and barbarism were not as widely made public until after the war.
 
Reba said:
I think the goals of the Germans and Japanese during WWII were not secret but their techniques and barbarism were not as widely made public until after the war.
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I had a neighbor that was in WWII and he helped liberate Jewish people from concentration camps . He took a lot of photos but never showed them to anyone not even his family and when he got ill and was dying he burnt all the photos . It was too bad , they could had been given to Jewish Holocaust museum .
 
whatdidyousay! said:
I had a neighbor that was in WWII and he helped liberate Jewish people from concentration camps . He took a lot of photos but never showed them to anyone not even his family and when he got ill and was dying he burnt all the photos . It was too bad , they could had been given to Jewish Holocaust museum .
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Yes, he could have donated them. At least there exist enough other photos to document the Holocaust.
 
From the time of the shooting until the couple was killed was about 3 ½ hours. What did they do during that time? :hmm:
 
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