It must get tiring!

[shel90]

You know what? That just makes some on here look like bitter, angry people. Most of us (myself included) have had a lousy upbringing. But, do you see me on here taking my upbringing out on someone? No.

So, what gives people the right to do that on here? What I'm talking about common decency, Shel.

Sure, CSign may have been wrong in your eyes. I'm not saying that. But, what I AM saying is does that give people the right to degrade her? In my view, it doesn't. Respect goes two ways. If you want it, give it. If someone doesn't want to do that, that's on them, but that doesn't give people the right to degrade someone; especially when we have this really cool feature on here called an ignore button. We also have another really cool feature on here called a "report post" button. Instead of all this name calling and bashing, I suggest using report and ignore.

That goes for everyone. That oralists and the deafies on here. This blood bath mentality needs to STOP.

Where did I degreade her? If I did, then my apologies.

However, this is not just about my upbringing. This is about deaf children I work with who suffered from the inaccurate information about ASL and how hearing people took a language and changed it which resulted in many children with gaps in their language development. I am not going to sit quietly about it.

What confuses me..you tell us to use the ignore button...that's fine but if this bothers you, why aren't you using it? I respect you as a friend but I have to disagree with you on some points here.

 

[deafskeptic]

Where did I degreade her? If I did, then my apologies.

However, this is not just about my upbringing. This is about deaf children I work with who suffered from the inaccurate information about ASL and how hearing people took a language and changed it which resulted in many children with gaps in their language development. I am not going to sit quietly about it.

What confuses me..you tell us to use the ignore button...that's fine but if this bothers you, why aren't you using it? I respect you as a friend but I have to disagree with you on some points here.

Same here, shel.

 

[AlleyCat]

Yes. Nothing easier than using the ignore button on posters who bug you (general you). Simple as that.

 

[Beowulf]

Where did I degreade her? If I did, then my apologies.

However, this is not just about my upbringing. This is about deaf children I work with who suffered from the inaccurate information about ASL and how hearing people took a language and changed it which resulted in many children with gaps in their language development. I am not going to sit quietly about it.

What confuses me..you tell us to use the ignore button...that's fine but if this bothers you, why aren't you using it? I respect you as a friend but I have to disagree with you on some points here.

Same here, shel.

Yes. Nothing easier than using the ignore button on posters who bug you (general you). Simple as that.

Ditto.

 

[Cheetah]

No. SEE II, or Seeing Essential English is still American MCE. It just drops the prefixes and the suffixes, but maintains all of the other features. Sort of like PSE, but not exactly, because it still uses initialized signs, and signs based on the word rather than the concept. Like" butter + fly", intead of "butterfly" or "nose + run" instead of the single sign for nose running (dripping). That is why it is so confusing. It totally takes away the conceptual nature that is necessary for comprehensive processing of a signed language.

Ah, this is why as a young kid I was so confused. My family is oral. I learned ASL from other deaf students when I started school (went to an oral school but used sign language with other students before and after school). By the third grade I was mainstreamed. In Middle school I joined my mom to learn sign language (SEE) but never picked it up because it was too confusing. I didn't know why at the time. I didn't learn ASL until college and was just flabbergasted as to how easy it was to pick up (and while learning ASL, I had weird flash backs to when I was in the oral school with my deaf friends). Without knowing it, I retained the "natural language" from so many years ago.

 

[BecLak]

Wirelessly posted

Deleted (incomplete)

 

[jillio]

Probably just me here but it seems all of the SEE jokes and puns are in pretty bad taste.....like making fun of someone for using a cane instead of a walker. Afterall it is still one way for a deaf person to cope.....even if it is not the most popular method. But the bullies still run the playground.....carry on.

We're not surprised that you SEE it that way. We have already SEEN that you don't have much of s sense of humor.

 

[jillio]

We all do...

I know nothing about SEE so I pretty much avoided the debate. It could be very confusing for all I know.

It is always wise to stay out of commenting on things you know nothing about. I hope a couple of others read your post.

 

[jillio]

but you're just here to make us look like a bully?

Of course!

 

[jillio]

No. That's a little unfair for you to come in at this point and say this. If you have a problem with some of us, that's what PMs are for. Have you read this thread from start to finish? You will see that it got derailed days ago with the topic being about food. We changed the subject yet again. I personally love compound words and I loved being creative in making unique sentences or thoughts out of them. It was just a word play game for me. You don't get to chastise me when you don't know what my intent was, which was just to have some word fun.

Exactly. It shows that you have great language skills by being able to play creatively with English in this way. Perhaps it is the result of not having skills equal to yours and others that makes one unable to see the humor and the purpose of our game.

 

[jillio]

That's great! No kidding, I would buy the book if you autograph it.
I know we are off topic, but what the hey: how is the homeless project coming along? That subject is very near and dear to my heart. Start a new thread about it, dammit. :P

Uhhh...the homeless project is off topic. Didn't Dad just give you a lecture about that?

 

[jillio]

Here is another school. Just FYI, I did not google those other two links as I was already aware of them.

School for the Deaf | Signing Exact English | Cochlear Implants | Seattle | Northwest School for Hearing-Impared Children

"“COMMUNICATION IS THE KEY” at Northwest School for Hearing-Impaired Children. Throughout the day, in every lesson and interaction, we celebrate the use of language to share ideas, achieve goals, explore the world and socially engage with others.* To facilitate early speech, language and auditory development, we support spoken communication with simultaneous Signing Exact English, where the speaker signs every word of the spoken message, including the grammatical structure of what is said.* This helps children more rapidly make sense of the auditory input provided by their cochlear implants or hearing aids by creating a visual bridge from sound to meaning and social communication.* Our students develop core language proficiency which is fundamental to academic achievement and future success in their home schools."

Northwest School for Hearing Impaired Children? Any one else know immediately what perspective they take?

 

[jillio]

Here is another one:

Special Education - Program & Services - Omaha Public Schools

"Program Description:
The Hearing Impaired Program serves students who are deaf or hard of hearing.* Signing Exact English (SEE II) is the communication system used for instruction and as visual support for other students.* Students participate in the general education curriculum with the support of sign language interpreters.* Students also receive enhanced vocabulary and language development instruction.* This program is provided in two elementary schools, one middle and one high school."

Hearing Impaired Program? Special Ed? Here is another one. You really don't need to read any farther than that to know that this is just more audist nonsenst and their idea of language is very, very limited to their own hearing experience. This is exactly what deaf children don't need.

 

[jillio]

And these are programs with the medical model of deafness.

And an audist philosophy of education.

 

[deafskeptic]

Ah, this is why as a young kid I was so confused. My family is oral. I learned ASL from other deaf students when I started school (went to an oral school but used sign language with other students before and after school). By the third grade I was mainstreamed. In Middle school I joined my mom to learn sign language (SEE) but never picked it up because it was too confusing. I didn't know why at the time. I didn't learn ASL until college and was just flabbergasted as to how easy it was to pick up (and while learning ASL, I had weird flash backs to when I was in the oral school with my deaf friends). Without knowing it, I retained the "natural language" from so many years ago.

I was confused here too cuz I learned SEE first before I leanred ASL. I rmemeber a Deaf guy who told me I was too English and he desmostrated a sentence in ASL. For example, I would say I grew up in Richmond. (using the sign for grow as in growing a plant) but he told me a proper sentence in asl would be Richmond then he lowered his hand and then raised it. In ASL, it's Richmond grow up me.. I was utterly confused cuz I was under the mpression it was visual English.

 

[deafskeptic]

Northwest School for Hearing Impaired Children? Any one else know immediately what perspective they take?

They prolly look down on ASL.

 

[jillio]

The things I've seen in this thread and continue to see in other threads mocking SEE and such is disgusting. I don't agree with CSign's choice, but it wasn't MY call to make. It was hers and hers alone. I accept that, and, have shut my mouth and fingers about it.

Just because most of you find SEE cumbersome and don't like it, doesn't mean you have to mock someone who has used it. Come off your high horses and just accept that she took a different path. Also, if you don't like what she posts, simply put her on ignore. It really is that simple. Those of you mocking her certainly have proven how venomous some in the Deaf culture can be, and if I didn't know some really cool people outside this forum, I would have been really turned off.

But, I'm hearing so what do I know, right?

Whatever.

I find it disgusting that a few have to take what was nothing more than good fun with any member who chose to able to participate and turn it into something horrible and mean. I find it disgusting that a poster comes back on for nothing more than the express purpose of attempting to cause dissention and try to make others look bad. I find it disgusting that there are those that try to take an interaction between several posters having fun, and make it all about poor little CSign. No wonder she keeps her narcissistic, all about me attitude. A few just keep feeding it.

I can guarantee you that no one here was thinking about CSign last evening when we were having fun playing with words. She is simply not significant enough to any of our lives to be thought about with every activity we undertake.

Fine. No one here cares that she took a different path. She is the one that will have to take responsibility for the consequences of that. No one here really cares one way or the other. However, we do care about new parents trying to make a decision regarding mode of communication for their newly diagnosed deaf children. And, because we do care about those parents and those children, we make every effort to see that those parents receive accurate information regarding modes of communication from the very people that communication is for: The Deaf.

I find it disgusting that a few friends and I cannot engage in some late night fun on this forum without a bunch of tight asses getting their panties in a wad. So there.

I find it disgusting that a hearing parent would even create such a thread as this for no other reason to cause dissention and manipulate pity from others. What I find wonderful, and exciting, and fulfilling is that the deaf community came together to show that they have no interest in such petty behaviors, and instead, will take the negative and make a positive out of it by having fun.

 

[BecLak]

Wirelessly posted

I would like to point out that this thread is not the only one where a 'Deaf party' was started. I have been a participant in this thread from the beginning to the end - I did not mock CSign but like many have pointed out how any MCE is deterimental to a Deaf child. The mocking btw was not directed at CSign but at SEE itself in a 'party' on the side. This thread is a typical example of the very stark differences between Deaf and Hearing Cultures. This thread is aptly named 'It must get tiring' because whenever it gets tiring,boring,monotonous,awkward or crossing the line into offensive - Deafies instead of choosing to fight with tooth and nail or worse making someone think they can oppress us when we have exhausted all means to educate people - its our way of saying 'Enough is Enough'

I don't drink alcohol, I don't smoke etc. I make a point not to mock either yet I joined in the party. Why because I am Deaf. I have only been around AD and the Deaf community for just over 2 years yet I am able to see this distinctive difference in cultural perspectives. Even my own thread a party started just 3-4 posts into it because it fizzled, it was a flop, boring etc. Do I get all hurt and defensive? Nope. I join the fun.

 

[jillio]

Wirelessly posted

I would like to point out that this thread is not the only one where a 'Deaf party' was started. I have been a participant in this thread from the beginning to the end - I did not mock CSign but like many have pointed out how any MCE is deterimental to a Deaf child. The mocking btw was not directed at CSign but at SEE itself in a 'party' on the side. This thread is a typical example of the very stark differences between Deaf and Hearing Cultures. This thread is aptly named 'It must get tiring' because whenever it gets tiring,boring,monotonous,awkward or crossing the line into offensive - Deafies instead of choosing to fight with tooth and nail or worse making someone think they can oppress us when we have exhausted all means to educate people - its our way of saying 'Enough is Enough'

I don't drink alcohol, I don't smoke etc. I make a point not to mock either yet I joined in the party. Why because I am Deaf. I have only been around AD and the Deaf community for just over 2 years yet I am able to see this distinctive difference in cultural perspectives. Even my own thread a party started just 3-4 posts into it because it fizzled, it was a flop, boring etc. Do I get all hurt and defensive? Nope. I join the fun.

Exactly. Just another case of the hearing and the hearing think not understanding what was going on the the Deaf world.

 

[deafskeptic]

Wirelessly posted

I would like to point out that this thread is not the only one where a 'Deaf party' was started. I have been a participant in this thread from the beginning to the end - I did not mock CSign but like many have pointed out how any MCE is deterimental to a Deaf child. The mocking btw was not directed at CSign but at SEE itself in a 'party' on the side. This thread is a typical example of the very stark differences between Deaf and Hearing Cultures. This thread is aptly named 'It must get tiring' because whenever it gets tiring,boring,monotonous,awkward or crossing the line into offensive - Deafies instead of choosing to fight with tooth and nail or worse making someone think they can oppress us when we have exhausted all means to educate people - its our way of saying 'Enough is Enough'

I don't drink alcohol, I don't smoke etc. I make a point not to mock either yet I joined in the party. Why because I am Deaf. I have only been around AD and the Deaf community for just over 2 years yet I am able to see this distinctive difference in cultural perspectives. Even my own thread a party started just 3-4 posts into it because it fizzled, it was a flop, boring etc. Do I get all hurt and defensive? Nope. I join the fun.

I haven't made fun of Csign but of I did make fun of SEE itself. Athougth like to tease people, making fun of them is a whole differnt matter. I'm much more like to make fun of their attitudes than the person themselves or to make jokes about some people who are difficult for everyone to deal with.

Now I'm going back to World of Warcraft to get my BE rogue lvl to 85.