Israel Vows to Expand Gaza Airstrikes as Death Toll Passes 200

[Jiro]

no, you not understand .... palestinian want peace then they better tell damn Hamas to STOP attack on Israel then there will be peace easy!

we want peace... we told Bush Administration to pull out of Iraq.. then there will be no more deaths.. easy, right? :roll:

 

[Jiro]

The whole Gaza Strip is not wiped out. The reasons "only" four Israelis died are Hamas missile incompetence and Israeli defense skills; it's not for lack of trying.

You should remove your last remark. That's beyond the pale.

ok well - "carpet-bombed" in a general sense. Actually it was because the Hamas missiles lacked guidance system and what Israeli defense skills? Israelis' so-called defense "shield" not stop the missiles from hitting the towns. They defended themselves by retaliating with incredibly excessive force.

 

[Jiro]

they already did enter Egypt Border or Israel Border, Most Palestines did not leave where they are because they are loyalist to Hamas but not all of them, some of them just stuck and have nowhere to go, they should know that they can't walk over street when street is war, just get safe place where you can hide, but this war can't be perfect when Hamas between IDF fighters over street and happened, Hamas or IDF really want kill them? no! they did not because Hamas want shot to IDF and IDF want shot to Hamas. I do understand that Public have hard to understand what is the war is, life going on.

what about the fact that they refused to leave their homeland that have been in their generations for many years.... and that was forcibly taken away by Israelis. Do you bet your ass that you will fight to death if UN choose to remove Ontarian residents out to Ontario to somewhere else in Canada/America/Alaska/British Colombia to make more space for Quebec people?

same thing

 

[Reba]

ok well - "carpet-bombed" in a general sense. Actually it was because the Hamas missiles lacked guidance system and what Israeli defense skills? Israelis' so-called defense "shield" not stop the missiles from hitting the towns. They defended themselves by retaliating with incredibly excessive force.

Yes, that's what I meant about their missiles.

The Israelis defend themselves by hiding in home and community shelters when the warning siren goes off.

 

[Jiro]

Yes, that's what I meant about their missiles.

The Israelis defend themselves by hiding in home and community shelters when the warning siren goes off.

ah... THAT defense system. How the heck did I forget about that? Yes it did contribute to having a fewer Israeli casualty. But still... Israelis did not have to retaliate with that excessive force. I would not complain in here against Israel and neither will the world if IDF responded with a very limited retaliatory strike.

 

[Reba]

what about the fact that they refused to leave their homeland that have been in their generations for many years.... and that was forcibly taken away by Israelis. Do you bet your ass that you will fight to death if UN choose to remove Ontarian residents out to Ontario to somewhere else in Canada/America/Alaska/British Colombia to make more space for Quebec people?

same thing

Except those areas were NOT their "homeland that have been in their generations for many years."

Your Ontario analogy is totally off reality. Please do some research.

 

[DLOP_024]

we want peace... we told Bush Administration to pull out of Iraq.. then there will be no more deaths.. easy, right? :roll:

Iraq? you talk about Iraq? I do agreed with you because Saddam is gone! Armys should pull out of Iraq and let new Iraq Government handle it.

no more deaths? not really, if Iraq people do peace with their new Iraq Government? if is good then would be no more death and there can get a peace. Only I do worry is Afghanistan because we still not get Bin Laden but Our Canadian Armys Death Toll went up, up, up, up and up .. finally reached over 100 Canadian Armys Death since 2006 because I don't understand why every Solider even not find Bin Laden? why only Saddam in Iraq? I know Saddam did not attack on Sept 11 2001 and This is illegal war but Western Civilization have to accept it whatever USA Government want, Iraq War is not worth it but Afghanistan is worth it, what we need hunter for Bin Laden.

 

[DLOP_024]

what about the fact that they refused to leave their homeland that have been in their generations for many years.... and that was forcibly taken away by Israelis. Do you bet your ass that you will fight to death if UN choose to remove Ontarian residents out to Ontario to somewhere else in Canada/America/Alaska/British Colombia to make more space for Quebec people?

same thing

why you care about Muslim? they already over 1 Billion Population! Jews? only under 15 Million Population on this Earth! Jesus was born in West Bank and Jesus was Jews! Jews been in Israel for many years!

 

[Jiro]

why you care about Muslim? they already over 1 Billion Population! Jews? only under 15 Million Population on this Earth! Jesus was born in West Bank and Jesus was Jews! Jews been in Israel for many years!

and there are 1.3 billion Chinese and 1.9 billion Christians in the world. your point is.......?

 

[Jiro]

Iraq? you talk about Iraq? I do agreed with you because Saddam is gone! Armys should pull out of Iraq and let new Iraq Government handle it.

no more deaths? not really, if Iraq people do peace with their new Iraq Government? if is good then would be no more death and there can get a peace. Only I do worry is Afghanistan because we still not get Bin Laden but Our Canadian Armys Death Toll went up, up, up, up and up .. finally reached over 100 Canadian Armys Death since 2006 because I don't understand why every Solider even not find Bin Laden? why only Saddam in Iraq? I know Saddam did not attack on Sept 11 2001 and This is illegal war but Western Civilization have to accept it whatever USA Government want, Iraq War is not worth it but Afghanistan is worth it, what we need hunter for Bin Laden.

what new Iraq government? You mean the puppet government set up by Bush Administration? It can't even hold itself together on its own! Iraq is a sectarian state. plain and simple. stop treating Iraq like a democratic country. The concept of democracy does not work in Iraq or anywhere else in Middle East. Most of Middle Eastern countries are monarchy!

and as for Osama bin Laden thing... well blame Pakistan government for not fully-cooperating with us. We all know bin Laden's hiding in Pakistan territory near to Afghanistan border. That area sympathizes with bin Laden so that made it more difficult as well.

 

[DLOP_024]

and there are 1.3 billion Chinese and 1.9 billion Christians in the world. your point is.......?

Yes, My Point is ... World have to accept Israel have right to exist and let Jews to be happy! If Arab Muslim World accept it to allow Israel to exist.

Iran President said "Wipe Israel Out!"
Syria President said "Destroy Israel!"
Hamas Said "Israel will not exist and Palestines will victory take over land"

This is enough! I hate to heard all word ... sound like World want to destroy all Jewish out like Nazi? huh? stop it, why not get a peace and let Israel exist!

1.9 Billion Christian, 1.3 Billion Chinese, 1 Billion Muslim and 700 Million Hindu .... but only under 15 Million Jews, Jesus did said on The Bible and Jesus said "leave Jews alone!"

 

[DLOP_024]

what new Iraq government? You mean the puppet government set up by Bush Administration? It can't even hold itself together on its own! Iraq is a sectarian state. plain and simple. stop treating Iraq like a democratic country. The concept of democracy does not work in Iraq or anywhere else in Middle East. Most of Middle Eastern countries are monarchy!

and as for Osama bin Laden thing... well blame Pakistan government for not fully-cooperating with us. We all know bin Laden's hiding in Pakistan territory near to Afghanistan border. That area sympathizes with bin Laden so that made it more difficult as well.

oh right, the puppet government set up by Bush Administration but Bush Administration is finish soon, Obama Administration will make better.

I hope Obama Administration will order Armys pull out of Iraq and force Iraq Government to set new Election for new vote with new Government people, new face, new name for Iraq.

stop treating Iraq like a democratic country is not true, 21st Century is more different than 20th Century .... Western Civilization try to make improve for Middle East, Russia, Asia and South America for Economy!!! look at Dubai, Dubai is very wonderful Construction of many new towers .... This is FUTURE!

I hope Western Civilization will pull Iraq, Jordan, Lebanon, Syria, Iran, Afghanistan to join Economy and Financial for Future! Next 20 years later, Baghdad, Iraq Skyline will be beautiful? many towers? what I hope.

anyway I know about Pakistan government did not fully-cooperating with Western Civilization.

 

[Jiro]

Yes, My Point is ... World have to accept Israel have right to exist and let Jews to be happy! If Arab Muslim World accept it to allow Israel to exist.

Iran President said "Wipe Israel Out!"
Syria President said "Destroy Israel!"
Hamas Said "Israel will not exist and Palestines will victory take over land"

This is enough! I hate to heard all word ... sound like World want to destroy all Jewish out like Nazi? huh? stop it, why not get a peace and let Israel exist!

1.9 Billion Christian, 1.3 Billion Chinese, 1 Billion Muslim and 700 Million Hindu .... but only under 15 Million Jews, Jesus did said on The Bible and Jesus said "leave Jews alone!"

what's the matter? Are you shy to use Israelis' hateful comments along with Iranian/Syrian Presidents and Hamas? I'll help you there.

"We must expel Arabs and take their places."
--Prime Minister of Israel David Ben Gurion, 1937, Ben Gurion and the Palestine Arabs, Oxford University Press, 1985.

"There is no such thing as a Palestinian people... It is not as if we came and threw them out and took their country. They didn't exist."
-- Prime Minister of Israel Golda Meir, statement to The Sunday Times, 15 June, 1969.

"Everybody has to move, run and grab as many (Palestinian) hilltops as they can to enlarge the (Jewish) settlements because everything we take now will stay ours...Everything we don't grab will go to them."
-- Ariel Sharon, Israeli Foreign Minister, addressing a meeting of the Tsomet Party, Agence France Presse, Nov. 15, 1998.

"Among ourselves, it must be clear that there is no place in the country for both peoples together. With the Arabs we shall not achieve our aim of being an independent people in this country. The only solution is Eretz-Israel, at least the west part of Eretz-Israel, without Arabs . . . And there is no other way but to transfer the Arabs from here to the neighbouring countries. Transfer all of them, not one village or tribe should remain . . ."
–Joseph Weitz, entry in his diary for 1940 (quoted in his article: ‘A solution to the Refugee Problem: An Israeli State with a small Arab Minority’, published in Davar, 29 September, 1967.

"Take the American Declaration of Independence for instance. It contains no mention of the territorial limits. We are not obliged to state the limits of our State."
– Ben Gurion's diary, 14 May 1948, quoted by Michael Bar Zohar in The Armed Prophet, p.133.

"We must do everything to ensure they (the Palestinian refugees) never do return."
– David Ben-Gurion, in his diary, 18 July 1948

Here's an Israeli that sympathized with Palestine

"Let us not today fling accusations at the murderers. Who are we that we should argue against their hatred? For eight years now they sit in their refugee camps in Gaza, and before their very eyes, we turn into our homestead the land and the villages in which they and their forefathers have lived."
– Moshe Dyan, 1953, quoted by Uri Avneri in Israel without Zionists, p. 134.

 

[SeanB]

Then educate us. You obviously know what you are talking about.

That will take a good deal of talking about tactical doctrine operations OR join the Army to get some hands on experience. Another possible solution - Israel has been pretty clear about its goals in Gaza, it wants to eliminate the Hamas organization that has openly dedicated itself to the destruction of Israel, and enthusiastically advocates killing Jews whenever, and wherever they can. But this brings up another issue, that of finally settling the "Palestinian question." Part of this solution is agreeing on what the borders shall be for the new Palestinian state. The Palestinians want the original 1967 borders, while the Israelis want to make some modifications (like keeping control of Jerusalem). It gets worse, with Palestinians insisting that those who fled Israel in 1948, and their descendents, be allowed to return.
Well, here's another solution; the "no-state" solution. Instead of continuing the arguments over the 1967 borders, why not go back to the 1967 politics. In short, convince Jordan to take back the West Bank (which it ran until 1967, and claimed as lost territory until 1988, when it ceded control to the "Palestinians.") Convince Egypt to take the Gaza Strip (which has been part of Egypt for most of the last few thousand years.) Israel and Jordan work out a deal, perhaps with some international organizations, for running Jerusalem. Then get the Arab states to stop treating all the Palestinians like refugees, and absorb them (as Israel did for all the Jews driven out of Arab countries after the 1948 Arab-Israeli war.)

Egypt might seem an unlikely host for 1.5 million Arab refugees in Gaza. But Egypt is well aware of the fact that Gaza is becoming a refuge for Islamic terrorists who direct their attacks at Egypt, as well as Israel. If Egypt wants to deal with that problem, the best way is to make all those refugees Egyptian citizens, and subject them to Egyptian law (and counter-terrorism efforts, if need be.)

And let us not forget how the problem started. The Arabs that left what-is-now-Israel in 1948 were convinced by the Arab countries to remain refugees for 60 years, on the promise that the Arab world would crush the new state of Israel. That didn't happen, and isn't likely to happen anytime soon. The Arab world has been getting more and more impatient with the Palestinians, and their inability to get along with each other, rule themselves or work out a deal with Israel. So let's just admit that the two-state solution isn't going to work, give the Arab refugees (actually, the children and grandchildren) a place to call home (the places where they are living now) and move on. The alternative is more head-butting by the Arab radicals (Palestinians, mainly) and misery for the refugees who, if they were treated like the 1948 Jewish refugees, would be a lot better off today.

In other words, get over past defeats and move on. But the chance of this solution getting accepted is low. The Arab world has been in the habit, for centuries, of adopting failed solutions, and sticking with them no matter what. This has resulted in poor economic, educational and political performance. Despite all the oil wealth, literacy, economic growth and all manner of performance indicators are among the lowest on the planet. We are dealing with a self-destructive culture that likes to blame others for their problems, problems they could easily solve themselves. But you never know. Bold solutions have been accepted here, occasionally, in the past. It's rare, and one can only hope. Because hope is about all that's left. The alternative is more generations hatred and violence.

 

[Jiro]

oh right, the puppet government set up by Bush Administration but Bush Administration is finish soon, Obama Administration will make better.

I hope Obama Administration will order Armys pull out of Iraq and force Iraq Government to set new Election for new vote with new Government people, new face, new name for Iraq.

stop treating Iraq like a democratic country is not true, 21st Century is more different than 20th Century .... Western Civilization try to make improve for Middle East, Russia, Asia and South America for Economy!!! look at Dubai, Dubai is very wonderful Construction of many new towers .... This is FUTURE!

I hope Western Civilization will pull Iraq, Jordan, Lebanon, Syria, Iran, Afghanistan to join Economy and Financial for Future! Next 20 years later, Baghdad, Iraq Skyline will be beautiful? many towers? what I hope.

anyway I know about Pakistan government did not fully-cooperating with Western Civilization.

Dubai is not a democratic country either. It's operated by 7 monarchies. You know what I hope? I hope Obama Administration is smart enough to not meddle with Middle East affairs. Middle East is only interested in doing trades... that's all. Other than that - it's none of our business. How is it our business to tell Iraq what kind of government system it should have and how to run it? Iraq is not ready for concept of democracy. I hope Obama Administration recognizes that.

 

[DLOP_024]

oh dear, Jiro

you still don't get it? If I am the government and I won't welcome Terrorists! I won't welcome Hamas!

Arab World been sitting and watch over Palestinians suffer as pain! Arab World do nothing! they just sitting and watch on TV! Palestinians is a Arab Muslim but Egypt, Jordan, Syria and Lebanon is a Arab Muslim too! why not they take Palestinians to their lands? no? they did not! they kept push Palestinians out! mean Arab World have no heart! If I am work for Canada Government and If I am the Leader for Canada Government, I would come to get all Palestinians to bring Canada for 5 years terms or 10 years terms agreement mean they can live in Canada for 5 or 10 years to training to get better life then they can choose where they want to live in Canada or Middle East!

The Truth is, Mostly Population in Gaza is Hamas (Terrorists Groups) and Supporter!

 

[DLOP_024]

Dubai is not a democratic country either. It's operated by 7 monarchies. You know what I hope? I hope Obama Administration is smart enough to not meddle with Middle East affairs. Middle East is only interested in doing trades... that's all. Other than that - it's none of our business. How is it our business to tell Iraq what kind of government system it should have and how to run it? Iraq is not ready for concept of democracy. I hope Obama Administration recognizes that.

you even not know about Muslim, Muslim need learn democracy! Muslim need build more better life! get more jobs! get more human rights!

you thinking Muslim men can do abused on Muslim women is ok? NO!!! THIS IS NOT OK!!!! Muslim can't abuse Muslim women!!!!

My Mom is Half Jewish and Half Christian, 2 years ago ... She went go to West Bank from Israel but just happened, she tried get back to Israel because this is dark time but 13 years old muslim tried to rape my mom! and hit my mom's face! throw rocks! and away! my mom been get painful!

You don't know what Middle East look like!

 

[Jiro]

oh dear, Jiro

you still don't get it? If I am the government and I won't welcome Terrorists! I won't welcome Hamas!

Arab World been sitting and watch over Palestinians suffer as pain! Arab World do nothing! they just sitting and watch on TV! Palestinians is a Arab Muslim but Egypt, Jordan, Syria and Lebanon is a Arab Muslim too! why not they take Palestinians to their lands? no? they did not! they kept push Palestinians out! mean Arab World have no heart! If I am work for Canada Government and If I am the Leader for Canada Government, I would come to get all Palestinians to bring Canada for 5 years terms or 10 years terms agreement mean they can live in Canada for 5 or 10 years to training to get better life then they can choose where they want to live in Canada or Middle East!

The Truth is, Mostly Population in Gaza is Hamas (Terrorists Groups) and Supporter!

Arab nations especially Saudi Arabia have programs and clerics to re-educate youths on proper interpretation of Koran to prevent them from joining terrorist groups and suicide bomber programs. and also.. Palestinians are not interested in living in Canada... not USA... not Jordan... not Egypt.. They want to live in where they used to live and that's in Israel.

Here's an interesting side note -

Under the plan, proposed yesterday by Saudi Crown Prince Abdullah bin Abdul Aziz, the 22 Arab League countries will call for a Palestinian state with Jerusalem as its capital and for the right of return for Palestinian refugees abroad. If Israel fulfilled Arab requirements, "the Arab-Israeli conflict would be considered finished, and (the parties) would enter into a peace treaty and achieving security for all countries of the region and establish normal relations with Israel," Hammud said.

 

[Jiro]

you even not know about Muslim, Muslim need learn democracy! Muslim need build more better life! get more jobs! get more human rights!

you thinking Muslim men can do abused on Muslim women is ok? NO!!! THIS IS NOT OK!!!! Muslim can't abuse Muslim women!!!!

My Mom is Half Jewish and Half Christian, 2 years ago ... She went go to West Bank from Israel but just happened, she tried get back to Israel because this is dark time but 13 years old muslim tried to rape my mom! and hit my mom's face! throw rocks! and away! my mom been get painful!

You don't know what Middle East look like!

USA supports death penalty. Europe does not. Is it our business to tell Europe to use death penalty because it makes country safer by executing dangerous criminals?

I'm sorry to hear about your mom. Sorry but world's not perfect and it's not our place to tell others what to do. I'm very fully-aware of what Middle East is like and what's going in there. I don't like it either but again - it's not our place to make them follow our principles. btw - have you been there?

 

[Jiro]

Except those areas were NOT their "homeland that have been in their generations for many years."

Your Ontario analogy is totally off reality. Please do some research.

point is - the time changed thru history and you can't just reverse the clock back to Day 1. America used to belong to Native Americans. Should we just move out now and give land back to Native Americans? No but the best we can do is to coexist peacefully and fairly. Israelis and Palestinians used to get along together and lived together for quite a while before the UN's Partitions Plan. The great Islamic Empire which ruled entire Europe and Middle East for centuries was very very tolerant to all religions living under Islamic Empire. With all religions coexisting peacefully together... this civilization flourished with great prosperity & peace and a tremendous advancement in all subjects. Many of our tools, navigational knowledge, medical knowledge, scientific/mathematical knowledge, chess, etc. were discovered & invented by them.

I blame Zionists & British for phucking it up. Moral of the story... segregation is always an epic fail. It failed in American history and it will fail in Israel as well.

most of Islamic countries are peaceful and they are interested in only one thing - trades. That's why they are very good at oil businesses and investments.. despite of their "primitive/archaic" lifestyle and laws compared to Western way.