Israel Vows to Expand Gaza Airstrikes as Death Toll Passes 200

[Buffalo]

I think it is pretty sad that one third of the dead in Gaza are children (220 plus so far). Israel has precise bombing, so one has to wonder where their humanity is.

Did you missed my post on school bus bombings? BBC News | MIDDLE EAST | Two die in Israeli school bus bombing in my post #144 of this thread. You apparently don't need to have accurate bombing technology as long as you have suicide bombers. They are targeting jewish kids.

Want to know why more Palestinian children died? Palestianians use the kids as shields. "The Use of Palestinian Children in the Al-Aqsa Intifada" by Justus Reid Weiner

Palestinian children's tv programs promoted martyrism, violence and hatred toward Jewish people. Palestinian children’s TV show preaches hate, tells young muslims to “kill and eat Jews” | Infidels Are Cool

Child martyrs are glorified and held up as role models for other children. Palestinians glorify <br> child 'martyrs' and Palestinian TV urging<br> children to kill. It is obvious to me that they are using them to play victims.

 

[Jiro]

well human shields aren't the biggest portion of the causality. another reason is because Gaza Strip is a tightly-densed area. There are many children around the targets.

 

[Beowulf]

I suppose using non-biased sources are out of the question, Buffalo? :roll:

 

[Jiro]

U.N. suspends aid work in Gaza

Israeli forces fired on a U.N. aid convoy Thursday in Gaza, killing two aid workers, during a three-hour truce that Israel set up to allow humanitarian aid to reach civilians, U.N. Secretary-General Ban Ki-moon said.

Palestinian medical sources said Thursday that the death toll from the Israeli incursion has reached 763, with more than 3,200 injured.

Nine Israeli soldiers and three civilians have been killed in the operation, the Israeli military reported.

overkill.... overkill.... overkill....

 

[Macian]

buffalo, I don't mean to sound arguementive but I really dont understand your reasoning, just because some terrorists commit attrocities against Israel doesn't give them the right to do the same, they claim how barbaric the terrorists are then go out in one week and kill more than they did for years , all I am saying is, if action is needed, there is no need to slaughter them,they ahve the technology and skilled tropps to take them out by other means, funny how mossad can travel the world killing and kidnapping enemies of Israel yet they can't do it just down the road, they now look worse in the eyes of the world these days than hamas do.

 

[Macian]

Hey, Macian, it is great to see you back! I was surprised to see this thread still going, but that can be explained by Scot terseness, eh? :P
Anyway, did you notice that the Obama camp is strangely silent on this issue? Maybe that's a good thing---just cut off the exorbitant aid we give Israel and see how long they last.
Either that, or just turn both areas into a giant skating rink, lol.

hi Beowolf, thanks good to see you too, and yeah blame the scots

I wonder what Obama will do, I hope he stands up for commonsense and doesnt get bullied by the jewish influence in senate, this will be a tellign time and I will watch with interest.
hell must admit I'd be thinking of doing a runner if I was him, what a start he's going to have.

ps liked the speech on the building program to get 3 million back to work to stave off the recession, not sure it will work but looks like he's going to do something, another topic methinks.

 

[Macian]

U.N. suspends aid work in Gaza




overkill.... overkill.... overkill....

yes you are right Jiro, can you imagine the uproar in the US or the UK if any of our armies did that I'm at a loss as to why some people still support israels actions.
still it would be a good score at the football 12-763 with the latter needing 2200 substitutes

 

[Jiro]

yes you are right Jiro, can you imagine the uproar in the US or the UK if any of our armies did that I'm at a loss as to why some people still support israels actions.
still it would be a good score at the football 12-763 with the latter needing 2200 substitutes

we're already in uproar, demanding Bush to leave. Well 12 more days.... with the lowest rating in the history.

GOOD BYE AND GOOD RIDDANCE!

 

[Macian]

we're already in uproar, demanding Bush to leave. Well 12 more days.... with the lowest rating in the history.

GOOD BYE AND GOOD RIDDANCE!

yes I agree, for no other reason than he's that stupid he was beginning to make the US look really silly for voting in a halfwit in to run a superpower.

 

[Buffalo]

I suppose using non-biased sources are out of the question, Buffalo? :roll:

It is hard to find a non-biased sources on this subject. One would go one way and other would go the opposite.

 

[Buffalo]

buffalo, I don't mean to sound arguementive but I really dont understand your reasoning, just because some terrorists commit attrocities against Israel doesn't give them the right to do the same, they claim how barbaric the terrorists are then go out in one week and kill more than they did for years , all I am saying is, if action is needed, there is no need to slaughter them,they ahve the technology and skilled tropps to take them out by other means, funny how mossad can travel the world killing and kidnapping enemies of Israel yet they can't do it just down the road, they now look worse in the eyes of the world these days than hamas do.

The Jewish people didn't make war to get Israel back. They got it back through politics. When the State of modern Israel was created on May 14th, 1948, five muslim countries attacked Israel the very next day. To me, the Arabs should be angry with the Brits, not the Israelis. The Israelis accepted the U.N.'s partition plan but the Arabs don't. I am tired of hearing how the media/people saying things that made Israel looks bad. I don't hear the same outrage when a sucide bomber killed several Israelis (including kids) as when Israeli soliders drop bombs into Gaza Strip. It is like people have accepted the sucide bombers as given but objected when the Israeli soliders/Israeli government tried to stop the terrorizing. When I post a link about how the Israeli school buses are armed with armor plates because the Hamas was targeting the Jewish kids, nobody in this thread expressed their shock at that. I feel that one shouldn't criticize only one side and ignore the other side. If there are too many posts that are pro-Arabs, I feel I should add posts that are pro-Israel to balance out the thread.

You think that Israeli soliders should be able to pick out just the bad guys and leave the good guys alone. Try putting yourself in their shoes and try to pick off the bad guys who are shielding themselves with their families, etc (they are breaking the Geneva Convention law). I bet you can't. Now try to go after their weapon stockpiles. They like to store them in the mosques. You need to get rid of their weapons so how do you go about it? The way I see is that the arabs fight dirty. The American soliders have the same problems in Iraq.

 

[Jiro]

The Jewish people didn't make war to get Israel back. They got it back through politics. When the State of modern Israel was created on May 14th, 1948, five muslim countries attacked Israel the very next day. To me, the Arabs should be angry with the Brits, not the Israelis. The Israelis accepted the U.N.'s partition plan but the Arabs don't. I am tired of hearing how the media/people saying things that made Israel looks bad. I don't hear the same outrage when a sucide bomber killed several Israelis (including kids) as when Israeli soliders drop bombs into Gaza Strip. It is like people have accepted the sucide bombers as given but objected when the Israeli soliders/Israeli government tried to stop the terrorizing. When I post a link about how the Israeli school buses are armed with armor plates because the Hamas was targeting the Jewish kids, nobody in this thread expressed their shock at that. I feel that one shouldn't criticize only one side and ignore the other side. If there are too many posts that are pro-Arabs, I feel I should add posts that are pro-Israel to balance out the thread.

don't forget about Israelis' "Holy War" and "Six Days War"

You think that Israeli soliders should be able to pick out just the bad guys and leave the good guys alone. Try putting yourself in their shoes and try to pick off the bad guys who are shielding themselves with their families, etc (they are breaking the Geneva Convention law). I bet you can't. Now try to go after their weapon stockpiles. They like to store them in the mosques. You need to get rid of their weapons so how do you go about it? The way I see is that the arabs fight dirty. The American soliders have the same problems in Iraq.

like what Macian said - just because Hamas was breaking the Geneva Convention law doesn't mean Israelis can. Why? because what separates Israelis soldiers from Hamas is that Hamas is a terrorist organization....

and if Israelis knew where the weapon stockpiles were.. well that means they're using spy. The spy can plant bomb to destroy it... or they can use a very limited precision attack... no need to send in 64 fighter jets to bomb the targets for weeks.

take a look at Israeli causalty caused by Hamas' attack.... and then take a look at Palestinian casualty caused by IDF (Israeli Defense Forces). I think we both know who is doing the overkill.

 

[Macian]

Wasn't the Geneva convetion written for countries at war? to say they have broken it would be agreeing they are a country or an army and NOT terrorists. but I admit I'm not fully versed on the geneva convention.

and yes they should be and were mad at the brits for what they and the UN did, but that was a long time ago, we now realise we made a mistake and now Israel is the aggressor,the UK has voted many times for sanctions on Israel, america is the only country in the world who wants to let them keep stealing land and murdering civilians, but then religion has no influence on politics in the UK, which is how it should be.

if the palestinians kept in the spot they were given(look at jiro's map) there might have been peace by now,albeit an uneasy one as they should never be there anyway, but their aggressive bullying and stealing more lands back has made sure that will never happen, certainly not when they are herded into a corner and Israel, having a turkey shoot.

did anyone see the leader of palestine crying on TV with the pics of all the dead kids? (no I don't mean the Hamas leader)
has no one got any heart?

now the stupid UN thinks they have secured a ceasefire in the near future and claiming they are near success, how naive they think we all are, Israel are controling when they stop as they always do, it was for this reason they couldnt admit making a mistake with the UN controlled school building, if they had admitted it and were forced to apoligise they would be pressured to the negotiating table and would have to agree to a ceasefire earlier than planned, I say earlier as they haven't killed the right amount of people yet, mark my words, they will murder more, then agree to negotiate, then the stupid UN will claim a victory for the palestians whilst Israel struggle to keep a straight face.

the problem is, they are right, they are way too many naive people out there who actually believe them, even defend them.

 

[Babyblue]

Watching the news. Said the death toll is now 760. Also 1 out of 3 are children.

 

[Liebling:-)))]

Gaza fighting takes toll on children
'Even if we run away here or there, their shells are faster than us'

Gaza fighting takes toll on children - Israel-Palestinians- msnbc.com


Red Cross: Israel troops ignored Gaza wounded
Soldiers criticized after rescuers are forced to wait 4 days to reach children

Red Cross: Israel troops ignored Gaza wounded - Israel-Palestinians- msnbc.com

Gaza fighting rages as U.N. resolution ignored
No quick end in sight as Israeli bombs pound Gaza, Hamas rockets hit Israel

Gaza fighting rages as U.N. call ignored - Israel-Palestinians- msnbc.com


I am not on both side but I'm sad about the death and suffer of children in palestinie..

My opinion is that Hamas/Palestine should recogonize Israel and Israel should also stop bomb on innocent people.

 

[Liebling:-)))]

Civilian Voices

Palestinians and Israelis talk about how the conflict has affected their lives, and their hopes for the future.

Civilians in Gaza and Israel Describe the Conflict | Newsweek International | Newsweek.com

 

[jillio]

Wasn't the Geneva convetion written for countries at war? to say they have broken it would be agreeing they are a country or an army and NOT terrorists. but I admit I'm not fully versed on the geneva convention.

and yes they should be and were mad at the brits for what they and the UN did, but that was a long time ago, we now realise we made a mistake and now Israel is the aggressor,the UK has voted many times for sanctions on Israel, america is the only country in the world who wants to let them keep stealing land and murdering civilians, but then religion has no influence on politics in the UK, which is how it should be.

if the palestinians kept in the spot they were given(look at jiro's map) there might have been peace by now,albeit an uneasy one as they should never be there anyway, but their aggressive bullying and stealing more lands back has made sure that will never happen, certainly not when they are herded into a corner and Israel, having a turkey shoot.

did anyone see the leader of palestine crying on TV with the pics of all the dead kids? (no I don't mean the Hamas leader)
has no one got any heart?

now the stupid UN thinks they have secured a ceasefire in the near future and claiming they are near success, how naive they think we all are, Israel are controling when they stop as they always do, it was for this reason they couldnt admit making a mistake with the UN controlled school building, if they had admitted it and were forced to apoligise they would be pressured to the negotiating table and would have to agree to a ceasefire earlier than planned, I say earlier as they haven't killed the right amount of people yet, mark my words, they will murder more, then agree to negotiate, then the stupid UN will claim a victory for the palestians whilst Israel struggle to keep a straight face.

the problem is, they are right, they are way too many naive people out there who actually believe them, even defend them.

You are correct about the Geneva Convention. And you hit the nail on the head when you made your statement regarding the influence of religion on politics.

 

[Jiro]

Wasn't the Geneva convetion written for countries at war? to say they have broken it would be agreeing they are a country or an army and NOT terrorists. but I admit I'm not fully versed on the geneva convention.

I have to give credit to Bush Administration for unethical cleverness. Bush Administration argued that Geneva Convention does not apply to terrorists which is why we were allowed to torture-interrogation and/or detain them indefinitely. Geneva Convention MAINLY cover the treatment of non-combatants and Prisoners of War but problem is... the convention was "vague" and the Administration claims that it only applies to combatants of recognized nations.

"We strongly believe that terrorists picked up off the battlefield -- who don't represent a nation, revel in killing the innocent, and refuse to wear uniforms -- do not qualify for protections under Geneva," White House counselor Dan Bartlett said.

Fortunately.... the Supreme Courts has FINALLY ruled against Bush Administration... meaning US policy of Geneva Convention has become more specific therefore...

The Bush administration has agreed to apply the Geneva Conventions to all terrorism suspects in U.S. custody, bowing to the Supreme Court's recent rejection of policies that have imprisoned hundreds for years without trials.

Quotes are from U.S. Shifts Policy on Geneva Conventions

 

[Reba]

Wasn't the Geneva convetion written for countries at war? to say they have broken it would be agreeing they are a country or an army and NOT terrorists. but I admit I'm not fully versed on the geneva convention.

This is a pretty good description:

"The Geneva Conventions are multilateral, international treaties. This means that they bind only those nation-states that have signed, ratified, and deposited their ratification with the United Nations. When a country such as the United States or Iraq signs and ratifies the Geneva Conventions, it agrees that all of those individuals under its control — military and civilian leaders, as well as soldiers in the field, in the air, and on the sea — are bound by the Conventions’ mandates.

Individuals not operating under the control of a government signatory to the Conventions such as independent news outlets — regardless of their medium — are not bound by the Geneva Conventions"
Wide Angle . The Geneva Conventions: To Whom Do the Conventions Apply? | PBS

 

[Reba]

More history:

Most people are as uninformed about the history of the Middle East as they are about its geography. Supposedly Jews took over the Palestinians' homeland in order to create the state of Israel.

But there was no Palestinian homeland. That whole region belonged to the Ottoman Empire until the Ottoman Empire was dismembered after its defeat in the First World War.

Christians, Jews, and Muslims had all lived in Palestine for centuries. In the course of carving up the Ottoman Empire to create new nations, the British set aside a small part of it for Jews -- and after violent objections from the Arabs, stalled for years on letting this bit of land become an independent nation.

Jews lived in Palestine long before there was a state of Israel and even before there was an Ottoman Empire. In 1939, Winston Churchill commented that Jews in Palestine "made the desert bloom." The resulting prosperity of the area attracted both more Jews and more Arabs, including some Arabs whose descendants would later claim that Jews took over their country.

After World War II and the Holocaust, Jews seeking refuge turned to their promised home in the Middle East and battled the British to seize control and proclaim the independence of Israel.

In the face of polarizing hostility and violence in surrounding Arab countries, Jews fled these countries and many were absorbed into Israel. Meanwhile, Arab countries urged Arabs living in Israel to leave before these countries' planned attacks with the aim of destroying the new state.

It was the Arabs, rather than the Israelis, who created a massive Palestinian refugee problem. While Jewish refugees were absorbed into the general population of Israel, Palestinians in Arab countries were kept in refugee camps for generations -- promised a right to return after Israel was conquered and the Jews displaced.

After the most complete failure of the many Arab efforts to annihilate Israel in 1967, the Israelis took over lands of strategic value, such as the Golan Heights, in order to prevent them from being used in future military attacks.

In all the years when these lands had been in the hands of Arab states, no one made them a Palestinian homeland. But now it has become a fervent cause to force Israel to create a Palestinian state that the Arabs never created....

Thomas Sowell : Will cease-fires never cease? - Townhall.com