Is this right?

[deafskeptic]

Yeah, she hears, but it's not the way hearing people hear.
Dhh kids do not and cannot hear the way hearing people hear. We hear......but the way we perceive the sound is different from what you hearing people hear. It's really hard to explain.
I can hear pretty well, but totally not the way hearing do. My idear of sound, is more tactile and visual.

Exactly. I remember when my great aunt got her hearing aid and asked me how did i cope with HA as the sounds weren't natural sounding.

I had to tell her as I born deaf and I've never known what it's like to hear natural sounds without the HA and to me the sounds were natural sounding.

 

[Cloggy]

Exactly. I remember when my great aunt got her hearing aid and asked me how did i cope with HA as the sounds weren't natural sounding.

I had to tell her as I born deaf and I've never known what it's like to hear natural sounds without the HA and to me the sounds were natural sounding.

I don't understand the "Exactly"...
Your aunt "hears", you "hear" and the two are different.
So why wouldn't a child with CI hear??

 

[Isaacsmom]

I agree with Cloggy. We will never know exactly how every person perceives sound, or for that matter vision. Like a colorblind person...They see a tree. They see that the leaves are a different color than the trunk of the tree. Just because their perception of a color is different than mine doesn't mean they don't see the same tree.

 

[eliotj]

I am watching the dvd Sign time and incorperating ASL into speech. I know there are several rules with asl that contradict english. I have fun teaching her, and she has more fun learning it!

ASL rules wouldn't exactly contradict english. They're different languages.

That would be like telling someone writing in Spanish, that they contradict english rules by placing an upside down exclamation mark at the beginning of a sentence.

I wouldn't compare them that much. This is the problem when people translate or interpret. You can sometimes give an equal, but you can't translate verbatim.

 

[deafskeptic]

I don't understand the "Exactly"...
Your aunt "hears", you "hear" and the two are different.
So why wouldn't a child with CI hear??

I meant to say what she hears will not sound natural to those born hearing and lost their hearing later.

I do realize that CI sound will become natural sounding later to the late deafened.

Or maybe I'm wrong?

 

[Cloggy]

I meant to say what she hears will not sound natural to those born hearing and lost their hearing later.

I do realize that CI sound will become natural sounding later to the late deafened.

Or maybe I'm wrong?

I don't know how the world sounds to her. Perhaps it is to be compared to a metallic sound for us.

Point is, it doesn't matter how it sounds. She has her own sound image of the world. It might never change.
The change you describe is when the brain adjusts the "CI-sound" to the sound that the brain knows from before. For my daughter, there is no "before" so there is nothing to change to.

But again.. it doesn't matter. If I say "bicycle" she will repeat it in the same manner. Perfectly understandable. To me that means she can hear...

I sometimes compare / illustrate it with colours. Perhaps my green gras looks red in your eyes. Both of us learned that that colour is "green", but we might see it differently. (and the next person might see it as "my" blue)

 

[deafdyke]

Yeah, but it's not nessialy personal perception of sound. It's not like the difference in omneionopenia between languages. (like in English sheep say "baa" and in French they say " ron ron") Our perception of sound is different from what hearing people perceive. It's probloy the same difference between what a cat or dog thinks of as "hearing" and what a human thinks of as hearing. Normally hearing humans would be "deaf" compared to dogs and cats.

 

[Cloggy]

"omneionopenia" WOW.... can't find it...

 

[deafskeptic]

I've ever heard of this word till yesterday. I can't find it on google.

 

[Cloggy]

..........Our perception of sound is different from what hearing people perceive. It's probloy the same difference between what a cat or dog thinks of as "hearing" and what a human thinks of as hearing. Normally hearing humans would be "deaf" compared to dogs and cats.

Probably, hearing people's perception of sound is probably different from what other hearing people perceive.

With normally hearing humans being "deaf" compared to dogs and cats, the fact still is that all can hear!

With this in mind, a person with CI hears. At least, when all's working

DeafDyke, I agree with you. The sound for a cow in Holland would be "Boe" (as in cartoons) whereas in Norway it's "Mø" or "Moe" (not sure if your computer picks up the character "Ø"
And frankly... The Norwegians are much closer than the Dutch!!

 

[jillio]

Yeah, she hears, but it's not the way hearing people hear.
Dhh kids do not and cannot hear the way hearing people hear. We hear......but the way we perceive the sound is different from what you hearing people hear. It's really hard to explain.
I can hear pretty well, but totally not the way hearing do. My idear of sound, is more tactile and visual.

Exactly my point dd.It's not a matter of sound perception, but of having the abiltiy to discriminate the stimuli.

 

[Cloggy]

Exactly my point dd.It's not a matter of sound perception, but of having the abiltiy to discriminate the stimuli.

Explain the difference between"sound perception" and "discriminate the stimuli"...
According to my experience, my daughter can do both with her CI.
So, she can hear... what else are you going to call it??

 

[jillio]

Explain the difference between"sound perception" and "discriminate the stimuli"...
According to my experience, my daughter can do both with her CI.
So, she can hear... what else are you going to call it??

Sound perception simply means that a sound wave have been perceived as a stimulus auditorily. Discrimination refers to the ability to process that stimulus into sosmething meaningful. For instance, a deaf individual wearing an HA might be able to pick up enough sound to know that someone standing to their back has made a noise, but are not able to discriminate the actual word until they turn around and use the visual lipreading for added clues.

The actual sound might be perceived as Hmmmmmmmmm. The disscrimination turns it into something that means "How are you?" Without discrimination, one does not know how to respond to Hmmmmmmmm.

 

[deafdyke]

exactly...........thank you jillo. No hearing person perceives sound the way a dhh person perceives sound. Yes, hearing people can perceive sound differently, but they don't perceive hearing the way WE do. That is why so many people have such difficulty adjusting to hearing aids. The number one reason that people don't use hearing aids, is b/c they don't like the sound!
Oh, and omenonopenia (I think I'm misspelling it) are basicly the "sound effect words in comics" or like sounds expressed as words.

 

[deafskeptic]

Amen! I can hear voices on radio but I can not make out words. Nor can I tell the difference bewtween certain music and singing. For me, a lot of sounds are not very clear.

Oh, and omenonopenia (I think I'm misspelling it) are basicly the "sound effect words in comics" or like sounds expressed as words.

I think that also applies to the old Batman show.

 

[Cloggy]

Sound perception simply means that a sound wave have been perceived as a stimulus auditorily. Discrimination refers to the ability to process that stimulus into sosmething meaningful. For instance, a deaf individual wearing an HA might be able to pick up enough sound to know that someone standing to their back has made a noise, but are not able to discriminate the actual word until they turn around and use the visual lipreading for added clues.

The actual sound might be perceived as Hmmmmmmmmm. The disscrimination turns it into something that means "How are you?" Without discrimination, one does not know how to respond to Hmmmmmmmm.

Exacly, so one can say that in order to have sound discrimination one needs to have sound perception.
So when my daughter can understand what I'm saying (or whisper) means she has both!

So, like a hearing person, she hears!

 

[deafdyke]

No, her perception of what she is hearing is NOT the same as what a hearing person hears! I am positive if there was somehow you could experiance how an implantee hears, you'd be like "This is NOT hearing!"
Your daughter is more hard of hearing. She's in the middle.

 

[Cloggy]

No, her perception of what she is hearing is NOT the same as what a hearing person hears! I am positive if there was somehow you could experiance how an implantee hears, you'd be like "This is NOT hearing!"
Your daughter is more hard of hearing. She's in the middle.

In the middle of what? I you mean in the middle of HOH and hearing, I would agree. If you mean in the middle of deaf and hearing, I disagree.

It could be that when I would listen to my wifes hearing experience I might be shocked as well. And this could be true for all persons.
Nobody knows.

I define her to be hearing because she can hear sounds that other people might not hear (Like my mother-in-law), she is able to reproduce sounds correctly and she speak clearly.

If I would give an unknown sound/word to a HOH person, and this person would repeat it, what are the chances of the word being repeated correctly?

 

[deafdyke]

Cloggy, no you're wrong. She does not hear like a hearing person. Even most hoh kids don't hear like hearing people....Like for example the people who have unilateral loss, (who are classifed as hoh, even thou they are "basicly hearing") have difficulty localizing sounds and talking in difficult listening situtions. No hearing people have that sitution (and we're talking not extremely difficult, but rather anything beyond slightly noisy!
I mean...........sheesh, there are unilateral kids who use FM in classroom situtions, and even wear hearing aids!
It IS NOT the difference between personal perception of sound. It really isn't.
Like there are MANY CId kids who speak with "deaf" sounding voices.
Seriously.....we do not hear like hearing people. I know it's hard for you to understand, but we can hear, but NOT really like hearing people. It's exactly the way someone with normal sight in one eye can see, but in their other eye, they can't see and they have no depth perception. We experiance sound like it's a flat picture. Hearing people experiance sound in three dimensions!

 

[Lillys dad]

I am undecided on this issue. I see valid points on both sides.But DD, Lotte has bi latterall CI. The main advantage of biCI, is not for a drastic improvement in hearing, but a massive improvement in quality of sound.
I have been told, read, and everything else while researching that the main advantage of the CI is that you do not have to really concentrate on listening so much. With the second CI, you can block out background noise pretty much the same as a "normal" hearing person. The ability to isolate or localize sound becomes almost automatic.
Many people with bilatteral CI say they can eat in a noisey reastauraunt and not even have to concentrate on converstaion. So, in a way, Cloggy is correct.