Is Deaf Culture still High Context?

[jillio]

Language dysfluency for $400, Berry? I learned this term tonight. So I thought I would take this opportunity to apply it.

Nope. Language dysfluency would be evident in all the posts. It is pretty consistent.

 

[Bottesini]

Nope. Language dysfluency would be evident in all the posts. It is pretty consistent.

Oh, well..... I am a lifelong learner. I had better study.

 

[Berry]

We have talked a lot about thinking.. Largely discussing semantics versus logical thinking, what about other aspects of High Context / Low Context Cultures.

Here are a few:

Time structuring.

Relationships.

Appeals to authority.

Individualism as opposed to Communalism.

Privacy.

Politeness.

Competition.

Anyone want to comment about these or add others?

 

[jillio]

Oh, well..... I am a lifelong learner. I had better study.

It is a term used with mental health care and the deaf, and is a consideration as to the type of treatment that would be effective for an individual with this condition. Here's the premise: a person who does not have native fluency in sign because they were not exposed to it until late adolescence or early adulthood, and do not have a native use of English because they did not have access to spoken language. You have to modify some of the treatment concepts to language that they will understand. You cannot use complicated ASL concepts, and you can't use complicated English concepts, simply because they don't have the language levels to make use of them in treatment. Not through any fault of their own mind you, but it is still something that needs to be considered in treatment.

 

[jillio]

We have talked a lot about thinking.. Largely discussing semantics versus logical thinking, what about other aspects of High Context / Low Context Cultures.

Here are a few:

Time structuring.

Relationships.

Appeals to authority.

Individualism as opposed to Communalism.

Privacy.

Politeness.

Competition.

Anyone want to comment about these or add others?

Achievement.

 

[Berry]

Language dysfluency for $400, Berry? I learned this term tonight. So I thought I would take this opportunity to apply it.

Duh...

I need a shout out to the internet on that one.

Nope. Language dysfluency would be evident in all the posts. It is pretty consistent.

Oh, well..... I am a lifelong learner. I had better study.

OMG! You guys have helped me come up with a concept/term I have been looking for for a long long time and could not find because it did not exist -- But this leads directly to it.

When Shakespeare wrote -- Say "To Be or Not To Be" half of what he meant was cloaked in what he said, but was not stated. Almost like the schizophrenic salad Gregory Bateson described in his metalogues.

If a term exists for the way Shakespeare wrote I have never found it -- But it is right there. The examples I just read of language dysfluency sound very much like a cross between Shakespeare's writing and schizophrenic salad -- Except Shakespeare was very deliberate.

So I looked up metafluency -- and until this instant it has apparently existed nowhere else except in my own brain. (My brain gave birth to the word this morning, thank you.)

I like it. I am going to work on it.

Thank you both.

You made my whole month.

 

[drphil]

Is schizophrenic thinking now a style of metafluency? Can this be integrated into "high/medium low/fluid: style of thinking?

Is this the new" intelligentsia" ? How does this incorporate "deafness"? Has Harlan Lane include these "insights" yet? Did Oliver Sacks "miss the boat" re his book "Seeing Voices"?

Ponder all of this while swimming-shortly.

Implanted AB Harmony activated Aug/07

 

[Bottesini]

Is schizophrenic thinking now a style of metafluency? Can this be integrated into "high/medium low/fluid: style of thinking?

Is this the new" intelligentsia" ? How does this incorporate "deafness"? Has Harlan Lane include these "insights" yet? Did Oliver Sacks "miss the boat" re his book "Seeing Voices"?

Ponder all of this while swimming-shortly.

Implanted AB Harmony activated Aug/07

Was Oliver Sacks book about schizophrenia? Wouldn't schizophrenic thinking be fragmented fluency?

In the style of drphil. "Will Grendel attack me for thinking drphil has lived a long time, and can probably be challenged, and doesn't need to be patted on the head for every post he makes."

Also I didn't get any PM that there is a campaign to drive drphil out. But then I only accept PM from friendly nice people....

 

[GrendelQ]

Was Oliver Sacks book about schizophrenia? Wouldn't schizophrenic thinking be fragmented fluency?

In the style of drphil. "Will Grendel attack me for thinking drphil has lived a long time, and can probably be challenged, and doesn't need to be patted on the head for every post he makes."

Also I didn't get any PM that there is a campaign to drive drphil out. But then I only accept PM from friendly nice people....

I have nothing against spirited debate and challenge. I don't agree with -- or understand -- every post DrPhil makes, much less pat his head. But I also don't disagree with every observation he makes and I think his style of communication is pretty straightforward. Especially when he's relating his own experiences, I didn't see why some were attacking things they had no authority over: his history, his feelings, his self-identity, even going so far as to track him down on other sites and post analyses of his participation in swimming groups and other club forums. Now I understand why, and it's wrong.

Botti, you have been so balanced, engaging and respecting of individuals, regardless of our foibles and eccentricities. I've not seen you behave in a cruel manner to any (well, maybe a few annoying newcomers, but deservedly so ). I wouldn't expect to see you enlisted -- at least not overtly -- to take part in cruelty to DrPhil or to fall victim to mass mentality and follow suit. The behavior of some on this board went past disagreement about specific topics some time ago and is full into harassment and bullying mode. Do we just watch it happen passively?

 

[Daredevel7]

Do we just watch it happen passively?

Yep!!! Effort to defend is not worth it. Here, battles have to be picked.

It can be damaging because it can give the illusion that most of us agree with the "Deaf" side, causing people to think "wow, I guess most deaf people here really feel strongly against people like drphil, rick, etc. Hmmm must be a good reason!" Sorta like a mob mentality.

However, the fact that it's all online and people don't have to participate if they don't want to makes it a lot easier to let the bullying go on. If drphil is really bothered by the bullying, then he simply can just go to vampirefreaks forum or deaf swimming or whatever he does.

 

[jillio]

OMG! You guys have helped me come up with a concept/term I have been looking for for a long long time and could not find because it did not exist -- But this leads directly to it.

When Shakespeare wrote -- Say "To Be or Not To Be" half of what he meant was cloaked in what he said, but was not stated. Almost like the schizophrenic salad Gregory Bateson described in his metalogues.

If a term exists for the way Shakespeare wrote I have never found it -- But it is right there. The examples I just read of language dysfluency sound very much like a cross between Shakespeare's writing and schizophrenic salad -- Except Shakespeare was very deliberate.

So I looked up metafluency -- and until this instant it has apparently existed nowhere else except in my own brain. (My brain gave birth to the word this morning, thank you.)

I like it. I am going to work on it.

Thank you both.

You made my whole month.

I see a light bulb over your head!:P I love it when someone makes the connection! You made my day!

 

[jillio]

Is schizophrenic thinking now a style of metafluency? Can this be integrated into "high/medium low/fluid: style of thinking?

Is this the new" intelligentsia" ? How does this incorporate "deafness"? Has Harlan Lane include these "insights" yet? Did Oliver Sacks "miss the boat" re his book "Seeing Voices"?

Ponder all of this while swimming-shortly.

Implanted AB Harmony activated Aug/07

No, no, and no.

Oliver Saks did not address disordered thinking in his text. He addressed real neurological changes that occur as the result of deafness and why ASL addresses those special ways of processing stimuli. This is a good thing

Disordered thinking is not a good thing, and has virtually nothing to do with deafness.

 

[jillio]

Was Oliver Sacks book about schizophrenia? Wouldn't schizophrenic thinking be fragmented fluency?

In the style of drphil. "Will Grendel attack me for thinking drphil has lived a long time, and can probably be challenged, and doesn't need to be patted on the head for every post he makes."

Also I didn't get any PM that there is a campaign to drive drphil out. But then I only accept PM from friendly nice people....

It is the same old paternalistic attitude that the Deaf have had to endure from the hearing for eons. Just a new generation of it. Best to just let them know that their paternalistic attitudes are insulting and not appreciated.

 

[Berry]

OMG! You guys have helped me come up with a concept/term I have been looking for for a long long time and could not find because it did not exist -- But this leads directly to it.

When Shakespeare wrote -- Say "To Be or Not To Be" half of what he meant was cloaked in what he said, but was not stated. Almost like the schizophrenic salad Gregory Bateson described in his metalogues.

If a term exists for the way Shakespeare wrote I have never found it -- But it is right there. The examples I just read of language dysfluency sound very much like a cross between Shakespeare's writing and schizophrenic salad -- Except Shakespeare was very deliberate.

So I looked up metafluency -- and until this instant it has apparently existed nowhere else except in my own brain. (My brain gave birth to the word this morning, thank you.)

I like it. I am going to work on it.

Thank you both.

You made my whole month.

This is one of the times when I wish my credentials equaled my curiosity and interests. There is nothing more I would have enjoyed this morning than writing up a grant seeking funding to research metafluency as it occurs in English, ASL, and Spanish.

When selecting a team I would have to try to get Jillio involved. Not because I think she is the most qualified to study the subject but because she is one of the very few who understands how I think and is tolerant of the fact I can have a mountain of information on a subject and still have gaping holes of ignorance you can drive a train through. As such she would be invaluable to me.

But then I would be expected to write reports in extremely obtuse jargon rather than understandable language and at some point I would get fed up and walk off.

Oh well, nice fantasy.

 

[sallylou]

Do we just watch it happen passively?

Deaf culture is blunt. Even your friends make fun of you. You have to learn to laugh at yourself.

 

[deafskeptic]

This is one of the times when I wish my credentials equaled my curiosity and interests. There is nothing more I would have enjoyed this morning than writing up a grant seeking funding to research metafluency as it occurs in English, ASL, and Spanish.

When selecting a team I would have to try to get Jillio involved. Not because I think she is the most qualified to study the subject but because she is one of the very few who understands how I think and is tolerant of the fact I can have a mountain of information on a subject and still have gaping holes of ignorance you can drive a train through. As such she would be invaluable to me.

But then I would be expected to write reports in extremely obtuse jargon rather than understandable language and at some point I would get fed up and walk off.

Oh well, nice fantasy.

I think I'm much the same way as you.

 

[deafskeptic]

Deaf culture is blunt. Even your friends make fun of you. You have to learn to laugh at yourself.

Yep. It took me a while to get used to that. I especially had to get used to how Deaf describe other people. I have no doubt Deaf would describe me as "short fat CI with gray hair and glasses".

 

[jillio]

This is one of the times when I wish my credentials equaled my curiosity and interests. There is nothing more I would have enjoyed this morning than writing up a grant seeking funding to research metafluency as it occurs in English, ASL, and Spanish.

When selecting a team I would have to try to get Jillio involved. Not because I think she is the most qualified to study the subject but because she is one of the very few who understands how I think and is tolerant of the fact I can have a mountain of information on a subject and still have gaping holes of ignorance you can drive a train through. As such she would be invaluable to me.

But then I would be expected to write reports in extremely obtuse jargon rather than understandable language and at some point I would get fed up and walk off.

Oh well, nice fantasy.

I'll handle the reports, my friend. Been writing proposals and research reports for awhile. Obtuse jargon is second nature at this point!

 

[deafskeptic]

I'll handle the reports, my friend. Been writing proposals and research reports for awhile. Obtuse jargon is second nature at this point!

I think I'll leave the spelling to you.

 

[sallylou]

No kidding, deafskeptic. They had a field day with my signing. lol