Is ASL Fading Away or Not?

[deafskeptic]

Merry Christmas, and Happy New year, Banjo!

Nods. That was a wonderful post. Anyway, Merry Christmas and Happy New Year, Jillio and Banjo.

 

[jillio]

Nods. That was a wonderful post. Anyway, Merry Christmas and Happy New Year, Jillio and Banjo.

Right back at you, deafskeptic.

 

[loml]

If CS was invented because of the written format of English, then that would mean we are asking deaf children to acquire language through the written form first?

shel90- Cued Speech was not invented because of the written format of Enlglish, but because Dr. Cornett was concernd by the low level of Enlgish literacy amongst some deaf children.

 

[loml]

dup

 

[loml]

Here we go, loml....from the Acoustic Characteristics thread, post # 871.Originally Posted by Kaitin
This makes sense to me. If cued speech is not a language then it should be used after ASL and English is learned? Do you agree, Loml?


No I do not agree Kaitin.

And this is but one of your numerous posts that convey your philosophy of Cued Speech being used for langauge acquisiton and ASL not being introduced until a strong foundation of oral English is in place.

jillio - I would still answer Kaitlins' question with a no.

For your own needs, you insert your interpretation of my statements, claiming that this is what I have said.

 

[loml]

And that has absolutely nothing to do with Banjo's ability to critical analyze that which he has observed.

Are you implying that my statement is referring to Banjos' ability to critical analyze?

 

[loml]

Banjo never said that Cloggy is him. Banjo is voicing his opinions based on observations. Big difference.

shel90- I was eluding to Banjo having not walked in Cloggys' shoes and vica versa.

 

[Cheri]

shel90- I was eluding to Banjo having not walked in Cloggys' shoes and vica versa.

Parents will naturally want their child to be as much like themselves as possible and will probably choose oralism, Most of us know that for fact because we have hearing parents, What Banjo stated was 100 percent correct-- You must walk a mile in another person's shoes before you can understand what it means to be that person. Only deaf people understand what it means to be deaf because deaf people know the full communication access and quality for themselves.

 

[jillio]

jillio - I would still answer Kaitlins' question with a no.

For your own needs, you insert your interpretation of my statements, claiming that this is what I have said.

The words are right there. No interpretation needed. Direct question, direct answer.

 

[jillio]

shel90- Cued Speech was not invented because of the written format of Enlglish, but because Dr. Cornett was concernd by the low level of Enlgish literacy amongst some deaf children.

Which again stresses the fact that it was never intended for language acquisition, nor for the teaching of speech skills. One must have a langauge before one can become literate.

 

[jillio]

Are you implying that my statement is referring to Banjos' ability to critical analyze?

I'm not implying anything. If I have something to state, I will state it outright. You seem to be the one fond of implication. If you meant Banjo has not walked in Cloggy's shoes, why didn't you simply say so?

My relpy was to another poster, not to you.

 

[jillio]

Parents will naturally want their child to be as much like themselves as possible and will probably choose oralism, Most of us know that for fact because we have hearing parents, What Banjo stated was 100 percent correct-- You must walk a mile in another person's shoes before you can understand what it means to be that person. Only deaf people understand what it means to be deaf because deaf people know the full communication access and quality for themselves.

Exactly. Which is why it makes perfect sense: if you want to know what it is to be a deaf child, ask a deaf adult.

 

[loml]

The words are right there. No interpretation needed. Direct question, direct answer.

jillio - Your words not mine.

 

[loml]

Parents will naturally want their child to be as much like themselves as possible and will probably choose oralism, Most of us know that for fact because we have hearing parents, What Banjo stated was 100 percent correct-- You must walk a mile in another person's shoes before you can understand what it means to be that person. Only deaf people understand what it means to be deaf because deaf people know the full communication access and quality for themselves.

As only Cloggy knows what it means to be the father of his deaf child.

 

[loml]

That would be, but neither are you he. And that has absolutely nothing to do with Banjo's ability to critical analyze that which he has observed.

Are you implying that my statement is referring to Banjos' ability to critical analyze?

I'm not implying anything. If I have something to state, I will state it outright. You seem to be the one fond of implication. If you meant Banjo has not walked in Cloggy's shoes, why didn't you simply say so?

My relpy was to another poster, not to you.

jillio - And that poster would be??

 

[rick48]

ASL is the third most learned second langauge in the U.S. Evidently, there are quite a few still using it. And in those still using it, CI users are among the numbers.

Late deafened individuals have, historically, never relied on ASL as a group.

In a vacuum that sounds impressive but figures I have seen have only 550,000 people in the US AND Canada who use ASL. So it is a very small percentage of the total population.

Still, I do not see ASL ever fading away as a substantial portion of the deaf population will use it as either their primary or secondary method of communication.

 

[rick48]

You are in fact, saying that we are not qualified to give out any advices. Yet you are. You blatantly ignore the first-hand experiences of many deaf members here. We have quite a few CI users here and they are nowhere as hostile as you and the other hearing parents like Rick48 have been. Heck, Rick got banned because he couldn't resist urging insults and attack people even though he was already warned. Some people are just ill tempered. They have no self-control. The reason why CI users are perfectly welcome here is because they know what’s it’s like to be deaf even though our experiences differ on a large scale, but we all know what it’s like to be deaf.

If you have something to say about me, then why don't you have the intestinal fortitude to say it directly to me? I have no idea who you are and cannot recall ever discussing anything with you but yet you seem to be quite an expert on who is and who is not qualified to give advice on this forum. Have you ever raised a deaf child? Have you ever raised any chidren? Have you walked a mile in our shoes?

I have had the opportunity to meet many deaf adults during the continuing course of raising my child, and deaf adults are no different from hearing adults. There are some whose advice is sage and greatly accepted and there are others who, well let's just say their advice is not so sage. The bottomline is that parents such as Cloggy and myself know our children far better than you ever will for the one thing you seem to have forgotten in your insulting putdown of both of us is that mutual deafness pales in comparision to the bonds of love that is formed by the parent child relationship. My child is deaf but that is not all she is and if that is how you choose to define her then you have missed the essence of who she is.

You can think whatever reason you want for why I was "banned" but if you seriuosly think that "insults and attacks" are only from those who are parents of ci kids then I have a bridge in Brooklyn that I would love to sell to you.

Maybe the next time you choose to attack me, you will have the decency to do it directly to me and not bury it in some other thread.

Merry Christmas,
Rick

 

[Luv2Chat]

Cloggy,

It's a wonder why people would listen to you after all that conspiracy theories you spew out about 9/11 and that it was an insider job. You tried to say it was true.

You have absolutely no credibility here at Alldeaf.com. This isn't a personal attack, but it's quite clear you are only here to provoke the members by belittling their intelligence on a daily basis.

Enough is enough. It's quite clear you are no longer welcome here because of your hostility toward the other members simply because you don't agree with them. You treat them like second-class citizens.

You are not deaf. Your daughter is, not but you. You seem to keep forgetting that. Therefore, your knowledge on deafness is much, much more limited whether you like it or not. You have demonstrated how limited your knowledge is on many occasions. Even hearing parents like Jillo know that and they know better not to cross that line with us.

What I'm saying is, we don't need hearing parents coming in here and tell us you know what's the best for deaf children. Especially when we are deaf. We should be debating in a civilized manner, but with that attitude of yours, we are getting nowhere. Instead, you keep pointing fingers and provoking members then try to turn the table on them and say they started it.

It always has been you. Always been you. Truth is, you have no people skills. You haven't shown any of that at all. All you have managed to do is offend and provoke more and more people.

You are in fact, saying that we are not qualified to give out any advices. Yet you are. You blatantly ignore the first-hand experiences of many deaf members here. We have quite a few CI users here and they are nowhere as hostile as you and the other hearing parents like Rick48 have been. Heck, Rick got banned because he couldn't resist urging insults and attack people even though he was already warned. Some people are just ill tempered. They have no self-control. The reason why CI users are perfectly welcome here is because they know what’s it’s like to be deaf even though our experiences differ on a large scale, but we all know what it’s like to be deaf.

So do your daughter. I just hope she won’t turn out to be such an arrogant person like you are and I truly hope she will be an independent woman and is unafraid to tell you what’s on her mind. Even if the truth hurts.

You have long forgotten what it’s like to be a child. They seem so innocent and carefree. Then once they grow up, they start to see you differently and realize your flaws as a parent. That day will come for you. Not now, not anytime soon. But someday, the truth will strike you where it hurts the most.

Not trying to dampen your day, but I just had to say it. Wake up and smell the coffee, the world doesn’t revolve around you. Not everybody share the same views as you do. You are not an expert on deafness. Your daughter is. She knows what it’s like because she has the first-hand experience of it. You may try to understand it, but you truly won’t until you experience it.

Here’s an advice, start treating people the way you want to be treated. Then you might be surprised what a difference it makes.

Have a Merry Christmas and a Happy New Year.

OMG, i cant believe what i am reading at this sight. I've been checking out this sight for some time now trying to get some more info on deaf culture. I have a 7 year old child who is deaf and wears a ci. I figured she is old enough now to understand when we talk about different cultures. One thing i must say is this is absolutely NOT the place to get any info regarding deaf culture. Statements that are made like the one above make me just shake my head. I am hearing and my child is deaf BUT if you think you know my child better then me because you are deaf, then i'm sorry but you are sadly mistaken. This is not the 1970's where parents had no access to info as easy as we do now or where parents were ashamed if their child had a disability. Times have changed and so has technology. Of course you guys had it rough growing up, technology back then sucked and most relied on lip reading and just got frustrated, well whether you want to believe it or not times have changed. You talk about hearing parents have not walked a mile in a deaf persons shoe...well guess what you have not walked a mile in my shoe either and infact nor have you walked in my childs either whether you want to believe it or not. Nobody knows another persons child more then the parent and for you to believe that is insane. Just becase you expeirenced a rough childhood does not mean every deaf child will. Their may be a few bad apples out there but don't generalize all hearing parents who do not agree with you because if that's the case then i really don't need to look into the deaf culture any more based on what i am seeing here. Heres some advise for you, treat people the way oyu want to be treated

 

[Cheri]

You only made one post today, and You had to quoted Banjo's on your first visit, on Alldeaf Luv2Chat? It doesn't sound so right to me, something fishy is going on.

 

[deafskeptic]

OMG, i cant believe what i am reading at this sight. I've been checking out this sight for some time now trying to get some more info on deaf culture. I have a 7 year old child who is deaf and wears a ci. I figured she is old enough now to understand when we talk about different cultures. One thing i must say is this is absolutely NOT the place to get any info regarding deaf culture. Statements that are made like the one above make me just shake my head. I am hearing and my child is deaf BUT if you think you know my child better then me because you are deaf, then i'm sorry but you are sadly mistaken. This is not the 1970's where parents had no access to info as easy as we do now or where parents were ashamed if their child had a disability. Times have changed and so has technology. Of course you guys had it rough growing up, technology back then sucked and most relied on lip reading and just got frustrated, well whether you want to believe it or not times have changed. You talk about hearing parents have not walked a mile in a deaf persons shoe...well guess what you have not walked a mile in my shoe either and infact nor have you walked in my childs either whether you want to believe it or not. Nobody knows another persons child more then the parent and for you to believe that is insane. Just becase you expeirenced a rough childhood does not mean every deaf child will. Their may be a few bad apples out there but don't generalize all hearing parents who do not agree with you because if that's the case then i really don't need to look into the deaf culture any more based on what i am seeing here. Heres some advise for you, treat people the way oyu want to be treated

You sound like my mother. Things haven't changed even though techology has changed. You're not very open to our views judging from your post. We may not know your child's likes or dislikes but we certainly know what communcation barriers she'll face.

Most hearing do not understand what we really need as it's all speech speech and they neglect our language skills. They insisit that we be just like them. Even if some of us want to, we can never be truly like the hearing.