Do Jews believe in Jesus and still be Jewish?

[deafdyke]

Nonsense. Jesus wasn't a bad teacher.

Good point Teresh.......not believing in the divinity of Jesus, doesn't mean that we totally look down on him as a Teacher. Hey, even different deominations believe different things about Jesus. Some believe He was God, others say He was only a representive of God.

 

[hottiedeafboi]

Right, many religions look at Jesus as Great teacher, or a prophet or many other thing. When disciples were with Jesus and Jesus asked them, who did others say who I am? Some of each disciples answered, just like today what they say who Jesus is. Then He asked another question? Who do you think I am? Peter spoke boldly, You are The Christ, The Son of God. And Jesus said what you said it isn't from you, but the Spirit of God spoke through you. And about why called christians, bec Jesus was the jew. You are correct, He was a jew. But what is christians. For example, we live in America, those who live in America called Americans. Same as christians, those who are in Christ are called christians. When the name start, you see it in Book of Acts chappter 11:19-30. But named christians found in verse 26. That's in town of Antioch.

 

[Reba]

...who created that word, "Christian"?

Acts 11:19-26
19 Now they which were scattered abroad upon the persecution that arose about Stephen travelled as far as Phenice, and Cyprus, and Antioch, preaching the word to none but unto the Jews only. 20 And some of them were men of Cyprus and Cyrene, which, when they were come to Antioch, spake unto the Grecians, preaching the Lord Jesus. 21 And the hand of the Lord was with them: and a great number believed, and turned unto the Lord. 22 Then tidings of these things came unto the ears of the church which was in Jerusalem: and they sent forth Barnabas, that he should go as far as Antioch. 23 Who, when he came, and had seen the grace of God, was glad, and exhorted them all, that with purpose of heart they would cleave unto the Lord. 24 For he was a good man, and full of the Holy Ghost and of faith: and much people was added unto the Lord. 25 Then departed Barnabas to Tarsus, for to seek Saul: 26 And when he had found him, he brought him unto Antioch. And it came to pass, that a whole year they assembled themselves with the church, and taught much people. And the disciples were called Christians first in Antioch.

 

[Reba]

...Do Jewish Americans still call themselves Israelis?

If a Jewish American never lived in Israel, or never had Israeli citizenship, then that person is not an Israeli.

 

[Reba]

...Why Jewish can't be Hebrew, is that the same thing?

Here are the applicable definitions:

Jew (jū)

[Middle English Jeu, from Old French giu, from Latin Iūdaeus, from Greek Ioudaios, from Aramaic yəhudāy, from Hebrew yəhûdî, inhabitant of Judah, from yəhûdâ, Judah; see Judah2.]

noun
An adherent of Judaism as a religion or culture.
A member of the widely dispersed people originally descended from the ancient Hebrews and sharing an ethnic heritage based on Judaism.
A native or inhabitant of the ancient kingdom of Judah.


He·brew (hē'brū)

[Middle English Ebreu, from Old French, from Latin Hebraeus, Hebraic, from Greek Hebraios, from Aramaic ‘ibrāy, from Hebrew ‘ibrî.]

noun
A member or descendant of a Semitic people claiming descent from Abraham, Isaac, and Jacob; an Israelite; a Jew.

The Semitic language of the ancient Hebrews.
Any of the various later forms of this language, especially the language of the Israelis.

 

[Oceanbreeze]

Kudos to Teresh for standing up for her beliefs that she arrived at with rationality.
I've had some debates with Christians at RIT. Plenty of them respected me as a person, ie by not giving me a black eye, but some didn't do the same for my beliefs and nonbeliefs. It'd be hard to deal with a debate like the one here in real life with people in front of you expecting answers right away. But at least it's easier when there's time to write posts.

Exactly! I agree!!!

 

[Teresh]

I would say that most of my faiths are Messianic Judaism! And no one can take it away from me! For Jewish people like myself who belives in Jesus as their Messiah is called messiancs.

No, you're called Christians. A Jew or not, you are a follower of Jesus "the Christ" and are therefore a Christian. Your suggestion that "Messianic Judaism" is a form of Judaism (when it is clearly not by any rational analysis) is incorrect.

don't have to be a Christian to believe in Jesus. Jesus was a Jew...

Jesus wasn't a Christian. The term Christian refers to a person who follows Christ. As Jesus was (according to Christianity) Christ, he could not logically follow himself as he would be the leader/mentor.

Why Jewish can't be Hebrew, is that the same thing?

Hebrew refers to the descendants of the Twelve Tribes of Israel and those that joined the Tribe of Israel and their descendants. All Jews are Hebrews but not all Hebrews are Jews. There are likely a great many Hebrews in the world that are not Jews as all of the Tribes other than Simeon, Judah, Benjamin and part of Levi disappeared when Israel and Judah split into two seperate Kingdoms.

Do Jewish Americans still call themselves Israelis?

American Jews are Americans, not Israelis. Israeli refers to a citizen of the State of Israel, something that most American Jews are not. An American Jew calling himself or herself an Israeli when he or she does not have citizenship is about as valid as me calling myself Japanese or you calling yourself a Spaniard.

 

[pek1]

Are u telling me, people who practice CC are non-believers and not Christians? They do not understand bible? This is what I am getting impress from many Christians about my faith thru CC.

What is "CC?"

 

[FreedummyRing]

Okay 12 tribes...

Jacob's sons...

Reuben
Simeon
Levi
Judah
Issachar
Zebulun
Dan
Naphtali
Gad
Asher
Joseph
Benjamin


Dinah, Jacob's only daughter didn't own a land.

Moses, from the Levi's tribe, Levi's parents were Leah and Jacob.

Leah was Jacob's first wife, because she was the older than Rachel.

Levi killed his sister Dinah's rapist.

So Levi's daughter Jochebed gave birth to Moses.

 

[Teresh]

So Levi's daughter Jochebed gave birth to Moses.

Um, no. There was more than a 400 year span of time between the death of Joseph and the birth of Moses.

...And I feel the need to clarify. Joseph did not have his own Tribe, though his sons, Ephraim and Manessah, did. They were blessed along with Israel's sons. Joseph did not receive this blessing while his brothers did.

 

[FreedummyRing]

Joseph and his brothers stayed near Egypt, and then Moses and Joshua and people of Israel left Egypt... and then took over other people's land and killing them.... and call it Israel.

Why Egypt can't be the promise land, land of milk and honey, why can't they conquer Egypt and kill all the Egyptians...?

Instead of crossing the Jordan river and destroying Jericho and killing people there?

I don't understand.

 

[hottiedeafboi]

Remember God sent Abraham to the land which he doesn't know where to. That land where he settled is where God said the land will be. But after the time when Joseph was sent to Egypt caravans that which they left from Gilead by getting the balms and etc where out of Joseph's borthers jealousy by solding him to them and sent to Eqypt. God been using Joseph in special way bec forknew the famine is coming which saved his families. And Joesph died of old age and the new pharoah feared Hebrews will overtaken Egypt. But that's during the time span btwn Joseph's death and Moses birth about 400 years. That is the purpose to bring back the Hebrews where God promised Abraham.

 

[Teresh]

Joseph and his brothers stayed near Egypt, and then Moses and Joshua and people of Israel left Egypt... and then took over other people's land and killing them.... and call it Israel.

Moses and Aaron, rather... Joshua came later.

Why Egypt can't be the promise land, land of milk and honey, why can't they conquer Egypt and kill all the Egyptians...?

Because Israel was the Promised Land. God didn't make two Promised Lands for the Israelites. God only made one. If that one were Israel, it was to the exclusion of all other possible lands.

 

[FreedummyRing]

I think Joseph's brothers and their children are being punished and being slaves for 400 years for selling Joseph as slave in the first place.

What comes around goes around

 

[hottiedeafboi]

I think Joseph's brothers and their children are being punished and being slaves for 400 years for selling Joseph as slave in the first place.

What comes around goes around

Hahaha, no, that's not how that goes. New pharoah haven't met Joseph and know much about Joseph as a full story. As Joseph told his brothers, all of what he's been going thru its for the good and Joseph loved his brothers and forgiven them. God has the perfect plans which we don't even know it about our own lives and purposes. Similar of what has happening to the Hebrews.

 

[pek1]

I think Joseph's brothers and their children are being punished and being slaves for 400 years for selling Joseph as slave in the first place.

What comes around goes around

Nope!! They wandered in the wilderness for 40 years to kill off the first generation that refused to believe God. The 400 years was still for not believing and trusting God (Yahweh). And, might I add, the Jews (Old Testament) are still walking in the wilderness because they've been shown, by God Himself, that Jesus Christ IS their Messiah.

Archaeologists, even those who aren't Christians, have proven countless times who Jesus Christ was and is. Teresh just doesn't want to be proven wrong. I'd rather be dead right about Jesus Christ than to find out on the Day of Judgment and be dead wrong then!

 

[Teresh]

Nope!! They wandered in the wilderness for 40 years to kill off the first generation that refused to believe God.

The first generation believed in God. Lack of faith is not why they died.

They died because they had the slave mentality. They believed that life was so much better in Egypt because they had more variety of food and because while they had to work hard and while they were oppressed, their needs were tended for by the Egyptians. In the desert, however, they learned that in the Land of Israel they would need to fend for themselves (indeed, they would even need to fight to gain control over the land God had promised). They would need to establish a real government, they would need to grow their own crops, develop their own religious rituals.

It's very easy for one who has never before had freedom to not fully comprehend the meaning of being a free individual. The older generation that was born into slavery needed to die off so that the younger generation, born in the desert, would be able to do what is necessary to build the People of Israel in the Promised Land into a real nation.

The 400 years was still for not believing and trusting God (Yahweh).

Scriptural basis? The 400 years were to solidify the Tribe of Israel into a unit, to allow it to grow and to bring them to the understanding of the wickedness of using people against their will to do your bidding. It was to teach them a moral lesson, by far the most important one, that freedom is important.

And, might I add, the Jews (Old Testament) are still walking in the wilderness because they've been shown, by God Himself, that Jesus Christ IS their Messiah.

They haven't been shown by anyone that Jesus of Nazareth was the Messiah. If anything, history has shown that Jesus was *not* the Messiah as he failed to live up to the prophecies. Paul of Tarsus invented the idea of the second coming, which I should note has no basis in Jewish scripture or tradition, as he could not rationalise why Jesus was supposedly the Messiah but did not live up to the prophecies.

Archaeologists, even those who aren't Christians, have proven countless times who Jesus Christ was and is.

That's what we call making stuff up. There are no sources, Jewish or Roman even that confirms Jesus even EXISTED at all, though given the impact the religion about him has had on the world is an indicator that he probably did exist, at least in some form.

Teresh just doesn't want to be proven wrong. I'd rather be dead right about Jesus Christ than to find out on the Day of Judgment and be dead wrong then!

My faith is self-sustaining. I do not base my faith on the inerrant fear that comes from an incorrect understanding of Pascal's Wager. I do not base my faith on fear of what it means to not believe. I base my faith on the existence of God, not on fear of atheism.

What if Jesus wasn't the Messiah? What if, for example, Muhammed was the Final Prophet of God? Then what happens to you at the end of the world? You're afraid of that possibility, no? If yes, then become a Muslim. If no, then you're too used to not thinking that you've already forgone reason.

 

[JohnnyE]

Oh My Lord, I have been watching this debate for some time and all the way from the start to this post. I have to say Teresh contradicts herself then attempts to say something different but if you watch the mintune details of what Teresh has been saying all along. I have lost my respect for Teresh. She just does not get it. Jesus Christ was Jewish so were his 12 disciples Jewish and Jesus Christ witnessed to large crowds of Jewish people. My God how more blind can you get than that? Teresh, I am thinking you are a muslim sympathizer.

 

[Maria]

Oh My Lord, I have been watching this debate for some time and all the way from the start to this post. I have to say Teresh contradicts herself then attempts to say something different but if you watch the mintune details of what Teresh has been saying all along. I have lost my respect for Teresh. She just does not get it. Jesus Christ was Jewish so were his 12 disciples Jewish and Jesus Christ witnessed to large crowds of Jewish people. My God how more blind can you get than that? Teresh, I am thinking you are a muslim sympathizer.

You are not the only one who noticed her contradiction. I noticed it, too and I am not interested in debatin' with her. To me, that's like she is playin' " cat and mouse " game with everyone who disagree with her. She is just usin' her " intelligence " to challenge anyone over issues to see who wins debate. It's just all her game.

 

[JohnnyE]

I agree Cyberred and if Teresh really is a member of the jewish organization of Hillel then I can't help but have to wonder how Hillel will think of Teresh after reading all these posts and what her conclusions have come to. She would probably not be very well recieved by Hillel nor by anybody once they realize and see what an angry woman Teresh really is with her attidute and her intellecutal debating skills really don't match anywhere near where real people think. I think that eventually, the cat will be let out of the bag. In some respects, Heath is right as he has pointed out all the revelant information for Teresh to see for herself. She probably could not find her own hand in the dark and that is very sad, let alone the facts and Teresh does not think very rationally like the rest of us do.