Deaf view on a CI kid... its a bummer..

[rick48]

Can all hearing people tune a piano?

I do not know but can they tune a fish?

 

[Liebling:-)))]

See they key words here are: Fuzzy talk about SOUND, I talk about EAR because I want to talk about EAR not SOUND. never mind Fuzzy can not read minds.
never mind what Fuzzy wants AT ALL.


NO YOU DON'T KNOW you ASSUME you do! I am telling you this for the HUNDRETH TIME!


I NEVER SAID "not happy", AND NEVER IT IN RELATION TO THIS! THAT'S YOUR ASSUMPTION!

I NEVER SAID THEY ARE UN-HAPPY!! JUST THAT THEY DON'T HEAR LIKE NORMAL HEARING PEOPLE DO!!



i NEVER SAID THEY CAN'T TALK ON THE PHONE LIKE NORMAL PEOPLE i SAID THEY CAN'T hear LIKE NORMAL HEARING PEOPLE! OF COURSE THEY CAN'T UNLESS THEY HEAR NORMAL!!!


Fuzzy

*sigh* you still can't get it...

You depend on books.
I depend on real life experiences.

That's why we talk different.

 

[Liebling:-)))]

Seen her type many times before as there is usually one on every forum-jealous of those kids who are doing well and of those parents who have raised such kids. Guess its because she is not totally convinced she made the right decision for her child after all. She has to knock us down in order to build herself up. Sad, very sad.

jealous?

I feel sorry for you...

 

[Liebling:-)))]

Jealous? I'm no where near jealous at the fact that your child can hear with cochlear implant, I don't care how much hearing your child can hear, I'm more cornering about the language development with speech and sign language. if your child can hear a cow mooing across Iowa state, Who cares!! I only care about their hard work and time you, your child, and child's therapist are truly working towards the child's goal, and the language that the child use at home, speech and signs, because of that having advance in language function so much better in the world, not in order to hear.

Exactly!!!

 

[Liebling:-)))]

And by definition, fuzzy, hadicapped implies reduced functioning. As my son functions as well as his hearing peers do. Therefore, he is not, by definition, handicapped.

However, you are greatly handicapped by your ignorance.

And, if my son were ever to encounter you, and to see you refer to him as handicapped, I would hope that he would be functioning optimally sothat he would sign to you to kiss his ass.

The fact that you see yourself as handicapped is the biggest part of your maladjustment. You don't see yourself as whole, and therefore, are resentful of those whom you believe to be non-handicapped, and you continually strive to prove to them that you aren't, or when that doesn't work, rely on your self appointed handicapped status as an attempt to gain sympathy. GAWD, what a whiner.

Yes, that's right... Like what I said before that Fuzzy don't get it...

For you, Fuzzy

handicapped definition - Dictionary - MSN Encarta

disability definition - Dictionary - MSN Encarta

Got it?


I agree with Jillo that you see yourself as a handicapped is lack of knowledge on people's real life experiences.

 

[rick48]

jealous?

I feel sorry for you...

Sorry, but if believing that there is no one way to raise any child, let alone a deaf child offends you and that if believing that parents should have all the options available to them to make decisions that are in the best interests of their child bothers you too bad. However, there is no need to feel sorry for me for we have raised a deaf child with a ci who is happy, well adjusted and is on her way to being a college graduate with unlimited possibilities before her.

 

[Liebling:-)))]

Shel just proved you just missed quite and important fact in this about me (something I have already stated, btw selective reading, huh) - I did was 4 years single mother).

And thank you SHEL. Yes, you remembered well.


Fuzzy

I only want to make sure either I remember correctly or not... You mentioned at some threads somewhere last or 2 years ago that you has a 16 years old daughter.

 

[Liebling:-)))]

Hey, Leibling is at work, earning a few dollars ahead of us who are sleeping! Lol...

 

[CutePommie]

My daughter just says that she is deaf but hears with her ci and moves on with her life, suggest you do the same and stop obsessing over Cloggy's daughter.

Huh pardon me !
Yes well done for your daughter said she is deaf and can hear with her C.I
.
I ain't no obsession over Cloggy's daughter no only himself willing not to typing * My daughter is deaf and she can hear with her C.I.*
He only typing * My daughter is deaf and she can hear....*
Make sense?

:roll: at some of you people it very sad .

Now am off to work I does to have a life thank you .
(pardon me for )

 

[Audiofuzzy]

I only want to make sure either I remember correctly or not... You mentioned at some threads somewhere last or 2 years ago that you has a 16 years old daughter.

two years ago would make her 14+ she is almost 17 now.


Fuzzy

 

[Audiofuzzy]

So, a handicapped person can never achieve more than a person that is not handicapped!

but this is actually true.

a handicapped person can never achieve
more than
a person that is not handicapped.

what can non-handicapped person achieve more? than handicapped?
by the same token, what can handicapped person achieve more than not handicapped?

For example.

Stephen Hawking. Physicist. Did handicapped person Stephen Hawking achieved more than non- handicapped Albert Einstein?

Albert Einstein. Physicist and mathematician. Did non- handicapped person Albert Einstein achieved more than Stephen Hawkings?

human abilities are more or less at the same level.

Fuzzy

 

[Audiofuzzy]

Jealous? I'm no where near jealous at the fact that your child can hear with cochlear implant, I don't care how much hearing your child can hear, I'm more cornering about the language development with speech and sign language. if your child can hear a cow mooing across Iowa state, Who cares!! I only care about their hard work and time you, your child, and child's therapist are truly working towards the child's goal, and the language that the child use at home, speech and signs, because of that having advance in language function so much better in the world, not in order to hear.

Cheri, because Lotte was implanted at the time when "window of opportunity" was not yest missed, she is able to learn to hear and speak faster, easier and more effectively than your hypothetical son would be if you've given him "choice" at 12 y.o..

and because Lotte was implanted early,
yes it takes a lot of work, (not neccessarily as much as one would think)
but a lot of it also comes naturally, a lot of it is by simply LISTENING.

The way the baby learns to hear sound its by realising (hearing) there is some sound. it then turns its head at the source. and connects one to the other.
since your children are hearing, you must have seen that happening - them looking very intently at the source of the sound. that's when it connects - cat to the meeow, dog to the woof!, trickling water to the faucet, sizzling candlewick to the candle, etc.

After enough time, the baby remembers what makes what sound, and learns to know the sound from MEMORY, by simply memorizing it.
It doesn't even need to look at anymore to know what makes this or that particular sound.

So, Lotte is learning to hear in a different ways, plus she is developing in one similar way to the hearing children with the exception she learns it with her CI. Pretty soon she will not need a lot of learning anymore. She will have a speech, she will hear better and better, and this is developing language, too.
Pretty soon she will have plenty of time to master ASL thousands times over, and master speech and language development from both sides thousands times over. Is it worth it? I think yes.

The same way it's worth to take advanced math, advanced English, comparative civilization, advanced biology and whathever else's available at a high school instead of only neccessary minimum to pass.
You are doing something that you don't HAVE TO, but it's WELL WORTH IT.


When I was in my early teens, I hated my speech classes my Mom made me have to make my pronounciation better and clearer. Was it tiresome? Like heck. Was it hard work? Like heck. Did I like it? Heck NO.
Did I need it to survive? NO.

Was it worth it? ABSOLUTELY. people understood me better, I didn't had to repeat myself over and over, or even write down if the word was particularly difficult for me to pronounce.
Now, looking back I am actually SORRY I skipped many hours of it, and didn't work harder, because me speech is still a bit unclear at times.

So I am pretty sure Lotte will thank her Mommy and Daddy for all the work she has to do now. I am sure her general language dev. and sign will not suffer because of all that.

Fuzzy

 

[Liebling:-)))]

but this is actually true.

a handicapped person can never achieve
more than
a person that is not handicapped.

what can non-handicapped person achieve more? than handicapped?
by the same token, what can handicapped person achieve more than not handicapped?

For example.

Stephen Hawking. Physicist. Did handicapped person Stephen Hawking achieved more than non- handicapped Albert Einstein?

Albert Einstein. Physicist and mathematician. Did non- handicapped person Albert Einstein achieved more than Stephen Hawkings?

human abilities are more or less at the same level.

Fuzzy

To claim that deaf, Deaf or HOH person is handicapped is an ignorant thing to say.

It doesn't mean that deaf/Deaf humans are abnormal!

Example:

You use sign language like you can speak different languages like German, Chinese, Russian, etc. Deaf/deaf/HOH itself are disablity, not human because they (human) are unable to go to war, be solider, phone operator, etc. It's same with language disablity because they (human) are unable to understand other countries' languages and unable to work together with them.

Would you consider the people from other countries to visit your country as a handicapped due their lack of English language?

 

[Audiofuzzy]

Is it push when I expressed my opinion in friendly and polite way to you? I often say that I am not interest about an exact sound etc. etc... All what I want to positive you what I know in life experiences how the people are happy what they are.. and can hear on the phone with HA and can speak like hearing... It´s mainly important to me than consider the exact different sounds etc.

yes, it is still push if you force me to yield to you even if you are polite.
For example, you can tell somebody "GET the F.. OUT!", or you can ask politely "Please leave".
Either way you exercise your will over that person.
I know that deaf and HoH people are happy what they are. Don't forget I am deaf and with HAs I am HoH, too and I am happy.
I know people can talk on the phone like hearing - but they don't hear like hearing. I too can talk on the phone, although in my native language only, in English just a basic.

I am not interest about an exact sound etc. etc... All what I want to positive you what I know

Exactly. See what did you just said- you are not interested in my side, only to tell me what you know.

I quoted your posts because I disagree with your post

BINGO! and THAT is not listening. even if you quote me.

I would only if you respect our posts instead of prove us wrong.

Excuse me, if somebody was telling untrue things about you and then denied doing that, what would you do?

I have no problem to have you to disagree with me but prove us wrong/accused us as a liar, false, etc...

Okay, I'll try not to do that. But yes I will prove you wrong if you are wrong and deny it.

You said "Ham in pet food". I was like huh because I never see that ham in pet food here in Germany but pork, beef, chicken, turkey, kind of fishes...

And that's HOW I knew you don't understand ME because I knew you thought of HAM as 'cooked ham for sandwich', and that WAS NOT what I was talking about because I was talking about RAW MEAT. (or CUT).

You should say PORK... , not HAM...

It doesn't matter - I was telling you over and over that you don't understand. you should have believed me, and ask me what do I mean then.
I had no way of knowing that for you Ham is not pork.
and anyway I told you I am talking about animal parts, raw unpreparred cuts.

I told you:

Fuzzy: Like steak parts or porkchops parts.

Liebling: Did you know that salt is also include in ham, bacon?

Fuzzy: I was reffering to animal parts,

Fuzzy: made from parts of animal like ham, steak, sirloin- raw, unprepared cuts?

Liebling : I understand you prefectly but I can't convince how different system we have in our countries.

Liebling: No ham in pet foods because they are made with salt.

at this point I found the picture of Ham and raw ham as meat part.

and then you said:

I´m sorry to misunderstand you over ham... Occhhh!!!

Well I knew all the time. I tried to TELL YOU.
http://www.alldeaf.com/our-pets/18740-ugliest-dog-3.html

What kind of pictures, you want to prove me here since you already posted several pictures here and another CI threads ? *scratch my head* or you think I don´t understand the pictures what you posted here?

I said THERE just IS NO picture to help to explain.
How do you picture sound? you can record sound, but not picture it. You can't take a picture of wind.

F: I abolutely did not that to convince other posters. That was between me and you. Should I have PM you?
L: Really?

That was to show Shel how miscommunication causes problems and because of that, a lot of crap. How because of miscommunication I am falsely accused of lot of things I didn't do. yes I used you as an example.
But not to convince her or anyone that you are wrong or something. Only to show miscommunication.

Yes I know what you talked about but do I have to follow your POV when I see different as you?

But you didn't knew what I was talking about, like in the Ham example, and if you want to KNOW my POV then you should listen to my POV. To know, not to follow.

Those ham situation is confused with different language between British and American which is total different as our debate here. Don´t try to compare ham situation with CI situation here.

The ham situation was because of two things;
1. the difference in A. and E. language
2. you didn't understood my explanation

You claimed you understood that the confusion between British and American language over ham but why brought those subject up to create more problem here for? Is that because I am not interesting to follow your POV?

No, because I wanted to show that when you say "yes I understand" - you don't. Will you believe me now?


Fuzzy

 

[Liebling:-)))]

Cheri, because Lotte was implanted at the time when "window of opportunity" was not yest missed, she is able to learn to hear and speak faster, easier and more effectively than your hypothetical son would be if you've given him "choice" at 12 y.o..

I just thought about compare wear glasses with HA or CI...

Simple question:

Is that sight development improve itself when they wear glasses?


My answer is: No, they need their glasses to help them to see because they want to see... it's same thing with CI or HA, they need CI or HA's help to hear because they want to hear.

That's what I tried to explain in previous posts that hearing development has nothing do with language/speech skill itself but people themselves.

and because Lotte was implanted early,
yes it takes a lot of work, (not neccessarily as much as one would think)
but a lot of it also comes naturally, a lot of it is by simply LISTENING.

Yes, only if she really want it...

Don't you know that some hearing people are too lazy to listening anything?

The way the baby learns to hear sound its by realising (hearing) there is some sound. it then turns its head at the source. and connects one to the other.

Yes, but I would wear HA on my baby first to familiar with sound first. Remember that HA and CI are not the same sound as an original hearing.

since your children are hearing, you must have seen that happening - them looking very intently at the source of the sound. that's when it connects - cat to the meeow, dog to the woof!, trickling water to the faucet, sizzling candlewick to the candle, etc.

Yes, so? I can see that you think hear the sound from ear is mainly important to you but I see different as you...

All what I know is deaf people are happy that they can SMELL anything, can TASTE anything, FEELING anything toward people & animal's movement, can LEARN anything and can SEE anything.. Why should it important for them to HEAR the sounds? Blind people are happy that they can HEAR anything when they can not SEE... They said... Why do I have to see anything because I can hear, smell, taste, etc?

After enough time, the baby remembers what makes what sound, and learns to know the sound from MEMORY, by simply memorizing it.

See? It's parents who feed their babies into brain with the help from HA, CI or original hearing, not HA, CI or original hearing itself. (I personally against to implant babies with CI but respect parents' decision).

Example about Cloggy's videos... I viewed his's videos - they HELPED Lotto to develop to hear and speech and also sign as well.

So, Lotte is learning to hear in a different ways, plus she is developing in one similar way to the hearing children with the exception she learns it with her CI. Pretty soon she will not need a lot of learning anymore. She will have a speech, she will hear better and better, and this is developing language, too.
Pretty soon she will have plenty of time to master ASL thousands times over, and master speech and language development from both sides thousands times over. Is it worth it? I think yes.

I would say the same thing with HA as well, not just CI.

The same way it's worth to take advanced math, advanced English, comparative civilization, advanced biology and whathever else's available at a high school instead of only neccessary minimum to pass.
You are doing something that you don't HAVE TO, but it's WELL WORTH IT.

Don't compare hearing development with language development because they are different. For language skill, is mainly important to learn anything than train them to hear anything.

When I was in my early teens, I hated my speech classes my Mom made me have to make my pronounciation better and clearer. Was it tiresome? Like heck. Was it hard work? Like heck. Did I like it? Heck NO.
Did I need it to survive? NO.

Important question is feeling... How do you feeling? Burden? or Happy? I mean during your teens time. If I remember correctly, I know from your threads that you don't sign?

So I am pretty sure Lotte will thank her Mommy and Daddy for all the work she has to do now. I am sure her general language dev. and sign will not suffer because of all that.

I know from Cloggy's posts and would say that there're huge difference between him and your mother. I do not compare them with your mother.

 

[Audiofuzzy]

To claim that deaf, Deaf or HOH person is handicapped is an ignorant thing to say.

I said it is a matter of how you view the word "handicapped". To me, if you can't hear you are in this area handicapped.
yes i read your link. It says:


hand·i·capped [ hándee kàpt ]


adjective

Definition:

1. physically or mentally challenged: physically or mentally challenged ( often considered offensive )


If you can't hear, then you are physically challenged.

And please see here, too:

Definition of handicapped - Merriam-Webster Online Dictionary

Main Entry: handicapped
Function: adjective
Date: 1891
sometimes offensive : having a physical or mental disability; also : of or reserved for handicapped persons <handicapped parking spaces>

But I see this is considered offensive, I don't know why, but I can understand why some people are against use of this word.
Still, it means what it means- a disability.

It doesn't mean that deaf/Deaf humans are abnormal!

I never said that.

I'm just thriller that none of these hearing parents here are like you, it seem you would put yourself first before your deaf child, how sad....



You already responded to that on post #172 after I stated that on post #162...

Nice try Fuzzy,

Excuse me, but nice try what? You said lie about me here- that I put myself first before my child.
I DON'T.



Fuzzy

 

[Liebling:-)))]

yes, it is still push if you force me to yield to you even if you are polite.
For example, you can tell somebody "GET the F.. OUT!", or you can ask politely "Please leave".
Either way you exercise your will over that person.
I know that deaf and HoH people are happy what they are. Don't forget I am deaf and with HAs I am HoH, too and I am happy.
I know people can talk on the phone like hearing - but they don't hear like hearing. I too can talk on the phone, although in my native language only, in English just a basic.

No, see yourself what you posted here and other CI threads is acussed us misinformation, liar, etc. All what we do is STOP and POSITIVE you in polite way.

Excuse me, I know how to deal with people in polite and manner way instead of harsh word like what you did to posters... All what I do is won't let you negative about deafness... and positive you about deafness in polite way because you are on hearing posters side to negative our posts. I really don't understand you anymore because you are DEAF and look your own feeling instead of listen books.

Exactly. See what did you just said- you are not interested in my side, only to tell me what you know.

BINGO! and THAT is not listening. even if you quote me.

Whatever :roll:

Excuse me, if somebody was telling untrue things about you and then denied doing that, what would you do?

Simple is positive them what I know from experience or my own experience. I do not expect to make the people to beleive me but up to them either they beleive me or you.

Okay, I'll try not to do that. But yes I will prove you wrong if you are wrong and deny it.

I would prove you wrong in positive and nice way instead of negative way like what you did to posters here.

And that's HOW I knew you don't understand ME because I knew you thought of HAM as 'cooked ham for sandwich', and that WAS NOT what I was talking about because I was talking about RAW MEAT. (or CUT).

It doesn't matter - I was telling you over and over that you don't understand. you should have believed me, and ask me what do I mean then.
I had no way of knowing that for you Ham is not pork.
and anyway I told you I am talking about animal parts, raw unpreparred cuts.

I told you:

at this point I found the picture of Ham and raw ham as meat part.

and then you said:

Well I knew all the time. I tried to TELL YOU.
http://www.alldeaf.com/our-pets/18740-ugliest-dog-3.html

I said THERE just IS NO picture to help to explain.
How do you picture sound? you can record sound, but not picture it. You can't take a picture of wind.

I can't see the sense why you brought the drama over that confusion languages between American and English since I did ADMITTED that I confused the languages between American and English. *sigh* You brought those 2 years old subject to compare my posts here which is not acceptance because they are TOTAL different... You are for EAR ... and I am for LANGUAGE SKILL.

If you still can't get it then I can't help you...

That was to show Shel how miscommunication causes problems and because of that, a lot of crap. How because of miscommunication I am falsely accused of lot of things I didn't do. yes I used you as an example.
But not to convince her or anyone that you are wrong or something. Only to show miscommunication.

Okay, did I called you liar or whatever when you claimed that you did not convince the posters about our 2 years old posts in your first post? No, I did not but polite provided the link to show you that you DID. What I did in positive way, not like what you did with other posters.

But you didn't knew what I was talking about, like in the Ham example, and if you want to KNOW my POV then you should listen to my POV. To know, not to follow.

I didn't know that Ham is raw meat for American language... For raw meats, we use pork... something like that... chop pork, pork fillet, pork schnitzel, cooked, boiled pork etc. for ham is different as raw pork because we have kind of ham here is smoked and boiled. We don't use those word "cooked ham" here but just ham. I asked my American co-worker. She said that most Americans use those word "ham sandwich"... Interesting...

The ham situation was because of two things;
1. the difference in A. and E. language
2. you didn't understood my explanation

No, because I wanted to show that when you say "yes I understand" - you don't. Will you believe me now?

It has nothing do with this but I kept say "I never heard" which mean I understand you but I never heard... until you show me the picture... I got that it's American language to use Ham which we use pork as raw meat.

If you still can't get it then I can't help you.

I am not only one who says that you don't get it.

 

[shel90]

I am not handicapped.

 

[Liebling:-)))]

But I see this is considered offensive, I don't know why, but I can understand why some people are against use of this word.

This problem is your lack of knowledge is depend on books and listen hearing people's side too much than consider yourself and your own feeling.

Anyway, thank you for brought 2 years old link here then the posters will see themselves after finish read the whole 3 pages thread.

 

[Maria]

Fuzzy,

It doesn't mean that Lieblin' don't listen. She is D E A F ! And, she can SEE to READ you, not listenin'. She sees differently than you. She views with her own eyes by readin' - differently than what you view with your own eyes by readin'.

You and Lieblin' are 2 different people and you can't make Lieblin' to be Fuzzy. Lieblin' is only ONE unique name and so is yours.