Are you sick of highly paid teachers?

Beowulf said:
That's fine, but I still call it disinformation. Supposedly a teacher gets raises totalling an average of 40% over ten years and we know it is complete rot.
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True...good point.
 
Tousi said:
That's not something I'd say...emotions are getting the best of some...there's no intended ill-will going on here just for it's own sake. IMO
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I'm getting emotional? It seems to me that education is quite important and we should treat our teachers with respect and pay accordly.

I don't have a personal stake in this subject (even though members of my family are in the teaching profession) and it has always seemed logical to me that it's in our collective interest best interests that our society be well educated as a whole.
 
TXgolfer said:
Many of the brightest young minds are becoming teachers....at private schools.....for less pay....and less benefits.

It speaks volumes that teachers in private schools are not in an uproar over pay. Very likely that one reason a private education is so much better than a public education is that the teachers are there for the students.....not for the money.
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LOL, you have no idea what you're talking about. Where do you get this information??? The majority of private school teachers are LESS-qualified than public school teachers.

The reason private education is "better" (debatable), has much more to do with the social-economic status of the students and opportunities available to students, both pre-existing and those made available by institutions with more available money than public schools.
 
So far, I found:

PRIVATE RELIGIOUS SCHOOLS

NAICS 813100 - Religious Organizations

Education, Training, and Library Occupations top
Employment Estimates Wage Estimates
SOC Code Number Occupation Title (click on the occupation title to view an occupational profile) Employment (1) Percent of Total Median Hourly Mean Hourly Mean Annual (2) Mean RSE (3)

25-0000 Education, Training, and Library Occupations 26,510 14.18% $13.72 $16.26 $33,820 2.2 %

25-1199 Postsecondary Teachers, All Other 30 0.02% (8) (8) (8) (8)

25-2011 Preschool Teachers, Except Special Education 6,870 3.68% $12.86 $14.09 $29,300 2.8 %

25-2012 Kindergarten Teachers, Except Special Education 620 0.33% (4) (4) $41,970 5.4 %

25-2021 Elementary School Teachers, Except Special Education 3,220 1.72% (4) (4) $42,070 3.8 %

25-2022 Middle School Teachers, Except Special and Vocational Education 350 0.19% (4) (4) $43,020 4.9 %

25-2031 Secondary School Teachers, Except Special and Vocational Education 440 0.24% (4) (4) $48,770 5.0 %

About.com:
&bts=1&zu=http%3A//www.bls.gov/oco/ocos069.htm%23earnings


PUBLIC SCHOOLS

Education, Training, and Library Occupations top
Employment Estimates Wage Estimates
SOC Code Number Occupation Title (click on the occupation title to view an occupational profile) Employment (1) Percent of Total Median Hourly Mean Hourly Mean Annual (2) Mean RSE (3)

25-0000 Education, Training, and Library Occupations 5,701,280 66.50% $21.88 $22.70 $47,220 0.7 %

25-2011 Preschool Teachers, Except Special Education 63,560 0.74% $17.82 $18.58 $38,640 0.9 %
25-2012 Kindergarten Teachers, Except Special Education 170,260 1.99% (4) (4) $51,430 1.1 %

25-2021 Elementary School Teachers, Except Special Education 1,531,700 17.87% (4) (4) $53,190 0.8 %

25-2022 Middle School Teachers, Except Special and Vocational Education 661,060 7.71% (4) (4) $53,590 0.6 %

25-2023 Vocational Education Teachers, Middle School 14,000 0.16% (4) (4) $51,530 0.8 %

25-2031 Secondary School Teachers, Except Special and Vocational Education 1,082,210 12.62% (4) (4) $55,210 0.6 %

25-2032 Vocational Education Teachers, Secondary School 89,730 1.05% (4) (4) $54,620 0.6 %

25-2041 Special Education Teachers, Preschool, Kindergarten, and Elementary School 213,640 2.49% (4) (4) $54,390 0.8 %

25-2042 Special Education Teachers, Middle School 101,290 1.18% (4) (4) $54,790 0.9 %

25-2043 Special Education Teachers, Secondary School 142,450 1.66% (4) (4) $56,560 0.9 %

About.com: http://www.bls.gov/oco/ocos069.htm#earnings

(I highlighted the middle school teachers simply to make it easier to read and compare.)
 
Reba said:
So far, I found:

PRIVATE RELIGIOUS SCHOOLS

NAICS 813100 - Religious Organizations

Education, Training, and Library Occupations top
Employment Estimates Wage Estimates
SOC Code Number Occupation Title (click on the occupation title to view an occupational profile) Employment (1) Percent of Total Median Hourly Mean Hourly Mean Annual (2) Mean RSE (3)

25-0000 Education, Training, and Library Occupations 26,510 14.18% $13.72 $16.26 $33,820 2.2 %

25-1199 Postsecondary Teachers, All Other 30 0.02% (8) (8) (8) (8)

25-2011 Preschool Teachers, Except Special Education 6,870 3.68% $12.86 $14.09 $29,300 2.8 %

25-2012 Kindergarten Teachers, Except Special Education 620 0.33% (4) (4) $41,970 5.4 %

25-2021 Elementary School Teachers, Except Special Education 3,220 1.72% (4) (4) $42,070 3.8 %

25-2022 Middle School Teachers, Except Special and Vocational Education 350 0.19% (4) (4) $43,020 4.9 %

25-2031 Secondary School Teachers, Except Special and Vocational Education 440 0.24% (4) (4) $48,770 5.0 %

About.com:
&bts=1&zu=http%3A//www.bls.gov/oco/ocos069.htm%23earnings


PUBLIC SCHOOLS

Education, Training, and Library Occupations top
Employment Estimates Wage Estimates
SOC Code Number Occupation Title (click on the occupation title to view an occupational profile) Employment (1) Percent of Total Median Hourly Mean Hourly Mean Annual (2) Mean RSE (3)

25-0000 Education, Training, and Library Occupations 5,701,280 66.50% $21.88 $22.70 $47,220 0.7 %

25-2011 Preschool Teachers, Except Special Education 63,560 0.74% $17.82 $18.58 $38,640 0.9 %
25-2012 Kindergarten Teachers, Except Special Education 170,260 1.99% (4) (4) $51,430 1.1 %

25-2021 Elementary School Teachers, Except Special Education 1,531,700 17.87% (4) (4) $53,190 0.8 %

25-2022 Middle School Teachers, Except Special and Vocational Education 661,060 7.71% (4) (4) $53,590 0.6 %

25-2023 Vocational Education Teachers, Middle School 14,000 0.16% (4) (4) $51,530 0.8 %

25-2031 Secondary School Teachers, Except Special and Vocational Education 1,082,210 12.62% (4) (4) $55,210 0.6 %

25-2032 Vocational Education Teachers, Secondary School 89,730 1.05% (4) (4) $54,620 0.6 %

25-2041 Special Education Teachers, Preschool, Kindergarten, and Elementary School 213,640 2.49% (4) (4) $54,390 0.8 %

25-2042 Special Education Teachers, Middle School 101,290 1.18% (4) (4) $54,790 0.9 %

25-2043 Special Education Teachers, Secondary School 142,450 1.66% (4) (4) $56,560 0.9 %

About.com: http://www.bls.gov/oco/ocos069.htm#earnings

(I highlighted the middle school teachers simply to make it easier to read and compare.)
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If 43K is a part time job like TXGolfer claimed then it is GREAT PAY!
 
TheWriteAlex said:
LOL, you have no idea what you're talking about. Where do you get this information??? The majority of private school teachers are LESS-qualified than public school teachers.
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Where did you get your information?

The teachers at our Christian school bachelors and masters degrees, and are certified by state organizations. The school administrator has a doctorate degree. Some of the secondary teachers also work part time as college instructors. They attend workshops and/or take college courses during the summer. Some have worked previously in public schools. So, how are they less qualified?

The reason private education is "better" (debatable), has much more to do with the social-economic status of the students and opportunities available to students, both pre-existing and those made available by institutions with more available money than public schools.
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The amount of money spent on each of our school's students is less than the public schools spend. There are a few financially comfortable families at our school but most of them are middle class or struggling. The school provides some needs-based scholarships. My Sunday school class provided tuition and uniforms for one student. Grandparents help pay tuition for some families. Nearly all our families make financial sacrifices to pay for their kids' educations. When my daughter attended school there, we scrimped like crazy. We drove old clunker cars, shopped yard sales for clothing, got creative with beans and rice, and worked extra jobs.

It's not just rich people who send their kids to private schools.
 
shel90 said:
If 43K is a part time job like TXGolfer claimed then it is GREAT PAY!
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It's $10,000 less than the public school teacher makes, so perhaps the private school teacher works another part-time job to make up the difference. Or, they adjust their lifestyle to fit their income.
 
Reba said:
It's $10,000 less than the public school teacher makes, so perhaps the private school teacher works another part-time job to make up the difference. Or, they adjust their lifestyle to fit their income.
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huh?

See post #136


According to TXGolfer, their teaching job is a part time job (teaching 2 to 3 classes a week). For that pay, that is great!
 
deafskeptic said:
I'm getting emotional? It seems to me that education is quite important and we should treat our teachers with respect and pay accordly.

I don't have a personal stake in this subject (even though members of my family are in the teaching profession) and it has always seemed logical to me that it's in our collective interest best interests that our society be well educated as a whole.
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Sure, I agree but I didn't say anything about you.
 
shel90 said:
huh?

See post #136

According to TXGolfer, their teaching job is a part time job (teaching 2 to 3 classes a week). For that pay, that is great!
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I'm not posting about TXGolfer's personal experiences. I posted a national average.

If you have a disagreement with him please post to him, not me.
 
Reba said:
Where did you get your information?
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My mother is a teacher. All her friends are teachers. I grew up around teachers and have talked to them about the profession of teaching many times. I know for a fact that private schools do not need to require their teachers to be certified, and most don't. As inadequate as I feel teacher certification is, it is much better than none at all. Teacher training is vital. Also, public schools require their teachers to stay on top of certifications and attend yearly workshops and trainings (often unpaid). Just because you know your subject well, doesn't mean you will teach well. Training is vital.

As someone who is in a graduate program right now, I pretty much discount any graduate degree when it comes to preparing one to teach, unless the degree is in education itself, or if the degree included a REAL teaching component, not TAship (the vast majority don't). Graduate degrees tend to be very specialized, and only cover a few topics within a given discipline. That's the point of them. You are supposed to write a thesis or dissertation on a topic that has not been covered before. That's okay though, because that's the point of a graduate degree. But unless you plan to teach at the university level, a graduate degree does not do much to prepare you as an elementary or secondary teacher.

Also, there are plenty of public school teachers with graduate degrees. My mother has advanced degrees, and so does my brother's girlfriend, who is also a HS teacher. Many high level administrators in the public school systems have PhD and MAs as well.

You also seem to forget something: private schools are not required to provide free special education services for disabled (physical or LD) students. This is often a hefty part of a public school system's budget. In fact, many students with disabilities who attend private schools have their education paid for, either fully or in part, by the public school system.
 
Tousi said:
Although I think it has appeared that way a number of posts back, I don't think she means to take it out on you......at least I hope not.
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Yeah.....nah my deal is people know they deal going in. I think it silly to work that hard to become a teacher, knowing that teachers are paid poorly, and then complain about the pay.

Should teachers be paid more? Some of them yes and some of them no. BUT, the people are broke, the states are broke and Uncle Sam is broke....Where exactly is that money supposed to come from. I guess we are back to that money producing tree.
 
Tousi said:
I'll not argue "the "love", the "calling" but they must be well off enough in other ways or through someone else to do this. That's something I wish I was able to do way back when.....
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Somebody else said this already but discounted tuition is another big reason. I got my brother-in-law a job as the computer guy at my daughter's school so that my nephews could get a discount. They get about 50% off.
 
Reba said:
The teachers at our Christian school bachelors and masters degrees, and are certified by state organizations. The school administrator has a doctorate degree. Some of the secondary teachers also work part time as college instructors. They attend workshops and/or take college courses during the summer. Some have worked previously in public schools. So, how are they less qualified?
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I should add that using your own school as an example is a fallacy in this case. There is much variance among private schools, district to district, county to county, state to state. Public schools, on the other hand, have a much more uniform code for qualifications, which can be used as a basis for comparison.

If you find me the same exact data for a large sample of private schools, than I may revise my opinion, until then, you've got to provide more than just one example.
 
shel90 said:
huh?

See post #136


According to TXGolfer, their teaching job is a part time job (teaching 2 to 3 classes a week). For that pay, that is great!
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:nono:

I had stated that some teachers donate their time.....you asked how they could afford to do that and I said they only teach 3-4 classes. The full time paid teachers work....well.....full time. And get paid less.
 
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