250 Million Christians Will Be Persecuted in 2007

[christlovedeaf]

Do you want to say that what I know from Christians at 5 weeks spa is not fact?

Lets back it up. What you saw at the spa, of particular person who is a christian does not mean ALL christians behave that way.

 

[Liebling:-)))]

Lets back it up. What you saw at the spa, of particular person who is a christian does not mean ALL christians behave that way.

No, I'm not saying ALL but I only said what I withnessed at the spa... and saw an exact same what Shel90 described about her friend's brother.

I said few Christians at spa, not one Christian.

 

[Reba]

... They can't seem to understand the difference between worship the bible and read the bible story...

Christians don't worship the Bible. Christians worship God. God communicates with us thru His Bible.

Some people misunderstand or misuse the Bible. That's how problems happen.

Yes, read/study and worship is the same thing.

No, it's not. Christians are forbidden to worship objects. That is idol worship. We worship God only. We read and study the Book that He gave us. That Book is the Bible. But no Christian kneels before a Bible or prays to a Bible. The Bible is not "magic". The power is in the words of the Bible, not the paper and ink.

Some christians, I met there realized something wrong with them and want the help...that's why they went spa to improve their self-estreem. This is a not opinion of me but FACT...

Really? Or did psychologists, doctors, and worldly friends convince them that something was "wrong" with them because they didn't fit the perfect German image? The government offered them a free 5-week vacation at a nice spa--who would turn down that opportunity?

If "experts" keep telling you that something is wrong, and if you trust the "experts", after a while some weaker Christians might begin to believe the "experts", and begin to doubt themselves. That is a lot of peer pressure to combat.

 

[christlovedeaf]

bible is very difficult to understand to read. It is related to the history. I am not really motivated to read the bible.

I do read alot of other books like After Dead Communication. The book called, "Hello from Heaven". It helped me alot because it is the fact as true stories what other people who have lost of their decease spouses, children, parents or children. It was really impact me alot because I want to hear of the truth stories what they see.

Bible has too many change verse with various authors. The science have more fact than regilious. I do not see any much of fact science in the bible.

I become more involve in Widow/Widowers Support Group. I read alot of books lately since my husband passed away.

- Kalista

I know what is like to lose love ones. Its very painful. Even very comforting only a person who knows God sincerely, not how much people "know" the Bible and even claiming having devotional with God, but not. Bible never changes. The only changes is the language, but same author, but only different people using the language for someone to understand better. Many knows "about" the Bible, but not understand the purpose and the meaning of the Bible. No, its not wrong about scientist and etc, the only thing SOME scientist who is a believer have the whole info and backed up than non believers, but even tho, disagreement is still there. Many ddint realize everything in the Bible does apply to us and even comfort. Many I met asked, really? Its in the Bible, someone told me there isn't any. So I shared with them. Bible is not just history, there more than just history. And have not change at all. I weight the experience I have with people and I learned soo much from the Bible and people and I begin to see and also seeing what many christians went wrong. Some christians like me begin to see. For example, like Romans 1, many christians believe God gave them up bec they are homosexuals. What I read, its not true, God gave them up because people don't honor and won't give God thanks and so, God gave them up which lead people a choice. Does that mean people who is homosexual bec God gave them up? No, that's not what Paul meant. Other parts, about a man slept with step mom, Paul rebuke the chruch bec of gossipping and judging, Paul gave the church the procedures, as he is saying like how Jesus taught, if I personally caught my brother/sister in sin, I personally suppose to go to that person, NOT spreading the word about the person. That's what went wrong inthe churches. Many gave up their faith or walked out of church and etc and living in resentment. I don't agree with extremist christians, bec " Bible says so" attitude, true, the Bible says so, but that does not how it says. You know what I mean? Bible is like a scroll, we learn from. Its been written to pass down toward us and the next generations. That's what the Bible is about. Also, like science, when I use science and the Bible, there is a back up for it. I studied which does apply the Bible. It is much easier to share face to face than on here, bec there's so much info and questionings.

 

[Reba]

...I only judge the murder, rapist and form of abuses... This is all.

That's the reason why mankind needs God to put down the laws in the Bible. It's because each person thinks he or she knows what is right and wrong. But people don't know, so God put the laws down in writing in His Bible so that people could read His commandments.

Deuteronomy 12
8 Ye shall not do after all the things that we do here this day, every man whatsoever is right in his own eyes.

28 Observe and hear all these words which I command thee, that it may go well with thee, and with thy children after thee for ever, when thou doest that which is good and right in the sight of the LORD thy God.

32 What thing soever I command you, observe to do it: thou shalt not add thereto, nor diminish from it.


Proverbs 21
2 Every way of a man is right in his own eyes: but the LORD pondereth the hearts.

 

[christlovedeaf]

It's sound like preaching or sermon:


preach - Definitions from Dictionary.com

Sermon - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Yeah, emphasis that preaching/sermon not always relate Bible or church. It means anything. Even science preached. Even btwn parents/child(ren). Even non believers household, like parents does not want their kids get their life messed up, kids will tell parent, don't preach to me. Religions also is abroad, even sports can be religions, spouse can be religions. There are vatieties.

 

[Reba]

I only want to tell you that Shel90 is correct about obssession... I withnessed at spa.

Non-Christians think that Christians are "obsessed" with God and the Bible.

Christians think that non-Christians are "obsessed" with experts and psychology.

It goes both ways. Each group has an entirely different perspective.

 

[mecooncat]

hello!

I've been reading your post on the bible and i have an observation for both of you. the bible is Gods word for all of us to read and understand. its the church that has twisted the bible for their own ends.

I'll give you a couple of examples: in the old testament Jeremiah 10; 1-4.

"Hear ye the word which is the Lord speaketh unto you, O house of Israel:
Thus saith the Lord, learn not the ways of heathen, and be not dismayed at the signs of heaven; for the heathen are dismayed at them. For the costoms of the people are vain: for one cutteth a tree out of the forest, the work of the hands of the workman, with the ax. They deck it with silver and with gold; they fasten it with nails and with hammers, that it not move."

This sounds like a description of our christmas tree to me. the bible says not to do this, but we do it anyways.

christmas is a pagan holiday for the worship of the winter solstice. the church decided, years ago, to incorporate this into its own use. so they decided to call it Jesus' birthday so church followers would partake in this ritual.


another example of the church twisting things for their own advantage:

Exodus 20; 25

"and if thou wilt make me alter of stone, thou shalt not build it of hewn stone: for if thou lift up thy tool upon it, thou hast polluted it."

this sounds like the Lord is telling us not to build fancy church buildings to worship in. but the church does it anyway, and we follow.

there are more examples of the church twisting the bible to keep the people in line but i won't go into them now. surffice it to say always believe what the bible tells you, but take what the church says with a grain of salt.

this is mecooncats husband talking, thanks for listening.

 

[christlovedeaf]

hello!

I've been reading your post on the bible and i have an observation for both of you. the bible is Gods word for all of us to read and understand. its the church that has twisted the bible for their own ends.

I'll give you a couple of examples: in the old testament Jeremiah 10; 1-4.

"Hear ye the word which is the Lord speaketh unto you, O house of Israel:
Thus saith the Lord, learn not the ways of heathen, and be not dismayed at the signs of heaven; for the heathen are dismayed at them. For the costoms of the people are vain: for one cutteth a tree out of the forest, the work of the hands of the workman, with the ax. They deck it with silver and with gold; they fasten it with nails and with hammers, that it not move."

This sounds like a description of our christmas tree to me. the bible says not to do this, but we do it anyways.

christmas is a pagan holiday for the worship of the winter solstice. the church decided, years ago, to incorporate this into its own use. so they decided to call it Jesus' birthday so church followers would partake in this ritual.


another example of the church twisting things for their own advantage:

Exodus 20; 25

"and if thou wilt make me alter of stone, thou shalt not build it of hewn stone: for if thou lift up thy tool upon it, thou hast polluted it."

this sounds like the Lord is telling us not to build fancy church buildings to worship in. but the church does it anyway, and we follow.

there are more examples of the church twisting the bible to keep the people in line but i won't go into them now. surffice it to say always believe what the bible tells you, but take what the church says with a grain of salt.

this is mecooncats husband talking, thanks for listening.

Hahaha, I know exactly what you meant. Also, remember, thru the OT have holy of holies with think drapes which only priest enter it. After Jesus rose from the dead, earthquake hapened, the drapes were torned in half. In the OT called old agreement, after Jesus was raised, now having new agreement and it was foretold in Isaiah. Haha, yeah, I learned the history about christmas tree. In Jeremiah's time is similar as paganism. As paganism don't use the word christmas tree, couldn't remember what they call it. But like one part of the story, Martin Luther saw the night he was out during cold winter night and saw the stars thru evergreen tree. And he pictured it and chopped the tree and interesting, using the picture of three look like triangle tree (the way we draw), represent Father, Son and the Holy Spirit. Ornaments represent King of kings, lights represent, Light of the world and etc. We don't worship tree itself like Nehemiah time. There is no differenece when we study history and part of the history in the Bible. Haha, I know what you mean. You got a good point there. Smile

 

[Reba]

Disagree because the God or bible didn't know my weak and strength but physchologist or therapist because they know me as person, not the bible...

God knows more than any psychologist or therapist because God knows your heart and thoughts.

Proverbs 21
2 Every way of a man is right in his own eyes: but the LORD pondereth the hearts.

Psalm 44
21 Shall not God search this out? for he knoweth the secrets of the heart.

94
11 The LORD knoweth the thoughts of man, that they are vanity.

139
23 Search me, O God, and know my heart: try me, and know my thoughts:

I Chronicles 28
9...for the LORD searcheth all hearts, and understandeth all the imaginations of the thoughts...

Jeremiah 17
9 The heart is deceitful above all things, and desperately wicked: who can know it? 10 I the LORD search the heart, I try the reins, even to give every man according to his ways, and according to the fruit of his doings.

Genesis 6
5 And GOD saw that the wickedness of man was great in the earth, and that every imagination of the thoughts of his heart was only evil continually.

Isaiah 66
18 For I know their works and their thoughts: it shall come, that I will gather all nations and tongues; and they shall come, and see my glory.

Jeremiah 6
18 Therefore hear, ye nations, and know, O congregation, what is among them. 19 Hear, O earth: behold, I will bring evil upon this people, even the fruit of their thoughts, because they have not hearkened unto my words, nor to my law, but rejected it.

Matthew 9
4 And Jesus knowing their thoughts said, Wherefore think ye evil in your hearts?

12
25 And Jesus knew their thoughts, and said unto them, Every kingdom divided against itself is brought to desolation; and every city or house divided against itself shall not stand:

Luke 5
22 But when Jesus perceived their thoughts, he answering said unto them, What reason ye in your hearts?

6
8 But he knew their thoughts, and said to the man which had the withered hand, Rise up, and stand forth in the midst. And he arose and stood forth.

11
17 But he, knowing their thoughts, said unto them, Every kingdom divided against itself is brought to desolation; and a house divided against a house falleth.

I Corinthians 3
20 And again, The Lord knoweth the thoughts of the wise, that they are vain.

Hebrews 4
12 For the word of God is quick, and powerful, and sharper than any twoedged sword, piercing even to the dividing asunder of soul and spirit, and of the joints and marrow, and is a discerner of the thoughts and intents of the heart.

 

[Reba]

Do you want to say that what I know from Christians at 5 weeks spa is not fact?

That is only what you observed during 5 weeks with those particular individuals.

You wouldn't want Christians to judge non-Christians based on what they observed about you during your 5 weeks at the spa, would you?

 

[shel90]

It seems like many of u believe that people who dont obey or accept God, are missing something or dont have a good life. If that is so true then if my friend's brother is being guided and loved by God, then why has he become such a negative person attacking everyone for whenever they say or do that he percieves as a sin against God? It seems like he takes our "sins" as a personal insult to him even thought our actions or thoughts have NOTHING to do with him. After years of dealing with his behavior, we all got fed up and told him he needs to seek therapy but he chose not to so we gradually stopped hanging out with him. We wanted to get together and enjoy ourselves without any mention of God, the bible and sinning so now that I am living in MD, I dont get to see him anymore. I talk to him on VP sometimes but it is the same thing..the conversation turns to be about him and God. I just got so tired of it and now I havent talked to him anymore. I miss the old (name withheld) and so does my friend. She had to cut him off from her life cuz he did something that really hurted her and her other brothers.

My question is if it is so good to have God in his life then what is so good about alienating his friends and family? I think he needs some serious therapy.

He said doesnt really have a strong Christian support group cuz of the communication barrier since he doesnt read lips very well. He said he tried joining the Christian groups or Bible studies but he kept getting lost when everyone else was chatting away so he goes once in a well but doesnt feel as strong as a connection with them due to the communication barrier.

 

[mecooncat]

He needs to sit back and rethink. It's not easy to do by yourself. As for the group, they should have deaf interpretor or CART. I'm not surprise not that many have those in churches. I don't go to church because I'm having a hard time understanding what they are saying. I usually read my bible or go in religion chat line or like here or ask my husband. He knows what he's talking about.

Your friend seem to be lost as I call it "lost christain." I can't remember in bible how how a person saying bad remarks to others. I'm sure others will explain. I'm still learning and will always be.

 

[christlovedeaf]

I know how that goes. We'll, like sharing about the person, either exaggerating or actually happen. I'm not there. But, if he's a new christian, that's normal, he will learn as if he keep learning the experience around them and how to live an example. Many not really understand the deep meaning of being a christian. Many times we force ourselves do and donts. Yes, there are some boundaries in them. But, there is no difference btwn a person who share a personal experience of relationship with God and others share their experience about bed hopping. The reason feeling uncomfortable about God, is not from the person, but God's revealing thru the person. Uncleaness can't stand cleaness as much as cleaness can't stand uncleaness, also dark can't stand the light and the light can't stand the dark. There are uncomfortable feeling in that. And yes, very very sad, with many churches do not understand and know how to relate deaf world and missing so many point of the idea about the difference of the need of hearing and deaf. Many deaf lost out or feeling left out, bec not understanding what they are teaching and saying. That's very tragic thing to happen. He is learning and stil learning. Like me for example, I've shared that recently here on other threads, I don't jump in talk about God, I'm getting to know them, and whatever a person brought up like church, or the way christian behaving, I point it out and they begin to ask about whatever is the issues. They never thought of that. One particular christian ask me how I do that, bec I know that person(christian). I correct the person bec judgemental attitude, gossipping and etc where other people can't stand that person which causes turn them off. See, that's the example of being a christians, there are many different attitude in christians society, whatever you raise, or who you are around them and etc is different than mine. Many get easy excuse by blaming christian and gave up so easily whatever what's going on, you are not alone, I've myself been there, but I won't give up my faith, inspite some christians judging and gossipping about me and same time I don't have to pay back. I have to learn myself and what I need to adjust inspite if they haven't adjusting themselves. Church and the world are the same, but most ewould rather blaming the church than the world.

 

[XBGMER]

Liebling, I really admire what you doing this.. You really surprise me, you are still stand upon on the top of rock where the strong wind blew the water of sea against. You never fear the strong wind and waters rise against the top of the rock where you stand on. keep in your faith what you believe.. I know what you know what you doing.. keep your head up!

I agree with u. I get so tired of people judging me cuz I dont obey the bible. I dont judge them for obeying the bible but why do they judge others? It is like they consider themselves better cuz they obey the bible. Puts a strain in a lot of relationships..like my friend and her deaf brother's relationship. He is so obsessed with Christianity and the bible and it destroyed their relationship cuz she got tired of him preaching to her. It is sad cuz they are both only the deaf ones in their family. She said she doesnt care if he obeys the bible or whorship it but to force it on her and call her sinful cuz she doesnt have the same beliefs is what ruined their brother/sister relationship.

Shel90, You are true witness about one of your friends who ruined his relationship with lady. I can't even deny your facts, and your post hit my heart being truly guilty. Because your comments really remind me of me who destoryed my relationship with ex wife.. I was preached her about God, jesus, etc.. I brought the flame in relationship with her about God's issues what I was against her.. I pushed her as forced her believe in God, beliefs, etc than convinve her believe in God's things and beliefs... I was obessed about bible, jesus, and God.. I always thought JESUS CHRIST is most important than wife or kids.. I truly lost everythings what I had. I step back, sat down and re-think what the big mistake i made in my life done. I realized that Religion stuffs would cause my relationship problems/ ruins.

Like I said what i did judge others with my harash words what God call.

In events, I refuse to bring christ issues or stupid belief into relationship with my fiancee, it would be even worst flame and cause problem. because She is not strong christian nor bibical believer.. but she is the genuine native america of tribal member of family.. I respect who she is and learn what her belief where she grew up from tribal traditional. we can share and trade our beliefs. just simple protect and respect my relationship and family the most important..

I realized that my fiancee started to ask me about God or jesus sometime.. I gave her some explains or some points what the depend we talk about..

His life is run by the bible. He seems to cant think for himself anymore. If we ask him for his opinion, he would say "God this or that..." It is like we dont know him anymore. He cant make any decisions without "consulting" the bible. I think it is excessive and it has ruined his relationship with his deaf sister and his two other brothers and from what I hear, his children cant wait to grow up and move out.

Yeah your witness is correct, My life was run by bible more than the world or family.. I can't even think for myself and fmaily anymore.. I always cause them problem , because God doing this.. memebers of my relatives felt like not know me anymore.. they can see me really obessed with GOd's stuffs than my life was normal living where I grew up and rise by parents and relatives..

Shel90, I really hate to see some christians have something serious happen to others,, like one of christians killed husband, wife, or members.. christian person told them what God told me do it to killed .. what the fool person thinking?? God did not this.. There is nothing do with god's stuffs or God really nothng do with christians who fallen in sin of murder or other things.. I was like, where the heck person get that sayings about God cause me do it from??

 

[Animal_Lover]

Thanks god that I dont believe god because too many religious are still making conflict to each other

Don't give up ur faith to ur God!

Don't worry about me because I rather not to have afterlife.. I wonder if that is one of choice between heaven and no afterlife...
If it is..
Then that is interesting!

 

[mecooncat]

I'm still reading the bible. I don't know the whole book except ,Matt. Mark, Luke and John in NT and that it. Right now, I'm in Deuteronomy book and boy, that was very interesting. I've learn so much.

Let me tell you something, years ago when I was a child, my mother was a catholic and my father was a protestant. So, I was never baptized or go to church. While I was growing up, I used to go to the churches with my friends. I'm surprised at how all those fancy catholic are. I didn't like that church. To me is a greedy type like gold and silver. Then I was a very young mother say about 28 yrs old, JW came to my door and talked to me. So, I say okay, let's see what they have to say. I went on with them for 2 months. One day, I invited them for my daughter's birthday and they told me that they don't celebrate birthdays or any kind of holidays. I told them that's it and I quit. They tried several times to have me come back and I refused. 5 yrs later, a very good friend of mine was talking to me and I happen to notice her bible and ask her what is her religion are. She told me that she's christian. She invited to the Assembly of God church one Sunday. I just realize that my feeling has changed and knew this is the one I've been looking for. So, I went to see the pastor and asked to be a witnessed. I repented my sins and asked the lord to forgive and be my saviour. I felt my heart warm. I went to the church for awhile. I stopped going because I was going thru depression and my ex-husband is not showing love for me, call me name, he tells me what I should like a sexy model. He need to see in a sexy outfit but I wasn't thin at all. I've tried to work it out with him 3 times but no avail. I realize that he's going to be evil person. I can't change him for who he is. So, I divorced him and a year later, I met boyfriend (now hubby) and I asked him if he believe in God and he told me that he does but he doesn't go to the church. He explains to me why he doesn't go to the church. Last year, I went to the church and asked the pastor to be the witnessed again. So, I asked the lord for not being there and forgive me what I've done. I'm free again. Now, I don't go to church because they don't ASL interpretor or CART. It makes it hard for me so I just do it at home.

I don't preach but if someone wants to talk about the bible or God, I'm willing to do that.

 

[shel90]

Liebling, I really admire what you doing this.. You really surprise me, you are still stand upon on the top of rock where the strong wind blew the water of sea against. You never fear the strong wind and waters rise against the top of the rock where you stand on. keep in your faith what you believe.. I know what you know what you doing.. keep your head up!


Shel90, You are true witness about one of your friends who ruined his relationship with lady. I can't even deny your facts, and your post hit my heart being truly guilty. Because your comments really remind me of me who destoryed my relationship with ex wife.. I was preached her about God, jesus, etc.. I brought the flame in relationship with her about God's issues what I was against her.. I pushed her as forced her believe in God, beliefs, etc than convinve her believe in God's things and beliefs... I was obessed about bible, jesus, and God.. I always thought JESUS CHRIST is most important than wife or kids.. I truly lost everythings what I had. I step back, sat down and re-think what the big mistake i made in my life done. I realized that Religion stuffs would cause my relationship problems/ ruins.

Like I said what i did judge others with my harash words what God call.

In events, I refuse to bring christ issues or stupid belief into relationship with my fiancee, it would be even worst flame and cause problem. because She is not strong christian nor bibical believer.. but she is the genuine native america of tribal member of family.. I respect who she is and learn what her belief where she grew up from tribal traditional. we can share and trade our beliefs. just simple protect and respect my relationship and family the most important..

I realized that my fiancee started to ask me about God or jesus sometime.. I gave her some explains or some points what the depend we talk about..




Yeah your witness is correct, My life was run by bible more than the world or family.. I can't even think for myself and fmaily anymore.. I always cause them problem , because God doing this.. memebers of my relatives felt like not know me anymore.. they can see me really obessed with GOd's stuffs than my life was normal living where I grew up and rise by parents and relatives..

Shel90, I really hate to see some christians have something serious happen to others,, like one of christians killed husband, wife, or members.. christian person told them what God told me do it to killed .. what the fool person thinking?? God did not this.. There is nothing do with god's stuffs or God really nothng do with christians who fallen in sin of murder or other things.. I was like, where the heck person get that sayings about God cause me do it from??

Wow! Thanks for sharing your experiences. So, we just let my friend's brother be until he realizes what he is doing or do we keep trying to get him to see what he is doing to himself and his relationships?

BTW..Christlovedeaf...he has been a reborn Christian for over 20 years. It started out pretty good and he was humble about it but as the years passed, he seemed to get more and more obsessed about following the bible or God's words.

 

[shel90]

I'm still reading the bible. I don't know the whole book except ,Matt. Mark, Luke and John in NT and that it. Right now, I'm in Deuteronomy book and boy, that was very interesting. I've learn so much.

Let me tell you something, years ago when I was a child, my mother was a catholic and my father was a protestant. So, I was never baptized or go to church. While I was growing up, I used to go to the churches with my friends. I'm surprised at how all those fancy catholic are. I didn't like that church. To me is a greedy type like gold and silver. Then I was a very young mother say about 28 yrs old, JW came to my door and talked to me. So, I say okay, let's see what they have to say. I went on with them for 2 months. One day, I invited them for my daughter's birthday and they told me that they don't celebrate birthdays or any kind of holidays. I told them that's it and I quit. They tried several times to have me come back and I refused. 5 yrs later, a very good friend of mine was talking to me and I happen to notice her bible and ask her what is her religion are. She told me that she's christian. She invited to the Assembly of God church one Sunday. I just realize that my feeling has changed and knew this is the one I've been looking for. So, I went to see the pastor and asked to be a witnessed. I repented my sins and asked the lord to forgive and be my saviour. I felt my heart warm. I went to the church for awhile. I stopped going because I was going thru depression and my ex-husband is not showing love for me, call me name, he tells me what I should like a sexy model. He need to see in a sexy outfit but I wasn't thin at all. I've tried to work it out with him 3 times but no avail. I realize that he's going to be evil person. I can't change him for who he is. So, I divorced him and a year later, I met boyfriend (now hubby) and I asked him if he believe in God and he told me that he does but he doesn't go to the church. He explains to me why he doesn't go to the church. Last year, I went to the church and asked the pastor to be the witnessed again. So, I asked the lord for not being there and forgive me what I've done. I'm free again. Now, I don't go to church because they don't ASL interpretor or CART. It makes it hard for me so I just do it at home.

I don't preach but if someone wants to talk about the bible or God, I'm willing to do that.

 

[Kuifje75]

I wonder how many non-Christians will die this year.
And don't tell me that Christians don't kill in the name of religion. Spanish Inquisition, anyone?