WVSDB- Using SEE?

[InsaneMisha]

It is NEVER too late. It's certainly harder but it is never too late. That is a FACT!

True but most said they don't bother with it and stick with ASL. Remember that they included me were in schools from age 2 and over till graduation are tired of learning all over again. Some can catch up while others continue struggling. Two way street.....

 

[deafdyke]

Not always. I have seen many children start of with SEE and end up with poor literacy skills.

I have seen evidence of that on AD with former members who grew up with SEE. They had a problem with constantly misunderstanding what others wrote and would always get pissed off for the littlest things thinking the other poster meant something totally different from what he/she really meant.

Also, it is not just only looking at incorrect grammar but one's ability to organize their thoughts as well.

SEE is not a language and by building a first language based on SEE is just TOO risky and the child could end up with language delays or deficient.

SEE is just a teaching tool. ASL is a language, not a teaching tool. Big difference.

Exactly!!!!!! Deaf kids deserve ASL first. They may use SEE in English class, but their primary LANGUAGE needs to be ASL. The problem with using SEE as a first "language" is basicly the same problem with using Cued Speech as a first "language"

 

[InsaneMisha]

Exactly!!!!!! Deaf kids deserve ASL first. They may use SEE in English class, but their primary LANGUAGE needs to be ASL. The problem with using SEE as a first "language" is basicly the same problem with using Cued Speech as a first "language"

SEE, Cued Speech, SimCom, TC and PSE are NOT even "language" at all. I wish you stop using them as "language." They are just communication tools, nothing else.

 

[deafdyke]

SEE, Cued Speech, SimCom, TC and PSE are NOT even "language" at all. I wish you stop using them as "language." They are just communication tools, nothing else.

That is why I put language in "quotation" marks.
I can see how SEE and Cued Speech COULD be used as a "bridge" to English, by being used in English class. Note I said COULD. ASL needs to be used for the CONTENT, since it's easiest for dhh kids to understand......SimCom and TC are screwed up since you need to keep the languages separate.

 

[InsaneMisha]

That is why I put language in "quotation" marks.
I can see how SEE and Cued Speech COULD be used as a "bridge" to English, by being used in English class. Note I said COULD. ASL needs to be used for the CONTENT, since it's easiest for dhh kids to understand......SimCom and TC are screwed up since you need to keep the languages separate.

I know but don't use that because it sends mix signals.

 

[deafbirk]

what should be more important is the academics. Does the school have a good graduation rate? How many of the students go on to college? Does the school offer AP classes? If SEE is the only downside then the others, grad rate,AP and college track,should trump ASL. You have to know they students will use ASL outside the classroom and with you at home.
Don't need to focus so much on the signs if the academics are good to great

 

[deafdyke]

what should be more important is the academics. Does the school have a good graduation rate? How many of the students go on to college? Does the school offer AP classes? If SEE is the only downside then the others, grad rate,AP and college track,should trump ASL. You have to know they students will use ASL outside the classroom and with you at home.
Don't need to focus so much on the signs if the academics are good to great

Why is college so important? I DO think that there needs to be a college track, and there are some WVSDB kids who attend college.....But I also think that there needs to be attention paid to skilled job training. Also people need to realize that while Deaf Schools may not score super high on tests,(for a variety of reasons) many of them can still give their students functional academic abilty......Yes, I know it's better to score on par BUT a) testing can be a HUGE scam even in the hearing world....and b) At least many of the kids who test below grade level, have functional academic abilty. From the bashing from certain quarters you would think that Deaf Schools mostly produce kids who can't even write or read a kindergarten level book. There ARE some deaf school kids like that yes....but hearing schools ALSO produce HEARING kids like that too! And a lot of the times it's due to kids having missed out in the mainstream, or badly trained teachers or many other circumstances......I mean yes a more then fourth grade level is good....but at least with a fourth grade level, the kid has at least SOME functional abilty, and could do factory work or other semi skilled work.

 

[deafdyke]

I agree 100%! I know most of my friends who went through mainstream schools that were taught in all SEE have very poor literacy and English grammar skills. They now use ASL but too late to remedy the skills. That made me cringe when I read their writings. Same goes to former oral school kids. I was from oral school but my mom introduced me to the books at age of one that made me a true avid reader. (Picture books of course) That helped me with my literacy and English grammar skills tremendously. While I was in oral school, we used homemade, gestures and ASL in mix (in private out of staff's eyes) until I picked up ASL at age of 14. That is WHY ASL should be the utmost primary language for Deaf babies all the way.

Quick question.............do you agree with using SEE SOME of the time? Humble opinon. They need to concentrate on ASL for CONTENT for most subjects. They COULD use Cued Speech (the way hearing children use phonics) or SEE as a "bridge" to English in English/reading class....But they need to be LIMITED to that class

 

[deafdyke]

And I think that WVSDB is not exactly reknown. But hopefully that will change.....It does have the beginnings of potential to be a good school..Like it has a program for multihandicapped kids ...As I said it's in the works to turn into a good school.....and it's a resource that's desperately needed. West Virginia isn't a great state for education overall...Why not make the D&B school a good resource for the kids who are in really bad towns?

 

[Smithtr]

SEE, Cued Speech, SimCom, TC and PSE are NOT even "language" at all. I wish you stop using them as "language." They are just communication tools, nothing else.

exactly SEE.

PSE is risk on SEE is sign language on pretty deaf/Hoh community, many people risk confuse to understand clear interpreter SEE. language doesn't work .

access commmunication.. Burden Communication hard to risky hard problem your misunderstand stuck. how do you stuck awkward to communication PSE risky. How language aware it limit SEE. that is perceptive. it is very risky on language own your language both grammar, it is pretty difficult!

 

[CSign]

Hi, I'm Christie, Mom of a beautiful Deaf 3 month old. I realize that I'm probably getting way ahead of myself, but in my research I found out that WV School for the Deaf and Blind uses SEE exclusively. I am still learning a lot but understand that there are big differences between SEE and ASL, is this correct? My gut instinct has been that as a family we need to start using ASL to make sure that she has a good form of communication. My question is, are the two languages easily maneuvered between? I want to make sure that she doesn't graduate and find herself unable to communicate or fit in with people who primarily use ASL. Also, any feedback on the school itself would be greatly appreciated. Thank you!

To answer your question, I'd say that depends on the child. I used SEE and Total Communication with my son, and when he got a bit older we made the transition to ASL. He is able to understand both ASL and English with relative ease. He also has great language skills which I attribute to always having access to language. My top two goals for him were that we could communicate effectively, and that he also achieve proficiency in English. Both of those goals I had for my son have been met.

The purpose of SEE is to enable DHH children to attain proficiency in English, assist with speech reading, and in many cases to still provide the child with that auditory input to begin to make sense of the sounds around them. SEE allows for the face to face interaction that is so critical in acquiring language.

Your baby is still young so you have plenty of time to figure out what approach works best for your child. As long as you start to incorporate sign into your daily routine things will work out.

You should research all your options. No one philosophy or mode of communication can be deemed the "best" as all children and their circumstances are unique.

The Bi-Bi philosophy is good, but doesn't necessarily mean the child will become fluent or even proficient in English. The same can be said for other philosophies as well. It really depends on the child, their school, and parental involvement.

Just do your research, and make the choice for your child that will help her get to where you want her to be.

 

[CSign]

My humble opinion would be that the goal of teaching SEE would be so that a child can effectively communicate with others using ENGLISH. With SEE, written and spoken English could be grammatically correct, but it would have no bearing on how well the child can effectively use ASL.

Yes. There is no reason a child cannot become fluent over time with both English/SEE and ASL.

Knowing one language does not hinder the ability to learn another.

 

[ShilohBuchman]

WOW! I had no idea so much had happened in this thread since I posted. Didn't mean to incite a riot! RELAX!!!

I don't believe my original post referred to SEE as a language at all.

I know quite a few deaf people who grew up learning SEE in school. Their written and spoken English skills are excellent. However, they subsequently had to/chose to learn ASL. Just because they could sign using SEE didn't mean they could sign in ASL.

So if a school is teaching using SEE, my humble opinion (I'll say that again since it went over so well the first time), is that they would be doing it for the purpose (their purpose) of helping a child become proficient in understanding English grammar.

 

[Bottesini]

WOW! I had no idea so much had happened in this thread since I posted. Didn't mean to incite a riot! RELAX!!!

I don't believe my original post referred to SEE as a language at all.

I know quite a few deaf people who grew up learning SEE in school. Their written and spoken English skills are excellent. However, they subsequently had to/chose to learn ASL. Just because they could sign using SEE didn't mean they could sign in ASL.

So if a school is teaching using SEE, my humble opinion (I'll say that again since it went over so well the first time), is that they would be doing it for the purpose (their purpose) of helping a child become proficient in understanding English grammar.

Do you have some fantasy that you are here to inform us all, and it has completely escaped our attention the purpose that SEE was invented for?

As for relaxing, we have been fighting the same battles for many years, and will be fighting them long after your interest has waned.

 

[Frisky Feline]

I wish I could learn ASL instead of SEE when I was a kid. SEE put me to sleep.

 

[deafdyke]

You should research all your options. No one philosophy or mode of communication can be deemed the "best" as all children and their circumstances are unique.

The debate seems to be which language should be first, ASL vs English.
I also think that ALL parents need to be openminded and fleixable as to communication. They also need to realize that communication should not be set in stone, and that needs change over time.
For example, I know a family with two Deaf sons, who had them in mainstream, deaf, oral, SEE, bi-bi and so on educational settings.

 

[InsaneMisha]

exactly SEE.

PSE is risk on SEE is sign language on pretty deaf/Hoh community, many people risk confuse to understand clear interpreter SEE. language doesn't work .

access commmunication.. Burden Communication hard to risky hard problem your misunderstand stuck. how do you stuck awkward to communication PSE risky. How language aware it limit SEE. that is perceptive. it is very risky on language own your language both grammar, it is pretty difficult!

Huh?

 

[Jane B.]

The debate seems to be which language should be first, ASL vs English.
I also think that ALL parents need to be openminded and fleixable as to communication. They also need to realize that communication should not be set in stone, and that needs change over time.
For example, I know a family with two Deaf sons, who had them in mainstream, deaf, oral, SEE, bi-bi and so on educational settings.

In this post of yours you included a "quote" for someone but once again left off the name of the poster that you were quoting. Why do you ever do this? It makes a difference to other peoples reaction to the entire post.

 

[shel90]

I wish I could learn ASL instead of SEE when I was a kid. SEE put me to sleep.

 

[MommaC]

I didn't mean to stir anything up. I'm genuinely trying to learn about what would be best for my daughter. I've not been able to find any other deaf people in our area. I don't know asl. I'm watching signing time, learning signs from asl pro and lifeprint, and from early intervention. The school doesn't have any classes until fall. So what I'm worried about is that even though I have a long list of words I can sign, I don't know asl, so I'm signing English. I do believe it is her right to have asl as her first language. I don't know how to make that happen. Our ei teacher is from the school and signs English as well. I appreciate all the help she's giving, but would hate for my kid to have to learn what should have been her first language later. I hope this makes sense... Any help is greatly appreciated.