Why - Why the Medical Society constantly pressure on the Parents?

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jillio said:
SEE is not a language separate in and of itself....SEE is English.
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I agree that SEE is not a language but I do not agree that it is English. People say it is English because they have decided to put English words to the signs. That does not make it English.
 
jillio said:
Back on topic:

Yet another misleading comment by a medical professional pushing for infant implantation:

Dupree wishes parents would wait until the children were old enough to decide for themselves.

However, Dr. John Greinwald, with Cincinnati Children's Hospital, said that by that age it's too late.
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Too late for what? language acquisition or oral skills development?
 
shel90 said:
Too late for what? language acquisition or oral skills development?
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That was my question, as well. Very misleading. What is the hearing parent going to read from that statement. "Your child will not learn to talk if you wait."
 
jillio said:
That was my question, as well. Very misleading. What is the hearing parent going to read from that statement. "Your child will not learn to talk if you wait."
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:eek3::eek3:

That is very misleading!
 
jillio said:
It is still a monolongual program relying on an incomplete access to whole language.
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Cueing can/is used for whole or phonemic teaching/learning. If you wish to confine the system of Cued Speech to English, then it is monoligual. The fact is, Cued Speech has been adapted to be used with 65 different languages.
 
loml said:
Cueing can/is used for whole or phonemic teaching/learning. If you wish to confine the system of Cued Speech to English, then it is monoligual. The fact is, Cued Speech has been adapted to be used with 65 different languages.
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Then it is monolingual in 65 different languages. In the United States, that would be applicable to English. It is used to teach a spoken language.
 
jillio said:
Then it is monolingual in 65 different languages. In the United States, that would be applicable to English. It is used to teach a spoken language.
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Conversing in ASL is also monoligualism.
 
loml said:
Conversing in ASL is also monoligualism.
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Only difference is that ASL users read and write in English making us bilingual.
 
loml said:
Conversing in ASL is also monoligualism.
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Yes it is, if ASL is the only language used. However, there are no ASL monolingual programs of which I am aware. The programs incorporating ASL also incorporate English, thus making them bilingual. Bilingual programs do not limit themselves to one language. I would also challenge you to show me a single person who chooses ASL as their primary means of communication that is not bilingual to some degree. All must have interaction with the hearing community, and therefore, all must use English to some degree, whether it is in spoken form, or written form. Can the same be said of the monolingual oralist?
 
rick48 said:
You are so right Jackie, but that would require them to do something and it is so much easier to sit back do nothing and then complain about what others are doing!
Rick
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It is just so much easier just sit there and complain. For me it makes so much more sense to do something. There is this implant center out here that does not have a complete team and so I am going to make a change. I am going to give up of my time and show the importance of having a complete team instead of complainging about them.
 
shel90 said:
My question is..why is having oral skills more important than the quality of education?


oral skills is not more important then education but it can be done both equally and why would that be a bad thing to be able to be oral and have a great educaiton just like my children, their friends and my students.

I just dont understand how it is ok to put deaf children in an educational environment where they dont have equal access to education as hearing children to. Is that the sake for having good speech skills? :confused:
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What you do not get is that deaf children with the right technology, support, and guidance can have great speech skills and have an amazing education.
 
jackiesolorzano said:
What you do not get is that deaf children with the right technology, support, and guidance can have great speech skills and have an amazing education.
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Read what one person said in your "Respect for all Thread" about dying inside from being raised in the oral-only environment.

The majority of deaf kids dont suceed in the oral-only setting. Even successes like myself, ended up with serious scars and emotional damage. I do not call that a success despite getting good grades and being involved in sports.
 
Yes it is, if ASL is the only language used. However, there are no ASL monolingual programs of which I am aware. The programs incorporating ASL also incorporate English, thus making them bilingual. Bilingual programs do not limit themselves to one language. I would also challenge you to show me a single person who chooses ASL as their primary means of communication that is not bilingual to some degree. All must have interaction with the hearing community, and therefore, all must use English to some degree, whether it is in spoken form, or written form. Can the same be said of the monolingual oralist?
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My post were stating that cueing can be used to learn multiple languages, enpowering people to be multi-lingual.

Having English to "some degree" does not mean the person is bilingual. It means: peu un anglais
 
loml said:
My post were stating that cueing can be used to learn multiple languages, enpowering people to be multi-lingual.

Having English to "some degree" does not mean the person is bilingual. It means: peu un anglais
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That definition of being bilingual needs to change cuz some deaf people arent at fault for being unable to develop oral skills. I still call them bilingual cuz they have an understanding of ASL and English regardless of how they use them.

Hey lolm..check out my thread "A Comprehensive List" it talked about how many people feel that ASL and CS should be used in the educational setting.
 
shel90 said:
Read what one person said in your "Respect for all Thread" about dying inside from being raised in the oral-only environment.

The majority of deaf kids dont suceed in the oral-only setting. Even successes like myself, ended up with serious scars and emotional damage. I do not call that a success despite getting good grades and being involved in sports.
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What I am trying to say is that not all kids are the same and technology has changed and it is OK if you cannot see that.
 
jackiesolorzano said:
What I am trying to say is that not all kids are the same and technology has changed and it is OK if you cannot see that.
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I am still seeing an influx of children coming to our program so language deprived and socially withdrawn...even those who have CIs. History is just repeating itself. U admitted that CIs do not make deaf children hearing so therefore, they dont have access to everything being said in the academic setting just exactly like it was for me growing up. I dont see the difference. I know not all children are the same but there is that risk when putting any deaf children in an environment where they dont have full access to language or access to the curriculm. I dont believe in taking that risk with any child just to see which is successful and which is not successful.

I guess I will just have to accept that these kinds of educational practice is acceptable to many people nad just try to do as much remedial teaching for those who lost out in those programs. I will always see the injustice of that.

No worries Jackie..u did good with your kids. Unfortunately too many school systems out there continue to fail so many deaf kids with giving as minimal support as they can.
 
shel90 said:
That definition of being bilingual needs to change cuz some deaf people arent at fault for being unable to develop oral skills. I still call them bilingual cuz they have an understanding of ASL and English regardless of how they use them.

Hey lolm..check out my thread "A Comprehensive List" it talked about how many people feel that ASL and CS should be used in the educational setting.
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shel90- You do not have to be oral(as in spoken/speech/voice) to be bilingual when you learn English via cueing.
 
shel90 said:
TC uses any mode of communication ASL, SEE, PSE, oral in one classroom (see Deafbajagal"s thread about quitting teaching) while the BiBi doesnt so pls do not say that these programs are the same. We also teach and expose the kids to both hearing and Deaf cultures while TC and oral programs dont.

The kids are learning English too so they are using both languages so they are fluent in two languages.

My view is different....I see oral deaf ed as an environment where deaf children do not have equal access to language as hearing kids or being put at risk for language deprivation which is why we use a language that is fully accessible to all children regardless of their dB loss and that language is ASL. Nobody is missing out on anything that is being discussed in the classrooms and that is the most important thing to me. CIs do not give children full 100% access to spoken language like hearing kids which is why I dont feel the oral-only approach is an appropriate setting for deaf children whether they are implanted or not.

We respect that not all children can develop oral skills but they will never be put at an disadvantage in the educational setting.

Also, so what if the curriculm is taught in ASL...the kids are learning! Nobody is missing out on anything. What I hate is how we get so many older kids who fell so far behind academically due to missing out on what is taught in the oral-only environment. That is just so wrong.
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Still have the same question, how is it a Bi lingual program? Why not just be honest with the parents and call it what it is. An educational program with instruction in ASL and where oral S&L therapy is provided?
Rick
 
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