to believe or not to believe...

[darkangel8603]

I have been going through this stage of practicing religion and that stuff etc, for the last couple of years...

I never know what to think or believe for relgions and stuff. I always question if god do exist or not, and where proof of that. I never understand the whole thing about god and christianty.

I never know what to believe, and what not to believe. My mom's side of family is catholic, and my dad's side don't practice relgion. While i was bapsited when i was a baby, and attended church til i was 9 or 10 years old, although i never listen because of my deafness. I never learn or anything about that stuff.

If god was real, then why didnt he answer my prayers when i asked him for some help in past?

How do we know if the bible is real? what if someone from thousands of years ago just thought it up and wrote it themselve claiming that god wrote it?

In last few years, i never really thought about relgions and christianity etc, i never really believed in god or that kind of stuff. Now i am curious about it and want to know more about it etc.

I feel like i don't know myself, i don't belong anywhere in this world. Just being invisble in a dark hole. I wish i could understand the whole thing and understand myself more relate to these issues.


just raving... heath, i don't wanna hear lectures and try to conform me.

 

[Cheri]

Opps wrong forum.

 

[Momoftwo]

Hi DarkAngel,

Yes, it is very hard to understand about God. I hope you already read my thread "Have you experienced seeing Jesus?" in this section. Before I thought that God was not there. After I experienced seeing Jesus, it changed me totally!!!! Much happier!!! Yes, God is very real. I got more blessings by Him. I have a huge faith in Him. God is very wonderful!! Maybe God has reasons not to give you His answers because maybe He has the reasons for your life. I don't know. He makes the decisions to use some people for a very good reason.

I am telling you that God is real. God loves you very, very much and yes, He heard your prayers but be patient and wait for His answers - maybe tomorrow or maybe next year or maybe 5 years. He has the reasons.

Don't hate God because He loves you very, very much.

 

[Rose Immortal]

Mind if I take a shot at these?

If god was real, then why didnt he answer my prayers when i asked him for some help in past?

There can be a lot of reasons for that. I don't pretend to know God's mind, but these are some things that seem reasonable to me.

Sometimes God has something better in mind for the future--that is, a better solution to the problem than the one you may have in mind or think is the best. Or that solution may come later than when you wanted or expected it. Other times, you may not connect the response that occurs with the original prayer. And sometimes (and this is the toughest pill for me to swallow, anyway) it seems like God denies an answer to a prayer out of "tough love". Consider a horseshoe or sword or something being forged. It has to be beaten, melted, and all of that--but what comes out is stronger and more useful than before. In other words, sometimes the bad experiences refine us even though they're really terrible.

I know that might sound like platitudes, but that's the best I can do so far. Others may be better equipped to answer.

How do we know if the bible is real? what if someone from thousands of years ago just thought it up and wrote it themselve claiming that god wrote it?

You might be interested to know that the Bible is actually one of the best sources of historical information we have about the Middle East in that time period. There's a lot of corroborating archaeological evidence.

Another interesting thing to you might be that the novel as a literary form did not exist back then; Don Quixote was the first in Europe, and it is just slightly pre-dated by a novel in Japan. Both are well over 1000 years newer than the Bible. Creative works generally occurred in poetic form or as plays back then--you didn't see the kind of historical fiction that was made to appear almost indistinguishable with actual events back then. Literature simply hadn't advanced that far as an art yet.

Now, not all of the things in the Bible can be backed up through archaeology and related sciences. Other things are matters of the heart and spirit, and also more philosophical. Please tell me if you're interested, and if you are, I can make a book recommendation for you that I found useful myself, for those issues.

I feel like i don't know myself, i don't belong anywhere in this world. Just being invisble in a dark hole. I wish i could understand the whole thing and understand myself more relate to these issues.

I know there's not a lot I can do from where I am, but the first thing to understand is pretty simple: that you were created specially and lovingly.

 

[Cheri]

Hi DarkAngel,

Talk about prayers, You cannot just pray to God on something you need help with only, You gotta have faith, grace and patience. Pray for forgiveness in yourself and others. If you pray daily, You'll get answers that you are looking for but on God's time not on your time. God does hear your prayers and everyone else's as well.

And about believing God exit, God already revealed himself as mankind, the holy spirits, He is Jesus Christ the one who went through all the pains for all of us sinners. If you read the bible, It would give you impression of God, and Who is God. Think about this, How did we get on earth? God made all mankinds even you and me, That's how Adam and Eve were formed from dust of the ground, God breathe life into it, He designed in his own image. Now, if people have doubts about God, ask yourself one question, where did you really came from? Where did everyone else came from?

Now, Some people would say, How come we haven't met Jesus or God ourselves? Long time ago people have witness Jesus and God, did anyone followed? Not everyone. So what make you think we will follow Jesus/God if we saw them? It's all about faith, If you have faith that Jesus is real and believing him because the bible says so then you'll shall have eternal life.

It's all in your hands, your heart and mind. You make the choice, either you believe or you don't believe.

 

[pek1]

darkangel8603,

Not sure if this is allowed, will take a chance. I will refer you to another website, if that's okay with you, to get those questions answered. Click on http://www.crosswalk.com and to a forum, http://forums.crosswalk.com/God/forumid_51/tt.htm

I would also suggest you contact the forum administrator, his name is Fred Alberti (I believe that's his last name) at, fritz@salemwebnetwork.com

Feel free to tell him that pek1 sent you, as he knows who I am.

Blessings to you, my friend. If you want to pm me instead, feel free to do so. I've been in the Christian ministry for 18 years and I can help you if you'd like.

 

[Beowulf]

Someone actually said to me today, "Thank God I am an atheist."
Believe it or not.

 

[Endymion]

it is just slightly pre-dated by a novel in Japan.

Is this Japanese novel you speak of Lady Murasaki Shikibu's Tale of the Genji?

On a literary (and not theological) level, I wonder if texts similar to the Bible in complexity and format significantly preceded Don Quixote de la Mancha. I say this because I don't think the bible is in a "novel" form.

When looking at Hammurabi's Code of Laws came out in the 18th century, it had a profound impact on its time. Reading it, I see that there are certainly similarities between its structure and the Bible's. There are differences as well, I will certainly agree. The similarities (and differences) between Hammurabi's code and the Bible makes me wonder if the format of the Bible was already in common usage when it came out. I am by no means an authority on the subject, I should add.

Tangentially (and because I find odd things amusing), I also find it very ironic that Augustine of Hippo's City of God Against the Pagans has been credited for the separation of church and state that existed in Western Europe during the middle ages and onwards.

 

[Rose Immortal]

Yep, that's the novel I was thinking of! I was a bit too lazy to look it up, so thanks.

What I mean by the "novel" aspect of the Bible is that the parts of it that give the accounts of Christ's life, as well as other historical sections like the Pentateuch are written in straight prose in the way one reported actual news back then. Works of fiction generally weren't written in that prosaic, news-account-like way back then, the way you sometimes see them now. I've heard it said that Luke wrote VERY much in the style used by historians in his day rather than a style you'd see in the fiction-writers back then. I believe he was the author of both the Gospel of Luke and the Book of Acts. I also don't recall any instances in ancient literature of the epistle (letter) format being used in fiction. I can't back that up yet with my own research because I don't know enough Greek of the time to know the difference, but from what I HAVE seen of older fiction works and older historical/philosophical works, I think there may be something to it.

It's interesting to note that the Code of Hammurabi is a NONfiction work as opposed to a fiction work...which again makes the Bible fall, from a literary standpoint, on the non-fiction side of the fence as far as the way it was written. But my point is that back then, people didn't use forms like THAT for fiction.

 

[VamPyroX]

Hi DarkAngel,

Yes, it is very hard to understand about God. I hope you already read my thread "Have you experienced seeing Jesus?" in this section. Before I thought that God was not there. After I experienced seeing Jesus, it changed me totally!!!! Much happier!!! Yes, God is very real. I got more blessings by Him. I have a huge faith in Him. God is very wonderful!! Maybe God has reasons not to give you His answers because maybe He has the reasons for your life. I don't know. He makes the decisions to use some people for a very good reason.

I am telling you that God is real. God loves you very, very much and yes, He heard your prayers but be patient and wait for His answers - maybe tomorrow or maybe next year or maybe 5 years. He has the reasons.

Don't hate God because He loves you very, very much.

We can look at this two ways...

We can hate God because of what he does that doesn't make us happy.

OR

What's the point of hating God if God doesn't exist?

 

[VamPyroX]

Someone actually said to me today, "Thank God I am an atheist."
Believe it or not.

I never thought of that. Hehehe!

 

[Endymion]

Yep, that's the novel I was thinking of! I was a bit too lazy to look it up, so thanks.

What I mean by the "novel" aspect of the Bible is that the parts of it that give the accounts of Christ's life, as well as other historical sections like the Pentateuch are written in straight prose in the way one reported actual news back then. Works of fiction generally weren't written in that prosaic, news-account-like way back then, the way you sometimes see them now. I've heard it said that Luke wrote VERY much in the style used by historians in his day rather than a style you'd see in the fiction-writers back then. I believe he was the author of both the Gospel of Luke and the Book of Acts. I also don't recall any instances in ancient literature of the epistle (letter) format being used in fiction. I can't back that up yet with my own research because I don't know enough Greek of the time to know the difference, but from what I HAVE seen of older fiction works and older historical/philosophical works, I think there may be something to it.

It's interesting to note that the Code of Hammurabi is a NONfiction work as opposed to a fiction work...which again makes the Bible fall, from a literary standpoint, on the non-fiction side of the fence as far as the way it was written. But my point is that back then, people didn't use forms like THAT for fiction.

Lol. You're welcome! Literature is an old passion of mine, just along with history, art, cuisine, wine, and snowboarding. That snowboarding one is the big one.

I see your point. Makes sense. I definitely cannot think of an example of epistolary fiction preceding authorship of the Gospel of Luke. Wasn't it written around 80-130 AD?

I would love to repeat what I vaguely recalling hearing and cite the Tain Bo Cuailnge and relate it to Luke, but unfortunately we're starting to get outside of my familiarity with Luke. Lest I shoot myself in my foot, I shall have to read more his gospel.

 

[Rose Immortal]

I'm not entirely sure. Some stuff in the New Testament was written around that time, but others may have been a bit older. I bet you'd also not find epistolary fiction until quite a bit later than Luke. In fact, I'd be willing to bet (though I could very easily be wrong) that the first instance is somewhere in the 19th century, maybe 18th at the very earliest. So basically, it would've been a MAJOR innovation that was done once and forgotten for 1800 years if the epistles were fiction.

 

[Askjo]

I always question if god do exist or not, and where proof of that.

Why did you doubt about God? Look at your quotation, "I always question if god exist or not,.." The word, "question" means that you doubt God because of the definition of question.

If god was real, then why didnt he answer my prayers when i asked him for some help in past?

Well, there are 3 things that prevent God's answer to your prayer.

1. You amiss Him.
2. You have no Jesus in your heart.
3. You hold any sins in your life.

How do we know if the bible is real? what if someone from thousands of years ago just thought it up and wrote it themselve claiming that god wrote it?

The Bible claims the inspiration. Therefore the Bible is here because the Bible is the LIVING word that God spoke to you.

In last few years, i never really thought about relgions and christianity etc, i never really believed in god or that kind of stuff. Now i am curious about it and want to know more about it etc.

I see, you STILL search Him. Why do you doubt Him? If you search Him, PLEASE find Him right now before too late.

 

[Askjo]

Someone actually said to me today, "Thank God I am an atheist."
Believe it or not.

That is a simple lie because this atheist knows there is a real God, but rejects Him. When this atheist uses the word, "God," he is a real liar because he knows the existence of God. That is why he SPOKE about Him.

 

[Askjo]

Talk about prayers, You cannot just pray to God on something you need help with only,

Can't God help you by saving your soul? Can't God help you by loving you? Can't God help you by answering your prayer? Keep in mind that you CANNOT sit and wait until God help you after your prayer answered. You MUST move on then God helps you.

My testimony was incredible. When I have someone out of the USA, who need to get saved, I prayed God for helping me to find something for 2 girls. In the morning God commanded me to go to the store. I got up and clothed myself then went straight to that store WITHOUT breakfast. I arrived at that store and entered in it then I stood and waited. I listened to God. He told me to go to the south left corner, then I walked toward to that area. I was in wrong aisle and stood firmly. I listened to God again. He told me to go back to east aisle and I did. I looked around this aisle because I look for a address of the church. God told me to stand firmly then I did. I listened God finally then God told me to look at my shoes. I looked down at them and FOUND a book that has address. I wrote it down. and carried it home. I wrote a letter to the church in the location where someone reside. A month later I received a letter from that church. I opened it and read it. I was extremely joy to learn that 2 girls GOT SAVED!!!!

My other tesimony was also incredible. I was lonely for many years because most deaf girls HATED me and hurted me by mocking me. Most hearing girls are reluctant to date with me. I prayed for God to help me to find a right girl. God told me to go to a city bus. I went to city bus and found a woman. We have been married for 20 years and over.

What do you think of God possibly helping His people when they prayed to God?

 

[apathrev]

That is a simple lie because this atheist knows there is a real God, but rejects Him. When this atheist uses the word, "God," he is a real liar because he knows the existence of God. That is why he SPOKE about Him.

That's why its called a joke.

 

[pek1]

1. You amiss Him.
2. You have no Jesus in your heart.
3. You hold any sins in your life.

With all due respect, Askjo, SPEAK ENGLISH AND NOT CHRISTIANESE.

 

[VamPyroX]

That's why its called a joke.

It's what you call an oxymoron. You say something that has two contradicting sides.

 

[chirowife03]

You said : just raving... heath, i don't wanna hear lectures and try to conform me.
__________________


I think that you DO want someone to talk to you about this or you would not have even posted such an intimate concern for your spirituality and about diety. So with that.....I will put my two cents in. First...it is normal for one to seek out God in these days. We are in a world full of confusion. There are so many lies and so many contradictions it can be so confusing. What does one beleive? I DO know becuase I was there once. I was raised baptist. My dad was catholic and noone lived anything they claimed to beleive. It was like church was twice a year and that was it. We walk out of church and smoke and drink on the way home. We did what we wanted and noone took a second thought to God until something bad happened. Then we were all over that praying and calling out his name. What is that scripture- "not everyone who says Lord Lord will enter the Kingdom of Heaven"? I get it now.

It is interesting how people feel after him when things are hard but when things are great.......they so easily forget him.

There is truth on this earth Heath. I am here to tell you. There IS truth. I found it, I know it to be true. The Lord does live. You are his son. He totally is aware of you and your concerns and your desires to know more. You just need to ask him. James 1:5 is a great place to start.

I highly recommend and challenge you to read the book of mormon. It is another testiment of Jesus Christ. Its a companion to the Bible. (you can find it by calling the LDS church missionaries) It is written for us in the Latter days. Written by Prophets just like the bible. Many have said to me, "its so like the bible".. its becuase it has the same author. It is inspired by God like the bible. You will find many plain and precious truths in the Book of Mormon. Like proper baptism, proper preisthood authority, prayer, how to pray, how to recognize real answers, heaven, temples, eternal marriage, pre existance, and signs for the second coming. I promise you that if you read this book and you are prayerful about it.. asking god in faith to find out if its true and that church is true.....(the church of jesus christ of latter day saints) you WILL be answered. Just know that when you find out, it will change your life. You will know if you really want to know. He will answer you.

I testify to you in the name of his son.

Penni