The Death Penalty

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The U.S. vs. the world in the death penalty debate

The U.S. is one of very, very few western nations that still engage in state-sponsored killing. The rest of the western world sees the death penalty as barbaric, which it is.

It is also illogical: Why do we kill people who kill people to show that killing people is wrong?

And it is unethical. Amnesty International calls the death penalty "the ultimate cruel, inhuman, and degrading punishment." And most major religious denominations in the United States are opposed to the death penalty.

Some people believe that the death penalty serves as a deterrent to crime, but that theory doesn't hold up under careful scrutiny.

And then there's the risk of executing an innocent person. Since the first DNA exoneration took place in the U.S. in 1989, 208 people have been freed via DNA evidence after being wrongfully convicted of crimes they did not commit. Many more have been exonerated via other kinds of late-coming evidence.

Some of those innocent people were freed from death row. These folks are the "lucky" ones, because they had a chance to prove their innocence before they were put to death. How many others have not been so lucky? We cannot know. But do we really want to risk that kind of mistake?

Furthermore, the American Bar Association recently described the legal process leading to executions as "deeply flawed". Studies in Pennsylvania, Ohio, and elsewhere have shown that the death penalty is applied in a discriminatory, arbitrary, and uneven manner, and is used disproportionately against racial minorities and the poor. For example, a 1998 study of death sentences in Philadelphia found that African-American defendants were almost four times more likely to receive the death penalty than were people of other ethnic origins who committed similar crimes. That's not what I would call justice.

And these are just a few of the many good reasons to go instead with a sentence of life in prison without parole. Like the rest of the civilized world.

So, on November 15, a human rights committee of the United Nations General Assembly passed a resolution calling for a global "moratorium on executions with a view toward abolishing the death penalty."

The vote was 99 in favor and 53 against, with 33 abstentions.

Want to guess who voted against the resolution? Yep, the good ol' United States of America, along with Afghanistan, China, North Korea, Saudi Arabia, Zimbabwe, and a handful of other countries known for their systematic violations of human rights.

What do they say about the company you keep?

The U.S. vs. the world in the death penalty debate | The Smirking Chimp

 

[Byrdie714]

Not true.

There are many victim families who do not seek revenge, and yet are relieved when the criminal is executed. It definitely relieves them of the agony of repeated appeal and parole hearings, and the fear of reprisal. They no longer have to read in the papers the words, or see on TV the face the killer while he's being interviewed by a sympathetic reporter.

I don't know where some of you get this image of revenge-thirsty victims. It is entirely possible and probable for victim families to want justice without wanting revenge.

It's terrible when people are wrongly convicted. But it's even more terrible that victims are not getting the support and justice that they deserve.

Can you prove us some links to support your claim because I didn't find it...?

All what I found a lot from google that many victim families see different what you claim here and oppose death penalty for many reasons.


Question: Would Justice system respect or fulfill victim's families's wish for not want to sentence criminal to death but life sentence or follow justice system to ignore victim's families's wishes?

You can ask me.

I used to be a supporter of anti-capital punishment until my daughter was murdered and now, I'm pro-death penalty due to the reasons that Reba stated in her post.

I have to live with the fact that her kliller is still alive and is eligible for parole. I have to give up a part of my time to travel to the parole board hearings to make sure that the killer doesn't walk free.

Is this the justice one wants when they have a loved one that was murdered?

 

[Cheri]

I'm with you, Byrdie714 But, some people here just do not understand because they have not lost a family member to murder.

 

[jillio]

Is that one movie "Cries Unheard: The Donna Yaklich Story (1994)", you refer to?

Cries Unheard: The Donna Yaklich Story Review - TV Show Reviews - Analysis Of Cries Unheard: The Donna Yaklich Story The TV Series

Very sad and true movie. I saw it on TV few years ago...

Donna met Police Officer Dennis and fall in love each other. They married and produced together a child. (Dennis already had a daughter from his previous marriage). After marriage, Dennis depend on heavyweight and took steriod drugs, etc. - it turn him into aggressive person and abuse his wife a lot. She cries for help but nobody listen her... he threaten her and destory her self-esteem... She can't take it anymore and desire to kill him but she can't so she paid a young farmer or hunter to shot him for her. Many witnesses described him as good person and police officer to against other witnesses (on her side)... etc. etc. The juries voted guilty and label her as a murder. They sent her to 40 years to life sentence. Her son visited to her time to time... He is a lawyer but none of lawyer can help to get her out of jail... She said she wish to do something different instead of got someone to shot him for her... She thought court would see the reason and give her free but it's not what she thought... I can image what if they sentence her to death if there're law in her state... which is a scary...


Yes I agree with you about repeat that behavior... Nobody repeat that behavior like this... Some people lost their mind and then next day, they doesn't intend to kill them but that's just happened...

I don't know that movie, but I'll have to see if I can find it. I was just making up a "what if" situation.

 

[Oceanbreeze]

I'm with you, Byrdie714 But, some people here just do not understand because they have not lost a family member to murder.

Actually, Cheri. You're wrong. My biological grandfather was raped and murdered back in 1985, when I was just a teenager. The killer was convicted and sentenced to death. He is still on death row awaiting his sentence be carried out.

I am still very conflicted about the death penalty, even though my grandfather was murdered. Why? Because the system is flawed. There is a chance that the killer will have his sentence commuted to life in prison. Do you have any idea of the torment my family has gone through since my grandfather was murdered?

There is no justice. My grandfather was a wonderful man according to those who knew him.I did not (long story and no need to go into it). It really doesn't matter what happens to the killer, because it still won't bring my grandfather back.

I sit on the fence of this debate. I can see points on both sides and I agree with many. I question the use of the death penalty as it exists. If we're going to use it, the system needs to be revamped. My family should NOT have had to wait 20+ years to see the murderer punished.

 

[jillio]

Actually, Cheri. You're wrong. My biological grandfather was raped and murdered back in 1985, when I was just a teenager. The killer was convicted and sentenced to death. He is still on death row awaiting his sentence be carried out.

I am still very conflicted about the death penalty, even though my grandfather was murdered. Why? Because the system is flawed. There is a chance that the killer will have his sentence commuted to life in prison. Do you have any idea of the torment my family has gone through since my grandfather was murdered?

There is no justice. My grandfather was a wonderful man according to those who knew him.I did not (long story and no need to go into it). It really doesn't matter what happens to the killer, because it still won't bring my grandfather back.

I sit on the fence of this debate. I can see points on both sides and I agree with many. I question the use of the death penalty as it exists. If we're going to use it, the system needs to be revamped. My family should NOT have had to wait 20+ years to see the murderer punished.

 

[Oceanbreeze]

Thank you. I used to be staunchly for the death penalty. I have not completely changed my mind about it, but I question it's use as it currently exists in this country.

 

[Byrdie714]

Actually, Cheri. You're wrong. My biological grandfather was raped and murdered back in 1985, when I was just a teenager. The killer was convicted and sentenced to death. He is still on death row awaiting his sentence be carried out.

I am still very conflicted about the death penalty, even though my grandfather was murdered. Why? Because the system is flawed. There is a chance that the killer will have his sentence commuted to life in prison. Do you have any idea of the torment my family has gone through since my grandfather was murdered?

There is no justice. My grandfather was a wonderful man according to those who knew him.I did not (long story and no need to go into it). It really doesn't matter what happens to the killer, because it still won't bring my grandfather back.

I sit on the fence of this debate. I can see points on both sides and I agree with many. I question the use of the death penalty as it exists. If we're going to use it, the system needs to be revamped. My family should NOT have had to wait 20+ years to see the murderer punished.

If the person admits to killing your grandfather and shows no remorse, you still wouldn't want justice for your grandfather? Knowing that you will never see him again, go fishing with him, listening to him tell stories, etc, etc.

As for my situation, my daughter was only 6 and I will never be able to watch her grow up or give her away at her wedding, etc, etc. She was and is my only child and I can't have children anymore due to a health situation. So...I want justice done for her.

I want her killer....executed.

 

[Oceanbreeze]

If the person admits to killing your grandfather and shows no remorse, you still wouldn't want justice for your grandfather? Knowing that you will never see him again, go fishing with him, listening to him tell stories, etc, etc.

As for my situation, my daughter was only 6 and I will never be able to watch her grow up or give her away at her wedding, etc, etc. She was and is my only child and I can't have children anymore due to a health situation. So...I want justice done for her.

I want her killer....executed.

I'm not going to speak anymore about my grandfather or the details of what happened to him. I only put some of the details out here to demonstrate that our system is flawed. IT IS!!!! It shouldn't take two decades or more to carry out an execution, but in alot of states it does.

In order for me to support the death penalty wholeheartedly again, the system has to be revamped.

 

[Byrdie714]

I'm not going to speak anymore about my grandfather or the details of what happened to him. I only put some of the details out here to demonstrate that our system is flawed. IT IS!!!! It shouldn't take two decades or more to carry out an execution, but in alot of states it does.

In order for me to support the death penalty wholeheartedly again, the system has to be revamped.

No offense but I don't want to know the details and you don't have to divulge.

I just asked....

If the person admits to killing your grandfather and shows no remorse, you still wouldn't want justice for your grandfather?

A simple, 'yes' or 'no' is sufficient.

 

[jillio]

I'm not going to speak anymore about my grandfather or the details of what happened to him. I only put some of the details out here to demonstrate that our system is flawed. IT IS!!!! It shouldn't take two decades or more to carry out an execution, but in alot of states it does.

In order for me to support the death penalty wholeheartedly again, the system has to be revamped.

I couldn't agree with you more, Oceanbreeze. The details of individual cases only serve to cloud the bigger issue.

I will not pretend to understand what it is to loose a family member through a violent death such as murder. I have not experienced that; however, I do have great empathy for those that have. It would only be natural to want to transfer the suffering that one endures as a result onto what is perceived as the cause of that suffering. However, the desire to make another feel the pain that we are experiencing, no matter how normal or how understandable, is still, by all definition, a desire for revenge. We want to impose on another the pain that we are experiencing with the mistaken belief that we will be relieved of our pain by imposing it on someone else. Does it work? Decidedly not. Our loved one is not returned to us. The situation is not changed. It does not take us back in time, and reverse the situation. It simply compounds it.

We tell our children, on a daliy basis, that if someone treats you unfairly, or badly, it is not appropriate or justifiable, to act the same way. "Be the bigger person", we tell them. "Take the high road." "Do not bring yourself down to their level." And then we turn around and support the idea that it is perfectly acceptable to kill in retaliation for killing. That is contradiction and hypocracy.

And the simple fact remains that our system is flawed. Until we can be absolutely, 100% sure of guilt in any situation; and our system proves that it is subject to human error; we cannot be certain that we have not executed in error.

 

[Oceanbreeze]

I couldn't agree with you more, Oceanbreeze. The details of individual cases only serve to cloud the bigger issue.

I will not pretend to understand what it is to loose a family member through a violent death such as murder. I have not experienced that; however, I do have great empathy for those that have. It would only be natural to want to transfer the suffering that one endures as a result onto what is perceived as the cause of that suffering. However, the desire to make another feel the pain that we are experiencing, no matter how normal or how understandable, is still, by all definition, a desire for revenge. We want to impose on another the pain that we are experiencing with the mistaken belief that we will be relieved of our pain by imposing it on someone else. Does it work? Decidedly not. Our loved one is not returned to us. The situation is not changed. It does not take us back in time, and reverse the situation. It simply compounds it.

We tell our children, on a daliy basis, that if someone treats you unfairly, or badly, it is not appropriate or justifiable, to act the same way. "Be the bigger person", we tell them. "Take the high road." "Do not bring yourself down to their level." And then we turn around and support the idea that it is perfectly acceptable to kill in retaliation for killing. That is contradiction and hypocracy.

And the simple fact remains that our system is flawed. Until we can be absolutely, 100% sure of guilt in any situation; and our system proves that it is subject to human error; we cannot be certain that we have not executed in error.

And, yet...I wonder, because, I ALSO don't ever want to see my grandfather's killer ever free again. The details of my grandfather's death are gruesome. It's so heinous that my Mother STILL hasn't told me *everything* about it. I know he was killed. I know how. I know he was abused before he was killed, but I told my Mother that there are just some things I DO NOT want to know, so she hasn't told me.

I am starting to believe that the questions I have about the death penalty will never be answered, because I don't think anyone will be brave enough to call a halt to executions, so they can examine all that is wrong the process.

 

[Oceanbreeze]

No offense but I don't want to know the details and you don't have to divulge.

I just asked....

If the person admits to killing your grandfather and shows no remorse, you still wouldn't want justice for your grandfather?

A simple, 'yes' or 'no' is sufficient.

And, I'm choosing not to answer, because that's an inflamatory question.

 

[shel90]

I couldn't agree with you more, Oceanbreeze. The details of individual cases only serve to cloud the bigger issue.

I will not pretend to understand what it is to loose a family member through a violent death such as murder. I have not experienced that; however, I do have great empathy for those that have. It would only be natural to want to transfer the suffering that one endures as a result onto what is perceived as the cause of that suffering. However, the desire to make another feel the pain that we are experiencing, no matter how normal or how understandable, is still, by all definition, a desire for revenge. We want to impose on another the pain that we are experiencing with the mistaken belief that we will be relieved of our pain by imposing it on someone else. Does it work? Decidedly not. Our loved one is not returned to us. The situation is not changed. It does not take us back in time, and reverse the situation. It simply compounds it.

We tell our children, on a daliy basis, that if someone treats you unfairly, or badly, it is not appropriate or justifiable, to act the same way. "Be the bigger person", we tell them. "Take the high road." "Do not bring yourself down to their level." And then we turn around and support the idea that it is perfectly acceptable to kill in retaliation for killing. That is contradiction and hypocracy.

And the simple fact remains that our system is flawed. Until we can be absolutely, 100% sure of guilt in any situation; and our system proves that it is subject to human error; we cannot be certain that we have not executed in error.

Jillo, I can see your points but my issue is that while the killer or killers are in jail, there is a chance for parole or chance for escape. That idea alone is frightening enough and for the victims' families, that has to be torment. I am basing my opinions on from what my mom and her family has shared what little info on how they feel about what happened to my mom's cousin. No, I dont know what it is like to lose someone to violent crimes but I think if I lost someone to a violent crime, I would want that person dead for several reasons. One being that this person would never ever commit another crime against another family.

 

[Byrdie714]

Suppose it was you that was murdered and your friends and family are like..."Let the killer serve his/her time and they can be paroled" and/or "No death penalty for this person."

If you were brutally murdered, wouldn't you want your loved ones seek justice for you?

I will not pretend to understand what it is to loose a family member through a violent death such as murder. I have not experienced that; however, I do have great empathy for those that have. It would only be natural to want to transfer the suffering that one endures as a result onto what is perceived as the cause of that suffering. However, the desire to make another feel the pain that we are experiencing, no matter how normal or how understandable, is still, by all definition, a desire for revenge. We want to impose on another the pain that we are experiencing with the mistaken belief that we will be relieved of our pain by imposing it on someone else. Does it work? Decidedly not. Our loved one is not returned to us. The situation is not changed. It does not take us back in time, and reverse the situation. It simply compounds it.

If I wanted "revenge" -- I could've killed the person myself. Instead I chose, "justice" for my daughter's murder.

There is a difference between the two.

 

[shel90]

Suppose it was you that was murdered and your friends and family are like..."Let the killer serve his/her time and they can be paroled" and/or "No death penalty for this person."

If you were brutally murdered, wouldn't you want your loved ones seek justice for you?



If I wanted "revenge" -- I could've killed the person myself. Instead I chose, "justice" for my daughter's murder.

There is a difference between the two.

I am sorry about your daughter. I am at loss for words.

Yea, revenge would be taking the law into one's hands.

 

[Cheri]

If I wanted "revenge" -- I could've killed the person myself. Instead I chose, "justice" for my daughter's murder.

There is a difference between the two.

Right. Do you remember the movie, "A Time to Kill" where 10-year-old girl named Tonya was violently rape and beaten, and her father killed the two guys who did this to his daughter? He did it out of revenge, it's not that I blamed him, because I don't, he just didn't want those two men to walk out free, and you don't either, nobody does.

 

[jillio]

Suppose it was you that was murdered and your friends and family are like..."Let the killer serve his/her time and they can be paroled" and/or "No death penalty for this person."

If you were brutally murdered, wouldn't you want your loved ones seek justice for you?



If I wanted "revenge" -- I could've killed the person myself. Instead I chose, "justice" for my daughter's murder.

There is a difference between the two.

Yes, you could have, and opened yorself up for his family to take the same kind of revenge against you. Instead, the state does the killing.

 

[jillio]

Jillo, I can see your points but my issue is that while the killer or killers are in jail, there is a chance for parole or chance for escape. That idea alone is frightening enough and for the victims' families, that has to be torment. I am basing my opinions on from what my mom and her family has shared what little info on how they feel about what happened to my mom's cousin. No, I dont know what it is like to lose someone to violent crimes but I think if I lost someone to a violent crime, I would want that person dead for several reasons. One being that this person would never ever commit another crime against another family.

But that's my point. Our penal system is intended to punish the behavior of the individual, not dole out justice based on our emotional needs. That isn't to say that I don't empathize with the victims, because I do. And I understand the validity of their feelings. But if we allow emotion to make these decisions, we loose all objectivity. That is why a criminal is tried in front of a judge....an objective party. And why jurors can't know the parties participating in the trial. It would skew their objectivity in making a decision.

 

[shel90]

But that's my point. Our penal system is intended to punish the behavior of the individual, not dole out justice based on our emotional needs. That isn't to say that I don't empathize with the victims, because I do. And I understand the validity of their feelings. But if we allow emotion to make these decisions, we loose all objectivity. That is why a criminal is tried in front of a judge....an objective party. And why jurors can't know the parties participating in the trial. It would skew their objectivity in making a decision.

That's kinda hard in some cases..the OJ Simpson case is a perfect example, for one.