Survey of Bi-Bi programs - Empirical Article

[Cheri]

That's pretty much all I could find, at least if you want to provide something of the year of 2000-2008 Go ahead.

yea there you go.. just to show you how it was less understood at that time.

Some of us still don't know that program as well as of today. You think u know so much about bi- bi then take the floor and educated me.

 

[Jiro]

That's pretty much all I could find, at least if you want to provide something of the year of 2000-2008 Go ahead.

Some of us still don't know that program as well as of today. You think u know so much about bi- bi then take the floor and educated me.

lol i'm just saying it's better to provide studies about deaf education from year of 2000 or so. 1990's studies are just simply too outdated and so much has changed... in terms of awareness, technology, new understanding, etc. No doubt that we're so much better off than deaf people in 1990's.

 

[Oceanbreeze]

Pay attention, I said "speech" "speech" "speech". Then tell me why were the deaf children didn't speak? why were they mute?? there's a reason for it, everything has a reason. If you think you know why, you tell me.

It has alot to do with the L1 language. If you don't have acces to your L1 language, you're not going to be able to learn a second language. Children who are mute either couldn't hear enough using their residual hearing to aquire spoken language, OR they didn't have access to sign language during the critical period where a child aquires language (birth thru age 3).

 

[deafskeptic]

It has alot to do with the L1 language. If you don't have acces to your L1 language, you're not going to be able to learn a second language. Children who are mute either couldn't hear enough using their residual hearing to aquire spoken language, OR they didn't have access to sign language during the critical period where a child aquires language (birth thru age 3).

Exactly. I play WoW (World of Warcraft) as a hobby and I remember one deaf man who said that when he first began playing games like Everquest, his English was so bad that people thought he was 10 years old in real life. However, as his English improved, he didn't get mistaken for a 10 years old anymore. As soon as he said that, I knew at once that he's likely to have ASL as a first language because his English is nearly faultless. People with language delays usually don't master English as well as he did. As it turns out, he's fourth generation deaf.

 

[Cheri]

It has alot to do with the L1 language. If you don't have acces to your L1 language, you're not going to be able to learn a second language. Children who are mute either couldn't hear enough using their residual hearing to aquire spoken language, OR they didn't have access to sign language during the critical period where a child aquires language (birth thru age 3).

ASL been invented first before spoken language So yeah they had signs back then. The debate of signed communication versus spoken language was during 1880 to 1990. Many of those children were mute before the 1880 and during the 1800-1990.

 

[Bottesini]

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Hi, Cloggy!

 

[flip]

A majority of us know that if one do a survey among deaf adults what they missed during their years at school, we will get the reciept on "bi-bi" education.

Why not call it "deaf school", like "french school". Why are we making this so complicated? Like bi-bi this and oral that. Hearing people sure have their way to argue, with stats and findings that get them nowhere. I mean, just shut up and listen to deaf people?

 

[Jiro]

ASL been invented first before spoken language So yeah they had signs back then. The debate of signed communication versus spoken language was during 1880 to 1990. Many of those children were mute before the 1880 and during the 1800-1990.

even before 1800 and during 1800-1990.... the stigma was still same. the taboo was still same. they were treated the same - invalid. useless. ignored. dumb. Thanks God America (and other well-developed nations) are much more understanding to disabled people than under-developed/developing countries (which was what we used to be).

 

[Tousi]

Cheri, what do you mean "ASL been invented first before spoken language"...."?

If you mean exactly that, I don't think that's true.

 

[Oceanbreeze]

ASL been invented first before spoken language So yeah they had signs back then. The debate of signed communication versus spoken language was during 1880 to 1990. Many of those children were mute before the 1880 and during the 1800-1990.

It doesn't matter, Cheri. You're not understanding that in order to aquire a language, ANY language, you have to have access to it. If a child doesn't have access to a visual language during the period of language acquisition, they will have trouble learning both ASL AND English.

 

[Tousi]

And speech training is offered to those deemed capable of benefiting from it. Wow, then you have someone who will have everything! :P

 

[shel90]

lol i'm just saying it's better to provide studies about deaf education from year of 2000 or so. 1990's studies are just simply too outdated and so much has changed... in terms of awareness, technology, new understanding, etc. No doubt that we're so much better off than deaf people in 1990's.

Yes, too outdated..we know so much more about the Bibi approach in 2008 than we did in 1990.

 

[shel90]

It doesn't matter, Cheri. You're not understanding that in order to aquire a language, ANY language, you have to have access to it. If a child doesn't have access to a visual language during the period of language acquisition, they will have trouble learning both ASL AND English.

My point..speech has nothing to do with it. It is not about speech skills vs. language skills

 

[Cheri]

Cheri, what do you mean "ASL been invented first before spoken language"...."?

If you mean exactly that, I don't think that's true.

The actual history of American Sign Language was traced back 1800 with Dr. Thomas Hopkins Gallaudet I believe I wasn't seeing spoken speech until much later, they thought deaf children were uncapble of learning and be educated.

 

[shel90]

Pay attention, I said "speech" "speech" "speech". Then tell me why were the deaf children didn't speak? why were they mute?? there's a reason for it, everything has a reason. If you think you know why, you tell me.

If speech is your primary focus over language acquisition, then that's clear as a bell to why u put so much importance over speech. I put language acquisition and literacy skills as the primary focus. Without them, the deaf child will struggle later on in life with literacy skills and put at risk for becoming illiterate.

 

[shel90]

A majority of us know that if one do a survey among deaf adults what they missed during their years at school, we will get the reciept on "bi-bi" education.

Why not call it "deaf school", like "french school". Why are we making this so complicated? Like bi-bi this and oral that. Hearing people sure have their way to argue, with stats and findings that get them nowhere. I mean, just shut up and listen to deaf people?

LOL! That is what seems to be happening in South Brazil..the policity makers in education are starting to listen to deaf people when setting policies in Deaf education.

 

[shel90]

The actual history of American Sign Language was traced back 1800 with Dr. Thomas Hopkins Gallaudet I believe I wasn't seeing spoken speech until much later, they thought deaf children were uncapble of learning and be educated.

Thank god for Gallaudet...he believed in these children and he gave all of them the opportunity to be educated.

 

[Cheri]

If speech is your primary focus over language acquisition, then that's clear as a bell to why u put so much importance over speech. I put language acquisition and literacy skills as the primary focus. Without them, the deaf child will struggle later on in life with literacy skills and put at risk for becoming illiterate.

They both are important not one over another. I've said that for the million of times already.

The fact is that you keep pushing speech out of the way, you kept saying ASL/Written English where does speech fits in?

 

[Tousi]

The actual history of American Sign Language was traced back 1800 with Dr. Thomas Hopkins Gallaudet I believe I wasn't seeing spoken speech until much later, they thought deaf children were uncapble of learning and be educated.

Oh, from THAT perspective, okayyyyy. I was thinking of Mankind; the cave guys and gals grunted their way to spoken language first before sign language was what I was thinking, lol...

 

[shel90]

They both are important not one over another. I've said that for the million of times already.

The fact is that you keep pushing speech out of the way, you kept saying ASL/Written English where does speech fits in?

For the millionth time I am not pushing speech out of the way. See my post #309

I am more concerned with establishing a strong first language so the deaf children...see my several posts from citations to the importance of establishing a strong foundation in language.