See this. It s a perfect example!

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deafskeptic said:
QFT! I actually agree with Sweetmind on several things that aren't CI related but she does take it too far.
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I find those debates boring at times .. We're already a small community , yet we prefer 'hurting' ourselves instead of tolerating differences.. why ? :|
 
contradica said:
Could someone translate what the film blog says?
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Indeed.
In the blog there's a "request" to show it to as many hearing parents as possible. But since they do not know sign, they will not be able to follow.
Not a good way to reach out to them....
 
Cloggy said:
Indeed.
In the blog there's a "request" to show it to as many hearing parents as possible. But since they do not know sign, they will not be able to follow.
Not a good way to reach out to them....
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Thank you very much, all I was able to understand was by lipreading calling her baby beautiful and somehow I didn't think it was about that. I don't know any sign what so ever.
 
Cloggy said:
Indeed.
In the blog there's a "request" to show it to as many hearing parents as possible. But since they do not know sign, they will not be able to follow.
Not a good way to reach out to them....
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The hearing parents who know sign will be able to understand it. Maybe the hearing parents whodon't know sign could have it interpreted, LOL. Kind of puts the shoe onthe other foot, huh?
 
jillio said:
The hearing parents who know sign will be able to understand it. Maybe the hearing parents whodon't know sign could have it interpreted, LOL. Kind of puts the shoe onthe other foot, huh?
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I don't' know what's funny about it. And I do not mind being able to understand only little of it. I realise that I do not understand sign. And I have no problem with it.
When I met the teacher of Lotte in the kindergarden who signed to me, I realised that I needed to know sign. So I learned.

But that's not what is the issue here.
If the idea is to reach out to parents that have gotten the message that their child is deaf, this message will not mean anything to them, since they have not learned signlanguage yet.

But Jill..
I am happy for you that you can enjoy the fact that someone else doesn't speak sign-language!
 
Cloggy said:
I don't' know what's funny about it. And I do not mind being able to understand only little of it. I realise that I do not understand sign. And I have no problem with it.
When I met the teacher of Lotte in the kindergarden who signed to me, I realised that I needed to know sign. So I learned.

But that's not what is the issue here.
If the idea is to reach out to parents that have gotten the message that their child is deaf, this message will not mean anything to them, since they have not learned signlanguage yet.

But Jill..
I am happy for you that you can enjoy the fact that someone else doesn't speak sign-language!
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Its called culture schock, cloggy. The hearing parent who is put in a situation of not being able to understand information conveyed visually undergoes the same frustration and confusion that a deaf child experiences constantly when placed in an oral only environment. It is actually quite effective in helping these parents to develop empathy for the experience of deafness. For some parents, that is. There are others that are so ethnocentric and such a medicalized view of deafness that they are unable to develop that empathy no matter how many times it is demonstrated to them because they refuse to try to see things through their child's eyes and insist on seeing the child's experience through their eyes.
 
jillio said:
Its called culture schock, cloggy. The hearing parent who is put in a situation of not being able to understand information conveyed visually undergoes the same frustration and confusion that a deaf child experiences constantly when placed in an oral only environment. It is actually quite effective in helping these parents to develop empathy for the experience of deafness. For some parents, that is. There are others that are so ethnocentric and such a medicalized view of deafness that they are unable to develop that empathy no matter how many times it is demonstrated to them because they refuse to try to see things through their child's eyes and insist on seeing the child's experience through their eyes.
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So you think you can shock parents more by showing them a video that they cannot understand than by the same video which includes subtitles....

Glad you feel that way. And good luck shocking parents... Nice!
 
I think that just for ease of communication, it would have been sensible to include captions in the blog or if this cannot be done, a transcript at the end.

Even if the parents could understand some sign, it may not be advanced enough. Also not all parents viewing the blog come from America and understand ASL even if they could sign!
 
Agreed, R2D2. Can't expect everyone to understand sign.
 
jillio said:
Its called culture schock, cloggy. The hearing parent who is put in a situation of not being able to understand information conveyed visually undergoes the same frustration and confusion that a deaf child experiences constantly when placed in an oral only environment. It is actually quite effective in helping these parents to develop empathy for the experience of deafness. For some parents, that is. There are others that are so ethnocentric and such a medicalized view of deafness that they are unable to develop that empathy no matter how many times it is demonstrated to them because they refuse to try to see things through their child's eyes and insist on seeing the child's experience through their eyes.
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True...

a situation simliar to this just happened at my house on Monday for Labor Day. My husband and I threw a Labor Day cookout at our place. About 30 of my deaf/hh/ and hearing (who r fluent in ASL) came to the party. I also invited my hearing cousin who lives in DC cuz she said she wanted to see the house and was going to be in the Baltimore area so I told her about our party so she brought her hearing husband. Mind u, she grew up in Seattle so whenever we get together growing up, it was always with family and since we both moved to the DC area, we get together from time to time but with just 4 of us or when my mom or her mom r in town so she has never seen me around my friends who r fluent in ASL. This party was a first for her..I didn't warn her about everyone being signers even my hubby.

Anyways, everyone arrives and we r out in back hanging out under the canopy just having a grand ole time. My cousin was totally quiet the whole time cuz she didn't understand ASL. She looked very uncomfortable and kept looking around. My husband and her husband were by the bbq grill cooking so my cousin was the only non signer in a group of about 30 people. I did make an effort to tell her what everyone was saying, but like she and my family members do to my brother and I all the time, I got caught up in the different conversations and sometimes forgot about interpreting for her. Yes, I felt bad but at the same time, I am kinda glad that this happened cuz I hope that helped her see from my brother and my eyes' whenever we r at our family gatherings feeling totally lost, left out, and very uncomfortable.

She and her hubby left after a short time. I guess it became too much for her but I did tell her this before she left.."are u willing to learn ASL?" she said she would look into it. She works with International politics so she had to become fluent in few other languages so why not ASL too? *crossing my fingers*

Yea, sometimes it takes for the hearing person to be put in a situation where they feel completely lost, left out and not at ease before they really get what deaf/hh people have to endure when placed in oral-only enviornments without any visual languages. That's how many deaf/hh people feel often in non signing environments unless they r completely oral and don't mind situations like thses. As for me after experiencing ASL and getting to know what it feels like to be totally involved in large group conversations without being lost, that kind of situation are no longer a desire for me anymore.
 
I understand the general gist of what you are saying Shel. However, I don't think somehow an incomprehensible blog would inspire parents to learn the language any more than you feeling lost in a large group conversation would inspire you to go into further speech therapy. People that feel alienated tend to distance themselves further away.

I think that rather than giving the faceless mass of "hearing people" a serve back of what deaf people are use to, which clearly produces feelings of alienation and which actually may backfire by producing a reaction of (I don't want to be able not to communicate with my child so we'll go oral all the way) why not actually communicate the message directly to them using a common language e.g. written English.
 
Cloggy said:
So you think you can shock parents more by showing them a video that they cannot understand than by the same video which includes subtitles....

Glad you feel that way. And good luck shocking parents... Nice!
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Unfortunately, cloggy, there are many parents out there who need to be shocked out of their complacency. I did not say that the film could not be sub-titled. What I said was culture schock goes a long way toward fostering empathy.
 
shel90 said:
True...

a situation simliar to this just happened at my house on Monday for Labor Day. My husband and I threw a Labor Day cookout at our place. About 30 of my deaf/hh/ and hearing (who r fluent in ASL) came to the party. I also invited my hearing cousin who lives in DC cuz she said she wanted to see the house and was going to be in the Baltimore area so I told her about our party so she brought her hearing husband. Mind u, she grew up in Seattle so whenever we get together growing up, it was always with family and since we both moved to the DC area, we get together from time to time but with just 4 of us or when my mom or her mom r in town so she has never seen me around my friends who r fluent in ASL. This party was a first for her..I didn't warn her about everyone being signers even my hubby.

Anyways, everyone arrives and we r out in back hanging out under the canopy just having a grand ole time. My cousin was totally quiet the whole time cuz she didn't understand ASL. She looked very uncomfortable and kept looking around. My husband and her husband were by the bbq grill cooking so my cousin was the only non signer in a group of about 30 people. I did make an effort to tell her what everyone was saying, but like she and my family members do to my brother and I all the time, I got caught up in the different conversations and sometimes forgot about interpreting for her. Yes, I felt bad but at the same time, I am kinda glad that this happened cuz I hope that helped her see from my brother and my eyes' whenever we r at our family gatherings feeling totally lost, left out, and very uncomfortable.

She and her hubby left after a short time. I guess it became too much for her but I did tell her this before she left.."are u willing to learn ASL?" she said she would look into it. She works with International politics so she had to become fluent in few other languages so why not ASL too? *crossing my fingers*

Yea, sometimes it takes for the hearing person to be put in a situation where they feel completely lost, left out and not at ease before they really get what deaf/hh people have to endure when placed in oral-only enviornments without any visual languages. That's how many deaf/hh people feel often in non signing environments unless they r completely oral and don't mind situations like thses. As for me after experiencing ASL and getting to know what it feels like to be totally involved in large group conversations without being lost, that kind of situation are no longer a desire for me anymore.
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Absolutely. Your cousin received a very valuable lesson. Sometimes, turning the tables is the only thing that brings understanding. People are too quick to ignore when you attempt to explaint he situation, or to minimize what you say. Put them in the same situation, make them experience the same frustration and helplessness, and they can't ignore it any longer. They have a point of reference all of a sudden.
 
R2D2 said:
I understand the general gist of what you are saying Shel. However, I don't think somehow an incomprehensible blog would inspire parents to learn the language any more than you feeling lost in a large group conversation would inspire you to go into further speech therapy. People that feel alienated tend to distance themselves further away.

I think that rather than giving the faceless mass of "hearing people" a serve back of what deaf people are use to, which clearly produces feelings of alienation and which actually may backfire by producing a reaction of (I don't want to be able not to communicate with my child so we'll go oral all the way) why not actually communicate the message directly to them using a common language e.g. written English.
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While shel90 and Jillo raise an excellent point about culture shock and the need for a visual language for deaf children, I must note here that if the vblog is intended for parents who don't know sign, it's best to have it captioned or have a summery of the blog and then indicate that this is a summery of the blog. The paragraph does summerize much of what she said but it also leaves out some stuff. There's no indication that this is a summery though.

The paragraph in this blog doesn't mention the fact the signer in this vblog questioned the idea of having the 6 month old baby's small head cut open and the implant be put in it. If I recall correctly, babies have to wait till they're a year old to be implanted. She says the hearing parents are dismayed that the child is deaf and that they'd try to get the baby implanted. As she points out, the implant does destroy the remaining natural hearing that the baby has. She says the baby has no advocates that will stand up and speak for the baby's rights to live as deaf person. The baby is beautiful as she is.
 
Erm.. some corrections: she says that the baby has no voice so it's up to other deaf to stand up and fight for her rights.

She also wants to know if it's ok for deaf parents to remove the baby's hearing so they can become deaf like the parents themselves. She says no so why should it be ok to implant the child? She implies the parents thinks the implants will make the baby hearing like them. She wasn't pointing out that the implant removes the remaining hearing as i thought in the beginning. Mea culpa.
 
deafskeptic said:
Erm.. some corrections: she says that the baby has no voice so it's up to other deaf to stand up and fight for her rights.

She also wants to know if it's ok for deaf parents to remove the baby's hearing so they can become deaf like the parents themselves. She says no so why should it be ok to implant the child? She implies the parents thinks the implants will make the baby hearing like them. She wasn't pointing out that the implant removes the remaining hearing as i thought in the beginning. Mea culpa.
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You are forgiven, my child.:giggle:
 
deafskeptic said:
Erm.. some corrections: she says that the baby has no voice so it's up to other deaf to stand up and fight for her rights.

She also wants to know if it's ok for deaf parents to remove the baby's hearing so they can become deaf like the parents themselves. She says no so why should it be ok to implant the child? She implies the parents thinks the implants will make the baby hearing like them. She wasn't pointing out that the implant removes the remaining hearing as i thought in the beginning. Mea culpa.
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Thank you so much for that translation :) I really appreciate it :)
 
R2D2 said:
I understand the general gist of what you are saying Shel. However, I don't think somehow an incomprehensible blog would inspire parents to learn the language any more than you feeling lost in a large group conversation would inspire you to go into further speech therapy. People that feel alienated tend to distance themselves further away.

I think that rather than giving the faceless mass of "hearing people" a serve back of what deaf people are use to, which clearly produces feelings of alienation and which actually may backfire by producing a reaction of (I don't want to be able not to communicate with my child so we'll go oral all the way) why not actually communicate the message directly to them using a common language e.g. written English.
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Oh, I was just using Jillo's comment about putting hearing people in deaf people's shoes to apply to what happened on Monday with my cousin. The time I posted that post, I still had no access to the Internet so I couldnt open the link that the OP provided. Will look at it later. Thanks
 
You created a very good thread here, Sweetmind!!!! :ty: You share your feeling and heart for children which is wonderful.

Shel90 and Jillo made an excellent points here... I am with them in their most posts.
 
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