Observation

deafbajagal said:
Yes, but the schools shouldn't have to pay for CIs...that's the parents' responsibility.
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Could you please point me to the post where anyone suggested schools pay for CI's?
 
#317, in reference to the quote that comes with the post... I was merely pointing out that schools, technically, do not pay for CIs...or they shouldn't, if they do...
 
deafbajagal said:
#317, in reference to the quote that comes with the post... I was merely pointing out that schools, technically, do not pay for CIs...or they shouldn't, if they do...
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They don't. They may pay for specialized education, which they do for every child with a disability, but other than that, the school does not cover implants, equipment for the CI, MAPing, or anything like that.
 
I understand that you are not "anti-oral skills", but many are anti- spoken language as a mode of communication. Those are two totally different things.

And again, why is it assumed that I am PRO mainstreaming? I have said over and over, that I am not. I know that deaf kids often struggle socially and with identity, if you look and actually read what I say, I say that I think that deaf kids should be given ASL, have access to the Deaf community, and be with trained Teachers of the Deaf. Why do you ignore that and instead attempt to push other beliefs on me?
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Huh? Where the heck do you get that? There are anti oralists out there, but they are in the MINORITY! That is what you don't understand! Almost ALL Deaf people (including DODA families are FINE with developing spoken language abilty......as long as ASL is included! It's VERY possible for hoh kids to aquire both ASL and spoken language abilty. Most audilogically hoh kids do not need intense "Clarke School" or auditory verbal style intervention. That's NOT to say that they wouldn't be behind in spoken language, just that they don't need hyperintense instruction in spoken language the way a deaf kid with a severe expressive spoken language delay would have.
And no, you are not "pro mainstreaming" BUT you have expressed elation that there are a lot of kids in the mainstream doing really well....You do seem to think that the CI will overcome the downsides of the mainstream. Some kids will do well yes.......but the thing you're missing is that there have always been kids who have done well in the mainstream.
When a child is mainstreamed a terp is necessary, a regular classroom teacher is necessary, a special ed teacher is necessary, and resource room staff are necessary. That is 4 employees per student. In a bi-bi placement, one classroom teacher is all that is necessary.

Then add in speech therapists and/or tutors for remedial work. Not to mention which, the school district is mandated to provide these services, but very often are not provided the funds with which to do it. So, the additional cost has to come from their regular budget. Quality of ed goes down for the entire school because of lower funding.
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jillo, how often are mainstreamed kids on par and don't need resource room style intervention? Did you mean TOD for special ed teacher?
 
deafdyke said:
Huh? Where the heck do you get that? There are anti oralists out there, but they are in the MINORITY! That is what you don't understand! Almost ALL Deaf people (including DODA families are FINE with developing spoken language abilty......as long as ASL is included! It's VERY possible for hoh kids to aquire both ASL and spoken language abilty. Most audilogically hoh kids do not need intense "Clarke School" or auditory verbal style intervention. That's NOT to say that they wouldn't be behind in spoken language, just that they don't need hyperintense instruction in spoken language the way a deaf kid with a severe expressive spoken language delay would have.
And no, you are not "pro mainstreaming" BUT you have expressed elation that there are a lot of kids in the mainstream doing really well....You do seem to think that the CI will overcome the downsides of the mainstream. Some kids will do well yes.......but the thing you're missing is that there have always been kids who have done well in the mainstream.

jillo, how often are mainstreamed kids on par and don't need resource room style intervention? Did you mean TOD for special ed teacher?
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As for people being against spoken language, I was very clear. They are against spoken language as a mode of communication in daily life. Yes, a kid can learn some phrases to easy communication in the hearing world, but if they communicate with spoken language, at home or school, that is considered being restrictive and it is unacceptable.

Oh, one hand you say that the kids don't need "intensive therapy" and specialized schooling, but the on the other hand, you say that they aren't performing as well as hearing kids. Maybe if they had that therapy and teachers of the deaf, they would be.
 
Unfortuantely, that is the reality of deaf ed in this country. I've been dealing with it for years, beginning with my own child
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Oh hell yes. The attitude is basicly " Oh we'll mainstream and accept you, but we won't give you accomondations you desperately need, b/c we just like the money you bring in. About the ONLY reason why mainstreaming is even popular is b/c the disabled kid brings money to the mainstream......BUT there's no law saying that a school cannot get away with providing a minimal accomondations approach. Kids in dhh programs do get more benifit from a solotaire approach. Plus the preschool/kindergarten elementary programs are good for kids who are too young to go off to live at school.
Actually to defend faire joure's choice of educational placement, while Miss Kat is doing well receptively her expressive spoken language is still REALLY behind. I don't think that faire joure has the training to teach a deaf kid to use spoken language. I do see both sides.....on one hand Miss Kat isn't able to learn on a second grade level just using spoken English.....It is inhibiting her chance to just learn, rather then have spoken language therapy as a school day.
Beowulf, that is AWESOME she's sending her son to Missouri School for the Deaf!
Is he in hearing aids and also getting speech training too?
Lots of CI kids are in programs at deaf schools. It is a big deal at Iowa School for the Deaf.
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YAY! Glad that many of the Deaf Schools are reconizing that they have to become hoh friendly in order to survive.
know children who went through school with very minimal accommodations such as note takers. Our friend's daughter went to a very good college without even notetakers in all her classes and graduated #1 in her college and in the top ten of her university. She did not play "catch up" nor go "deeper into the hole" but in fact excelled more in college than she did in HS.
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rick bear in mind that AG Bell is kind of high acheiving. It does not surprise me that a lot of AG Bell kids may only need minimal accomondations. But that's like looking at the graduates/curriculum of one of those exam schools in a city, and assuming that ALL graduates of that particualr school system do that well.
Heck, my senoir year of high school I did UNAIDED. Let me repeat that, UNAIDED and I made Honor Roll! All I had was a notetaker That doesn't mean that all hoh kids will be able to do that well. You are DAMN lucky your daughter didn't need more accomondations. Then you would see where we are coming from.
 
deafbajagal said:
#317, in reference to the quote that comes with the post... I was merely pointing out that schools, technically, do not pay for CIs...or they shouldn't, if they do...
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I would be surprrised if there was such a school especially with all the budget cuts and freezes going on now. :lol:
 
deafbajagal said:
Some of the BEST modifications you can do for a deaf child in a public school are free.
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Some are. Those are the minimal accomodations that most kids get. Unfortunately, they are rarely sufficient to keep children from falling behind. But they are the ones that the public school system relies on and will readiy provide.
 
deafdyke said:
Huh? Where the heck do you get that? There are anti oralists out there, but they are in the MINORITY! That is what you don't understand! Almost ALL Deaf people (including DODA families are FINE with developing spoken language abilty......as long as ASL is included! It's VERY possible for hoh kids to aquire both ASL and spoken language abilty. Most audilogically hoh kids do not need intense "Clarke School" or auditory verbal style intervention. That's NOT to say that they wouldn't be behind in spoken language, just that they don't need hyperintense instruction in spoken language the way a deaf kid with a severe expressive spoken language delay would have.
And no, you are not "pro mainstreaming" BUT you have expressed elation that there are a lot of kids in the mainstream doing really well....You do seem to think that the CI will overcome the downsides of the mainstream. Some kids will do well yes.......but the thing you're missing is that there have always been kids who have done well in the mainstream.

jillo, how often are mainstreamed kids on par and don't need resource room style intervention? Did you mean TOD for special ed teacher?
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I've never seen one that did not need to utilize resource room instruction. Generally, it is a special education teacher doing added work to catch them up on what they are missing in the regular classroom. Only if it is a self contained program is it deaf students only. More likely is that the deaf child has resource room time with children with various disabilities. And more often than not, the same methodolgy is used for all. In short, the kid just more of the same only in a smaller group.
 
faire_jour said:
As for people being against spoken language, I was very clear. They are against spoken language as a mode of communication in daily life. Yes, a kid can learn some phrases to easy communication in the hearing world, but if they communicate with spoken language, at home or school, that is considered being restrictive and it is unacceptable.

Oh, one hand you say that the kids don't need "intensive therapy" and specialized schooling, but the on the other hand, you say that they aren't performing as well as hearing kids. Maybe if they had that therapy and teachers of the deaf, they would be.
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You must be confusing people from another forum with AD. No one here is against spoken language in daily life. They are against an oral educational environment.
 
deafdyke said:
Oh hell yes. The attitude is basicly " Oh we'll mainstream and accept you, but we won't give you accomondations you desperately need, b/c we just like the money you bring in. About the ONLY reason why mainstreaming is even popular is b/c the disabled kid brings money to the mainstream......BUT there's no law saying that a school cannot get away with providing a minimal accomondations approach. Kids in dhh programs do get more benifit from a solotaire approach. Plus the preschool/kindergarten elementary programs are good for kids who are too young to go off to live at school.
Actually to defend faire joure's choice of educational placement, while Miss Kat is doing well receptively her expressive spoken language is still REALLY behind. I don't think that faire joure has the training to teach a deaf kid to use spoken language. I do see both sides.....on one hand Miss Kat isn't able to learn on a second grade level just using spoken English.....It is inhibiting her chance to just learn, rather then have spoken language therapy as a school day.
Beowulf, that is AWESOME she's sending her son to Missouri School for the Deaf!
Is he in hearing aids and also getting speech training too?
YAY! Glad that many of the Deaf Schools are reconizing that they have to become hoh friendly in order to survive.
rick bear in mind that AG Bell is kind of high acheiving. It does not surprise me that a lot of AG Bell kids may only need minimal accomondations. But that's like looking at the graduates/curriculum of one of those exam schools in a city, and assuming that ALL graduates of that particualr school system do that well.
Heck, my senoir year of high school I did UNAIDED. Let me repeat that, UNAIDED and I made Honor Roll! All I had was a notetaker That doesn't mean that all hoh kids will be able to do that well. You are DAMN lucky your daughter didn't need more accomondations. Then you would see where we are coming from.
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How would you possibly know? How can you assess the language, either receptive or expressive, of a child you have never met?

If that worked for you, great. We have made a different choice for my child. Thanks for your input.
 
faire_jour said:
How would you possibly know? How can you assess the language, either receptive or expressive, of a child you have never met?

If that worked for you, great. We have made a different choice for my child. Thanks for your input.
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You said it yourself.
 
faire_jour said:
How would you possibly know? How can you assess the language, either receptive or expressive, of a child you have never met?

If that worked for you, great. We have made a different choice for my child. Thanks for your input.
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Didn't you post on your blog that she still had gaps that were not closing despite the advances she had made? You kind of made it public knowledge when you did that.
 
"We were so thrilled with her progress (which in retrospect was sooooo little!) but also so worried about the gap that she needs to close (ok, so that part hasn't gone away yet!)"

Miss Kat's Deaf journey

Maybe someone else is posting to your blog?
 
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