more interpreter issues...UGH!

[jillio]

It's also distressingly common. Many hearing parents who have a deaf child are so desperate to make their child "normal" that they're practically in denial concerning their child's condition which compels them to make a number of unfortunate choices.

Agreed. This does happen all too frequently.

I think we also need to keep in mind that educational interpreting is a specialized area. When one is lucky enough to get a terp that is proficient in educational interpreting and is also certified, it is a rare occurance. Especially in the lower grades, one is not likely to get either. The schools are in no way mandated to hire certified terps at any level. They are only mandated to hire "qualified interpreters" as set forth in the language of the ADA. That "qualified" is open to interpretation, and can, and does include a person who graduated with a 2 year degree from a substandard program. This happens in the public schools (mainstream) more often than not.

 

[posts from hell]

Agreed. This does happen all too frequently.

I think we also need to keep in mind that educational interpreting is a specialized area. When one is lucky enough to get a terp that is proficient in educational interpreting and is also certified, it is a rare occurance. Especially in the lower grades, one is not likely to get either. The schools are in no way mandated to hire certified terps at any level. They are only mandated to hire "qualified interpreters" as set forth in the language of the ADA. That "qualified" is open to interpretation, and can, and does include a person who graduated with a 2 year degree from a substandard program. This happens in the public schools (mainstream) more often than not.

I've seen some stuff that would make one shudder. This is the big part of the reason I don't teach ASL at colleges anymore.

 

[CSign]

In California Educational Interpreters must be certified, regardless of the age of student.

Educational Interpreter Regulations - Laws, Regulations, & Policies (CA Dept of Education)

 

[jillio]

I've seen some stuff that would make one shudder. This is the big part of the reason I don't teach ASL at colleges anymore.

I can imagine you have, as have I. Colleges, on the whole, are getting better at using certified terps because they generally go through an agency. But as far as the public school system is concerned...nope. And colleges still have a way to go in a lot of cases. A lot of it is because they simply do not recognize the difference between interpreting and transliterating.

And, as we have discussed prior, Federal law supercedes state law, so if push were to come to shove, it is the ADA wording that would be upheld. And the ADA states that "qualified intepreter" is the standard that is mandated in all interpreting situations, education included.

 

[posts from hell]

I can imagine you have, as have I. Colleges, on the whole, are getting better at using certified terps because they generally go through an agency. But as far as the public school system is concerned...nope. And colleges still have a way to go in a lot of cases. A lot of it is because they simply do not recognize the difference between interpreting and transliterating.

And, as we have discussed prior, Federal law supercedes state law, so if push were to come to shove, it is the ADA wording that would be upheld. And the ADA states that "qualified intepreter" is the standard that is mandated in all interpreting situations, education included.

ie: using "college ASL students" as intern interpreters at local schools because they are the only places that will accept the interns.....

 

[jillio]

ie: using "college ASL students" as intern interpreters at local schools because they are the only places that will accept the interns.....

Absolutely. And that will even happen with colleges at times. When I first started working in a college disability office, they tried to pawn a practicum student off on a deaf student whose case I was in charge of. Needless to say, that didn't work at all. The same practicum student applied for a job at the state deaf school and was turned down because her ASL was not proficient enough. Where did she end up? Public school system.

 

[posts from hell]

Absolutely. And that will even happen with colleges at times. When I first started working in a college disability office, they tried to pawn a practicum student off on a deaf student whose case I was in charge of. Needless to say, that didn't work at all. The same practicum student applied for a job at the state deaf school and was turned down because her ASL was not proficient enough. Where did she end up? Public school system.

I couldn't stomach that... I had to leave.

 

[jillio]

I couldn't stomach that... I had to leave.

I stayed and fought for as long as I could stand it. Now I just consult and advocate....for the students, not the school.

 

[posts from hell]

I stayed and fought for as long as I could stand it. Now I just consult and advocate....for the students, not the school.

How can you fail students when they do good on paper but not good in practice??? (ASL wise that is??) It's all objective....

 

[CSign]

Most states require at least a score of 3.5 on the EIPA and/or certification through RID.

State Regulations for Interpreters

Educational agencies (the public school system) is required to provide certified interpreters, not students who've graduated from their second year of an ASL class.

 

[Mountain Man]

I can imagine you have, as have I. Colleges, on the whole, are getting better at using certified terps because they generally go through an agency. But as far as the public school system is concerned...nope.

It depends on the state. Some states require certified interpreters, but there's always the "teacher's aide" loophole.

 

[Mountain Man]

How can you fail students when they do good on paper but not good in practice??? (ASL wise that is??) It's all objective....

It depends on the program. Some have lower standards than others. In the interpreting program I'm currently enrolled in, students have to pass a strict minimum proficiency performance exam before entering practicum (only about 50% of students who take the exam pass), and they're teamed with a certified interpreter at the practicum site who actively teams with and monitors the student's performance.

 

[posts from hell]

Most states require at least a score of 3.5 on the EIPA and/or certification through RID.

State Regulations for Interpreters

Educational agencies (the public school system) is required to provide certified interpreters, not students who've graduated from their second year of an ASL class.

Don't act so naive. I've been there, I've seen it, I've taken part of helping deaf students getting screwed in the state that REQUIRES the above.

 

[jillio]

How can you fail students when they do good on paper but not good in practice??? (ASL wise that is??) It's all objective....

Because what matters is not what is on paper, but what is in air.

 

[jillio]

It depends on the state. Some states require certified interpreters, but there's always the "teacher's aide" loophole.

Exactly. And that loophole is used quite often in the elementary schools. The only way a school system will have to abide by certification is if a parent or a student checks into the terps credentials and files an official complaint with the school district. That will happen...almost never. Most parents are not proficient enough in ASL themselves to even discern the difference between and ASL terp, or a terp that is signing PSE and is conceptually incorrect in sign use. Especially when we get to subjects that require some degree of specialized vocab.

 

[jillio]

It depends on the program. Some have lower standards than others. In the interpreting program I'm currently enrolled in, students have to pass a strict minimum proficiency performance exam before entering practicum (only about 50% of students who take the exam pass), and they're teamed with a certified interpreter at the practicum site who actively teams with and monitors the student's performance.

There are many great programs out there, don't get me wrong. Unfortunately, there are also many horrid ones, and the general public and the public school faculty and staff don't know the difference. They are generally so ignorant regarding ASL, language acquisition, and deaf educational needs that any one who knows a handful of signs is deemed "qualified". This happens more often than not at the elementary levels. Truth be known, at this age, the school system is looking more for an aide than for a terp.

 

[jillio]

Don't act so naive. I've been there, I've seen it, I've taken part of helping deaf students getting screwed in the state that REQUIRES the above.

Exactly. That "requirement" only serves to provide parents with a false sense of security. They see that on paper, and automatically assume that the terp is certified and qualified just because it says they must be on paper. Let's talk about what really happens in practice, not what it says on a piece of paper.

 

[CSign]

Don't act so naive. I've been there, I've seen it, I've taken part of helping deaf students getting screwed in the state that REQUIRES the above.

Why would you take part in that? I would think participating in placing an unqualified terp with a student would go against your moral compass.

I'm not naive, I'm stating the facts. We have already been through the discussion that if a terp is unqualified, or does not provide the student with benefit they should be replaced. Parents and guardians are equal members of the IEP team.

 

[posts from hell]

Why would you take part in that? I would think participating in placing an unqualified terp with a student would go against your moral compass.

I'm not naive, I'm stating the facts. We have already been through the discussion that if a terp is unqualified, or does not provide the student with benefit they should be replaced. Parents and guardians are equal members of the IEP team.

It was called a JOB. I was nice enough to quote things so you can have the ease of viewing.

I've seen some stuff that would make one shudder. This is the big part of the reason I don't teach ASL at colleges anymore.

I couldn't stomach that... I had to leave.

Next time, read and remember what I have to say.

Now, I am going to ask you this question: Since you, like majority of parents with a deaf child, do not know ASL well enough to judge qualifications - what position do you hold to determine facts compared to these who grew up in the system or worked in it?

 

[GrendelQ]

Now, I am going to ask you this question: Since you, like majority of parents with a deaf child, do not know ASL well enough to judge qualifications - what position do you hold to determine facts compared to these who grew up in the system or worked in it?

That's an interesting point. Are you suggesting that deaf children don't deserve qualified interpreters if their parents can't really tell the difference between qualified and unqualified levels of ASL? Maybe kids also don't deserve to visit medical doctors with actual degrees if their parents don't have enough medical knowledge to determine whether or not the doctor is really qualified and have to rely on whether or not they hold a license to know if this guy happens to be a real doctor and have a certain specialt. Teachers, too: why do we insist on qualified teachers of the deaf if we really don't have the same level of expertise as those teachers and can't determine whether they truly are qualified without checking up on those degrees.