Jury recommends death sentence for Cleveland Serial Killer

Oceanbreeze said:
That's true for the most part. There are states, however, that use it frequently.

Florida and Texas being two of them.
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Not as much as you think.. Click on this link and scroll down to the chart. It will tell you how many is executed since 1976 in Florida http://www.dc.state.fl.us/oth/deathrow/
 
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I'm kind of both ways regarding the death penalty. I realize a lot of people are on death row and may possibly be innocent due to DNA testing. I also realize that some have mental issues. Those are reasons that the death penalty is not right. But, some crimes are so heinous that a firing squad is the best thing if they are truly guilty.

I mentioned before, I have a cousin who was my absolute favorite, that was murdered by a roommate. there was never any indication that this roommate had problems. He and my cousin work for the same agency. They were both social workers for the Minnesota Department of Families and Children (whatever they call it). He was behind in his rent, by about 5 days. My cousin just gently reminded him. He had a psychotic break and grabbed a kitchen knife and stabbed her 47 times. He then passed out. Another roommate heard what happened and saw the crime happen. She called 911. After much soul searching, my uncle and aunt decided to not push for the death penalty. They pushed for mental health treatment and incarceration in a mental health facility for 25 years. It was just before my wedding that he was sentenced. He is still there and has since written letters of apologies to my uncle, aunt, their remaining children and to me. For the "pick me up" happening for my uncle and aunt after the sentencing, my uncle gave me away at my wedding and my aunt was wearing a dress that was my cousin's.

I feel my uncle and aunt did the right thing there. It's hard to decided whether a death penalty is right or not, but then again, prisons are getting so overcrowded and I have heard a lot of times that people never get the rehabilitation they need in jail. Most times, they only get worse. Also, too many of our tax dollars are spent on these prisoners. So, where is the line to be drawn? Even the bible believed in the death penalty.
 
KristinaB said:
I'm kind of both ways regarding the death penalty. I realize a lot of people are on death row and may possibly be innocent due to DNA testing. I also realize that some have mental issues. Those are reasons that the death penalty is not right. But, some crimes are so heinous that a firing squad is the best thing if they are truly guilty.

I mentioned before, I have a cousin who was my absolute favorite, that was murdered by a roommate. there was never any indication that this roommate had problems. He and my cousin work for the same agency. They were both social workers for the Minnesota Department of Families and Children (whatever they call it). He was behind in his rent, by about 5 days. My cousin just gently reminded him. He had a psychotic break and grabbed a kitchen knife and stabbed her 47 times. He then passed out. Another roommate heard what happened and saw the crime happen. She called 911. After much soul searching, my uncle and aunt decided to not push for the death penalty. They pushed for mental health treatment and incarceration in a mental health facility for 25 years. It was just before my wedding that he was sentenced. He is still there and has since written letters of apologies to my uncle, aunt, their remaining children and to me. For the "pick me up" happening for my uncle and aunt after the sentencing, my uncle gave me away at my wedding and my aunt was wearing a dress that was my cousin's.

I feel my uncle and aunt did the right thing there. It's hard to decided whether a death penalty is right or not, but then again, prisons are getting so overcrowded and I have heard a lot of times that people never get the rehabilitation they need in jail. Most times, they only get worse. Also, too many of our tax dollars are spent on these prisoners. So, where is the line to be drawn? Even the bible believed in the death penalty.
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I'm absolutely stuck when it comes to the Death penalty. I think the concept of it is a good one. But, the procedures that are used to apply it are so flawed that I can't support the death penalty wholeheartedly. There are too many people sitting on death row who shouldn't be. As previously mentioned by Babyblue, the appeals process can mean it can take years to execute someone. Then, when someone IS executed, often it is done in error. We execute minors in this country. We execute mentally ill people in this country. How is that fair? I just have a lot of misgivings that I can't and don't support it.

I should also note that you and I have something in common. I also had a relative who was murdered. The murder of my grandfather occured back in 1985 when I was 15 yrs old, and the murderer is STILL awaiting execution.

I don't believe that the death penalty always brings closure to murder victims families. It just prolongs their agony, and at the end of it, their loved one is still gone.

I believe that the entire justice system, along with the death penalty, needs to be overhauled. I'm not comfortable abolishing it, but I have trouble supporting it as it applied currently.
 
jillio said:
No, not truly. The purpose of putting someone in prison, under our criminal justice code is to separate the person from society while they are given the opportunity to be rehabilitated. But, rehabilitation is hard to find in our criminal justice system as it is practiced.

There are 4 different types of justice. Restorative, distributive, procedural, and retributive. Our criminal justice system was designed to function on the principles of restorative and distributive justice. The death penalty is retributive.

We also need to keep in mind, when it comes to the death penalty, that our justice system is not perfect. Innocent people have been incarcerated numerous times, and there are cases where innocent people were on death row. Until the risk of executing an innocent man can be removed 100% we run that risk with every death sentence. I am not comfortable with the risk of even one innocent person being executed.

Let me know what you think of the book. I have recommended it many times, and people have always had a strong reaction to it.
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The one thing I have concerned about the death penalty is what if it the wrong person... The court better made sure they have the right person. There has been a few cases in the news of the wrong guys being jail for 30 years .
 
Chevy57 said:
Sowell's Imperial Ave house should torn down? Fear of haunting.
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Get this, I'm watching local news as Im reading this thread. Neighborhood wants the house demolished to get rid some of bad memories. But the problem is the house is foreclosured. Chained fences surrounded the property.
 
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KristinaB said:
I'm kind of both ways regarding the death penalty. I realize a lot of people are on death row and may possibly be innocent due to DNA testing. I also realize that some have mental issues. Those are reasons that the death penalty is not right. But, some crimes are so heinous that a firing squad is the best thing if they are truly guilty.

I mentioned before, I have a cousin who was my absolute favorite, that was murdered by a roommate. there was never any indication that this roommate had problems. He and my cousin work for the same agency. They were both social workers for the Minnesota Department of Families and Children (whatever they call it). He was behind in his rent, by about 5 days. My cousin just gently reminded him. He had a psychotic break and grabbed a kitchen knife and stabbed her 47 times. He then passed out. Another roommate heard what happened and saw the crime happen. She called 911. After much soul searching, my uncle and aunt decided to not push for the death penalty. They pushed for mental health treatment and incarceration in a mental health facility for 25 years. It was just before my wedding that he was sentenced. He is still there and has since written letters of apologies to my uncle, aunt, their remaining children and to me. For the "pick me up" happening for my uncle and aunt after the sentencing, my uncle gave me away at my wedding and my aunt was wearing a dress that was my cousin's.

I feel my uncle and aunt did the right thing there. It's hard to decided whether a death penalty is right or not, but then again, prisons are getting so overcrowded and I have heard a lot of times that people never get the rehabilitation they need in jail. Most times, they only get worse. Also, too many of our tax dollars are spent on these prisoners. So, where is the line to be drawn? Even the bible believed in the death penalty.
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When mental health is brought into the sentencing, what most don't realize is that the individual usually spends much more time being mandated to a locked ward than they would in prison. It is not the free ride that so many seem to think it is.
 
I'm opposed to the death penalty, primarily because our justice system is flawed and many many innocent people have been put to death. I cannot support something like that. If even a single innocent has ever been put to death for a crime they didn't commit, the entire punishment should be scrapped, IMO.

Having said that, there are just some people who are bad. They need to be put down, the same way we would put down a sick or rabid animal, and removed from the gene pool. I'm not going to support the decision to put Anthony Sowell to death, but at the same time, I'm not going to lose any sleep over it.
 
i checked online to the local uni, they dont have the copy of that book "Executing the Mentally Ill" bugger! i am interested, so, I will check out in 'bookfinder.com' my fav website for finding rare books...

so ok some of you who's reading this has discovered a secret to best books, have fun going to the book searcher its very very useful, it rarely failed me. very good, but for really rare sought books, you'd Never find a bargain these are priced accordlngly, so dont get your hopes up on this. :)
 
Jillio, is this book written by Kent Miller?
just ascertaining if im looking at the right book
 
Oceanbreeze said:
I'm absolutely stuck when it comes to the Death penalty. I think the concept of it is a good one. But, the procedures that are used to apply it are so flawed that I can't support the death penalty wholeheartedly. There are too many people sitting on death row who shouldn't be. As previously mentioned by Babyblue, the appeals process can mean it can take years to execute someone. Then, when someone IS executed, often it is done in error. We execute minors in this country. We execute mentally ill people in this country. How is that fair? I just have a lot of misgivings that I can't and don't support it.

I should also note that you and I have something in common. I also had a relative who was murdered. The murder of my grandfather occured back in 1985 when I was 15 yrs old, and the murderer is STILL awaiting execution.

I don't believe that the death penalty always brings closure to murder victims families. It just prolongs their agony, and at the end of it, their loved one is still gone.

I believe that the entire justice system, along with the death penalty, needs to be overhauled. I'm not comfortable abolishing it, but I have trouble supporting it as it applied currently.
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Being wishy-washy, eh? Either you are FOR the death penalty or you are AGAINST it. As far as I am concerned, there is no middle ground.
Some posters in here complain about the cost, yet they keep forgetting that is is FAR CHEAPER to imprison a person for life than to give the death penalty.

And by the way, I also had people close to me murdered.
 
TheWriteAlex said:
I'm opposed to the death penalty, primarily because our justice system is flawed and many many innocent people have been put to death. I cannot support something like that. If even a single innocent has ever been put to death for a crime they didn't commit, the entire punishment should be scrapped, IMO.

Having said that, there are just some people who are bad. They need to be put down, the same way we would put down a sick or rabid animal, and removed from the gene pool. I'm not going to support the decision to put Anthony Sowell to death, but at the same time, I'm not going to lose any sleep over it.
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Today is different, we have dna. back then we didnt. I told my relative while back, innocent people who were locked up 15 to 30 yrs are my true heroes. I dont know how they did it.

Beowulf said:
Being wishy-washy, eh? Either you are FOR the death penalty or you are AGAINST it. As far as I am concerned, there is no middle ground.
Some posters in here complain about the cost, yet they keep forgetting that is is FAR CHEAPER to imprison a person for life than to give the death penalty.

And by the way, I also had people close to me murdered.
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I dont understand why people complain about costs. It is so annoying.
I do think death penalty do scare people to death. Taking someone's life with yo' hands is a big no-no!
 
Any way a person looks at it and/or forms an opinion about the death penalty, there has to be order within any society. To have this requires a set of rules carried out and enforced by an authority. Nevertheless, the whole of society must participate in the process from beginning to wend. This is why some states do and some don't have the death penalty, the people of those states have made their opinions known. The Federal system already has the death penalty within itself but states are left to their own (i.e. State rights).
I, myself, have no doubt that if the whole population of votes in America were allow to vote on the issue of the death penalty being allowed to be vindicated as one form of justice punishment, the voters will pass it to allow such. Of course, the system of the court is due for an over-haul but that is a separate issue.
There are those who have the opinion that innocent people are on death row..Let me make it clear here.......there are NONE! A jury of ordinary citizens went through hell to come to a decision about a criminal and a crime. They came to a decision that the crime is so heinous and terrible that the criminal should get the death penalty as a fair punishment of justice for the victim of that crime. They used the evidence and testified statements to come to their decision. Does that mean no mistakes were made? Possible so, but not assumed as many have a firm belief that it the American justice system has the most check-and-balance of any system in the world. Ours is a system with the most generous amount of time for automatics appeals. There are even safe guards from the beginning to prevent certain criminals from even being considered for the death penalty (i.e. the mental ill, youth). So, much is done to have an as-close-to-perfect system as possibles. Anyone who follows the news knows the last day of a criminal is all seriousness. The system goes into over-drive to make sure the punishment is fair. Once that punishment is carried out, we need to realize that we did all we could to be fair.
To make the death penalty something other than its intended purpose, punishment, is a disservice to society. As stated from the beginning, the population has decided that it will be a PUNISHMENT ONLY. It can not and must not be allowed to be anything other than punishment. Since it is the supreme punishment, to dilute it for any reason would dilute all other punishments and the results would be a system that looks like a train wreak.
In closing, I'm not
saying there are NOT people in prison who do not belong there. They may be under a sentence other than the death penalty. But, I'm saying that after the punishment ids handed down by our own citizens, much, if not all, is done to be sure WE, yes you and I, did the right thing. Would you rather live elsewhere where there is no mercy and/or excellent appeal process?
 
rolling7 said:
Any way a person looks at it and/or forms an opinion about the death penalty, there has to be order within any society. To have this requires a set of rules carried out and enforced by an authority. Nevertheless, the whole of society must participate in the process from beginning to wend. This is why some states do and some don't have the death penalty, the people of those states have made their opinions known. The Federal system already has the death penalty within itself but states are left to their own (i.e. State rights).
I, myself, have no doubt that if the whole population of votes in America were allow to vote on the issue of the death penalty being allowed to be vindicated as one form of justice punishment, the voters will pass it to allow such. Of course, the system of the court is due for an over-haul but that is a separate issue.
There are those who have the opinion that innocent people are on death row..Let me make it clear here.......there are NONE! A jury of ordinary citizens went through hell to come to a decision about a criminal and a crime. They came to a decision that the crime is so heinous and terrible that the criminal should get the death penalty as a fair punishment of justice for the victim of that crime. They used the evidence and testified statements to come to their decision. Does that mean no mistakes were made? Possible so, but not assumed as many have a firm belief that it the American justice system has the most check-and-balance of any system in the world. Ours is a system with the most generous amount of time for automatics appeals. There are even safe guards from the beginning to prevent certain criminals from even being considered for the death penalty (i.e. the mental ill, youth). So, much is done to have an as-close-to-perfect system as possibles. Anyone who follows the news knows the last day of a criminal is all seriousness. The system goes into over-drive to make sure the punishment is fair. Once that punishment is carried out, we need to realize that we did all we could to be fair.
To make the death penalty something other than its intended purpose, punishment, is a disservice to society. As stated from the beginning, the population has decided that it will be a PUNISHMENT ONLY. It can not and must not be allowed to be anything other than punishment. Since it is the supreme punishment, to dilute it for any reason would dilute all other punishments and the results would be a system that looks like a train wreak.
In closing, I'm not
saying there are NOT people in prison who do not belong there. They may be under a sentence other than the death penalty. But, I'm saying that after the punishment ids handed down by our own citizens, much, if not all, is done to be sure WE, yes you and I, did the right thing. Would you rather live elsewhere where there is no mercy and/or excellent appeal process?
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The bolded renders your whole argument moot. Tsk tsk, such an error on your part.
 
Beowulf said:
Being wishy-washy, eh? Either you are FOR the death penalty or you are AGAINST it. As far as I am concerned, there is no middle ground.
Some posters in here complain about the cost, yet they keep forgetting that is is FAR CHEAPER to imprison a person for life than to give the death penalty.

And by the way, I also had people close to me murdered.
Click to expand...

Exactly. There is no middle ground here. Any time you add "except in cases of" you are stating that you are, in effect, for the death penalty.
 
rolling7 said:
Any way a person looks at it and/or forms an opinion about the death penalty, there has to be order within any society. To have this requires a set of rules carried out and enforced by an authority. Nevertheless, the whole of society must participate in the process from beginning to wend. This is why some states do and some don't have the death penalty, the people of those states have made their opinions known. The Federal system already has the death penalty within itself but states are left to their own (i.e. State rights).
I, myself, have no doubt that if the whole population of votes in America were allow to vote on the issue of the death penalty being allowed to be vindicated as one form of justice punishment, the voters will pass it to allow such. Of course, the system of the court is due for an over-haul but that is a separate issue.
There are those who have the opinion that innocent people are on death row..Let me make it clear here.......there are NONE! A jury of ordinary citizens went through hell to come to a decision about a criminal and a crime. They came to a decision that the crime is so heinous and terrible that the criminal should get the death penalty as a fair punishment of justice for the victim of that crime. They used the evidence and testified statements to come to their decision. Does that mean no mistakes were made? Possible so, but not assumed as many have a firm belief that it the American justice system has the most check-and-balance of any system in the world. Ours is a system with the most generous amount of time for automatics appeals. There are even safe guards from the beginning to prevent certain criminals from even being considered for the death penalty (i.e. the mental ill, youth). So, much is done to have an as-close-to-perfect system as possibles. Anyone who follows the news knows the last day of a criminal is all seriousness. The system goes into over-drive to make sure the punishment is fair. Once that punishment is carried out, we need to realize that we did all we could to be fair.
To make the death penalty something other than its intended purpose, punishment, is a disservice to society. As stated from the beginning, the population has decided that it will be a PUNISHMENT ONLY. It can not and must not be allowed to be anything other than punishment. Since it is the supreme punishment, to dilute it for any reason would dilute all other punishments and the results would be a system that looks like a train wreak.
In closing, I'm not
saying there are NOT people in prison who do not belong there. They may be under a sentence other than the death penalty. But, I'm saying that after the punishment ids handed down by our own citizens, much, if not all, is done to be sure WE, yes you and I, did the right thing. Would you rather live elsewhere where there is no mercy and/or excellent appeal process?
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Which is it? Vindication or punishment? They are not one and the same concept. The death penalty is not punishment. Punishment has, at it's very core, then intent of rehabilitation, or changing negative behaviors. That very premise is totally opposed to the death penalty.

To say that there are not, nor have there ever been, people on death row that were innocent is an extreme case of either naivete, or burying your head in the sand. You really should educated yourself on the facts before making statements such as that.

There is no mercy in the death penalty. It is as barbaric in the US as it is in any other country.
 
im gonna get the book, even we dont have death penalty in NZ.as a small country, with 4 and half million ppl here, with rising crime rates there have been abit of calling for the need of capital punishment to be introduced here. So I'd want to read this book to get educated about this related issue. heck im doing death and dying right now, while its not 'covered' in the study guide - Id still come away learned more, and impress my lecturer - actually she's my mate i helped to train one of her dog...now she regrets it because her dog wants to shake hands all the time:giggle:
 
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