Is it ever ok for kids NOT to use ASL?

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jillio said:
If it is about adults, it cannot be used in any way to support your claim regarding the statement that early implanted children have brains that more closely resemble the brains of hearing children.

Still waiting.
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The adults who have only had a CI for a few months, their brains reorganize more like a hearing person. That is the whole point of the article. Young children's brains are more pliable and are organizing rather than re-organizing.
 
faire_jour said:
But I'm saying that many children do not have an "absence of early communication".
There are many that are arriving at Kindergarten, NOT delayed.
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The research I have quoted states quite clearly that the average delay is 2 years. Unless a child has had access to language from birth in a mode that they are capable of processing, there will be a delay.
 
faire_jour said:
The adults who have only had a CI for a few months, their brains reorganize more like a hearing person. That is the whole point of the article. Young children's brains are more pliable and are organizing rather than re-organizing.
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It seems that being deaf is such a terrible thing, isnt it? Why is the ultimate goal is to become like hearing people? Are hearing people the gods of this universe or what? Get so sick and tired of being measured up to hearing people as if we are inferior. Oh brother..no wonder some people in the Deaf community despite hearing people in general cuz of that attitude and view.
 
jillio said:
The research I have quoted states quite clearly that the average delay is 2 years. Unless a child has had access to language from birth in a mode that they are capable of processing, there will be a delay.
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What was the date on the data quoted for the 2 year delay? I saw dates as early as the 80's in the quoted piece.
 
shel90 said:
It seems that being deaf is such a terrible thing, isnt it? Why is the ultimate goal is to become like hearing people? Are hearing people the gods of this universe or what? Get so sick and tired of being measured up to hearing people as if we are inferior. Oh brother..no wonder some people in the Deaf community despite hearing people in general cuz of that attitude and view.
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It is not an attitude or view. I am simply paraphrasing the research.
 
faire_jour said:
So you have read the articles I am refering to! Good, now I don't need to find them.
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I haven't read any articles that support the claim that a child implanted early has a brain that more closely resembles that of a hearing child, and I read research and texts on a daily basis. Perhaps, since you have already used an abstract that you quite obviously misinterpreted, you are simply not understanding the research.
 
faire_jour said:
It is not an attitude or view. I am simply paraphrasing the research.
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Yea, that's the attitude the CI circle and organizations that support CIs probably has...it makes me sick.
 
faire_jour said:
And I said hearing speech, i.e. hearing thresholds at 45 db or lower.
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Hearing is not discriminating. It is not useful to simply perceive a sound if one cannot discriminate that sound.
 
shel90 said:
Yea, that's the attitude the CI circle and organizations that support CIs probably has...it makes me sick.
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I am a member of CiCircle and I do not have that attitude. I support CI's and I don't believe that. There are many people that believe in CI's but do not believe that the Deaf are inferior. That would be believing my child inferior, and that would never happen!
I know several families who actively support and "advertise" CI's but also use ASL.
 
faire_jour said:
The adults who have only had a CI for a few months, their brains reorganize more like a hearing person. That is the whole point of the article. Young children's brains are more pliable and are organizing rather than re-organizing.
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Still a false conclusion. Please provide the research that states this implicitly.
 
jillio said:
Hearing is not discriminating. It is not useful to simply perceive a sound if one cannot discriminate that sound.
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Correct, but I was saying that enviromental sound awareness alone is not typical for a CI. Even if the user does not have speech discrimination, they should have speech awareness.
 
faire_jour said:
I am a member of CiCircle and I do not have that attitude. I support CI's and I don't believe that. There are many people that believe in CI's but do not believe that the Deaf are inferior. That would be believing my child inferior, and that would never happen!
I know several families who actively support and "advertise" CI's but also use ASL.
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The adults who have only had a CI for a few months, their brains reorganize more like a hearing person.

Statements like these are what many of us grew up battling against..

"Oh, you talk like a hearing person."

"Oh, you can talk on the phone like a hearing person."

and so on..


for many of us, all of our lives we were constantly being compared against hearing people ..why cant we just be us, deaf people, who we are?
 
shel90 said:
The adults who have only had a CI for a few months, their brains reorganize more like a hearing person.

Statements like these are what many of us grew up battling against..
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That is a statement, not a judgement. Why is it bad?
 
faire_jour said:
Correct, but I was saying that enviromental sound awareness alone is not typical for a CI. Even if the user does not have speech discrimination, they should have speech awareness.
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It is typical for any number of CI users. Speech awareness is not the issue. Many people have speech awareness with an HA. They still require visual language for comprehension.
 
faire_jour said:
That is a statement, not a judgement. Why is it bad?
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I edited my post...

if u know what life is like being compared to hearing people on a constant basis and what it can do to one's self esteem..
 
jillio said:
It is typical for any number of CI users. Speech awareness is not the issue. Many people have speech awareness with an HA. They still require visual language for comprehension.
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I never stated otherwise.
 
faire_jour said:
I did. Access the full article.
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Your conclusion is still false. Likewise, you cannot apply this research on adults to support a statement you made about children.

Still waiting.
 
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