Is Islam a Threat?

[Reba]

Oh, yes, the Crusades, the Inquisition and the Holocaust are great ways of demonstrating that policy. Right.

Born-again Christians weren't the leaders of the Crusades, Inquisition, and Holocaust. In fact, they were themselves victims of the Inquisition, and many of them went to concentration camps because they helped Jews hide or escape during the Holocaust.

Meh. "Saving" people is meaningless if they're not a good person and pointless if they already are.

Saving people from the eternal flames of Hell is "meaningless"? Oh, that is a heartless attitude. I don't see anything "meaningless" about saving people from suffering.

Since no person is "good" enough to enter Heaven on self merit, then, oh well, just let them go to Hell.

No, I don't think so.

Nope... Murder is not acceptable in Islam any more than it is in any other major religion.

"A fatwah released in September 2003 in Al-Qaeda's name declares that "nuclear warfare is the solution for destroying America." In April 2004, Hafez Sayeed, leader of the disbanded Pakistani Jihadist group Lashkar-e-Taiba, said that "mass killing of non-believers is the only solution to international conflicts in the Muslims' favor."
http://www.aei.brookings.org/policy/page.php?id=207

Behind Closed Doors There Are No Moderate Muslims
http://www.ropma.net/no_moderate_muslims.htm

Terror on the dole
By David Cohen, Evening Standard
20 April 2004
Four young British Muslims in their twenties - a social worker, an IT specialist, a security guard and a financial adviser - occupy a table at a fast-food chicken restaurant in Luton. ..

"As far as I'm concerned, when they bomb London, the bigger the better," says Abdul Haq, the social worker. "I know it's going to happen because Sheikh bin Laden said so. Like Bali, like Turkey, like Madrid - I pray for it, I look forward to the day."

"I agree with you, brother," says Abu Yusuf, the earnest-looking financial adviser sitting opposite. "I would like to see the Mujahideen coming into London and killing thousands, whether with nuclear weapons or germ warfare. And if they need a safehouse, they can stay in mine - and if they need some fertiliser [for a bomb], I'll tell them where to get it."

His friend, Abu Musa, the security guard, smiles radiantly. "It will be a day of joy for me," he adds, speaking with a slight lisp.

As they talk, a man with a bushy beard, dressed in a jacket emblazoned with the word "Jihad", stands and watches over them, handing around cups of steaming hot coffee. His real name is Ishtiaq Alamgir, but he goes by his adopted name, Sayful Islam, meaning "Sword of Islam". He is the 24-year-old leader of the Luton branch of al-Muhajiroun, an extremist Muslim group with about 800 members countrywide, who regard Osama bin Laden as their hero.

Until recently, nobody took the fanatical beliefs of al-Muhajiroun too seriously, believing that a British-based group so brazenly "out there" could not be involved in something as "underground" as terrorism. The group is led by the exiled Saudi, Sheikh Omar Bakri Mohammad, from his base in north London. Yesterday, in a magazine article, Bakri warned that several radical groups are poised to strike in London.

...Is al-Muhajiroun nothing more than a repository for disaffected Muslim youths who have adopted an extreme interpretation of Islam - ... who are essentially posturing? Or does the group also perform a more sinister function, sucking in alienated young men and brainwashing the more impressionable into becoming future suicide bombers?

...He no longer works, even though he is able-bodied, he admits, preferring instead to claim housing benefit and jobseeker's allowance. He smiles sheepishly and says the irony is not lost on him that the British state is supporting him financially, even as he plots to "overthrow it".

"I made a decision that I wanted to follow what Islam really said," Sayful begins, sitting on his sofa in his thowb (a traditional robe) and bare feet. "I went to listen to all the local imams, but I found their portrayal of Islam was too secularised. When I heard Sheikh Omar [the leader] of al-Muhajiroun speak, it was pure Islam, with no compromise. I found that appealing.

...But it was the events of 11 September that crystallised Sayful's worldview. "When I watched those planes go into the Twin Towers, I felt elated," he says. "That magnificent action split the world into two camps: you were either with Islam and al Qaeda, or with the enemy. I decided to quit my job and commit myself full-time to al-Muhajiroun." Now he does not consider himself British. "I am a Muslim living in Britain, and I give my allegiance only to Allah."

According to Sayful, the aim of al-Muhajiroun ("the immigrants") is nothing less than Khilafah - "the worldwide domination of Islam". The way to achieve this, he says, is by Jihad, led by Bin Laden. "I support him 100 per cent."

Does that support extend to violent acts of terrorism in the UK?

"Yes," he replies, unequivocally. "When a bomb attack happens here, I won't be against it, even if it kills my own children. Islam is clear: Muslims living in lands that are occupied have the right to attack their invaders.

... "If we want to engage in terrorism, we would have to leave the country," he says. "It is against Islam to do otherwise." ...

Two members of the group - Abu Yusuf, the financial adviser, and Abu Musa, the security guard - scorn al-Muhajiroun as "too moderate".

..."You want to know how far I will go," says Abu Musa, his high-pitched lisp rising an octave. "When Allah said in the Koran 'kill and be killed', that's what I want. I want a martyr operation, where I kill my enemy."

... "The mosques say one thing to the public, and something else to us. Let's just say that the face you see and the face we see are two different faces," says Abdul Haq. "Believe me," adds Musa, "behind closed doors, there are no moderate Muslims."

"Islam is not like Christianity, where they turn the other cheek. If they raid our homes, it could lead to the covenant of security being broken.

"Islam allows us to retaliate. That would include" - he tugs his "Jihad" coat tight against the night air - "by violent means."
http://www.thisislondon.co.uk/news/londonnews/articles/10329634?source=Evening Standard


I guess someone should tell these guys.

 

[Fo'Shizzle]

 

[Heath]

You need to stop making that ridiculous statement. Intellectuals are the ones that revolutionized the world - the concept of democracy, the concept of human rights, the concept of humanism, the concept of science, the concept of science, the concept of computing... it goes on. Without intellect, none of that would happen.

Intellcutals did not revolutionize the world. People who were doers and worked hard made the world go around. The concepts are just that , concepts. Action is what makes things happen, not intellectual talk or intellecutal pursuits.

Teresh makes her points clearly and she explains clearly why you got the information wrong. She cites sources based on observations, experiences, and facts. Unlike you, she speaks from her personal/religious Jewish experience - something that YOU have none.

You do think she is explaining her points clearly and what she really is trying to do is cover up her real lack of knowledge and just because I happen to be a conservative she wants to vent her mentally ill liberal establishment rage towards me and I have provided experiences, observations and facts and they happen to be conservative. I have had plenty of dealings with Jewish people and once you understand how cunning and sneaky jewish people really are in diguise then you will understand exactly what I am talking about. She will accuse me of hating her when I do not hate her.

You rely on pseudo-science and misinformation from looney websites that have no proof but their own delusions. The information you gave is so unreliable, I cannot trust you as a source of reliable information.

I do not rely on looney websites or pseduo science or mis information or anything like that and they happen to be conervative or well researched or something the liberal establishment hates or are horrified because it is the truth and you have to scream so loud that people watch and pay attention to you in an effort to make people not focus on the truth and if they really took the time to sit down alone and think about those things then observe these things without you being pushy or breathing threats that if you do not conform to her ways of thinking or anything like that then you are going to be punished by the liberal establishment , what a contradication in the freedom of thought that is being excersiced by anothers who simply think differently based on their life experience, what they have seen and where they have been etc. Something you are not gonna understand because you refuse to understand and you are very scared of the truth where I am not scared of the truth.

I was a practicing Christian. My father was a minister who denied evolution as a fact. I know from my experience that Christian fundamentalism is intellectually bankrupt. You simply cannot enrich your own intellect if you're constrained to think in "Christian" ways. It just doesn't work.

Christian fundamentalism is intellectually bankrupt ? Really ? you have no idea what you speak of and Christian fundamentalism really builds character, hard work and study and reading, and you think I only think in the " Christian " ways ? You really don't know what thinking in Christian ways really means ? It is the act of saving somebody's life from certain destruction if somebody were to go down that path of sin and where it leads that person through a series of horrible experiences before reaching hell if that person has not repented and accepted Jesus Christ then the spiritual situation remains the same. I have been a Southern Baptist, Pentecostal, Christian Identity , a Regular Christian I even was in Messianic Judaism, mind you and I studied Lutheran as well as Christian Fundamentalism and just plain following the KJV Holy Bible and you focus on one aspect of Christianity ? and you forget the whole another Christian experiences I have had. You also forget that I studied Roman Catholicism and I have studied many, many different religions in addition to mine. Teresh is simply projecting her hatred upon me because it is convienent for her to do so but in the end all she will do is end up hating herself more while I work towards progess and learning studying and watchhing , understanding what is going on and what the situation is which Teresh obivously has no clue of nor does she respect that fact because she is so angry and simply very insecure in what she believes but will not admit it. I am not afraid to move on and have new experiences and I think she is afraid that the more new experiences I have the better I get and the more angry she gets even though she will not admit she is angry you can see how hostile she really is by her words and her actions and her deeds. I have explained myself clearly and she has tried to divert that attention towards herself without allowing people to take the time to read and really think about what I am saying or what I am talking about because she knows I know the truth and I am not afraid to debate and if you will notice all she has done is insult, get angry and talk like she is a smart person and keep in mind she is only 19 years old barely out of high school and I am 30 years old and I have been through the real world and I have seen what works and what does not work and I listen to both sides of the story where she only wants you to listen to one side of the story, her story without you really knowing that you are listening to one side of the story, hers out of fear and acceptance and not looking at the real issues and when people do not understand something then they fear it which in turn leads to all kinds of problems that she can hide behind but when it really comes down to it. She is the problem herself and she does not want to face the truth for herself. I already have seen the truth for myself and I am comfortable with the truth and I see it in everyday life and it just reinforces what I believe in and what I see everyday.

 

[Fo'Shizzle]

The perpetuated history of the Middle East intertwined with great religions of the world have made the region one of the most abused vicinities of human civilization on Earth. Islam as the dominant religion of the region has ruled the mind and lives of the inhabitants for more than a millennium. It is Islam, which has shaped and determined the sociopolitical structure of the Middle Eastern countries. To understand the mind and thought of a group of people and ultimately their role as the citizens of this world, one should look at the utmost structural religious belief in which the direct word of God is the only absolute truth of human life. Is Islam a threat to the world? To answer this question, one should first answer the question whether or not Islam is a threat to the region by itself. In a greater attempt, one should answer the question what the role of organized religions have been in human civilizations.

Islam as a powerful social force ascended the pre-Islamic primitive Arab tribes into an egotistical civilization by late 600s and early 700s AD. The emergence of Islam as an empire from the so-called lizard-eaters of the Arabian Desert was indeed a miracle. No wonder no one could believe that only a man like Muhammad could do it on his own except having an unmitigated divine force behind him. This phenomenon sounds logical when a group of unprofessional army can defeat the super powers of the time, the Sassanids and Bezantines. Perhaps, Osama Bin Laden with his al Qaeda followers truly believed that they could do the same thing with today’s superpower, the almighty U.S.A., as Muhammad did to Sassanids and Bezantines 1,400 years ago. Nonetheless, the Islamic social reform in the heart of Arabia followed by many other nations in the region brought equality and prosperity for the majority of the believers who were the slaves of the former empirical systems. A sociological approach would help one to answer the question why Islam as an ideology gave rise to a worldwide belief and a dominant dogma for the region.

Marxist interpretation of social evolution can be applied to what happened in Arabia in mid 600s. Islamic social reform was one gigantic step towards social harmony and justice. It was Islam, which made people understand humanity as a source of change for a better life. This could be accepted by the uncivilized mass of the time if Muhammad could dress up his social reform with a divine outfit. The social equation of formulating the end of human history under an ideology is not something new that was invented by Karl Marx. The great religions have already predicted the end of the history of mankind but in a divine utopian manner in which humanity can rest in heaven for an eternal life. This phenomenon has been reflected in Judaism, Christianity, and Islam. Islam was announced as the final religion, which God revealed himself to humanity as the last offer for an eternal salvation of mankind. This religious ideology gives a static nature to Islam and to most religions in general.

God as the absolute truth and Islam as the only factual ideology leave no room for any further changes and reforms. This is what is called social stasis, the true character of an organized religion. There is no doubt that Islam did contribute to the good of humanity 1400 years ago. It is clear enough that Islam was beneficial to humanity in Arabia when women were personal properties with no human rights. It is easy to understand how Islam brought light to the dark ages of Arabia where the baby girls were buried alive. And no doubt that Islam transformed Arabia from a place of desert dwellers into the center of a new civilization expanded from Spain to China. However, this was centuries ago when the corruption of the civilized powers of the time and social orders had left no other options except a new social reform.

The majority of the people in the Middle East welcomed Islam 14 centuries ago simply to escape the social repression and the corrupted systems of the time. It would be a big mistake if one believes that what Islam did centuries ago can save humanity now in the 21st Century. As a fact, the inevitable dynamic nature of human societies goes against any social or ideological stasis. A good example is the dark ages of Europe where it was believed that the Trinity was the cure for all plagues. We should not forget that the birth of science, which brought space exploration, information age, and human welfare, could not happen if the Renaissance had not occurred.

Having a mass nostalgia for the great past is not unique to Islam and the Middle East. Human history is full of it. The annual pilgrimage of Mongolians around the Genghis Khan’s tomb signifies the nostalgia of a nation for their great past. But, is another Genghis Khan a solution to the poverty and misery of Mongolians in 21st century? Will an Islamic theocracy bring economic prosperity and peace to the Middle East? Did Iranian theocracy deliver economic achievement and social freedom after 24 years of Islamic rule? Is this life only a bridge to eternal life where one has to scarify everything to please God to be granted with an eternal life? And if this is the case, then why bother with exploring the space and universe when prayer is the only solution to gain an everlasting life in heaven. Why bother with inventing new medicines for a better health and a longer life when this life is merely a bridge to heaven? Why bother with extending the bridge when the bridge is full of misery? Why bother to live longer when one can shortcut to heaven by becoming martyr? These are the facts, which Islam seeks as an ideology. One can conclude, easily, that Islam as an obstinate religion with no flexibility in its 1400-year old doctrine is indeed a threat to our modern civilization and humanity in general.

 

[Rose Immortal]

I was a practicing Christian. My father was a minister who denied evolution as a fact. I know from my experience that Christian fundamentalism is intellectually bankrupt. You simply cannot enrich your own intellect if you're constrained to think in "Christian" ways. It just doesn't work.

I do not think that's a fair statement.

I think you will find many names on this list of Christians who have had much to contribute to the intellectual progress of humankind. This particular list is just of scientists, and not an exhaustive one at that, but I think it's worth a look:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Christian_thinkers_in_science

I would think hard before dismissing the development of minds like those of Johannes Kepler, Isaac Newton, Blaise Pascal, Robert Boyle (of Boyle's Law fame), Carolus Linnaeus, Charles Babbage, Michael Faraday, Gregor Mendel, Francis Collins (current director of the National Human Genome Research Institute), among others.

And that's just the hard sciences--I haven't even touched upon other worthy intellectual endeavors.


And Reba--one small critique of your post further up in this thread: I don't believe that the Protestant church was even around at the time of the Crusades, let alone the term "born-again" in the way it's applied these days. And I would not want there to be any suggestion that all Catholics were or are corrupt or hellbound. As far as the leaders of the Crusades are concerned, their temporal power went to their heads in an awful way. But I just want to make sure that no unintended implications are drawn from what you wrote.

 

[Fo'Shizzle]

Everyone needs to take a chill about who is right or wrong about this thread... Everyone had a mind of thier own

 

[Heath]

Your actions and statements have generally indicated otherwise...



I never said that. You're making that up on your own.



I support the freedom of people to do what they want with their bodies. As far as AIDS goes, I don't encourage people to get AIDS. If they want to, that's their choice. It's a bad choice, but that's their freedom. It's not something I encourage people to go out and get, though. Again, you're making stuff up.



Again, I support freedom. A fetus is a fetus, not a baby. I will say, however, that I am against late-term abortions and always have been. In the first few months, no rational person could argue that a little cluster of cells is a human person, but towards the end of the pregnancy, yeah, you can make that argument.



I am a real patriot of this nation. I believe in freedom, a concept you cannot understand.



You're making stuff up. I don't want that any more than you do.



"Dumbing down"? I suppose that's why I believe we should be spending more money on education and less on the war?



Nope, though you'd like to believe that, I'm sure.



Rose Immortal has been respectful to me, and thus she gets it in kind from me. You and several others on this forum have not been respectful to me and therefore have not received my respect.



Again, I believe in freedom for all, regardless of sex.



I would say the same about you. My thoughts are my own, my opinions are my own. I've been presented with a lot of different ideas from different sources. I can choose either to agree or disagree and develop my own opinion. I understand the concept of both. I nonetehless also extend that right to others, I don't expect or require them to hold my opinions to gain my respect, a concept you cannot fathom.



Nope. I love myself, if you haven't noticed my gigantic level of arrogance and my tremendous sense of ego from the way I post.



This is really OT, so let's cease the bickering and get back on-topic, no?

You are diverting the attention from the real issues at hand again here.

 

[Heath]

Born-again Christians weren't the leaders of the Crusades, Inquisition, and Holocaust. In fact, they were themselves victims of the Inquisition, and many of them went to concentration camps because they helped Jews hide or escape during the Holocaust.



Saving people from the eternal flames of Hell is "meaningless"? Oh, that is a heartless attitude. I don't see anything "meaningless" about saving people from suffering.

Since no person is "good" enough to enter Heaven on self merit, then, oh well, just let them go to Hell.

No, I don't think so.



"A fatwah released in September 2003 in Al-Qaeda's name declares that "nuclear warfare is the solution for destroying America." In April 2004, Hafez Sayeed, leader of the disbanded Pakistani Jihadist group Lashkar-e-Taiba, said that "mass killing of non-believers is the only solution to international conflicts in the Muslims' favor."
http://www.aei.brookings.org/policy/page.php?id=207

Behind Closed Doors There Are No Moderate Muslims
http://www.ropma.net/no_moderate_muslims.htm

Terror on the dole
By David Cohen, Evening Standard
20 April 2004
Four young British Muslims in their twenties - a social worker, an IT specialist, a security guard and a financial adviser - occupy a table at a fast-food chicken restaurant in Luton. ..

"As far as I'm concerned, when they bomb London, the bigger the better," says Abdul Haq, the social worker. "I know it's going to happen because Sheikh bin Laden said so. Like Bali, like Turkey, like Madrid - I pray for it, I look forward to the day."

"I agree with you, brother," says Abu Yusuf, the earnest-looking financial adviser sitting opposite. "I would like to see the Mujahideen coming into London and killing thousands, whether with nuclear weapons or germ warfare. And if they need a safehouse, they can stay in mine - and if they need some fertiliser [for a bomb], I'll tell them where to get it."

His friend, Abu Musa, the security guard, smiles radiantly. "It will be a day of joy for me," he adds, speaking with a slight lisp.

As they talk, a man with a bushy beard, dressed in a jacket emblazoned with the word "Jihad", stands and watches over them, handing around cups of steaming hot coffee. His real name is Ishtiaq Alamgir, but he goes by his adopted name, Sayful Islam, meaning "Sword of Islam". He is the 24-year-old leader of the Luton branch of al-Muhajiroun, an extremist Muslim group with about 800 members countrywide, who regard Osama bin Laden as their hero.

Until recently, nobody took the fanatical beliefs of al-Muhajiroun too seriously, believing that a British-based group so brazenly "out there" could not be involved in something as "underground" as terrorism. The group is led by the exiled Saudi, Sheikh Omar Bakri Mohammad, from his base in north London. Yesterday, in a magazine article, Bakri warned that several radical groups are poised to strike in London.

...Is al-Muhajiroun nothing more than a repository for disaffected Muslim youths who have adopted an extreme interpretation of Islam - ... who are essentially posturing? Or does the group also perform a more sinister function, sucking in alienated young men and brainwashing the more impressionable into becoming future suicide bombers?

...He no longer works, even though he is able-bodied, he admits, preferring instead to claim housing benefit and jobseeker's allowance. He smiles sheepishly and says the irony is not lost on him that the British state is supporting him financially, even as he plots to "overthrow it".

"I made a decision that I wanted to follow what Islam really said," Sayful begins, sitting on his sofa in his thowb (a traditional robe) and bare feet. "I went to listen to all the local imams, but I found their portrayal of Islam was too secularised. When I heard Sheikh Omar [the leader] of al-Muhajiroun speak, it was pure Islam, with no compromise. I found that appealing.

...But it was the events of 11 September that crystallised Sayful's worldview. "When I watched those planes go into the Twin Towers, I felt elated," he says. "That magnificent action split the world into two camps: you were either with Islam and al Qaeda, or with the enemy. I decided to quit my job and commit myself full-time to al-Muhajiroun." Now he does not consider himself British. "I am a Muslim living in Britain, and I give my allegiance only to Allah."

According to Sayful, the aim of al-Muhajiroun ("the immigrants") is nothing less than Khilafah - "the worldwide domination of Islam". The way to achieve this, he says, is by Jihad, led by Bin Laden. "I support him 100 per cent."

Does that support extend to violent acts of terrorism in the UK?

"Yes," he replies, unequivocally. "When a bomb attack happens here, I won't be against it, even if it kills my own children. Islam is clear: Muslims living in lands that are occupied have the right to attack their invaders.

... "If we want to engage in terrorism, we would have to leave the country," he says. "It is against Islam to do otherwise." ...

Two members of the group - Abu Yusuf, the financial adviser, and Abu Musa, the security guard - scorn al-Muhajiroun as "too moderate".

..."You want to know how far I will go," says Abu Musa, his high-pitched lisp rising an octave. "When Allah said in the Koran 'kill and be killed', that's what I want. I want a martyr operation, where I kill my enemy."

... "The mosques say one thing to the public, and something else to us. Let's just say that the face you see and the face we see are two different faces," says Abdul Haq. "Believe me," adds Musa, "behind closed doors, there are no moderate Muslims."

"Islam is not like Christianity, where they turn the other cheek. If they raid our homes, it could lead to the covenant of security being broken.

"Islam allows us to retaliate. That would include" - he tugs his "Jihad" coat tight against the night air - "by violent means."
http://www.thisislondon.co.uk/news/londonnews/articles/10329634?source=Evening Standard


I guess someone should tell these guys.

Teresh, See I told you that the Quran is full of violent verses and it pales in comparsion with Christian verses and Teresh, I can not believe you just denied that the Quran is full of violent verses. These are the guys I have a problem with. Not the innocent muslims who have nothing to do with terrorism and lead peaceful lives.

 

[Heath]

Teresh, It is also painfully obivous that you do not really know what the Quran says or teaches.

You claim to have studied the Quran. You really have not studied the Quran, both the positive and the negative aspects of the Quran.

 

[Maria]

I'd say that my God is the King of Kings, the Lord of Lords, the Host of Hosts, the Most High, HaShem, Adonai, YHVH, the LORD, God, Allah, Elohim, and all of the other neat names people have come up with for God.

Allah is the same God that the Jews have always worshipped, albeit with different names... Therefore, your question begs a different one: Are you a monotheist?

Allah = The Moon God = Idol

Psalm 115:2-8

"Wherefore should the heathen say, Where is now their God?

But our God is in the heavens: he hath done whatsoever he hath pleased.

Their idols are silver and gold, the work of men's hands.

They have mouths, but they speak not: eyes have they, but they see not:

They have ears, but they hear not: noses have they, but they smell not:

They have hands, but they handle not: feet have they, but they walk not: neither speak they through their throat.

They that make them are like unto them; so is every one that trusteth in them."

Deuteronomy 4:28

"And there ye shall serve gods, the work of men's hands, wood and stone, which neither see, nor hear, nor eat, nor smell."

Exodus 20:3-6

"Thou shalt have no other gods before me.

Thou shalt not make unto thee any graven image, or any likeness of any thing that is in heaven above, or that is in the earth beneath, or that is in the water under the earth.

Thou shalt not bow down thyself to them, nor serve them: for I the LORD thy God am a jealous God, visiting the iniquity of the fathers upon the children unto the third and fourth generation of them that hate me;

And shewing mercy unto thousands of them that love me, and keep my commandments."

So, there's only ONE Jesus Christ who is GOD and HE is the BREATHIN' WORD God.... the LIVIN' WORD GOD. He is not Allah or other kinds of god ( statues/idols )that are made in woods/stones/silver/gold. For instance : Buddah that people worship.. or let's say Hindu statue that people worship and so on. And, you are tellin' me that there's ONE God for all kinds of religion eh ? I don't think so.

God will say it is called " whore " to join in ONE God with many religions. I find that absurd if, you believe in that kind of thing. Muslims kill themselves with their dynamite bombs on their bodies and yet, they think it will take them to heaven. Gee - I don't agree. They are mockin' Jesus Christ who is True, The One and Only God.

 

[Heath]

Teresh, Have you forgotten how Islam is a threat to the U.S.A. ?

I can't believe you just denied that Islam does not have violent verses that muslim terrorists themselves, actually acted upon those violent verses.

Do you need a reminder ? and please read the comments on there too.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=42rOcVJbMOQ&search=islam

Then read what you just said .....

http://www.alldeaf.com/showpost.php?p=573001&postcount=2

See what I said .....

http://www.alldeaf.com/showpost.php?p=573069&postcount=4

Here is another one to back up what I just said.

http://www.alldeaf.com/showpost.php?p=573530&postcount=52

The organization Hillel that you work so hard at which is a good thing .... but for you to say that the Quran is not a violent book really would anger many people who live with this daily islamic threat in Israel. See the USA got attacked by airplane weilding islamic terrorists and then in Jerusalem here is what happened and even I do not approve of their methods. That is no military tactic at all so I am with the jewish people on this one. I value life.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cnwg0fIGbWQ&search=suicide bomb

 

[LuciaDisturbed]

You don't bother me at all. Feel free to mock.

That is not a mockery. I guess you missed the point.

 

[Maria]

That is not a mockery. I guess you missed the point.

Well, were you just jokin' ?

 

[LuciaDisturbed]

Well, were you just jokin' ?

No.

 

[Heath]

Born-again Christians believe that Jesus Christ wants us to go to all parts of the earth to spread the good news of salvation thru Christ. Thru teaching, doing good works, living lives of good example, patience, and showing a love for the people, Christians introduce Jesus to people of the world. Christians teach about Jesus, and the Holy Spirit convicts the souls of individuals unto repentance and salvation.

God and Christians rejoice when more people become saved.

God and Christians sorrow when people die in their sins without salvation.

Christians don't spread belief in Jesus by killing off non-believers. That doesn't make sense. The only way people can be saved for eternity is while they are alive, and salvation can't be forced.


Christians are rewarded by God for souls that they save from Hell.

Muslims believe they are rewarded by Allah for souls that they send to Hell.

That's the difference.

Teresh ..... Here is a video clip of how happy a islamic terrorist is right before he sends souls to hell and he thinks he is going to Heaven when in fact the Quran forbids suicide. You think the Quran permits suicide and I can tell you the Quran does not permit suicide. It is almost 4 a.m. and I can't remember the verse in the Quran where suicide is clearly forbidden but the islamic terrorists overlook that verse and they can not explain away that verse. I don't see how I can approve of this and you just said Islam is not a threat, no violence in their book ? Now think about what Reba just said above in what she just said. I am sure Reba can help you with this one. I really do want you to think about what Christianity is really all about. I don't want anybody to die and I prefer that people know more about Jesus Christ because then you will have more peace in your heart as well as going home to Heaven with Jesus Christ and God of Israel to New Jerusalem, That is Holy and Pure Heaven ..... New Jerusalem.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VH6IzAS4J3A&search=suicide bomb

 

[Maria]

No.

Alright.

 

[Cloggy]

Powerfull!

 

[Cloggy]

Teresh, Have you forgotten how Islam is a threat to the U.S.A. ?
..........................

U.S.A. is a threat to U.S.A. !!!!

 

[LuciaDisturbed]

Powerfull!

Thanks.

It isn't mine...I found it on the internet a few months ago and really liked it so I saved it to my pc.

I just thought it was quite appropriate for this subject/thread.

 

[Teresh]

Born-again Christians weren't the leaders of the Crusades, Inquisition, and Holocaust. In fact, they were themselves victims of the Inquisition, and many of them went to concentration camps because they helped Jews hide or escape during the Holocaust.

I don't deny what some Christians did during the Holocaust, I only also choose to remind you of what the Nazis were. At the highest levels, the movement was decidedly pagan (like the KKK, actually), but the vast majority of the soldiers and support staff were Christians.

Since no person is "good" enough to enter Heaven on self merit, then, oh well, just let them go to Hell.

Some of us don't think God hates His creation. Some of us don't have a negative v iewof humanity.

"A fatwah released in September 2003 in Al-Qaeda's name declares that "nuclear warfare is the solution for destroying America." In April 2004, Hafez Sayeed, leader of the disbanded Pakistani Jihadist group Lashkar-e-Taiba, said that "mass killing of non-believers is the only solution to international conflicts in the Muslims' favor."
http://www.aei.brookings.org/policy/page.php?id=207

The Alhambra decree was issued on July 31, 1492. It declared that "Any Jew who does not comply with this edict and is to be found in our kingdom and domains, or who return to the kingdom in any manner, will incur punishment by death and confiscation of all their belongings."

The Nuremberg Laws were passed in 1935.

I guess someone should tell these guys.

Indeed. Just because a person doesn't understand his or her religion doesn't mean that their actions reflect the consensus of the adherents.

You claim to have studied the Quran. You really have not studied the Quran, both the positive and the negative aspects of the Quran.

I never said I gave a fair amount of time to the Qur'an or its meaning. You're putting words in my mouth there. I simply said that you haven't.

Allah = The Moon God = Idol

Then you're misinformed. Allah is the same God that you worship. It's kind of sad that you aren't able to see that.

Deuteronomy 4:28

"And there ye shall serve gods, the work of men's hands, wood and stone, which neither see, nor hear, nor eat, nor smell."

Allah is not an idol... Any sort of depiction of God in Islam is forbidden, not unlike Judaism.

So, there's only ONE Jesus Christ who is GOD and HE is the BREATHIN' WORD God.... the LIVIN' WORD GOD. He is not Allah or other kinds of god ( statues/idols )that are made in woods/stones/silver/gold.

Allah isn't a statue/idol. Allah is God, the same God that you worship.

Thus, the question remains: Are you monotheistic? Or do you believe the Jews worship something other than the Lord? If the Jews worship the same God, then you really don't have a leg to stand on in saying that Muslims do not worship the same God.

For instance : Buddah that people worship.. or let's say Hindu statue that people worship and so on. And, you are tellin' me that there's ONE God for all kinds of religion eh ? I don't think so.

Buddhists do not worship Siddhartha. He is considered an example for humanity, not something to be worshipped. It's important to remember also that Buddhism is a nontheistic religion. Sure, Buddhism does hold out the possibility of there being a God, but the belief is that the existence of a God (or gods) is unimportant and irrelevant.

One cannot "worship" Siddhartha, because there is no "worship" in Buddhism.

Hinduism is different, though. I won't deny that Hinduism may be a form of idolatry, though I still believe that if a Hindu person is good then it does not matter their beliefs.

Muslims kill themselves with their dynamite bombs on their bodies and yet, they think it will take them to heaven. Gee - I don't agree. They are mockin' Jesus Christ who is True, The One and Only God.

Muslims regard Jesus as a prophet. They're not mocking Jesus, they're mocking Mohammed and the teachings of Islam.