Heaven and Hell...

[Teresh]

Teresh,

Hormones, cells, gonads and the like had to have been produced somewhere? Would you not agree?

Um, yeah. They're produced in the womb, the result of the multiplication of fertilised egg into the zygote.

Evolution is biology. Evolution has been scientifically proven. Creationism is ascientific and has not been scienfitically proven. Moreover, Creationism requires that one reject the concepts of logic and reason.

 

[Angel]

God is real.

Heaven is real.

Satan is real.

Hell is real.

Everything we need to know about those things are included in the Holy Bible.

Not everyone accepts the Bible as the Word of God.

God and His Word continue, whether or not people believe.

Right on!

 

[hottiedeafboi]

Well, wouldn't God give the some people a talent of using biology? To me, I do. Like I ve been said, God gave us brain to use and everyone has the differences. All of 100% of all kinds of forms were created by God. Of all of this, I'm amazed how God has use each person different gifts.

 

[Teresh]

Well, wouldn't God give the some people a talent of using biology?

I would say no. Your DNA does determine a lot about you. As far as a love for that particular subject, I don't know. Maybe God is involved there, maybe not.

Like I ve been said, God gave us brain to use and everyone has the differences.

Creationism expects you, however, to ignore the fact that you have a brain and also oppose science, intelligence and education.

 

[hottiedeafboi]

I would say no. Your DNA does determine a lot about you. As far as a love for that particular subject, I don't know. Maybe God is involved there, maybe not.



Creationism expects you, however, to ignore the fact that you have a brain and also oppose science, intelligence and education.

I totally dissagree with that. Friend of mine who was going to be a biology teacher, but God called her to be in the deaf ministry, but still love biology. Would she agree what you said, no she wouldn't. Even she said isn't interesting how God created all of this? I said, I sure am and all the creation all over the universe that man never could nt figure it out how it start and how awestruck that God created. You are looking at particular group, not christian groups, some different side of christian group. I have seen so much wrong idea how christians are and what they do. Would Jesus oppose scientist? No. Does all scienitst agree one another? No. No doubt, people who can't stand christians wil support scientist who doesn't either to make christians look stupid, which they think we are. I do agree in some part, there are some christians doesn't believe in science and stuff, problem, they didn't realize who behind of all of this and that is God. There is no bam there it is. Tho when God said let it be light and there is light. But does that mean bam theory? I say no. DNA does created by God. Like fingerprints, all have differences. God doesn't forget anything and even tho, like the time like now, all the DNA is the reason God made for a good purpose. But be aware, some scientist could taint it like blackmailing and fool people and etc which has been happening lately.

 

[Reba]

...Creationism expects you, however, to ignore the fact that you have a brain and also oppose science, intelligence and education.

That's not true. I've never read anything from a responsible Creation science source that ever said that. None of the people that I know personally who believe in Creationism have that attitude. That includes scientists, doctors (MDs and PhDs), teachers, military officers, and engineers.

 

[hottiedeafboi]

That's not true. I've never read anything from a responsible Creation science source that ever said that. None of the people that I know personally who believe in Creationism have that attitude. That includes scientists, doctors (MDs and PhDs), teachers, military officers, and engineers.

Thanks, Reba , smile

 

[EagleCherokee63]

That's not true. I've never read anything from a responsible Creation science source that ever said that. None of the people that I know personally who believe in Creationism have that attitude. That includes scientists, doctors (MDs and PhDs), teachers, military officers, and engineers.

me too! AMEN!

 

[EagleCherokee63]

I totally dissagree with that. Friend of mine who was going to be a biology teacher, but God called her to be in the deaf ministry, but still love biology. Would she agree what you said, no she wouldn't. Even she said isn't interesting how God created all of this? I said, I sure am and all the creation all over the universe that man never could nt figure it out how it start and how awestruck that God created. You are looking at particular group, not christian groups, some different side of christian group. I have seen so much wrong idea how christians are and what they do. Would Jesus oppose scientist? No. Does all scienitst agree one another? No. No doubt, people who can't stand christians wil support scientist who doesn't either to make christians look stupid, which they think we are. I do agree in some part, there are some christians doesn't believe in science and stuff, problem, they didn't realize who behind of all of this and that is God. There is no bam there it is. Tho when God said let it be light and there is light. But does that mean bam theory? I say no. DNA does created by God. Like fingerprints, all have differences. God doesn't forget anything and even tho, like the time like now, all the DNA is the reason God made for a good purpose. But be aware, some scientist could taint it like blackmailing and fool people and etc which has been happening lately.

:fruit: :fruit:

 

[Teresh]

That's not true. I've never read anything from a responsible Creation science source that ever said that. None of the people that I know personally who believe in Creationism have that attitude. That includes scientists, doctors (MDs and PhDs), teachers, military officers, and engineers.

Creationism *ITSELF* is a demonstration of that idea! It's taking a rational, logical, predictable and proven theory, evolution, and saying it's not true because some book said otherwise.

That is irrational. It also demonstrates the idea that science, and education, from which science hails, is meaningless and unimporant.

You can't claim to support education and be a Creationist--that would make you a hypocrite.

 

[hottiedeafboi]

Creationism *ITSELF* is a demonstration of that idea! It's taking a rational, logical, predictable and proven theory, evolution, and saying it's not true because some book said otherwise.

That is irrational. It also demonstrates the idea that science, and education, from which science hails, is meaningless and unimporant.

You can't claim to support education and be a Creationist--that would make you a hypocrite.

That's absolutely not true,not in the slightest. Bec there are different view of scientist's perspective and also different view of creationism's view. All I see is blood thirst to find the negative side of creationism, and see their errors. God in the scientist are more higher level than scientist doesn't believe in God. Like gas, neuron, atom and all that created by itself, the fact is no, it didn't creat it by itself, its been created by God. Nothing is creating outside of God.

 

[Reba]

Creationism *ITSELF* is a demonstration of that idea! It's taking a rational, logical, predictable and proven theory, evolution, and saying it's not true because some book said otherwise.

Creation scientists also study evolution theory, do their own research using scientific methods, and compare results.

That is irrational. It also demonstrates the idea that science, and education, from which science hails, is meaningless and unimporant.

Belief in Creation doesn't make science or education meaningless or unimportant. In fact, Christians and Christian schools encourage their students to continue their higher educations.

You can't claim to support education and be a Creationist--that would make you a hypocrite.

Oh, you mean if I don't support your version of "education"?

Your statement is a result of being uninformed, dishonest, haughty, or close-minded. Take your pick.

 

[Teresh]

Bec there are different view of scientist's perspective and also different view of creationism's view.

Evolution is the only view held in the scientific community. These "different views" you speak of are held by people who are not scientists and do not understand science as a discipline.

All I see is blood thirst to find the negative side of creationism, and see their errors.

Then you're blind, as there is no blood thirst in the theory of evolution, just simple logic and an opposition to teaching religion, which is nonrational and unproven, in favor of a rational and proven theory.

God in the scientist are more higher level than scientist doesn't believe in God.

The vast majority of scientists do believe in God. However, they are not fools in that they let their belief cloud their search for answers. Science has always been about a better understanding of the nature of God and God's creation. The fact that you think that it's anything else shows your personal naivete and lack of understanding of the subject.

Like gas, neuron, atom and all that created by itself, the fact is no, it didn't creat it by itself, its been created by God. Nothing is creating outside of God.

Believing that God created the universe is something that is simply a matter of belief. Belief has nothing to do with science. The two are not fundamentally in opposition or mutually exclusive.

Christians, however, have, as a matter of history and tradition, made the two out to be mutually exclusive--that science is a fundamental opposition to belief. You are a perfect example of this idea.

Creation scientists also study evolution theory, do their own research using scientific methods, and compare results.

Creationism is not science, it's a religious idea. One cannot be a biologist and a creationist. A scientist follows the scientific method as the foundation of his or her coming to the understanding of observed phenomena. The biologist is a scientist specifically in the field of the life or organisms (biology). Thus, the biologist must, in order to qualify the definition, operate under the terms of the scientific method.

Creationists forgo the scientifc method because it is inconvenient to them to follow it. That is, the scientific method would, by history and by their own experimentation, render their creation beliefs incorrect. Therefore, the only way to maintain their beliefs is to forgo the scientific method, which consequently eliminates any possibility of them being considered scientists.

Belief in Creation doesn't make science or education meaningless or unimportant. In fact, Christians and Christian schools encourage their students to continue their higher educations.

It's not "education" if the idea of learning is not there. Christians, in the sense described above, are not concerned with learning or coming to a greater understanding. Actually, if anything, they seek to use education as a means of control. They aim to take the search for greater knowledge and understanding out of the picture by diametrically opposing that search.

It is not "education" if the student is simply told what the answer is and does not understand what it means or why that is the answer. Additionally, it is not "education" if the student is not allowed to pursue higher knowledge because it would conflict with the beliefs of the teacher.

Oh, you mean if I don't support your version of "education"?

My "version"? There are many different ways by which one can educate, but if you do not qualify the above definition, it's not education, it's teaching. Education isn't just about going to school and getting good grades, nor is it about a man or woman standing at a podium teaching things to a class. Education also has meaning to the students.

If the student does not receive the essence of what it means to learn, then the purpose of education is lost.

Your statement is a result of being uninformed, dishonest, haughty, or close-minded. Take your pick.

Only because I disagree with you are you going to use such terms for my opinion. Obviously, if I were a conformist who thought the same way as you do, that we need to brainwash the children into a specific set of immutable and unchangable ideas, then you would think higher of me.

But no. I disagree. I must be wrong. I must not know what I'm talking about because I don't believe in the same set of beliefs as you do.

Honestly, Reba, you're funny some times.

 

[EagleCherokee63]

 

[hottiedeafboi]

Evolution is the only view held in the scientific community. These "different views" you speak of are held by people who are not scientists and do not understand science as a discipline.



Then you're blind, as there is no blood thirst in the theory of evolution, just simple logic and an opposition to teaching religion, which is nonrational and unproven, in favor of a rational and proven theory.



The vast majority of scientists do believe in God. However, they are not fools in that they let their belief cloud their search for answers. Science has always been about a better understanding of the nature of God and God's creation. The fact that you think that it's anything else shows your personal naivete and lack of understanding of the subject.



Believing that God created the universe is something that is simply a matter of belief. Belief has nothing to do with science. The two are not fundamentally in opposition or mutually exclusive.

Christians, however, have, as a matter of history and tradition, made the two out to be mutually exclusive--that science is a fundamental opposition to belief. You are a perfect example of this idea.



Creationism is not science, it's a religious idea. One cannot be a biologist and a creationist. A scientist follows the scientific method as the foundation of his or her coming to the understanding of observed phenomena. The biologist is a scientist specifically in the field of the life or organisms (biology). Thus, the biologist must, in order to qualify the definition, operate under the terms of the scientific method.

Creationists forgo the scientifc method because it is inconvenient to them to follow it. That is, the scientific method would, by history and by their own experimentation, render their creation beliefs incorrect. Therefore, the only way to maintain their beliefs is to forgo the scientific method, which consequently eliminates any possibility of them being considered scientists.



It's not "education" if the idea of learning is not there. Christians, in the sense described above, are not concerned with learning or coming to a greater understanding. Actually, if anything, they seek to use education as a means of control. They aim to take the search for greater knowledge and understanding out of the picture by diametrically opposing that search.

It is not "education" if the student is simply told what the answer is and does not understand what it means or why that is the answer. Additionally, it is not "education" if the student is not allowed to pursue higher knowledge because it would conflict with the beliefs of the teacher.



My "version"? There are many different ways by which one can educate, but if you do not qualify the above definition, it's not education, it's teaching. Education isn't just about going to school and getting good grades, nor is it about a man or woman standing at a podium teaching things to a class. Education also has meaning to the students.

If the student does not receive the essence of what it means to learn, then the purpose of education is lost.



Only because I disagree with you are you going to use such terms for my opinion. Obviously, if I were a conformist who thought the same way as you do, that we need to brainwash the children into a specific set of immutable and unchangable ideas, then you would think higher of me.

But no. I disagree. I must be wrong. I must not know what I'm talking about because I don't believe in the same set of beliefs as you do.

Honestly, Reba, you're funny some times.

Well, the way I see, you seem funny and also naive of what christians really believes. I have seen how many claims what christians believe they use out of context also buttering up what appear to be and etc. Seeing so many excuses why they refuse to believe, and not only that, many christians, remember many, not all, are not looking for win or lose positions. But humongous unbelievers are looking for winning and you lose attitudes. it doesn't bothers me whatever some believe how christians believe or act, I keep my eyes set on my God which is eternal, but the things we see is only temporary. I stick with the fact of what God has created and how is created. Even I'm not expert of science, bec its not my gift, but there are numbers of christians are expert in science and biology, chemist and etc. Bec God give each of them a gifts, God called us many different gift, but one body in Christ, and honor Him what He has called us to do.

 

[Teresh]

Well, the way I see, you seem funny and also naive of what christians really believes.

I was raised a Christian. I went to Christian schools for twelve years of my life. I know a lot about Christianity. There is nothing you know about Christianity that I don't.

I have seen how many claims what christians believe they use out of context also buttering up what appear to be and etc.

Examples?

it doesn't bothers me whatever some believe how christians believe or act, I keep my eyes set on my God which is eternal, but the things we see is only temporary.

So you doubt reality and your perceptions of it? It doesn't matter if life is only temporary--You still have to get through it!

I stick with the fact of what God has created and how is created.

In other words, you trust a book written 2500 years ago over something you can see and perceive today. You also ignore the fact that most Jews (and B'reshit is THEIR book) do not even interpret the story the same way you do. Right. That makes sense.

 

[hottiedeafboi]

I was raised a Christian. I went to Christian schools for twelve years of my life. I know a lot about Christianity. There is nothing you know about Christianity that I don't.



Examples?



So you doubt reality and your perceptions of it? It doesn't matter if life is only temporary--You still have to get through it!



In other words, you trust a book written 2500 years ago over something you can see and perceive today. You also ignore the fact that most Jews (and B'reshit is THEIR book) do not even interpret the story the same way you do. Right. That makes sense.

For example? Christians cause this nations fall apart, christians believe the world is flat. There's so much of wrong perspective of it and again, not all christians believe the same. It doesn't matter which "book". Think for a moment, in the old testaments time, who is right? Jeremiah or king of Babylon? Moses or Pharoah? Who side are you, Joshua or Caananites? There are many religons thru the years, battle goes on. Jews and christians worship same God, some jews met the Messiah and gentiles believed, other jews still waiting for the Messiah. But other religion believe different god.

 

[Teresh]

Christians cause this nations fall apart, christians believe the world is flat.

I don't know many Christians who think the world is flat. Beyond that, I also can't think of any cases where Christians destroyed nations (except for persecuting non-Christians, but that's another story).

Jews and christians worship same God,

I can name several Jews who would disagree on that subject. Honestly, I'd say Judaism has more in common with Islam than either does with Christianity but that's my take as an observer. Christianity belives in the Trinity and the divinity (or partial divinity) of Satan, things which do not make any sense in the scope of Judaism, whereas Islam worships the one God.

But other religion believe different god.

That's a matter of belief. Personally, I'd say that all religions worship the same God--All divinities are One.

 

[hottiedeafboi]

I don't know many Christians who think the world is flat. Beyond that, I also can't think of any cases where Christians destroyed nations (except for persecuting non-Christians, but that's another story).



I can name several Jews who would disagree on that subject. Honestly, I'd say Judaism has more in common with Islam than either does with Christianity but that's my take as an observer. Christianity belives in the Trinity and the divinity (or partial divinity) of Satan, things which do not make any sense in the scope of Judaism, whereas Islam worships the one God.



That's a matter of belief. Personally, I'd say that all religions worship the same God--All divinities are One.

On the contrary other christians fight against christian or execute whomever persecute different religion or innocence, bec that is not of Christ, but mostly majority, christians being executed by non christians. We worship one God also. But wrong concept of seeing what and who is Trinity. I have seen other religion gods and it looks scary. And everything make sense whom I believe. Its been alive since the acsension, till thru those time when other religion comes along to pervert the ideas. And it is obvious, if Jesus isn't the one, then all religion is pointless, doesn't matter how hard you try or believe, it won't do us good. Sin still hold against us, if Jesus isn't the one. Yeah, you will say that's christians belief, in some way true, God's calling us to share the Gospel, but God does the rest, and each person is accountable for what they choose.

 

[Teresh]

On the contrary other christians fight against christian or execute whomever persecute different religion or innocence, bec that is not of Christ,

That doesn't mean you have any right to forget the atrocities members of your faith have committed against other religions.

but mostly majority, christians being executed by non christians.

Christians have not been persecuted on the wide scale for the last 1800 years. Christians are not a persecuted religious group. Your idea that Christians are being persecuted by non-Christians is just plain incorrect. Cite some examples.

I can cite many examples where Christians have exterminated non-Christians en masse simply as a matter of faith. The Crusades? The Inquisition? The Holocaust? Never in the history of the world have Christians EVER been persecuted to that degree.

We worship one God also. But wrong concept of seeing what and who is Trinity.

Three persons in one God. That's the idea of the Trinity. Three distinct divine entities. So either you worship three gods or God has multiple personality disorder.

I have seen other religion gods and it looks scary.

That's strange. I don't see how it could be scary.

And it is obvious, if Jesus isn't the one, then all religion is pointless, doesn't matter how hard you try or believe, it won't do us good.

To me, that idea is absolutely absurd. One does not need Jesus or any other dead person, no matter how great, to have a meaningful relationship with God.

Sin still hold against us, if Jesus isn't the one.

People are born with a clean slate. Human beings don't start out as sinners, though some certainly become that way in the course of their life.