Grammar

KristinaB said:
Now, this does not pertain to me, but:

I will say that for the most part, the deaf who had ASL as their primary language may have had a harder struggle to learn proper English grammar mainly due to the fact that they originally learned ASL grammar. Most can and do learn the proper English grammar or the proper grammar of their country's language. Some people still find the English grammar to be too hard, so they type in whatever they feel comfortable with. We do not make a habit to criticize a person's grammar. We do have a few here on this forum who will try to correct spelling. I have been known to do that a few times, but I always am careful about who I do it to and how I do it.

I was fortunate that I had some hearing and spoken English was my first language. I am finding ASL grammar syntax to be very challenging, but I will succeed at it or die trying. :giggle:
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Ummm..what I saw in 13 years in the Deaf Ed field...it is those who had ASL from the beginning who were able to master English through reading and writing than most who didnt. Just sayin'
 
Funny, I noticed some young hearing people and older don't type the way grammar was supposed to make the sentences so that it will be understandable. They kind of chop up the words and use like shorthand to make us understand what they are talking about. If they can talk in complete sentences with the teachers and other students clearly. But on the computer writing, they type differently than speaking. :dunno:

That is what make me puzzled about that. :confused: So that might make us along with the hearing people not type good grammars. :lol: I do make mistakes on my grammar a lot but I have been trying to do better with grammar. Grammar was and still is never easy to learn how to write complete sentences in the proper way. That is hard. I do feel that English is the most difficult language in the world. :hmm:
 
shel90 said:
Ummm..what I saw in 13 years in the Deaf Ed field...it is those who had ASL from the beginning who were able to master English through reading and writing than most who didnt. Just sayin'
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I stand corrected. Thanks!!
 
This question is the underlying question of literacy of deaf education, and regardless of all the hype about attitude and culture choices, it is a good question to ask. The problem with the question here is that it is not being asked nicely, but with that aside, seriously, it is a good question.

Why do some students succeed in English while others do not? If we don't ask that question, we have no business working in deaf education or debating its approaches and methods.
 
It IS a good question...unfortunately everyone thinks it's their answer that's the correct solution. how do you address finding a way to have everyone come around to the same conclusion which is that both early language development and an education providing all tools is the answer? How do you push for the "ideal" solution to the literacy problem when everyone has their own ideas for what's causing it in the first place. It's a huge conundrum.
 
You do it by putting aside the politics and focus on the key elements of literacy development. Sweden did it.
 
Wirelessly posted

It's very interesting reading this post, it gives me a whole different perspective in teaching methods. I didn't go to public school at all. My parents sent me to catholic school all my life, my education was paid by my parents to send me to those schools. The curriculum is much tougher and challenging. English was a challenge for me, I got the red marks on my paper from time to time lol basically, run-on sentences were the issue.
It seems penmanship has decreased, we are using typing these days on a computer and/or pagers. I tend to skip words using the typing method vs writing with ink and pen. I must be careful when type or reply to posts, emails, or other.
 
sailerboy said:
I don't consider myself to have perfect grammar. I am genuinely curious about such things. I don't claim to know sign language. I am interested to see why it is harder for some people than others. If you want to play the "You don't know how it is" card, that's fine. Go ahead.

My focal point of the essay in the previous post was the illegible combinations of words, not minor grammar mistakes. I find it hard to believe that this is an exclusively Deaf site, as this site has a Hearing Aids, CI, etc.

I take it i'm not welcome here simply because i represent everything all of you stand against, that is, hard work, curiosity, novel ideas, and change. I'm going to go back to reading 1984.
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Crikey, what is your deal?
 
I find that the people who write in ASL style are helpful. If I sign the written words, it makes sense and allows me to practice. Ya'll don't stop!

Even the most over-educated people (like me-lol) make mistakes, especially when they type fast and don't proof read posts. Lighten up!
 
Wirelessly posted

sallylou said:
I find that the people who write in ASL style are helpful. If I sign the written words, it makes sense and allows me to practice. Ya'll don't stop!

Even the most over-educated people (like me-lol) make mistakes, especially when they type fast and don't proof read posts. Lighten up!
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Good post
 
I will try to explain my opinion on this but, I often get off subject and is sometimes confusing. Enjoy.

Those like yourself who are "Hearing" (because you are with a hearing aid or whatever the fuck device you use) are more susceptible to be able to understand the English grammar then a person who cannot hear the pause in between sentences for comma's and such forth. A "hearing person" also of a different language will pick up English better because there language has grammar in it. ASL has a different structure form then english and different rules. It's also a visual language as English is not. It really isn't no matter how many times a person reads the words on the paper it is still an auditory language.

Now as far as I believe (which is speculation) for visualizing the English Language it's associated more of seeing visual cues like seeing the word dog versus a dog in their mind. Then the problem of spelling since you probably wonder on that. Spelling is something you either learn the "root word" meaning to in school like "Pod" is a Latin Root Word having to do with feet (ie: podium, podiatrists, etc.). Well that doesn't mean much to visual people. We see pod and we see a pea in a pod. Now phonetically spelling a word out doesn't exists either. Why? Cause only "hearing people" like yourself get the voices in their heads. Which in return I conclude you're totally bat-shit crazy.

Again, this is only my experience.


Now, if you really want to argue with shit like this or debate or whatever you do Posts From Hell is your person to do it. Also, I hope you do and he reams you a new ass while your at is.
 
sailerboy said:
I don't consider myself to have perfect grammar. I am genuinely curious about such things. I don't claim to know sign language. I am interested to see why it is harder for some people than others. If you want to play the "You don't know how it is" card, that's fine. Go ahead.

My focal point of the essay in the previous post was the illegible combinations of words, not minor grammar mistakes. I find it hard to believe that this is an exclusively Deaf site, as this site has a Hearing Aids, CI, etc.

I take it i'm not welcome here simply because i represent everything all of you stand against, that is, hard work, curiosity, novel ideas, and change. I'm going to go back to reading 1984.
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I am a hard worker, curious, have some novel ideas, and I did go through a major change with how I idenitifed myself a while back but not at the expense of putting others down.

That is what I am against...putting others down like what you are doing. Even in the bolded statement, you are generalizing that all of us are against all 4 characteristics implying that we are lazy, dont have our own mind, are incapble of having novel ideas, and are resistant to change. Not a good way to establish rapport with a community.
 
shel90 said:
I am a hard worker, curious, have some novel ideas, and I did go through a major change with how I idenitifed myself a while back but not at the expense of putting others down.

That is what I am against...putting others down like what you are doing. Even in the bolded statement, you are generalizing that all of us are against all 4 characteristics implying that we are lazy, dont have our own mind, are incapble of having novel ideas, and are resistant to change. Not a good way to establish rapport with a community.
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Yes. I see another instance here of an individual wanting to blame problems on the community, when it isn't really the community at all, but the way the individual approaches the community that causes the problem.
 
Are you insinuating that your personal efforts to write English like a college professor need to be recognized? Are those that did not focus on a similar curriculum somehow less intelligent? I really don't find it all that baffling that people that use ASL as their primary language might not write standard English with the same enthusiasm as someone that uses English as a primary language. You are an exception.

Just curious, have you tried reading a French version of "1984"?

How is my grammar? Vocabulary? Sentence structure? I can take constructive criticism. Feel free to enlighten me here.
 
(Ok--correct me if Im wrong anyone, BUT)--

Wow dude you need to chill out. A Deaf person cant hear, you have hearing aids to help you hear the spoken language! So, if you dont know how French is spoken, are you going to know how to write it? NO! Does that make sense to you?

I've always wondered about grammar, but even the grammar of ASL is different then English. Maybe you should take a class on Deaf Culture/History and then you would understand.

You should teach teenagers how to spell and do grammar.
 
Holy moly. I saw at least 5 errors in supposedly-perfect-grammar-boy's post.

And WE get called out for poor grammar? Even when we're deaf from birth? Yowza. Somebody needs a chill pill.
 
posts from hell said:
As you are working so hard to assimilate into the hearing "culture" (they dont have any, btw) why should the deaf people embrace you and tell you to "ohhhh come to our side"???

I'll help you out. There are no reasons for them to.
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Culture; isn't that something in yogurt?

I refuse to take this topic seriously. It is blatant trolling. "Hey, I think I will wander into a deaf forum, and assert that they are lazy if their writing skills are lower than college level." What next, championing MLK on White Supremist sites? Imagine the quality of writing skills THEY would exhibit. :laugh2:
 
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