Father Held Daughter in Cellar for 24 Years

I'm sorry, but that would like be forgiving Hitler or Stalin or Pol Pot.
jillo, I don't know...........I love the book and the movie, and all I saw was basicly a teen having a hard time growing up. Especially since the '60's was a time of major rebellion! It really didn't seem that she had that.

Well, we all see different things in a movie based on our own perspective. I can tell you, however, that I know a professor who uses this movie in her clinical undergraduate classes as an example of BPD. And she is also a praacticing clinical psychologist, as well as an associate prof. And I used clips from the movie in one of my master's level classes as an example of exitential therapy applied to BPD and got an A on the presentation. But then, I am in the habit of looking at movies like this from a clinical perspective. That's not to say that your interpretation is wrong, or that mine is right. We just approach it from different persectives.
 
I'm sorry, but that would like be forgiving Hitler or Stalin or Pol Pot.

Take an example of many Jews who live here in Germany. They forgave Hilter and move on when they can't forget what and how they had been through during Nazi time.

I am not saying that they should forgive that monster or force them to forgive that monster but I know they would free from their bitter feeling when they accept the forgive and move on. Without forgive, they can't move on to start a new life. I heard that it work on some people to free from bitter feeling when they faced monster and then accept their forgiveness.

I personally can image it's very, very, very hard for them to forgive that monster but it would take them long time to accept the forgive and move on.

I personally had been through with that monster (step-dad) in the past. The therapies/counsellor taught me positive way... I accept and move on... I said to myself in positive way that I would forgive him and move on... I did it with no bitter/hate feeling for him.... but my memory of childhood scar with me sometimes.. until I saw him for a first time after years no see... My bitter feeling for him is gone - no hate feeling toward him anymore...but feel sorry for him... No bitter feeling anymore when I bringing his name up to this post here. He was uninvited to attend my sister's funeral at 2 years ago which he knew he was unwelcome but I guess the reason why he determined to attend her funeral becaus he want to tell her how much sorry he was how and what he did to us). I have no feeling for him when I saw him at my sister's funeral... Like what I say before that it works when you faced that monster and then get over...



 
Liebling, age doesn't have anything to do with how severely sociopathic someone is. Wouldn't you be afraid of Hannibal Lector, or Charles Manson or any other severe sociopaths no matter HOW OLD they were?
jillo, but I thought that the message with the book and movie was basicly just like One Flew Over the Cuckoo's Nest. You know....what exactly is a "real" mental illness? Why are some conditions in the manual while others aren't?
I'm usually pretty good at noticing real life examples of mental illness or significent mental oddness. I cannot believe I never picked up on that! (and trust me, me and my friends love geeking out with movies and analyzing them)
 
Originally Posted by shel90
Hope I am not sticking my nose where it doesnt belong but I think Liebling is laughing cuz she is having a hard time believing that an 88 or 90 year old is capable of abusing people.

:gpost: That's the way I read it, too.

deafskeptic
That's how I read it too. Even women if they're sociopathic enough can cause a great deal of harm to others. I speak from personal experience.


:ty: for know my post.



Oceanbreeze's post
However, I agree with Reba. An older man (or woman for that matter) is capable of abusing someone.

I'm living proof. :(

Yes, I aware that old man or woman abuse the victims but it's Josef, I am referred to with my previous posts.

I am trying to say in my previous post that nobody would welcome him when he get out of jail as 88 or 90 years old because everyone in the world know who he is and will make sure that he keep away from them. He is too tire to repeat his crime after 15 or more years in jail accord his age. He would be lonely man...
 
The way I read your post is that you don't think an elderly man is capable of abuse and some are. There are those 80-90 yr olds who are in VERY good health, and would be capable of hurting a child.

Yes I aware it but it's Josef, I am refer to with my previous post. It's hard to beleive that 88 or 90 years old monster would repeat his crime after get out of 15 or more years jail.

I rather to think positive than being parnaiod anything...
 
There's a picture of the "father" in one of the links. He looks relatively "normal" in that picture. (conservative old guy) Whereas today's pictures of him are just beyond freaky. It's almost like the diffy between those crystal meth before and after pics.
He also kinda reminds me of Fred Phelps.
I really wonder.......could it be that this might be the result of a severe personality disorder PLUS drug abuse of some sort? Its just BEYOND hard to believe that that things actions were SOLELY the result of a severe personality disorder.
 
Austrian Father Who Imprisoned Daughter May Plead Insanity

Josef Fritzl, the Austrian who admits imprisoning his daughter and fathering children by her, may seek to avoid jail by pleading insanity, his lawyer indicated in comments published Sunday, May 4.

"In my personal opinion, Josef Fritzl is mentally ill and therefore of diminished responsibility," lawyer Rudolf Mayer told German weekly Bild am Sonntag in an interview.

"I believe that my client does not belong in prison but in a secure psychiatric unit."

Bildunterschrift: Großansicht des Bildes mit der Bildunterschrift: A view into a hidden room in the cellar

Until now Mayer has given no indication of how Fritzl would plead in any trial, saying he did not believe that his client he would receive a fair hearing in view of the huge amount of press coverage the case has attracted.

If he believes that a psychiatric evaluation of Fritzl, 73, ordered by the court does not give a proper assessment of his client he will consider ordering a separate report himself, Mayer told Bild.

He added that he is "not defending a monster but a human being, even if that is hard to take for some people. I am already receiving threatening letters saying that I belong in the cellar with Mr. Fritzl."

Fritzl, currently in custody, has admitted imprisoning his daughter in a specially made dungeon in his basement for nearly a quarter century where he fathered seven children by her, one of whom died, according to Austrian police.

Investigation almost complete

Mayer's comments came as the head of the investigation in the town of Amstetten, Franz Polzer, said that police were close to completing their examination of the bunker.

Bildunterschrift: Großansicht des Bildes mit der Bildunterschrift: Part of the cellar where Elisabeth Fritzl spent 24 years of her life

"Our puzzle is almost complete," Polzer told Austrian paper Kurier, adding that there was "no evidence" that Fritzl had any accomplices.

"We already know a lot and thanks to our information are currently putting things in order in this case," he said.

A major task of police is to establish whether Fritzl was serious about his alleged threat to gas the occupants of his windowless bunker if anything happened to him.

He confirmed to Austrian news agency APA details about the dungeon from Fritzl's daughter Elisabeth's published by German weekly Der Spiegel.

In front of children

The magazine said that for the first nine years of her imprisonment the dungeon comprised just one room, implying that incestuous sex or rape took place in the presence of young children.

From 1984 to 1993, "repeated rapes committed by Josef Fritzl" took place in front of children born in 1988, 1990 and 1992, the report cited Elisabeth's testimony to police as saying.

It also said Elisabeth was handcuffed to a post for the first two days underground, when she was 19 years old. She was then tied to a leash for the next six or nine months so that she could go to the toilet on her own. The magazine also said Elisabeth has exonerated her mother Rosemarie.

Bildunterschrift: Großansicht des Bildes mit der Bildunterschrift: The regional clinic where Elisabeth Fritzl and three of her six children are being treated
The 42-year-old, currently receiving medical and psychological treatment together with all her children, spelled out that Rosemarie "knew nothing of her incarceration, and had nothing to do with (Elisabeth's plight)."

Polzer also told Kurier that Fritzl had already installed a thick steel door in his cellar before imprisoning his daughter there in 1984.

Condition stabilized

Kerstin, 19, the daughter of Elisabeth, who was held captive by her father for 24 years, repeatedly raped and gave birth to seven children by him, remained in the intensive care unit at a hospital in Amstetten, a spokesman said.

She has been in an artificially induced coma for the last two weeks and is on a ventilation machine.

Her life-threatening illness had led to the release on April 24 of her mother and two of her siblings from the basement cellar.

Austrian Father Who Imprisoned Daughter May Plead Insanity | Europe | Deutsche Welle | 04.05.2008
 
Sara, :ty: for provide links... It make me feel sick in my stomach after read those articles.

Accord the article, I linked here.


"In my personal opinion, Josef Fritzl is mentally ill and therefore of diminished responsibility," lawyer Rudolf Mayer told German weekly Bild am Sonntag in an interview.

"I believe that my client does not belong in prison but in a secure psychiatric unit."

He added that he is "not defending a monster but a human being, even if that is hard to take for some people. I am already receiving threatening letters saying that I belong in the cellar with Mr. Fritzl."

Unfortunlately the lawyer is right about his condition accord the law, they are not allow to put mentally ill to jail but secure psychiatric unit. The lawyer have to follow the law what he know... I beleive he will demand Specialist to examine him either he is really mentally ill or not.

I hope the Prosecutor will see different... Accord Rosemarie's sister's decription what she know him as a tyrant. He made several trips to Thailand. Accord Josef's former Employer and co-workers, he work very hard and good worker. He lock his daughter for 24 years and born his 7 children.

One point, I disagree with the lawyer for saying that he is not monster but human being...

I personally am for that they lock him rest of life and make sure that he will NEVER go out of jail.


 
I don't belive that evil monster being mentally ill. He is claiming that in hoping to avoid going to the prison. He knows what he has done wrong for a long time and he covers up his secret family underground to hide his evil activity away from his innocent family & friends. I hope he goes to the prison to rot regardless he got mental illness or not. He has already made a huge damage to his family and it will takes his family many years to recover or perhap never recovers from their ordeal. His lawyer is getting just as bad trying to claim that he is mentally ill. Oh crap!
 
I don't belive that evil monster being mentally ill. He is claiming that in hoping to avoid going to the prison. He knows what he has done wrong for a long time and he covers up his secret family underground to hide his evil activity away from his innocent family & friends. I hope he goes to the prison to rot regardless he got mental illness or not. He has already made a huge damage to his family and it will takes his family many years to recover or perhap never recovers from their ordeal. His lawyer is getting just as bad trying to claim that he is mentally ill. Oh crap!

Yeah I can see that... I would say that he is a definitely sick man.

Many lawyers tried to cover for their clients and describe them as mentally ill but I hope the Prosecutor will see different and protest against lawyer's word.
 
Sara, :ty: for provide links... It make me feel sick in my stomach after read those articles.

Yes same here, it makes me feel sick in my stomach too reading all the latest articles. It's seem more and more details are coming out such as Elizabeth being chained up like a dog. Jeez! It gave me teary eyes. :cry:

:ty: sara for the update news.
 
She was forced to build her own prison and the ceilings are so low I dont think even I could stand up straight and Im 5'4". UGH
 
Leib, yes its horrible that he'd escape jail, but don't they have mental insistutions for the criminally insane in Europe? If so, it wouldn't be like a regular mental insistuion. It would be a jail.
 
Yes same here, it makes me feel sick in my stomach too reading all the latest articles. It's seem more and more details are coming out such as Elizabeth being chained up like a dog. Jeez! It gave me teary eyes. :cry:

:ty: sara for the update news.

I can't bear to read the gory details, so I haven't. I just hope justice is served and the children/adult children of this monster will get the best care possible. I hurt for them. :(
 
liebling,i did makes add links on articles and makes me freak! about that monster who throw his own daughter for 24 years! its hard believe story but im sure he makes cages for his daughter that stupid in pics!
 
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