Do you support suicide assistance?

[Maria]

and kept her like that for another 50 years or even longer? What if she outlives all of her relatives?

I highly doubt it if, it takes another 50 years or more. It doesn't matter, if she outlives all of her relatives, does it ?

 

[Maria]

so... that goes back to my question - at what point should we continue... I find your definition of death interesting. My opinion coincides with medical definition - if you are brain dead, that's when you died.. not heart.

And, yet the heart still pumpin' to give an oxygen with lungs ? A brain-dead patient still breathin' and, yet not die ? It doesn't make sense to me, Jiro. Once an oxygen quits givin' in, the lungs and heart stop functionin' and it will stop flowin' to the brain.

wow you must be really against modern medicine... even tylenol. I guess your mortality rate is not going to be pretty....

Naw, I take Aleve once in a while when I had a bad headache ( not often when that happens ). My heart is still beatin'. I am NOT dead yet.

 

[Maria]

In the case of terminal illness, I think a person should choose whether to die or not.

Yes, if a person is able to think, talk and makin' decision to discuss what person wishes when she/he dies. But, I don't agree with somethin' that someone else should make a decision for " brain-dead " patient like Terri to take her life away by makin' her to starve to death. I don't think it is right.

In the case of brain dead, I am only concerned for legal ramifications in this issue. There needs to be a lot of barriers, double checking, triple checking to make sure no one takes advantage. Personally, I'd want someone to kill me if I was brain dead.

Kill you ? With what ? You prefer someone to assist you to end your life ?

If someone is brain dead, they are dead to me. Sounds horrible I know, but that's life. Think about it this way, if someone you loved all of sudden is brain dead, are you telling me that you are still happy because they are still alive?

I am not sayin' that I am happy. There is a hope out there that one day she/he will come out of it as long as the heart is still functionin'. I know you maybe think that I am crazy, but that's the way I see it since I've heard so many stories/articles that there's a miracle. Miracle never stops.

Also, if you are brain dead, you don't mind staying alive? No.

Wasting bills? Burdening on others? Wasting food? Pooping on yourself? Peeing on yourself? Because of that 1 in a million chance you may wake up?

You are worryin' about all this, aren't you ? If, you are a millionaire, I am positively sure that you wouldn't worry about it and even, you wouldn't ask me all these questions.

 

[Daredevel7]

Naw, I take Aleve once in a while when I had a bad headache ( not often when that happens ). My heart is still beatin'. I am NOT dead yet.

So you ARE for "unnatural" means. You said that a person should live naturally. I know it's obvious that you can't stay away from medicine but this is my point, we can't live naturally nowadays and this blurs the line between "Living life naturally" (or as *insert religious figure here* intended it) and "Living life as WE want".

Has it ever occurred to you that perhaps miracles will happen whether we remove feeding/breathing tubes or not? It seems to me that you're not really against the act of pulling the plug but concerned that we are not allowing chances for miracles.

I can tell you this.... personally, if I was brain dead for a couple of years, and there is a chance of me waking up (a miracle!), honestly, I don't care. It may be a depressing outlook on life, but I don't particularly want to spend a few years bedridden to be alive later having people invading my home interviewing me "Oh my god! Tell me! What is it like to be a miracle!?" Then I have to start my life over again, new job, etc. No thank you. I like my life as it is now, and I can die happy.

 

[Maria]

Well, many people have no problem to agree each other to save their beloved ones´ suffering is pulled the machine plug out, remove organs from dead brain patients for donation to save other people´s life, etc. They negotiate out of their mouth to respect their wishes each other or some forward living will to doctor for file... They understand the logical that human and pets have pain... until Terri Schavio´s case.... The lawmaker decide that we should write living will for the case because the family or children might against spouse or parent for end their life by turn the machine off, etc... The living will helps to prevent them from fighting/harass each other.

You cannot expect anyone follow Karen´s parents example. You also cannot compare Karen Ann Quinlan´s parents with other parents because each person is different and have different decision as Karen´s parents. You cannot tell other people what to do because it´s their choice, not yours.

I didn't say that I EXPECT anyone to follow Karen's parents' example. I said in my previous post that there aren't that many people who are like Karen's parents.... unfortunately. Ohhh, yes I can compare Karen Ann Quilan's parents with other parents, because of what Michael did to his wife, Terri. Michael's example wasn't that good. I disagree with his choice about endin' Terri's life --- ohhhh, just because he just wants to move on with his NEW significant other. Gee, that's really pathetic to me -- obviously that he has a " selfish " in him for not bein' there to be with his wife. I don't believe that Michael is REALLY a widower -- not to my eyes. To my eyes, he is really a murderer, period.

 

[Maria]

So you ARE for "unnatural" means. You said that a person should live naturally. I know it's obvious that you can't stay away from medicine but this is my point, we can't live naturally nowadays and this blurs the line between "Living life naturally" (or as *insert religious figure here* intended it) and "Living life as WE want".

Again, you are a little off-topic here about my statement that you are not followin'. I can see that we don't think the same what we both see it. I am not goin' to explain again. You need to re-read all of my posts and try to understand where I came from. And, of course I respect your disagreement if, we don't agree on the same page.

Has it ever occurred to you that perhaps miracles will happen whether we remove feeding/breathing tubes or not? It seems to me that you're not really against the act of pulling the plug but concerned that we are not allowing chances for miracles.

I can tell you this.... personally, if I was brain dead for a couple of years, and there is a chance of me waking up (a miracle!), honestly, I don't care. It may be a depressing outlook on life, but I don't particularly want to spend a few years bedridden to be alive later having people invading my home interviewing me "Oh my god! Tell me! What is it like to be a miracle!?" Then I have to start my life over again, new job, etc. No thank you. I like my life as it is now, and I can die happy.

Well, that's you. *chuckles* It's your life. Hey, make sure that you write it in your Livin' Will.

 

[jillio]

So you ARE for "unnatural" means. You said that a person should live naturally. I know it's obvious that you can't stay away from medicine but this is my point, we can't live naturally nowadays and this blurs the line between "Living life naturally" (or as *insert religious figure here* intended it) and "Living life as WE want".

Has it ever occurred to you that perhaps miracles will happen whether we remove feeding/breathing tubes or not? It seems to me that you're not really against the act of pulling the plug but concerned that we are not allowing chances for miracles.

I can tell you this.... personally, if I was brain dead for a couple of years, and there is a chance of me waking up (a miracle!), honestly, I don't care. It may be a depressing outlook on life, but I don't particularly want to spend a few years bedridden to be alive later having people invading my home interviewing me "Oh my god! Tell me! What is it like to be a miracle!?" Then I have to start my life over again, new job, etc. No thank you. I like my life as it is now, and I can die happy.

Agreed. We are now beginning to bring religious arguments into a legal issue, as always happens with these topics. And once again, we are seeing that religious arguments are ineffectual when deciding legal and ethical issues regarding medical decisions for the individual. If someone has religious objections to particular medical procedures, then the solution is simple. Don't engage in those practices. That is your personal decision. However, under legal and ethical guidelines, you have no right to make the same decision for others. If you don't agree with PAS, don't opt for PAS. But you have absolutely no right to tell another human being that they can't.

 

[Daredevel7]

Agreed. We are now beginning to bring religious arguments into a legal issue, as always happens with these topics. And once again, we are seeing that religious arguments are ineffectual when deciding legal and ethical issues regarding medical decisions for the individual. If someone has religious objections to particular medical procedures, then the solution is simple. Don't engage in those practices. That is your personal decision. However, under legal and ethical guidelines, you have no right to make the same decision for others. If you don't agree with PAS, don't opt for PAS. But you have absolutely no right to tell another human being that they can't.

Yes you're right. This is going to become into something we don't want it to become. I let myself get carried away. So end result: PAS = thumbs up for me!

Think of it this way, if PAS is legal, and you don't like it, you can simply not do it yourself, and you can spit at those who does it. (I prefer if you didnt, but if you must...)

Whereas if PAS was illegal, if you don't like it, too bad, you're gonna suffer if you get terminal illness.

 

[jillio]

Yes you're right. This is going to become into something we don't want it to become. I let myself get carried away. So end result: PAS = thumbs up for me!

Think of it this way, if PAS is legal, and you don't like it, you can simply not do it yourself, and you can spit at those who does it. (I prefer if you didnt, but if you must...)

Whereas if PAS was illegal, if you don't like it, too bad, you're gonna suffer if you get terminal illness.

That's it in a nutshell!

And its thumbs up for me, too. I prefer to make my own decisions, not have them made for me by someone whose religion I don't even subscribe to.

 

[Cheri]

Let me get something straight here, nobody is telling nobody what to do with their life, and their body. we are just saying we don't agree with it, nothing more nothing less. I would respect the wishes of friends or family members or anyone else whatever their choice would be, and I would hope you all would do the same for me. Respect my opinions as well as others here who had voted "no".

 

[Angel]

Right Cherie, and what really disturbs me is a few had mentioned in this thread that "It's easy for people to say or vote "no" when they have never experienced or witness the suffering of a family member" how is that respecting our choices/wishes?

I personally think this is a very good discussion and I'm only here to share my views, not here to change anyone's decisions or telling them what to do with their own bodies.

 

[Daredevel7]

Right Cherie, and what really disturbs me is a few had mentioned in this thread that "It's easy for people to say or vote "no" when they have never experienced or witness the suffering of a family member" how is that respecting our choices/wishes?

I personally think this is a very good discussion and I'm only here to share my views, not here to change anyone's decisions or telling them what to do with their own bodies.

That is great, and I agree with you that people shouldn't assume what you have experienced or not. Not all experiences changes a person's belief. A miracle wouldn't change my belief so why would a horrible long drawn out death change another person's belief?

 

[Angel]

That is great, and I agree with you that people shouldn't assume what you have experienced or not. Not all experiences changes a person's belief. A miracle wouldn't change my belief so why would a horrible long drawn out death change another person's belief?

I understand and respect your choice/belief but you're right, sometimes miracle doesn't happen othertime it does happen but no one can predict what a person's life will be like.

 

[Jiro]

Are you saying that she was unable to give her husband his "needs" so he has every right to jump in bed with someone else?

Just wanted to make sure I'm reading you correctly.

well he can't exactly have sex with her... that would be necrophilia lol

 

[Angel]

well he can't exactly have sex with her... that would be necrophilia lol

Is that what most men think about is sex?

 

[Jiro]

Yes, I would like to share the true story what I learn in England...

Back around 1800s in England, (maybe long time before 1800s) the doctors didn't know what a coma was about and confirmed their death. She or He buried alive! .... (I cannot remember the reason why they digged up)... many years later after that they digged up and opened the coffin door and saw many "scratches" on the top of the coffin... it look like that he/she awake up from coma and cries for the help...but nobody heard her/him. They found out that they thought she/he were dead which really is COMA, not intended to bury alive. I assumed that they would never found out that dead brain person was being buried like coma person because brain dead person cannot wake up and scratches on the top of the coffin like what coma person did. It could be that many coma or dead brain people were being buried when they thought they are dead...

yea i have heard of it. that was terrifying. what happened was that her brain wave and pulse was barely detectable. that's why we continued to improve our medical technology. we now have EKG monitor and bunch other tests to confirm the death beyond reasonable doubt. again - it's not foolproof but still a lot better than in 1800's

 

[Jiro]

Is that what most men think about is sex?

you started it first. you mentioned about his "needs"

 

[Jiro]

I highly doubt it if, it takes another 50 years or more. It doesn't matter, if she outlives all of her relatives, does it ?

she has no reason to live if everybody she knows is dead. but then... if she just wants to live for herself, cool. good for her.

 

[Angel]

you started it first. you mentioned about his "needs"

LOL actually I was trying to get the poster to clarify what she meant on her post.

 

[PowerON]

Remember Old Yeller?

It's tough to kill someone who you love.